264 réponses à ce sujet

[Sebba da God]

Modifié par Sebba da God, 01 mai 2012 - 06:11 .

[Dexi]

Getorex wrote...

Tazzmission wrote...

The Grey Nayr wrote...

Ghost-621 wrote...

jreezy made me do it.

Well, this thread sets out to discuss pretty much the opposite point of what the "What if the EC is awesome" has.

A majority of the Mass Effect fans didn't want an extended or "clarified" version of the crappy ending, they wanted BioWare to make it right and remake the ending.

Shoveling more feces onto a pile of feces won't make it less fecal, no matter how "symbolic" the feces are.

The only thing that made the ending "crappy" was the lack of explanation and answers. Extended Cut is just what the doctor asked for.

now this right here i agree with 100%

No.  The ending was objectively crappy like it or not.  It was crappy because it was predicated upon nonsense that contradicted the very game you were just finishing.  It was crappy because it came out of nowhere with a new magical agent running the show.  It was objectively crappy because it totally negated EVERYTHING you did before in all 3 games. 

Mh, no. It, objectively did none of those, maybe just in your opinion, and then there's subjectivity.

Just because you put "objective" to what adjectives you deem appropriate to the ending doesn't make it objective, sorry. I stopped reading where I stopped the quote, but I also skimed a bit through your post and all I could read is "shortsightness, shortsightness, shortsightness etc"

It's your choice to dislike something, but don't push it as the general and unaffected truth, because it's really not. 


To me, the ending made sense. It hadn't contradicted a single thing. Sure, it approached problems differently than I'd wished, but it doesn't mean that because I wished/thought the problem to be handled differently, it negates all 3 games. 

Modifié par Dexi, 01 mai 2012 - 06:37 .

[abaris]

Dexi wrote...

To me, the ending made sense. It hadn't contradicted a single thing. Sure, it approached problems differently than I'd wished, but it doesn't mean that because I wished/thought the problem to be handled differently, it negates all 3 games. 

Makes no real sense, assuming you resolved the Geth/Quarian conflict. Makes no sense on many levels if you try to approach it logically.

Tastes however are different and always in the eye of the beholder.

[Emzamination]

abaris wrote...

Dexi wrote...

To me, the ending made sense. It hadn't contradicted a single thing. Sure, it approached problems differently than I'd wished, but it doesn't mean that because I wished/thought the problem to be handled differently, it negates all 3 games. 

Makes no real sense, assuming you resolved the Geth/Quarian conflict. Makes no sense on many levels if you try to approach it logically.

Tastes however are different and always in the eye of the beholder.

I've went over the ending logically and I found nothing out of place, logically.

[dmonorato]

Emzamination wrote...

Ghost-621 wrote...

Emzamination wrote...

Ghost-621 wrote...

Emzamination wrote...

This hatred has consumed and twisted you retakers against the company you once stood by, for shame.I shall pray that the retakers may find forgiveness and peace in Bioware once more, one day.

Who said anything about me being a Retaker? I just hate the ending...and pretty much most of ME3.

Your opening post is a retaker argument so you have been associated as such, blame jreezy.

SMH...

Guess what, the vast majority of Mass Effect fans vehemently hate the fact that they wasted hundreds of hours for an ending that ME3 gave them, and the vast majority of them are NOT part of "Retake."

When your opinions,arguments and goals differ from that of the Alpha anti-ending movement, only then will you be classified otherwise, until that day accept what you are.

So based on your obtuse logic you must be one of thoose "Pro-enders" that will blindly take whatever crap a company gives with a smile stating Thank you sir may I have another..... just saying since you seem to be sterotyping people.

I also suppose you never heard of one bad apple spoils the bunch? Just because a couple Retake members are rather vocal and obnoxious in there posts, doesen't mean they all are. Same can be said of the Pro-enders, bashing other opinions is what got BSN in tthe whole flame war hate spewing in the first place, and quite frankly you sir are not helping matters.

[JBONE27]

If it's terrible, then I'm not buying any new Bioware games again (I still might buy the Balder's Gate series and Jade Empire). This is not spiteful, it's simple logic. I don't want to buy something from someone who has lost their touch. For example, I didn't buy the latest Guns and Roses CD because, after hearing some tracks, I realized, it sucked. I love the old Guns and Roses, but their new stuff sucks, therefore I won't buy it. If they release something new, I probably won't buy it, but I will still check out a couple of their songs on youtube or something else that's free.

[Cancer Puppet]

All I really have to say about the EC is that it's not what I (and many others) have asked for, and if it doesn't really take me pleasantly by surprise then Bioware can forget about me paying for any future DLC for this game.

