282 réponses à ce sujet

[Comguard2]

Just another example of how they put zero effort in the whole story.

ME 2: Arrival DLC: Destruction of a Mass Relay is bad, destroys everything.

ME 3: Codex: Destruction of a Mass Relay is bad, destroys everything.

Ending of ME 3: You thought the explosion meant that the Mass Relay is destroyed? No stupid gamers, isn't it obvious that the explosion that damages the Normandy, can burn everyone on earth and physically crushes the Relay is just an overload? How couldn't you see it?

Every information given in the game, even in the ME3-codex, tells us that those Mass Relays caused a mass extinction event.

Why the Mass Relays didn't just stop glowing and moving to indicate an overload? Why did they include the explosions.

It's like there was a bet going on, how many plotholes can you create in 5 minutes.

[CmnDwnWrkn]

Mac's page of notes tells you everything you need to know...

"Device --> Vague Terms --> Impacts Everything"

So here you have a device, where no one really knows what it is or how it works. But...

It impacts EVERYTHING

Think about that for a second - an ambiguous "thing" that impacts EVERYTHING.

I don't know about you, but to me this looks like the writers giving themselves permission to use space magic to resolve anything they need it to.

[aj2070]

Leafs43 wrote...

Super nova or not, the galaxy is screwed.


No amount of retconning FTL speeds fixes what happened with the mass relays.


The franchise is ruined.

Yep. Stargate without the stargates.

[Gmandam]

aj2070 wrote...

Leafs43 wrote...

Super nova or not, the galaxy is screwed.


No amount of retconning FTL speeds fixes what happened with the mass relays.


The franchise is ruined.

Yep. Stargate without the stargates.

Ooohhhh I like this game.

Lord of the rings with out the rings.

[aj2070]

Ryuukishi wrote...

I'll accept whatever the Extended Cut puts forth as canon. But in the existing ending that we have now, it looks an awful lot like a giant explosion. And the ONLY reference we have within the series for an exploding relay is Arrival. It's not a 100% slam dunk that it always causes a supernova, but there is NO good in-game reason to think that it wouldn't.

Not necessarily.  I thought the same way you did Ryuukishi until I remembered that the Alpha Relay in the Bahak system (Arrival - the only Mass Relay we have seen explode and the reason why most people believe relay exploding = star system being wiped out) was different.  The Mass Effect Wiki (should not have to go here to explain but a second source of cannon) had an entry on the alpha relay that states that it was a unique relay that can be configured to use more power and probably was since the reapers were scheduled to come through it within 30 minutes.

Mass Effect Wiki entry on the Alpha Relay (Arrival)...

Outwardly the Alpha Relay appears to be a standard mass relay, differing
little, if at all, from the rest of the mass relays scattered
throughout the galaxy. However, it is unusual in its potential range and
versatility. Alpha usually sends and receives mass at the range of a
normal secondary relay, but if certain controls are adjusted, it becomes
powered by an unprecedented amount of dark energy that could send cargo
to sixteen other relays and even across a great distance to the Citadel. The Batarian Hegemony
has long been aware of Alpha's capabilities, but has covered them up to
avoid retaliation by other races who would view the relay as a direct
threat to their territories.

This is the only reason I no loger believe destruction of the relays equals mass genocide but it is still disruptive and the relays clearly explode in a non-controlled way.

Modifié par aj2070, 01 mai 2012 - 04:01 .

[ckriley]

DubVee12 wrote...

People continue to believe it because it justifies hatred of the ending.

And /thread.

[PsyrenY]

ckriley wrote...

DubVee12 wrote...

People continue to believe it because it justifies hatred of the ending.

And /thread.

[daecath]

DubVee12 wrote...

People continue to believe it because it justifies hatred of the ending.

Plenty of other reasons to hate the ending without this one point. Plus, in game info says destroyed relay = bad news. One writer's brief twitter post in a desperate attempt to reduce some of the hatred doesn't change anything. Unless it's in the game (or some other canon work like comics/books) it didn't happen and is just the opinion of one person. Of course they'll add it to the EC, with some excuse that may or may not be enough to satisfy people, but until then, relays destroyed = big kaboom.

[Funkdrspot]

Optimystic_X wrote...

ckriley wrote...

DubVee12 wrote...

People continue to believe it because it justifies hatred of the ending.

And /thread.

x4. thats the general feeling i get as well. People just turn off their thinking when theyre presented with an idea or theory that goes against their beliefs. The ad nauseam, circular logic and outright ignoring the variables between the ending and alpha relay is kinda old.

