843 réponses à ce sujet

[7isMagic]

I can't help but wonder (and I wonder if others have had the same thought) - Bioware may be holding out on this issue until they are satisfied they've milked MP for all it's worth.

Speculation on my part, I know.  But what is one to think after more than two months (rounding the corner on 3 months) of silence - not one OFFICIAL statement has been released regarding the SP tie-in to MP  (whether or not it was intentional or a bug) and no response to the fact 4K EMS isn't possible with SP alone?.   

Twitter, Facebook and the like are utterly unreliable in my book.    I will only accept an official statement either here at BSN (an OFFICIAL Bioware site, is it not?) or through an official press release.  

The only other answer I will accept:  A fix is included in the upcoming patch.

I've been thinking about this - the patch.  What if they include a fix but don't tell us WHY this issue reared its ugly head in the first place?   I won't care - as long as it is FINALLY fixed.  My game won't be broken anymore, thank goodness.

But my trust in Bioware has taken a serious hit because of this.  No more pre-orders and I won't be buying any of their games on the first day of release.   I won't buy anymore Bioware games until I'm am certain I'm not being lied to (or ignored) again.    

Modifié par 7isMagic, 25 mai 2012 - 12:03 .

[CmndrFisher]

Krogangreetings wrote...

I asked Chris on twitter and he gave me a small update on the patch that may or may not fix our problem

https://twitter.com/...781133156294656

in certification still, hopefully news soon

Would it hurt theses guys so much to come here on BSN, an official sight of Bioware to announce updates, etc.?  Why do we have to learn of updates at other places?  Is this not the place where we could learn of any progress on the issues?  Please, Bioware people,  show your face in here once in a while and let us know what's going on.  I am not a TwitFace so I'd appreciate some news in here.  OK?

Modifié par CmndrFisher, 25 mai 2012 - 08:14 .

[Krogangreetings]

CmndrFisher wrote...

Krogangreetings wrote...

I asked Chris on twitter and he gave me a small update on the patch that may or may not fix our problem

https://twitter.com/...781133156294656

in certification still, hopefully news soon

Would it hurt theses guys so much to come here on BSN, an official sight of Bioware to announce updates, etc.?  Why do we have to learn of updates at other places?  Is this not the place where we could learn of any progress on the issues?  Please, Bioware people,  show your face in here once in a while and let us know what's going on.  I am not a TwitFace so I'd appreciate some news in here.  OK?

It's not really news untill there is something to comment on

but I agree we should have been kept more in the loop on what was going on

if it's any help I did ask about the patch being announced on here

https://twitter.com/...796156272427009

[Kub666]

"@TheJasonPotter We'll announce everywhere, including BSN"

Still, it looks as if they care more about Twitter than BSN. Why not just close this place down, if they constantly give more updates somewhere else?

[NinjaDragonSword]

I want to be hopeful about this patch. I am not really sure it is going to address much. They probably got the patch that will effect the ending tied to the DLC Ending. Another word we wont see that until they release the Extended Cut DLC.

Modifié par NinjaDragonSword, 25 mai 2012 - 05:29 .

[Getorex]

OK, I'm not being facetious or an a-hole (at least not intentionally) when I ask this but...

Why do you people care? EMS, Readiness, etc, means nothing in the end. No matter how you play you still get essentially the same exact endings. Succeed in side missions, don't succeed. Play MP or don't. Doesn't really matter, and no, getting a quick flash of a gasping breath or not does NOT make the ending OK or "better". That is some pretty weak tea to think that all you have to do is see that gasp and all will be right with the game. No. Not at all.

So...why does it matter one way or another whether you can max EMS or whatever in SP mode or not? Sure, it is an dickish game design decision requiring MP to get a certain score above level x but fortunately, in this case, it doesn't really matter to the game as a whole. If, in fact, not being able to obtain a substantially different ending was predicated upon you achieving a certain score that could ONLY be accomplished by MP, then hell yes that would be something to scream about (and take more substantive action like boycott or worse) but that is not the case here. You see, or don't see, a mere 2-3 second flash of an ambiguous clip that does NOTHING to clarify the ending, does NOTHING to render the ending logical, reasonable, or viable. There's no there there.