I also will not be pre-oredering DA3 (DA2 being another game I did not buy DLC for), and if they manage to alienate me any further with PR BS then I don't see myself buying any more of their products. ME2 was a great game, although the story in relation to the overall reaper plot was worthless. Ever since EA entered the picture things have been going down hill in my opinion.

[ZackG312]

Bye Bye Bye

[darthnick427]

If they take out the god awful Normandy running away and getting stranded and Shepard never seeing any of them again part the rest of the ending would be acceptable as long as they showed war assets kicking serious ass. Even though I'd still hate starbrat

Modifié par darthnick427, 24 mai 2012 - 06:19 .

[Getorex]

Emzamination wrote...

abaris wrote...

Dexi wrote...

To me, the ending made sense. It hadn't contradicted a single thing. Sure, it approached problems differently than I'd wished, but it doesn't mean that because I wished/thought the problem to be handled differently, it negates all 3 games. 

Makes no real sense, assuming you resolved the Geth/Quarian conflict. Makes no sense on many levels if you try to approach it logically.

Tastes however are different and always in the eye of the beholder.

I've went over the ending logically and I found nothing out of place, logically.

You clearly don't actually know what logic entails.  It is kinda mathematical.  A + B = C, D + E = C, therefore A + B = D + E.  The ending in ME3 does NOT follow even this simple logic at all.  It adds ridiculous agency (a stupid toddler) out of no where to be the Ghost in the Machine.  It has Shepard die for NO logical or defenisble reason in ALL THREE ENDINGS.  There is NOTHING logical about control = death, synthesis = death, or even destruction = death.  There is nothing about control or synthesis in particular that can possibly and logically require the demise of ANYONE.  I don't die when I control my car, an RC aircraft, a rifle, a mouse pointer, my cell phone, etc.  NOTHING about control = death.  Synthesis "to create a new type of DNA" is by itself OBJECTIVELY ILLOGICAL.  There is NO SUCH THING EVEN POSSIBLE.  DNA is DNA by definition and it is organic no matter WHAT you do with it.  It cannot be DNA if it isn't DEOXYRIBOSE NUCLEIC ACID.  You can even change the nucleic acids to DIFFERENT nucleic acids but it would still be DNA by definition.  You could add a silicon molecule to it somewhere (for no valid reason) and it would STILL be DNA and ORGANIC by definition (containing carbon).  You could NOT replace all the carbons with silicon because silicon cannot make all the same covalent bonds as carbon, first of all, and it wouldn't be DNA anymore if you did because DEOXYRIBOSE is a sugar and sugar is carbon-based and ORGANIC by definition.  Cannot be different.  If you make it RIBONUCLEIC acid by simply reducing the 2' H with OH you merely get RNA instead of DNA and it is STILL ORGANIC and unsuitable as a replacement in any case...you would also be backtracking evolutionarily and you couldn't call it a "new type of DNA".  Illogic upon illogic upon illogic is "new kind of DNA".  IMPOSSIBLE.  Then there's the very basis: that you can combine synthetic DNA with organic DNA!  Synthetics DON'T HAVE OR NEED DNA!  Even if you did make a synthetic (meaning machine-type AI) that had DNA in it, you know what it would be based upon?  The DNA of the creators, most likely.  Even if it was made up new and unique as a synthetic biology experiment, it would STILL be normal old DNA, just different genes and organization than their 'creator's' DNA BUT IT WOULD STILL BE SIMPLE DNA.  There is no "new type of DNA."  Period.

Then there is the illogic of "synthetics always turn on their creators so I, starchild, needed to create synthetics to kill you before your own synthetics did the job for me".  Huh?  That is toddler logic right there and so in a way it is fitting that a toddler is the one spouting that nonsense.  Do you know what it takes to overthrow any theory or hypothesis?  Merely a single contrary example disproving the thesis/hypothesis.  In ME3 we have TWO contrary examples that disprove the starchild's toddler thesis: Most damningly we have the Geth and Quarians.  You can easily make peace between them both.  But even if you don't the toddler's thesis is disproven!  Why?  Because the creators (the Quarians) are the ones that turned on their synthetic creations, NOT THE OTHER WAY AROUND!  In fact, the Geth held back retaliating (most people would say they refrained from exercising their inalienable basic right of self-defense) against the Quarians until the Quarians proved that they were going to go too far and actually try to eliminate (commit genocide) ALL Geth.  The Geth didn't want to fight their creators but reluctantly did take up arms against them IN SELF DEFENSE ONLY.  Worse still, the ONLY Geth that continued to fight their "creators" after the justified initial rebellion against the Quarians were those being driven/controlled by the Reapers!  So here you have the synthetics created by space toddler forcing SOME synthetics (part of the Geth) to try to destroy the Quarians (their creators) but the Reapers had to FORCE them to because they just weren't into that schtick all on their own! 