[CmnDwnWrkn]

Funkdrspot wrote...

Optimystic_X wrote...

ckriley wrote...

DubVee12 wrote...

People continue to believe it because it justifies hatred of the ending.

And /thread.

x4. thats the general feeling i get as well. People just turn off their thinking when theyre presented with an idea or theory that goes against their beliefs. The ad nauseam, circular logic and outright ignoring the variables between the ending and alpha relay is kinda old.

The Mass Effect universe doesn't follow the laws of physics.  Mass relays are "space magic" to begin with, so the idea that a disrepancy can be rectified with some additional space magic really isn't that far fetched.  That doesn't mean the writers should rely on it every time they mess up, however.

[Aaleel]

daecath wrote...

DubVee12 wrote...

People continue to believe it because it justifies hatred of the ending.

Plenty of other reasons to hate the ending without this one point. Plus, in game info says destroyed relay = bad news. One writer's brief twitter post in a desperate attempt to reduce some of the hatred doesn't change anything. Unless it's in the game (or some other canon work like comics/books) it didn't happen and is just the opinion of one person. Of course they'll add it to the EC, with some excuse that may or may not be enough to satisfy people, but until then, relays destroyed = big kaboom.

Thank you.  The codex says one thing will happen if a relay is destroyed.  The one example we had before the ending of a relay being destroyed proved this as true.  Nothing other than speculation that "the means by which the relay is destroyed determines the damage" can be said for no supernova, but nothing in the game's lore supports this.

It amazes me that use of the given examples and facts = hatred of the ending.

If the writer's wanted to imply that the energy we see spreading from destroyed relays is harmless then show if washing over a planet and doing no damage.  Don't show it traveling at FTL speed and tearing through the back end of the Normandy.

[Funkdrspot]

Aaleel wrote...

daecath wrote...

DubVee12 wrote...

People continue to believe it because it justifies hatred of the ending.

Plenty of other reasons to hate the ending without this one point. Plus, in game info says destroyed relay = bad news. One writer's brief twitter post in a desperate attempt to reduce some of the hatred doesn't change anything. Unless it's in the game (or some other canon work like comics/books) it didn't happen and is just the opinion of one person. Of course they'll add it to the EC, with some excuse that may or may not be enough to satisfy people, but until then, relays destroyed = big kaboom.

Thank you.  The codex says one thing will happen if a relay is destroyed.  The one example we had before the ending of a relay being destroyed proved this as true.  Nothing other than speculation that "the means by which the relay is destroyed determines the damage" can be said for no supernova, but nothing in the game's lore supports this.

It amazes me that use of the given examples and facts = hatred of the ending.

If the writer's wanted to imply that the energy we see spreading from destroyed relays is harmless then show if washing over a planet and doing no damage.  Don't show it traveling at FTL speed and tearing through the back end of the Normandy.

LoL maybe i should make a new thread. The amount of people jumping in to state what has already been stated and disputed is ridiculous. It prevents us from having any progress on the convo.

[Funkdrspot]

daecath wrote...

DubVee12 wrote...

People continue to believe it because it justifies hatred of the ending.

Plenty of other reasons to hate the ending without this one point. Plus, in game info says destroyed relay = bad news. One writer's brief twitter post in a desperate attempt to reduce some of the hatred doesn't change anything. Unless it's in the game (or some other canon work like comics/books) it didn't happen and is just the opinion of one person. Of course they'll add it to the EC, with some excuse that may or may not be enough to satisfy people, but until then, relays destroyed = big kaboom.

Your entire point and many like you is based entirely on a fallacy of accident

Modifié par Funkdrspot, 02 mai 2012 - 03:05 .

[DistantUtopia]

All of a sudden I'm seeing an 'Ah, yes. "Supernovas." We have dismissed that claim.' from Bioware.

[Taboo]

It still doesn't justify Joker's scientifically impossible landing.

Or why they showed the relays blowing up.

It could have ended after Shepard made his choice.........

[Krunjar]

Look guys Mass Relays are a fictional technology. Which means that they can in fact blow up in a star destroying AND a non lethal way if the writers want them to. Plus it's really not so hard to imagine. At the end of Arrival the energy of the mass relay had nowhere to go so it just blew out in an all destroying wave. Whearas in the end of ME3 the energy of the relays was channeled into doing whatever it was they where set off to do. It's so easy to imagine and its again a FICTIONAL TECHNOLOGY so sorry nit picking it is kinda like star trek fans arguing about the technical schematics of warp engines. It's asinine and only a symptom of their own personal distatste for what happened it's not a logical or even understandable argument.