[AlanC9]

Getorex wrote...

OK, I'm not being facetious or an a-hole (at least not intentionally) when I ask this but...

Why do you people care? EMS, Readiness, etc, means nothing in the end. No matter how you play you still get essentially the same exact endings. Succeed in side missions, don't succeed. Play MP or don't. Doesn't really matter, and no, getting a quick flash of a gasping breath or not does NOT make the ending OK or "better". That is some pretty weak tea to think that all you have to do is see that gasp and all will be right with the game. No. Not at all

Just guessing here -- but maybe, just maybe,  whether your PC lives or dies might be seen as significant by some folks, all other factors being equal.

Also...maybe, just maybe, not everyone posting here hates the endings as much as you do. Actually, I'm not sure anyone on the board hates them as much as you do.

Modifié par AlanC9, 25 mai 2012 - 05:38 .

[Getorex]

AlanC9 wrote...

Getorex wrote...

OK, I'm not being facetious or an a-hole (at least not intentionally) when I ask this but...

Why do you people care? EMS, Readiness, etc, means nothing in the end. No matter how you play you still get essentially the same exact endings. Succeed in side missions, don't succeed. Play MP or don't. Doesn't really matter, and no, getting a quick flash of a gasping breath or not does NOT make the ending OK or "better". That is some pretty weak tea to think that all you have to do is see that gasp and all will be right with the game. No. Not at all

Just guessing here -- but maybe, just maybe,  whether your PC lives or dies might be seen as significant by some folks, all other factors being equal.

Also...maybe, just maybe, not everyone posting here hates the endings as much as you do. Actually, I'm not sure anyone on the board hates them as much as you do.

The ending without the gasp does not clearly leave your "PC" dead.  Hell, Shepard has survived worse or similar so you can take from it what you will. 

Most people hate the ending.  I hate it because it offends logic, sensibility, reason, and the story from which it emits.  So yeah, I hate the ending for solid reasons...like most people. But what does THAT have to do with a literally 2-3 second clip of full-on ambiguity?  It would be different if you don't play MP at all but otherwise max out your points and then get to the end and can only pick 2 of the 3 colors, but that is not the case.  You get to choose the color of your subsequent explosions same as everyone else. 

A minor thing like a 3 second ambiguity is merely a "trick" to try and coax people to play MP come hell or high water.  How else are they going to earn those micropayments on gear in between run-and-gun sessions? 

[AlanC9]

Getorex wrote...
The ending without the gasp does not clearly leave your "PC" dead.  Hell, Shepard has survived worse or similar so you can take from it what you will.  

People like to have confirmation. (That's my impression, anyway -- like I said, none of my Sheps find that ending acceptable in the first place.)

For someone who's so sure he knows how other people think about the game, it's remarkable that you don't grasp this.

Edit: We all know what's going to be in the EC. This bonus clip will be expanded into a full-on reunion scene when the Normandy survivors are picked up by the Alliance. The pickup, of course, will happen whether or not the player picked this ending -- it;ll just govern who makes the pickup.

Modifié par AlanC9, 25 mai 2012 - 06:11 .

[Getorex]

AlanC9 wrote...

Getorex wrote...
The ending without the gasp does not clearly leave your "PC" dead.  Hell, Shepard has survived worse or similar so you can take from it what you will.  

People like to have confirmation. (That's my impression, anyway -- like I said, none of my Sheps find that ending acceptable in the first place.)

For someone who's so sure he knows how other people think about the game, it's remarkable that you don't grasp this.

Edit: We all know what's going to be in the EC. This bonus clip will be expanded into a full-on reunion scene when the Normandy survivors are picked up by the Alliance. The pickup, of course, will happen whether or not the player picked this ending -- it;ll just govern who makes the pickup.

No what I grasp is that some people just feel compelled to max out points for the sake of maxing out points.  I merely wanted to know if THAT was the primary motivation.

As for the hate for the ending, that is not even a position in question.  Most people, very large majority, disliked the ending.  There would be no EC coming down the pike if most people were cool with it.  Most people didn't/don't want an EC that merely expands on the same, current ending either but that is the expected by the most reasonable (there are a lot of people in these forums, however, who hold out unreasonable hope that a NEW and different ending is coming...some of them are ITers, though not all).