Holy CRAP!  The evidence disproving the toddler's stupid thesis (on its very face it is stupid) is piling up like Mt Everest!  There can be no argument contrary to this because it came out CLEARLY thus in ME3 not long before the retarded child spouted his nonsense!  

Then we have the independent disproving example of EDI.  Yup.  There's EDI who not only does not even BEGIN to want to destroy her creators, she actually wants to become as close to human as she can...so she can have a relationship with one of the members of the creators!  I guess you think that wanting to have a relationship (including sex and love) with a creator = destroy eh?  I'd hate to see the state of YOUR relationships.  

TWO contrary examples to the toddler thesis disproves the toddler's thesis irrevocably.  This is just a fact.  It cannot be argued away or hand-waved away.  The ONLY handwaving in this whole thing is the current ending and the handwaving by the unthinking minority who claim the ending "made sense".  No it didn't by the rules of logic.  No it didn't by objective evidence in the very same game.  No it didn't, objectively it simply didn't.  It CANNOT be made to make sense.  It cannot be made to be logical unless it is claimed to be a fevered dream or hallucination (the basis of the IT, which I personally dislike as a fix but it is the ONLY way to use the current ending in a way that actually works logically).  Fever dreams/hallucinations do not have to be logical - they never are.  Thus the illogic of the ending, the OBJECTIVE illogic, can only be made reasonable by adopting IT.  

Beyond that, the ending has to be totally thrown out and redone.  There are no other options available to make it "logical" and "reasonable".

Modifié par Getorex, 24 mai 2012 - 02:49 .

[Scalabrine]

I made a thread on how EC is a win win for BW in which i said it would suck. I got bombarded on how i could judge it, if i haven't seen it. Well ****s we already know it's gonna suck cause the endings aren't changing.


So yeah EC will be terrible.

[AlanC9]

 

simfamSP wrote...
That choice would have mattered if the Rachni showed up on the bloody field [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/angry.png[/smilie]

 

Wouldn't allied rachni on the battlefield have been a friendly-fire incident waiting to happen?

Modifié par AlanC9, 24 mai 2012 - 02:57 .

[Getorex]

Cancer Puppet wrote...

All I really have to say about the EC is that it's not what I (and many others) have asked for, and if it doesn't really take me pleasantly by surprise then Bioware can forget about me paying for any future DLC for this game.

I also will not be pre-oredering DA3 (DA2 being another game I did not buy DLC for), and if they manage to alienate me any further with PR BS then I don't see myself buying any more of their products. ME2 was a great game, although the story in relation to the overall reaper plot was worthless. Ever since EA entered the picture things have been going down hill in my opinion.

All this EA hate.  Maybe the ire directed their way is valid, but maybe not.  Until and unless Hudson or some other exec at Bioware comes out and states that "EA pushed a diamond-hard release date and thus forced us to come up with an ending, any ending, so we did what we could with the time available", then I put it all on Hudson.  HE is the one who PERSONALLY whipped up the nonsense that is the ending.  HE did it.  He is simply not an author and is out of his depth.  He should not be wearing "writer" shoes when he is most suited to be a mere bean counter/manager.  Being an exec does NOT make you a genius by any stretch.  It does NOT make you a master coder, it does NOT make you a screenwriter, it does NOT make you a writer at all.  Writers write, execs make phone calls, insult/threaten employees, sometimes cajole employees, pad their own bank accounts with unearned "bonuses", etc.  

In short, without definitive proof that EA had a major hand in the ending of ME3 (and thus the destruction of the franchise) then it is all on Bioware and Hudson in particular.

[Getorex]

Scalabrine wrote...

I made a thread on how EC is a win win for BW in which i said it would suck. I got bombarded on how i could judge it, if i haven't seen it. Well ****s we already know it's gonna suck cause the endings aren't changing.


So yeah EC will be terrible.

True.  It simply cannot be otherwise given the circumstances. 

[forthary]

I'll see what happens. But let's say for a moment it is bad. I definitely would need to know why by playing it. If there's a good reason it is bad, then the game is dead in the water for me. No more chances. The series is done for me. Frankly, I see the EC as the only chance for this game to redeem itself. I don't think (But yet, somehow, don't think its impossible) this game will be worthy of GOTY status, but if the EC succeeds at giving us a great ending, there might just be hope for this game.

