247 réponses à ce sujet

[Laurencio]

Taboo-XX wrote...

Laurencio wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

I should mail these threads to Bioware with comments.

The thought amuses me.

But who should get them?

Casy Hudson is the project lead, if you want to go over his head then Dr. Ray Muzyka would probably be your best bet.

But would it reach Dr. Muzyka? I have my doubts. I sent something DIRECTLY to Michael Gamble I doubt that it reached him.

Hmm.. I guess sending it to Jessica and asking very nicely for her to consider giving it to Gamble or someone at bioware would be another way to do it. She is the community representative after all.

Victia wrote...
i
personally wanted to see the normandy go 1 on 1 with harbinger (your me2
upgrades could have determined the outcome) maybe to distract him so
shep and team could get to the beam - as to a boss fight I would have
loved one but not sure who or what would actually fit - maybe reaperised
TIM, or even Anderson(could have been a big shock) depending if you
destroyed or kept the collector base, would have been good, after you
defeat them you can deploy the catalyst and cut schenes of your outcomes
happen

For me 90% of the problem is the contrived solution the Crucible offer, so that really doesn't work in my opinion.

Modifié par Laurencio, 30 avril 2012 - 05:26 .

[JabberJim]

StrelokCH wrote...

JabberJim wrote...

A dark ending to anything rarely works for me. Maybe the Movie Se7en is the rare example. Dark ending seem so forced anymore.

Truthfully if I want something depressing I just read the news. Mass Effect was a great escape into a world that seemed to evolve with every decision we made... until the ending of course.

There was a pumpkin in the box, nothing else. [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/wink.png[/smilie]

But I agree on that point that games shouldn't force you "back" to reality, but dark endings don't have to do just because  there are no rainbows or unicorns. In fact, ME3 with its plot holes is so bananza that returning to reality is almost impossible.

Ahh yes!! A pumpkin!! John Doe.. evil genius!

No Unicorns, but BW gave us a star child!! So cute an innocent

[Taboo]

Laurencio wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

Laurencio wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

I should mail these threads to Bioware with comments.

The thought amuses me.

But who should get them?

Casy Hudson is the project lead, if you want to go over his head then Dr. Ray Muzyka would probably be your best bet.

But would it reach Dr. Muzyka? I have my doubts. I sent something DIRECTLY to Michael Gamble I doubt that it reached him.

Hmm.. I guess sending it to Jessica and asking very nicely for her to consider giving it to Gamble or someone at bioware would be another way to do it. She is the community representative after all.

I've probably become "that guy" though. I've sent them so much **** it's not even funny. They haven't said anything so I assume they don't care.

[crimzontearz]

I mentioned the Descent, Shep.. No....just NO. Especially since it was a goddamn bait and switch ending almost worse than "buried"

luckily it was retconned in several....only to make another downer ending for the sequel

does anyone have some ryncoll? I needa drink

[Ecrulis]

*snip*

How can I say about some the  westerns shows and other media..    Everything is starting to become copy and paste.  I don;t mean plots  or stories but the styles... everyone is going for dark and edge thing because  X show was succesfull because of it. 

Watch in the next 5 years how many shows try to copy Game of Thrones...

HA! so true and I will have to facepalm every time I see one

[Grimwick]

I agree OP. if I wanted 'deep' artsy rubbish I'd contract a depressed 15 year old to write about all their woes with the world... I wouldn't go to my favourite game trilogy ever!

Ugh the ending isn't deep as it stands - it's incredibly shallow and miserable. Where are my blue babies!?

[Laurencio]

Taboo-XX wrote...

Laurencio wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

Laurencio wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

I should mail these threads to Bioware with comments.

The thought amuses me.

But who should get them?

Casy Hudson is the project lead, if you want to go over his head then Dr. Ray Muzyka would probably be your best bet.

But would it reach Dr. Muzyka? I have my doubts. I sent something DIRECTLY to Michael Gamble I doubt that it reached him.

Hmm.. I guess sending it to Jessica and asking very nicely for her to consider giving it to Gamble or someone at bioware would be another way to do it. She is the community representative after all.

I've probably become "that guy" though. I've sent them so much **** it's not even funny. They haven't said anything so I assume they don't care.

Well then I would assume sending more would just ****** them off.

[Taboo]

Laurencio wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

Laurencio wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

Laurencio wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

I should mail these threads to Bioware with comments.

The thought amuses me.

But who should get them?

Casy Hudson is the project lead, if you want to go over his head then Dr. Ray Muzyka would probably be your best bet.

But would it reach Dr. Muzyka? I have my doubts. I sent something DIRECTLY to Michael Gamble I doubt that it reached him.

Hmm.. I guess sending it to Jessica and asking very nicely for her to consider giving it to Gamble or someone at bioware would be another way to do it. She is the community representative after all.

I've probably become "that guy" though. I've sent them so much **** it's not even funny. They haven't said anything so I assume they don't care.

Well then I would assume sending more would just ****** them off.

I thought about sending them a load of plastic ears to symbolize what some artists went through.........