[AlanC9]

Nevertheless, you agree with me about what's actually going to be in the ending, right?

That will make the EMS issue important, even if you don't think it is now.

Modifié par AlanC9, 25 mai 2012 - 06:22 .

[Salaya]

Getorex wrote...

OK, I'm not being facetious or an a-hole (at least not intentionally) when I ask this but...

Why do you people care? EMS, Readiness, etc, means nothing in the end. No matter how you play you still get essentially the same exact endings. 

...

Apart from the fact that I don't agree with the bretah scene being irrelevant, my most important concern is that Bioware stated -and states in the current FAQ- that SP campaign could be experienced as a whole withouth multiplayer intervention.

Whether the scene is irrelevant or not, the fact is that is not possible to archieve the best ending without using multiplayer or Infiltrator. The subsequent silence from the staff and developers is, in my humble opinion, terribly disappointing.

[Gtacatalina]

Salaya wrote...

Getorex wrote...

OK, I'm not being facetious or an a-hole (at least not intentionally) when I ask this but...

Why do you people care? EMS, Readiness, etc, means nothing in the end. No matter how you play you still get essentially the same exact endings. 

...

Apart from the fact that I don't agree with the bretah scene being irrelevant, my most important concern is that Bioware stated -and states in the current FAQ- that SP campaign could be experienced as a whole withouth multiplayer intervention.

Whether the scene is irrelevant or not, the fact is that is not possible to archieve the best ending without using multiplayer or Infiltrator. The subsequent silence from the staff and developers is, in my humble opinion, terribly disappointing.

Exactly, Bioware said we would be able to get the best outcome with Single Player only. It's a fact, you can't.
You also cannot get the Master & Comander and Defender achievements.

I'm also looking at the bigger picture here. If they can get away with this now (and it looks to me they might have after nearly 3 months of nothing), what's to say in their next game you will have to play multi player even to be able to finish the game.

To be honest I'm really annoyed that after 3 months Bioware still don't give a rats arse about this issue. I'm sorry but saying that it might be  fixed in some way in the next patch is not good enough.

There have been no official posts of any kind on this issue. Only condescending, childish posts of...

''We do not lie''
LOCKDOWN

''You can get the best endings SP only''

LOCKDOWN

''Mr Gamble tweeted he was looking into it''
(You Silly people)

LOCKDOWN

We are looking into it

LOCKDOWN

The whole thing is just pathetic.

All I needed was an official post on BSN saying that ''yes there is a problem and we will be fixing it''.

[freler31]

Gtacatalina wrote...

I'm also looking at the bigger picture here. If they can get away with this now (and it looks to me they might have after nearly 3 months of nothing), what's to say in their next game you will have to play multi player even to be able to finish the game.

This is my biggest problem, it's a matter of trust. I don't trust them anymore that they won't do something like this again. Add to that the fact that I don't like being lied to especially when it concerns me parting ways with e70 and that they're attitude during this entire thing has been horrendous (as the rest of your quote shows). 

[Willybot]

I believe that we'll see a 'fix' for the EMS issue shortly before the EC. This way it gives the incentive to actually *play* the game instead of simply watching the content on YouTube.

It costs them no additional resources and would, in theory, increase the amount of people willing to purchase the single-player dlc we'd see soon after.

Modifié par Willybot, 25 mai 2012 - 08:05 .

[devSin]

Gtacatalina wrote...

Exactly, Bioware said we would be able to get the best outcome with Single Player only. It's a fact, you can't.
You also cannot get the Master & Comander and Defender achievements.

Don't describe it this way. It just opens up pointless semantic arguments.

It's true that they at times used "best" and "perfect" to describe the possible outcomes and that such outcomes were possible with single-player alone, but they have also repeatedly and continuously stated that everything would be accessible without playing multiplayer or using the Galaxy at War system.

This isn't about whatever the "best" ending is. This is about the fact that content they said would be accessible to us is not accessible to us. Despite their claims otherwise (some of which are ongoing—the FAQ still tries to spin the whole thing as an alternative, when it is in fact a requisite in this case).

They lied, period. I don't think it was intentional, but it is fact, and they need to address it.

