410 réponses à ce sujet

[The Angry One]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

I don't feel it breaks characters because they find love with someone else not called Shepard. What breaks characters and makes them fan servicey is when they cater to the whims of the player character. Also note: two party members can get together in DA2.

I was no more fond of Fenris cheating on me than I am of Garrus cheating on me.
Yes they're cheating on me even if I never romanced them. *shakes fist*

[nitefyre410]

The Angry One wrote...

Allan Schumacher wrote...

I don't feel it breaks characters because they find love with someone else not called Shepard. What breaks characters and makes them fan servicey is when they cater to the whims of the player character. Also note: two party members can get together in DA2.

I was no more fond of Fenris cheating on me than I am of Garrus cheating on me.
Yes they're cheating on me even if I never romanced them. *shakes fist*

 

:huh:  

*backs away...very slowly.* 

[Unit-Alpha]

They deserve someone who loves them.

At least before they starve to death on Planet X.

[dreman9999]

Cecilia L wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...

nitefyre410 wrote...

Why does them hooking up bother people so much?... really its not the big of a deal.

It doesn't bother me so much. I just wish Bioware would stop taking cheap shots. It's the same as "everyone is bi". They break characters that way. That's like as if Morrigan and Alistair fall in love at the end of DA:O just because the Warden picks Zevran or Leliana or something. It is basically reducing characters to fanservice. They know people may want to see that happen and so do it, completely disregarding character's personality. I mean if they had built it up from ME1 over ME2 to ME3 where you can see that they really like each other, but there is nothing like that. It is poor writing and belittles the game, the writers and the characters. They should just stop doing things because they think "that would be cool" or something. Characters are supposed to have personality and act accordingly and situations develop accordingly. But Bioware sometimes just seems to mesh stuff together randomly because they think it is a good idea at the time.

This^

Also what thefallen2far said about how it is a big deal for them to romance Shepard in ME2. Garrus has never thought about being with a non-turian and it first wierds him out a bit when Femshep makes a move. Tali's got her whole immune system thing, plus, if Shep is male she is head over heels in love with him. It just seems cheap that she has gotten over him that fast from probably already having a crush on him in ME1.

Personally, I haven't heard their dialogue, but it seems like a cute romance. And the Normandy could use a little more love in these dark times. It's just completely against their personalities and it breaks their characters.

Also, my two primary canon sheps are frowning upon their relationship. As Deathstroke123 put it:

Deathstroke123 wrote...

How dare Garrus touch my waifu in an alternate universe where this Shep has no interest in her!?
Cheating across dimensions still counts!

You're  forgetting  to take in the fact that Shepard may of been interested in to Tali since ME1. It's the same case of Kadine being a male love interest in ME3. There is nothing off character for Tali to like or be attractive to Shepard, Quarian and Human bodies are simular. In my case, I liked her since ME1, but she didn't express any interest till ME2.

Modifié par dreman9999, 30 avril 2012 - 04:21 .

[wickedgoodreed]

Linksys17 wrote...

Have one or both of them die on the suicide mission, evil psychic shephard laugh

Tali still heads up to the main battery before the final battle and mourns Garrus instead. She's got it bad for the dude.


(And, yes, I'm a monster that has a save file with no Garrus.)

[Cecilia L]

dreman9999 wrote...

You from get to take in the fact thatShepard may of beeninterested in to Tali since ME1. It's the same case of Kadine being a male love interest in ME3. There is nothing off character for Tali to like of be attractive to Shepard, Quian and Human bodies are simular. In my case I like her since ME1, but she didn't express any interest till ME2.

wut?

Could you repeat that slowly?

[XTR3M3]

all the things wrong with ME3 and this is what some people complain about?

[CmnDwnWrkn]

Allan Schumacher wrote...

If Shepard and his/her love interest is able to find love within the span of one game, then as far as I'm concerned the crew members can do the same without it breaking verisimilitude.

Especially given Tali's comments from engineering about Garrus keeping things at a distance, and Garrus' "Wait what?"

I don't feel it breaks characters because they find love with someone else not called Shepard. What breaks characters and makes them fan servicey is when they cater to the whims of the player character. Also note: two party members can get together in DA2.

There are no characters that Shepard can have zero interest in for the first 2 1/2 games, and then suddenly have a romance with in the final 1/2 of the final game.  That's the whole problem with it.  You have 2 1/2 games where Tali and Garrus express no interest in each other.  Then, magically they're "a thing" right at the end.

It definitely seems like fan service, especially when the issue is forced with lines like.

Garrus: "How about you? You ever mind serving on an all-human ship?"