[StrelokCH]

JabberJim wrote...

Ahh yes!! A pumpkin!! John Doe.. evil genius!

No Unicorns, but BW gave us a star child!! So cute an innocent

Well, it is Kevin Spacey, you know what a strange little man he is.

And when Asian horror film have taught me anything, than it's that little children = satan. Like I said, "dark" ending is ok, if it makes sense. And if it's a game trilogy where people spent 100 hours into, it would be nice to include a mostly good ending too.
Why not make it like Neverwinter Nights 2 Mask of the Betrayer? Make a happy unicorn ending, make an evil ending where you end up as Satan and make the rest something between mostly good and mostly bad. That's a good M.O. for game endings, it has worked before. On a second thought... no, let's include more children.

[Oldbones2]

Taboo-XX wrote...

Laurencio wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

Laurencio wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

I should mail these threads to Bioware with comments.

The thought amuses me.

But who should get them?

Casy Hudson is the project lead, if you want to go over his head then Dr. Ray Muzyka would probably be your best bet.

But would it reach Dr. Muzyka? I have my doubts. I sent something DIRECTLY to Michael Gamble I doubt that it reached him.

Hmm.. I guess sending it to Jessica and asking very nicely for her to consider giving it to Gamble or someone at bioware would be another way to do it. She is the community representative after all.

I've probably become "that guy" though. I've sent them so much **** it's not even funny. They haven't said anything so I assume they don't care.

Jessica being community manager just means she 'manages' the community.

Remember all the PR talk and handling from a month ago.  That's her job, just over a long term and without a immediate goal, so she can do it without alienating her community.

[Kunari801]

StrelokCH wrote...

... Why not make it like Neverwinter Nights 2 Mask of the Betrayer? Make a happy unicorn ending, make an evil ending where you end up as Satan and make the rest something between mostly good and mostly bad. That's a good M.O. for game endings...  

That's pretty much what I expected and would have been happy with that.   There would have been discussions about which one was "Best" instead of the arguements we have now. 

[Taboo]

Kunari801 wrote...

StrelokCH wrote...

... Why not make it like Neverwinter Nights 2 Mask of the Betrayer? Make a happy unicorn ending, make an evil ending where you end up as Satan and make the rest something between mostly good and mostly bad. That's a good M.O. for game endings...  

That's pretty much what I expected and would have been happy with that.   There would have been discussions about which one was "Best" instead of the arguements we have now. 

Hubris.

Hubris everywhere!

[nitefyre410]

Laurencio wrote...

nitefyre410 wrote...

Laurencio wrote...

*snip* 

Wow.. How could he think any video game could live up to film critique? Let alone a science fiction game, and role playing game. That's madness.

I actually agree on the boss fight scenario though. Not really sure how it would fit in. Fighting Harbinger, sure it's a fun addition but it doesn't really "end" the threat. Fighting TIM is also a bit pointless. Although I would have expected a "final mission" where you actually fought the reapers in some way either by using EMS or directing the fleet, making a final push which ended the threat. It needed a climax, if not a boss fight.

They could have done a final battle with  Harbinger ... in stages  using the EMS... 

Stage 1:  Ground  
Stage 2: Air/Space   
Stage 3:   A Throw back to the Saren  Battle from  ME 1 with  other chacters doing a Hold the line type deal from ME 2  who lives is dependent on EMS.. On the  Citadel after  a conversation show down with TIM.

Hudson  "Too Video gamey" comment as I take is a flat out excuse because he  and walters could not think of anything.

See I don't really see how defeating one single reaper, Harbinger, ends the threat efficently. There needs to be something that comes after, so the "final" boss doesn't make sense. Fighting Harbinger as something that wasn't the final boss is another matter though.

  

The ending of the threat comes with confrontation with  The Catalyst... Harbinger is just final  door to go through before getting to that point so facing off with it should  highst point gameplay wise.   Once  you get to the Calatyst point you can  A.  Side with it Solutions,   B. Reject it solutions and talk it down.  C. Reject it solutions and battle it... which would have been nothing more than rather easy story battle or just cutscenes/dialogue choices.  

Modifié par nitefyre410, 30 avril 2012 - 05:36 .

[JabberJim]

StrelokCH wrote...

JabberJim wrote...

Ahh yes!! A pumpkin!! John Doe.. evil genius!

No Unicorns, but BW gave us a star child!! So cute an innocent

Well, it is Kevin Spacey, you know what a strange little man he is.

And when Asian horror film have taught me anything, than it's that little children = satan. Like I said, "dark" ending is ok, if it makes sense. And if it's a game trilogy where people spent 100 hours into, it would be nice to include a mostly good ending too.
Why not make it like Neverwinter Nights 2 Mask of the Betrayer? Make a happy unicorn ending, make an evil ending where you end up as Satan and make the rest something between mostly good and mostly bad. That's a good M.O. for game endings, it has worked before. On a second thought... no, let's include more children.