[Gatt9]

7isMagic wrote...
I've been thinking about this - the patch.  What if they include a fix but don't tell us WHY this issue reared its ugly head in the first place?   I won't care - as long as it is FINALLY fixed.  My game won't be broken anymore, thank goodness.

You're misundertanding,  this is obviously intentional,  and I doubt they'll be allowed to switch it back prior to the EC release where I'm sure they hope to sell more Online Passes.

In fact,  I'd be willing to bet we'll find the issue is even worse after the EC is released.  EA being as greedy as it is,  it'll likely gate even more content behind Online Pass...err...Multiplayer.  EA's going to see this as a marketing opportunity,  they'll try to recover their cost by putting even more of the ending behind the Online Pass wall,  hoping that people who pick up the used copies to see what the EC is about will now buy a Online Pass and cover the cost of development.

People keep thinking this EC is going to be free,  I really don't think that's the case.  EA's going to subsidize this somehow,  and I'm willing to bet that they do it by adding even more war asset tiers achieveable only through Multiplayer.

Don't describe it this way. It just opens up pointless semantic arguments.

It's true that they at times used "best" and "perfect" to describe the possible outcomes and that such outcomes were possible with single-player alone, but they have also repeatedly and continuously stated that everything would be accessible without playing multiplayer or using the Galaxy at War system.

Not arguing with your post, but wanted to mention,  there's really no semantic arguements to be had.  EA established a tiered point system,  with clear progression.  There's no "Great" resolution with 1000 war assets.  Higher assets unlock better solutions,  where "Better",  means less damage to earth and fewer deaths.

So while people may prefer one outcome over another,  the tiered system clearly delineates the intended overall quality of the ending,  and the highest tier which is the intended highest quality is behind the Online Pass wall.

[Getorex]

Gtacatalina wrote...

Salaya wrote...

Getorex wrote...

OK, I'm not being facetious or an a-hole (at least not intentionally) when I ask this but...

Why do you people care? EMS, Readiness, etc, means nothing in the end. No matter how you play you still get essentially the same exact endings. 

...

Apart from the fact that I don't agree with the bretah scene being irrelevant, my most important concern is that Bioware stated -and states in the current FAQ- that SP campaign could be experienced as a whole withouth multiplayer intervention.

Whether the scene is irrelevant or not, the fact is that is not possible to archieve the best ending without using multiplayer or Infiltrator. The subsequent silence from the staff and developers is, in my humble opinion, terribly disappointing.

Exactly, Bioware said we would be able to get the best outcome with Single Player only. It's a fact, you can't.
You also cannot get the Master & Comander and Defender achievements.

I'm also looking at the bigger picture here. If they can get away with this now (and it looks to me they might have after nearly 3 months of nothing), what's to say in their next game you will have to play multi player even to be able to finish the game.

To be honest I'm really annoyed that after 3 months Bioware still don't give a rats arse about this issue. I'm sorry but saying that it might be  fixed in some way in the next patch is not good enough.

There have been no official posts of any kind on this issue. Only condescending, childish posts of...

''We do not lie''
LOCKDOWN

''You can get the best endings SP only''

LOCKDOWN

''Mr Gamble tweeted he was looking into it''
(You Silly people)

LOCKDOWN

We are looking into it

LOCKDOWN

The whole thing is just pathetic.

All I needed was an official post on BSN saying that ''yes there is a problem and we will be fixing it''.

OK...I see.  Since I did not experience the issue (I did a little MP) I was not aware of the whole background (and repeat LOCKDOWNs).

Though I doubt it, there is always a possibility that the EC will include some kind of 'fix', though it would be an odd way to deliver it rather than just issuing a patch like normal game companies do.  Hell, I just got another patch of some kind for my Deus Ex: Human Revolution.  THEY are keeping up on their game and have been delivering patches since it was released.  Not a thing, that I recall, or any kind from Bioware/EA.

[Getorex]

Gatt9 wrote...

7isMagic wrote...
I've been thinking about this - the patch.  What if they include a fix but don't tell us WHY this issue reared its ugly head in the first place?   I won't care - as long as it is FINALLY fixed.  My game won't be broken anymore, thank goodness.