Remember folks just because the structure of the mass relay is destroyed DOES NOT MEAN THE SAME THING HAPPENED!

Modifié par Krunjar, 02 mai 2012 - 09:33 .

[luchozuca]

Aaleel wrote...

They can retcon all they want.



But I know what I saw, and I know what everything in the game points to.

Read OP, read second post.

/thread

You can paint it with more colored space magic on EC DLC, but "Relays only overloaded" when you can clearly see them torn to pieces on all three colors is crapsauce, why would the explosion destroy the Relay but its shockwave be harmless, something missing there huh?
I would go as far as tolerating the "they did not go supernova like Arrival" although it is also inconsistent with the rest of the plot, but they exploded nonetheless.

Modifié par luchozuca, 02 mai 2012 - 09:39 .

[Krunjar]

Aye theres no real reason to say they didn't explode the Catalyst itself said the mass relays would be destroyed. However it's actually hugeley illogical to think that the catalyst would give you options that would result in the cataclysmic destruction of the entire civilized galaxy. If that was what he wanted he could have set the relays to go Nova millions of years before the human race was even born. It is far far more logical to assume the relays destructed in a non-lethal mannar than in a lethal one. Lethal makes no sense at all. And any comparison to arrival assumes complete understanding of relay tech which dousn't exist because it is fictional XD

[GreggerG]

Starchild: The relays will be destroyed.
Codex: Destroying relays is bad news mmmmkay?
Arrival: Destroying a relay is seriously bad news guys. Guys?
Ending scene: Relays being destroyed.
Some twitter post: That's not what you were supposed to think happened.
Me: Well, why the **** didn't you make it clear so we would know what happened?
Message board: Arguments ensue...

[sistersafetypin]

Funkdrspot wrote...

Optimystic_X wrote...

ckriley wrote...

DubVee12 wrote...

People continue to believe it because it justifies hatred of the ending.

And /thread.

x4. thats the general feeling i get as well. People just turn off their thinking when theyre presented with an idea or theory that goes against their beliefs. The ad nauseam, circular logic and outright ignoring the variables between the ending and alpha relay is kinda old.

The funny thing is, the only people turning off their thinking are the ones willing to blindly believe what's posted on twitter as opposed to what happens in the game.

[nitefyre410]

Comguard2 wrote...

Just another example of how they put zero effort in the whole story.

ME 2: Arrival DLC: Destruction of a Mass Relay is bad, destroys everything.

ME 3: Codex: Destruction of a Mass Relay is bad, destroys everything.

Ending of ME 3: You thought the explosion meant that the Mass Relay is destroyed? No stupid gamers, isn't it obvious that the explosion that damages the Normandy, can burn everyone on earth and physically crushes the Relay is just an overload? How couldn't you see it?

Every information given in the game, even in the ME3-codex, tells us that those Mass Relays caused a mass extinction event.

Why the Mass Relays didn't just stop glowing and moving to indicate an overload? Why did they include the explosions.

It's like there was a bet going on, how many plotholes can you create in 5 minutes.

 


Bioware: This is not the relay explosion you are looking for.  *Hand wave*

Me:  <_<   Really because it looks the relays just blew  up in very bright colored explosion   in a  chain reaction.  


Esstainly  BIoware once again with the ending  messed up  and now they are trying to handwave thery're way out of a corner... 

I'm rather amused and I want to see how this all plays out. 

Modifié par nitefyre410, 02 mai 2012 - 10:17 .

[wizardryforever]

sistersafetypin wrote...

Funkdrspot wrote...

Optimystic_X wrote...

ckriley wrote...

DubVee12 wrote...

People continue to believe it because it justifies hatred of the ending.

And /thread.

x4. thats the general feeling i get as well. People just turn off their thinking when theyre presented with an idea or theory that goes against their beliefs. The ad nauseam, circular logic and outright ignoring the variables between the ending and alpha relay is kinda old.

The funny thing is, the only people turning off their thinking are the ones willing to blindly believe what's posted on twitter as opposed to what happens in the game.

The cinematics in-game are vague enough to interpret the relays' destruction in a number of different ways.  And then when Bioware clarifies exactly what it meant, you claim that the one's who actually accept what they say instead of sticking to their own viewpoint are blind?  I don't think you understand what blindness is, if you really believe that.