I know Bioware will do other DLC, such as Take Back Omega, but I think one of the things they should try doing is giving us a in-game editor, if the EC succeeds. I know, it sounds like a silly idea, but people love not only commander Shepard, but also a good portion of the characters in-game. Giving the players an editor is a great way to end the series so Bioware can work on other games, and not to mention the players can fix the plotholes and add wonderful content in-game with it.

[farlander28]

Tazzmission wrote...

people just need to quit always assuming the worst

Because EA/BW hasn't given us reason after reason to assume the worst, right? It stuns me how some people can still delude themselves into giving EA/BW the benefit of the doubt on, well, ANYTHING.

Modifié par farlander28, 24 mai 2012 - 03:06 .

[Getorex]

forthary wrote...

I'll see what happens. But let's say for a moment it is bad. I definitely would need to know why by playing it. If there's a good reason it is bad, then the game is dead in the water for me. No more chances. The series is done for me. Frankly, I see the EC as the only chance for this game to redeem itself. I don't think (But yet, somehow, don't think its impossible) this game will be worthy of GOTY status, but if the EC succeeds at giving us a great ending, there might just be hope for this game.

I know Bioware will do other DLC, such as Take Back Omega, but I think one of the things they should try doing is giving us a in-game editor, if the EC succeeds. I know, it sounds like a silly idea, but people love not only commander Shepard, but also a good portion of the characters in-game. Giving the players an editor is a great way to end the series so Bioware can work on other games, and not to mention the players can fix the plotholes and add wonderful content in-game with it.

Seriously, why do you need to play it?  Hell, you wont be able to "play it" anyway because all it is going to be is hands-off cutscene!  It is passive, not active.  You get the same effect by watching the Youtube videos of the EC rather than wasting time (and it will be total waste of time) "playing" it.  Passively watching Youtube vids of the EC is precisely the same as passively watching it in game only you don't have to waste your time firing up the game to do it (or if you were more reasonable, you would have uninstalled the stupid game after ONE playthrough and thus need to reinstall the game in order to simply view a few minutes of cutscene!  Silly!).

Youtube is faster and better than downloading a big cutscene and starting the game...just so you can passively watch the suck.

[Uccio]

The ending will be horrible and people will moan and cry out for months to come. It will be pure art and shows the artistic view of the ME3 dev team.


Note to self: Bioware is no longer making games, they make art now. It is allowed to be illogical and make no sense. Bio Art cannot be criticized either.

Modifié par Ukki, 24 mai 2012 - 03:12 .

[Getorex]

When is this stupid EC supposed to be released anyway? I was under the impression originally that it would be out by now, or close to now (the end of May). It would be so much easier if I had a target timeframe to look to so I don't have to keep logging in here and waste a few minutes to see if there has been an announcement. I just want to know when to search Youtube for the EC disaster.

Anyone?

[farlander28]

The Grey Nayr wrote...

The only thing that made the ending "crappy" was the lack of explanation and answers. Extended Cut is just what the doctor asked for.

You forgot the "IMHO" part. According to everyone with more than two brain cells to rub together, on the other hand, there were many problems with the ending. Deus ex machina starchild is the worst of them, with all the plot holes he opens (Geth/Quarian peace proves he's wrong, why did Sovereign need to exist if he was already a part of the citadel, etc.)

Don't assume that everyone else is as easy to please as you. Some of us have standards.

[AlanC9]

Getorex wrote...

When is this stupid EC supposed to be released anyway? I was under the impression originally that it would be out by now, or close to now (the end of May). It would be so much easier if I had a target timeframe to look to so I don't have to keep logging in here and waste a few minutes to see if there has been an announcement. I just want to know when to search Youtube for the EC disaster.

Anyone?

So you're seriously interested in the EC because you can't wait to unleash hatred on it?

Where did you get the idea that it would be out by the end of May? That's almost as silly as that Planet Incestus idea you used to push.

[farlander28]

Sebba da God wrote...

Ive restored some hope in Bioware after this tweet: Q: You can't wait? Does that mean you guys might actually do something about the endings? Like, maybe fix them?

JessicaMerizan: The team is working really hard right now on the EC DLC and I'm pleased with what's coming out of their work so far

You know she's required to say things like this, right? She's an employee of EA/BW, which means that *if* she says anything at all, it's going to be positive. To do otherwise would get her into trouble.

Or do you just not understand how business works? These people aren't your friends, they're employees of a corporate entity.