You're misundertanding,  this is obviously intentional,  and I doubt they'll be allowed to switch it back prior to the EC release where I'm sure they hope to sell more Online Passes.

In fact,  I'd be willing to bet we'll find the issue is even worse after the EC is released.  EA being as greedy as it is,  it'll likely gate even more content behind Online Pass...err...Multiplayer.  EA's going to see this as a marketing opportunity,  they'll try to recover their cost by putting even more of the ending behind the Online Pass wall,  hoping that people who pick up the used copies to see what the EC is about will now buy a Online Pass and cover the cost of development.

People keep thinking this EC is going to be free,  I really don't think that's the case.  EA's going to subsidize this somehow,  and I'm willing to bet that they do it by adding even more war asset tiers achieveable only through Multiplayer.

Don't describe it this way. It just opens up pointless semantic arguments.

It's true that they at times used "best" and "perfect" to describe the possible outcomes and that such outcomes were possible with single-player alone, but they have also repeatedly and continuously stated that everything would be accessible without playing multiplayer or using the Galaxy at War system.

Not arguing with your post, but wanted to mention,  there's really no semantic arguements to be had.  EA established a tiered point system,  with clear progression.  There's no "Great" resolution with 1000 war assets.  Higher assets unlock better solutions,  where "Better",  means less damage to earth and fewer deaths.

So while people may prefer one outcome over another,  the tiered system clearly delineates the intended overall quality of the ending,  and the highest tier which is the intended highest quality is behind the Online Pass wall.

That's kind of a goofy thing to be concerned about...Better solutions meaning fewer deaths and less damage to earth?  You don't SEE or experience any of that, it is all theoretical and made up.  It doesn't actually happen and doesn't actually change anything at all for you as a player.  For Bioware to simply say, "Well, getting higher points means fewer deaths blah blah..."  So what?  They didn't actually CODE anything to be effected by the higher points.  They didn't render anything.  There are no levels to play that get altered by this.  It is a just so story.

[Archer]

Getorex wrote...

OK, I'm not being facetious or an a-hole (at least not intentionally) when I ask this but...

Why do you people care? EMS, Readiness, etc, means nothing in the end. No matter how you play you still get essentially the same exact endings. Succeed in side missions, don't succeed. Play MP or don't. Doesn't really matter, and no, getting a quick flash of a gasping breath or not does NOT make the ending OK or "better". That is some pretty weak tea to think that all you have to do is see that gasp and all will be right with the game. No. Not at all.

So...why does it matter one way or another whether you can max EMS or whatever in SP mode or not? Sure, it is an dickish game design decision requiring MP to get a certain score above level x but fortunately, in this case, it doesn't really matter to the game as a whole. If, in fact, not being able to obtain a substantially different ending was predicated upon you achieving a certain score that could ONLY be accomplished by MP, then hell yes that would be something to scream about (and take more substantive action like boycott or worse) but that is not the case here. You see, or don't see, a mere 2-3 second flash of an ambiguous clip that does NOTHING to clarify the ending, does NOTHING to render the ending logical, reasonable, or viable. There's no there there.

I hate and despise the ending with a passion.

But thats not really the point with this.

The point is i HAVE to play MP in order to access a segment of single player content. Something Bioware assured us repeatedly pre release that wouldnt happen.

i.e they lied to me...AGAIN

Heres a new theory. When the first piece of PAID for SP DLC arrives it will contain enough additional war assessts to fix this "unitended issue" (insert disbelieving cough here) Until then i bet no Bioware name appears in this thread telling us the issue is resolved.

[crazyrabbits]

Gatt9 wrote...

You're misundertanding,  this is obviously intentional,  and I doubt they'll be allowed to switch it back prior to the EC release where I'm sure they hope to sell more Online Passes.

In fact,  I'd be willing to bet we'll find the issue is even worse after the EC is released.  EA being as greedy as it is,  it'll likely gate even more content behind Online Pass...err...Multiplayer.  EA's going to see this as a marketing opportunity,  they'll try to recover their cost by putting even more of the ending behind the Online Pass wall,  hoping that people who pick up the used copies to see what the EC is about will now buy a Online Pass and cover the cost of development.