[sistersafetypin]

wizardryforever wrote...

sistersafetypin wrote...

Funkdrspot wrote...

Optimystic_X wrote...

ckriley wrote...

DubVee12 wrote...

People continue to believe it because it justifies hatred of the ending.

And /thread.

x4. thats the general feeling i get as well. People just turn off their thinking when theyre presented with an idea or theory that goes against their beliefs. The ad nauseam, circular logic and outright ignoring the variables between the ending and alpha relay is kinda old.

The funny thing is, the only people turning off their thinking are the ones willing to blindly believe what's posted on twitter as opposed to what happens in the game.

The cinematics in-game are vague enough to interpret the relays' destruction in a number of different ways.  And then when Bioware clarifies exactly what it meant, you claim that the one's who actually accept what they say instead of sticking to their own viewpoint are blind?  I don't think you understand what blindness is, if you really believe that.

No. I don't think you understand the way Universe Lore works. If it's said outside of the game, on Twiter no less... It is not Universe Lore. That is called a handwave. Or Space Magic if you like.

[Mcfly616]

Comguard2 wrote...

Just another example of how they put zero effort in the whole story.

ME 2: Arrival DLC: Destruction of a Mass Relay is bad, destroys everything.

ME 3: Codex: Destruction of a Mass Relay is bad, destroys everything.

Ending of ME 3: You thought the explosion meant that the Mass Relay is destroyed? No stupid gamers, isn't it obvious that the explosion that damages the Normandy, can burn everyone on earth and physically crushes the Relay is just an overload? How couldn't you see it?

Every information given in the game, even in the ME3-codex, tells us that those Mass Relays caused a mass extinction event.

Why the Mass Relays didn't just stop glowing and moving to indicate an overload? Why did they include the explosions.

It's like there was a bet going on, how many plotholes can you create in 5 minutes.

This.....exactly this.....


Its the precise reason why the ending sucks.....

Not because Shep dies. Not because of Gilligans Planet. And (as much as we all hate him) its not because of Star Jar.....

Yes, some of these things we all dislike in some way or another but the Catalyst was the lazy writing of (whoever it was that wrote) the ending.

They contradict everything we've come to learn through 3 games, in a matter of 5 minutes....it really is unbelievable. And to put the cherry on top, they make every little bit of the ending ambiguously vague. Not only should such an ending be reserved to stand-alone stories and the middle installment of a trilogy, but above all else an ambiguously vague ending has no place as the finale of any trilogy.....

Things we've come to know from Mass Effect:

Joker is brave in the face of death. He loves the pressure of battle. He's most fearless and determined when the stakes are highest.

When a Mass Relay "explodes" it is NO GOOD



What we were shown in ME3:

Joker flying away as the Battle for Earth is coming to its climax, and the energy from.the "exploding" mass relay dismantling the Normandy

Mass Relays "exploding". How do we know it was exploding? Well usually when something is getting torn apart in a violent and fiery fashion, we call that an Explosion.


They show these these scenes in such a quick and vague way, that they are mere contradictions. If those scenes would've been lead into, instead of throwing us into the middle of them and cutting away from it before we can see what happens, then maybe it would've worked....

And now they go on Twitter and further contradict what they so vaguely showed us in the ending. Saying that, "oh they just overloaded and Joker isn't a coward".....well what did you expect fans to get from what was shown in the ending?

The whole ending is a cluster-f*** of contradictions that are further contradicted by anybody from Bioware that comments on them....

This is on top of all the other ridiculous things that occur in those final minutes, but we wont get into that (Really, Anderson? You came up behind me? That's weird because I didnt see anybody helping me out with Marauder Shields. And if you're telling the truth, how in the name of Zeus' butthole did you get to the control panel first?!)


And the worst worst worst part of the ambiguously vague "let's leave it all up to the imagination because 'what the hell', this is Shepards last game" moments: Shepard breathing in the rubble!


WHYYYYYYYYYYYY??????!!!!!!!!!

[Krunjar]

OK that's it I give up I started posting in this forum assuming i could have a coherant discussion about the game with other people who despite what you say clearly loved the game otherwise you wouldn't care! All you  do is repeat the same tired old arguments I counter it and you  cite the same old so called "proof" you  have used to justify youre self entitled sense of dissapointment.

you guys are WORSE than ANIME FANS!

Btw i like Anime just hate the rabid fans. But not as much as most of you.

Modifié par Krunjar, 02 mai 2012 - 10:35 .