Tali: "It's not ALL human...as long as YOU'RE here."

Ummm, Liara, Javik, and EDI, anyone??

What this tells me is that the writers were looking for something, anything, to force Tali and Garrus into some quick bonding/flirting.  Oh I know, let's have them bond over being the only aliens on an all human ship!  They'll naturally get together in that case!  Okay, except for the fact that they aren't the only aliens on the ship.

Modifié par CmnDwnWrkn, 30 avril 2012 - 03:45 .

[Pride Demon]

Other then romancing one of them or killing one of them? No...
Then again them hooking up, while feeling a bit out of the blue, isn't that problematic, at least to me (and my main Sheps romanced Tali and Garrus respectively, so...), it's no big deal.

What I find curious however, is that they are literally the only two squadmates that hook up if you don't romance them (there's Jacob too, but he hooks up with someone else regardless of romance, so he doesn't count)...
And they automatically hook up if you start playing in ME3 (you have to import to romance them)...

*Dons tinfoil hat*
This is obviously a evil scheme to condition new players against romancing either of them!
They'd have started seeing them hooking up and thus be unwilling to "break them up" if they go back to previous games!
This in turn will cause the percentage of talimancers and garrusmancers among the fanbase to drop! They want us destroyed, brothers and sisters! *shakes fist*

'Tis the truth, the truth, me tells ya!
*Takes off tinfoil hat*

But seriously, I find it curious, I would have been interested in seeing someone else get together if Shep ignored them... :/

[dreman9999]

Cecilia L wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

You from get to take in the fact thatShepard may of beeninterested in to Tali since ME1. It's the same case of Kadine being a male love interest in ME3. There is nothing off character for Tali to like of be attractive to Shepard, Quian and Human bodies are simular. In my case I like her since ME1, but she didn't express any interest till ME2.

wut?

Could you repeat that slowly?

You're  forgetting  to take in the fact that Shepard may of been interested in to Tali since ME1. It's the same case of Kadine being a male love interest in ME3. There is nothing off character for Tali to like or be attractive to Shepard, Quarian and Human bodies are simular. In my case, I liked her since ME1, but she didn't express any interest till ME2. 

[Bfler]

Who is Kadine?

[Jat371]

Normally I'm reluctant to call people out for not having a life considering we're all playing the same 100 hour trilogy but... seriously get a life.

[Dyorgarel Inkin]

I am not a big fan of xenophilia in Mass Effect. So, yes, I do understand the opening post.

And she wears an helmet for christ's sake!

[Mr. Big Pimpin]

I find it extremely strange how in some threads people can brag about how they got every last quarian down to the last man, woman, and child killed, and have Tali jump off a cliff over it in grief, and nobody insults them or calls them a horrible person for doing so. But somebody doesn't like an obviously shoehorned-in and contrived romance featuring that same character and want to prevent it from happening in their playthrough (which you can do for Joker/EDI, may I remind you) and they're called out by half the foum for being a dick. Stay classy, BSN.

Anyway, I pretty much always romance one or the other myself, so it's not really a problem for me.

[azerSheppard]

LMAO loser ****blocks trying to e-block digibro garrus.

[PsyrenY]

CmnDwnWrkn wrote...

Garrus: "How about you? You ever mind serving on an all-human ship?"

Tali: "It's not ALL human...as long as YOU'RE here."

Ummm, Liara, Javik, and EDI, anyone??

You do remember that line was part of a conversation about being dextro aliens right? Javik et al. are not.

[CmnDwnWrkn]

Christ, it's even worse than I thought! I just watched the "chocolate flirtation" during Geth Dreadnought. Talk about undermining a character...

Keep in mind, during all previous missions Tali has been on involving the Quarians, she is 100% focused on the mission, because she cares so deeply about her people. Even with Shepard in ME2, when she is very much in love with him, she is totally focused on the mission.

Now, the stakes are significantly higher - the potential destruction of the entire Quarian fleet. Maybe it's just me, but it doesn't seem like the most appropriate time for her to engage in lighthearted banter about food on the Normandy and Turian chocolates. Sure, my people might be obliterated within the next couple of hours, BUT I REALLY LIKE THIS GUY. Sorry, but this gets a Javik-sized facepalm (four eyes covered).

Again, it's not about whether two people are compatible in a general sense. The problem is with the writers deciding to violate a character's values in order to squeeze in a token romance.

For the record, I also think the banter between Shep and Tali is ridiculous, but at least they're in a relationship for that to happen, which makes it slightly more forgivable.

[Kilshrek]

Why anyone would want to deny Brorrus some love with Broli is beyond me. And please excuse the bro's flying about.