People keep thinking this EC is going to be free,  I really don't think that's the case.  EA's going to subsidize this somehow,  and I'm willing to bet that they do it by adding even more war asset tiers achieveable only through Multiplayer.

I agree.

I personally think Bioware should have done (or maybe still planning) single player DLC after the ending, which would cost money. Yeah, people would complain and whine, but if they did it months after the fact, at least we'd know they're trying to make reparations. Look how many people are jazzed for the Arkham City Harley Quinn DLC. Rocksteady has the right idea - release a GOTY edition 6-8 months after release with all the DLC included plus the new expansion. Everybody wins. Meanwhile, we still haven't gotten an ME2 edition with all the DLC's packed-in.

Given the fact that BW is trying to rush the EC in the middle of this ongoing controversy (what with EA having its own problems at the moment), it wouldn't surprise me if they find some way to sneak in a cost scheme into the scenes. I can't put anything past them at the moment. After all, this is the same group of people that has referred to playing one of the "tie-in" games to increase Galactic Readiness.

I'm serious when I say they should find the person who developed that concept and fire them. It is one of the dumbest design decisions I've ever seen in a video game.

Modifié par crazyrabbits, 25 mai 2012 - 11:28 .

[chuckles471]

I hate twitter, just a place for socially obstructed people to let out their inane thoughts........

Oh damn, I have glass in my eye. Somebody has just threw a brick at my glass house.

Modifié par chuckles471, 25 mai 2012 - 11:48 .

[7isMagic]

Bringing this into focus:

We have had numerous threads on this "invisible" issue - a great many locked down over the course of these past few months.  We keep going around in circles on this issue each and every time an EMS thread is created:

1.   Folks pop in and tell us that reaching 4,000 EMS is possible without multiplayer or other modes of play though it has been proven there simply aren't enough War Assets in the game to support this assertion. No one, as far as I know, has ever proven 4K is reachable with SP alone.  Most likely, folks are getting EMS and TMS confused.

2.  Others simply say "Engage in a little MP to get to 4K EMS, what's the big deal?"  Sure, MP may be fun but not everyone has access to  MP - lack of an internet connection or a connection that is too slow to support MP.  Some simply do not want to engage in that particular mode of play.

3. Others ask 'Why does it matter?" What's all the fuss?"  It's just a short breath scene - YouTube it and be done with it.   Do we, as gamers, know - really know - what that breath scene truly represents?   What if it has significant impact on future DLC or even the upcoming EC?   One cannot discount its significance quite yet. As such, shouldn't everyone be able to reach that scene no matter the mode of play?

4.  Others, myself included, wondering why this issue came to rear its ugly head in the first place. Speculation abound:  Bug or intentional?

These have been the four main lines of discussion within this and similar EMS threads that have popped up here over the past few months (only to be locked down one after the other). 

At the end of the day, it all boils down to one simple fact:  We were promised an SP experience supplemented with MP and other modes of play.  SP was not going to be affected by MP in any way.  That was the premise upon which I bought the game - and expect a great many more worldwide also believed this was the case.  I placed my trust in Bioware to hold to this - they didn't.    That's the REAL issue here.  

Adding salt to the wound, Bioware's apparent unwillingness to honestly and openly address this issue in an official manner.   Reprehensible.

Modifié par 7isMagic, 26 mai 2012 - 04:07 .

[CG Drum]

7isMagic wrote...

Bringing this into focus:


At the end of the day, it all boils down to one simple fact:  We were promised an SP experience supplemented with MP and other modes of play.  SP was not going to be affected by MP in any way.  That was the premise upon which I bought the game - and expect a great many more worldwide also believed this was the case.  I placed my trust in Bioware to hold to this - they didn't.    That's the REAL issue here.  

Adding salt to the wound, Bioware's apparent unwillingness to honestly and openly address this issue in an official manner.   Reprehensible.

/\\  This! /\\

Telling customers one thing, then doing the opposite, then telling us it was possible when it clearly isn't!!  

Whole thing is driving me crazy - and could have been easily and quickly fixed - but no we have been left to it - no proper acknowledgment of the issue on here and no real clue, even now, as to if they are actually fixing it or just looking into it. 

IMHO very poor.   I live in hope but the longer this goes on the less I believe that this wasn't intentional and that they wil actually sort it.