Team dextro ftw! Sadly, a bug prevented many of us from catching a second pair of crew members hooking up, down in the engine room too! For a moment I thought there'd even be a bit of Greg and Karin going on. Geez man, the Normandy really turned into a love boat.

[CmnDwnWrkn]

Optimystic_X wrote...

CmnDwnWrkn wrote...

Garrus: "How about you? You ever mind serving on an all-human ship?"

Tali: "It's not ALL human...as long as YOU'RE here."

Ummm, Liara, Javik, and EDI, anyone??

You do remember that line was part of a conversation about being dextro aliens right? Javik et al. are not.

So Javik "et al." are human?

[Jayelle Janson]

Unholyknight800 wrote...

Michel totally has the hots for Garrus.

Poor Dr. Michel, she's had the hots for him before he even met Tali.

The scenario of a universe where Michel replaces Chakwas as the ship's doctor and the three of them are stranded on Planet Eden would be an interesting one.

[Mr. Big Pimpin]

Jayelle Janson wrote...

Unholyknight800 wrote...

Michel totally has the hots for Garrus.

Poor Dr. Michel, she's had the hots for him before he even met Tali.

The scenario of a universe where Michel replaces Chakwas as the ship's doctor and the three of them are stranded on Planet Eden would be an interesting one.

My Shep's the ultimate cock-blocker. He romanced Tali and picked Chakwas over Michel as the crew doctor. Poor Garrus is forever-alone. Ah well, at least he'll always have his calibrations.

[Tapkomet]

Would have been better if everyone romanced each other if not romanced by you.
Liara+VS, Jack+Jacob (she would DESTROY HIM in ME3 for cheating), Thane+Kasumi, Zaeed+Samara (Shepard is just not her type), Vega+Morinth etc.

[PsyrenY]

 

CmnDwnWrkn wrote...

So Javik "et al." are human?

No, but they can eat human food and thus have a little more in common with the other crew than Garrus and Tali do.

Mr. Big Pimpin wrote...

My Shep's the ultimate ****-blocker. He romanced Tali and picked Chakwas over Michel as the crew doctor. Poor Garrus is forever-alone. Ah well, at least he'll always have his calibrations.

Mine was the opposite - romanced Garrus and read the Kal'Reegar e-mail, leaving Tali forever alone.
(Well, I suppose she could shack up with Veetor.)

[Pallid]

Tapkomet wrote...

Would have been better if everyone romanced each other if not romanced by you.
Liara+VS, Jack+Jacob (she would DESTROY HIM in ME3 for cheating), Thane+Kasumi, Zaeed+Samara (Shepard is just not her type), Vega+Morinth etc.

That would be fair. But then those people who now are "happy for Tali+Garrus" would be raging about their LI's hooking up with someone else...

[Allan Schumacher]

CmnDwnWrkn wrote...

There are no characters that Shepard can have zero interest in for the first 2 1/2 games, and then suddenly have a romance with in the final 1/2 of the final game.  That's the whole problem with it.  You have 2 1/2 games where Tali and Garrus express no interest in each other.  Then, magically they're "a thing" right at the end.

I just keep tripping up on why this is an issue.  Is the idea that they grow into an attraction something that unfathomable?  It's certainly something that happens a lot in real life.

They are both characters that have grown a lot since ME2 and I guess I don't see it as being something that "suddenly jumps out."  Especially since, from a male Shepard perspective, Tali had a crush on Shepard and has since then moved on (good for her).

It definitely seems like fan service, especially when the issue is forced with lines like.

Garrus: "How about you? You ever mind serving on an all-human ship?"

Tali: "It's not ALL human...as long as YOU'RE here."

Ummm, Liara, Javik, and EDI, anyone??

What this tells me is that the writers were looking for something, anything, to force Tali and Garrus into some quick bonding/flirting.  Oh I know, let's have them bond over being the only aliens on an all human ship!  They'll naturally get together in that case!  Okay, except for the fact that they aren't the only aliens on the ship.

If you genuinely feel that the writers were just trying to forcibly put Tali and Garrus into a relationship for no real good reason, then we're at a bit of an impasse.  I have no issues with the sequence and have seen situations like that happen in real life (between some of my own friends actually).  /shrug

The mere fact that you stumble upon them and they're embarrassed gives an indication that they weren't exactly being upfront with the rest of the crew on their feelings, and it likely slowly developed.  I'm sure a big part of what Tali appreciated was Garrus manning up and apologizing for his crass statements before.  Nevermind that the game follows Shepard so the idea that the crew may interact amongst themselves when Shepard isn't around also isn't far fetched.