For all their pre-release bravado of the ending, I think everyone figured there would be something that would satisfy just about everyone, depending on how they played the game. The replay value would have been sky high, paragon players playing again to see the renegade ending and vice versa. My Paragon shepard was almost forced to choose control, he just didn't want to destroy the Geth in which he spent 2 entire games trying to convince everyone they weren't as bad as they seemed. Meh... maybe Kevin Spacey is the one behind Bioware.

[StrelokCH]

Kunari801 wrote...

StrelokCH wrote...

... Why not make it like Neverwinter Nights 2 Mask of the Betrayer? Make a happy unicorn ending, make an evil ending where you end up as Satan and make the rest something between mostly good and mostly bad. That's a good M.O. for game endings...  

That's pretty much what I expected and would have been happy with that.   There would have been discussions about which one was "Best" instead of the arguements we have now. 

Discussions about which ending is the best? Never, this will lead to... dare I say it? Speculations! Speculations everywhere!

btw: An easy way to imporve the ME3 ending and keep it dark and edgy: Remove the ending completely and just show the best, and probabaly by now really old, movie/trailer/whatever that has ever existed!

JabberJim wrote...

For all their pre-release
bravado of the ending, I think everyone figured there would be something
that would satisfy just about everyone, depending on how they played
the game. The replay value would have been sky high, paragon players
playing again to see the renegade ending and vice versa. My Paragon
shepard was almost forced to choose control, he just didn't want to
destroy the Geth in which he spent 2 entire games trying to convince
everyone they weren't as bad as they seemed. Meh... maybe Kevin Spacey
is the one behind Bioware.

That's what I generally expect from Bioware, even though NWN2 was made by Obsidian. But even my Renegade "**** the aliens go Cerberus" Shep couldn't destroy the Geth. They are so adorable.

Modifié par StrelokCH, 30 avril 2012 - 05:40 .

[Victia]

nitefyre410 wrote...

Victia wrote...

*snip* 

Those where the days - i miss them so much, thanks for the article link was a very interestsing read and I agree with it.

My problem is, all trends come to an end you would think that some companies/writers etc would just jump ship before it starts to sink (which it will)

 

I think thats one of the reason why I gravitate towards the anime side of things more... I can just find more  variety(though they have their trends that are annoying) 

Still can name  in the past 5 years  3 shows the came out  that all have different endings from Downer to Bittersweeter to  Happy ending. 

How can I say about some the  westerns shows and other media..    Everything is starting to become copy and paste.  I don;t mean plots  or stories but the styles... everyone is going for dark and edge thing because  X show was succesfull because of it. 

Watch in the next 5 years how many shows try to copy Game of Thrones...

Sometimes I just think that I am just old- when I was a kid there seemed like there was so much variety on tv or even just sci fi - even up to the mid '90 you had a wide range of shows!

I have a thing about books being turned in to TV series/ films (I will never ever forgive Andrew Lloyd Webber for his desicration of The Phantom of the Opera) , I love the A Song Of Ice and Fire books but couldnt get past episode 3 of the TV series as it seemed to simplified, but you are right in a few months we wil start to get second rate versions of a simplified version of an amazing series of books !

[Kunari801]

Taboo-XX wrote...

Kunari801 wrote...

StrelokCH wrote...

... Why not make it like Neverwinter Nights 2 Mask of the Betrayer? Make a happy unicorn ending, make an evil ending where you end up as Satan and make the rest something between mostly good and mostly bad. That's a good M.O. for game endings...  

That's pretty much what I expected and would have been happy with that.   There would have been discussions about which one was "Best" instead of the arguements we have now. 

Hubris.

Hubris everywhere!

When BW said there would be "multiple" endings I pretty must expected a range of endings from "Reapers Win" to "Reapers are dead and Shepard lives" with one or two where Shepard dies killing the Reapers.  I expected it from BW based on their past performance in the ME games.  

The "Catalyst" I thought was going to end up being Shepard and him having to sacrifice himself to activate it.  So mid-way in game --at worst-- I expected no ending where Shepard could live and as long as his death was a last heroic act (like dying in ME2's ending) I would have been happy with that too.  

[Taboo]

Kunari801 wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

Kunari801 wrote...

StrelokCH wrote...

... Why not make it like Neverwinter Nights 2 Mask of the Betrayer? Make a happy unicorn ending, make an evil ending where you end up as Satan and make the rest something between mostly good and mostly bad. That's a good M.O. for game endings...  

That's pretty much what I expected and would have been happy with that.   There would have been discussions about which one was "Best" instead of the arguements we have now. 

Hubris.

Hubris everywhere!

When BW said there would be "multiple" endings I pretty must expected a range of endings from "Reapers Win" to "Reapers are dead and Shepard lives" with one or two where Shepard dies killing the Reapers.  I expected it from BW based on their past performance in the ME games.  

The "Catalyst" I thought was going to end up being Shepard and him having to sacrifice himself to activate it.  So mid-way in game --at worst-- I expected no ending where Shepard could live and as long as his death was a last heroic act (like dying in ME2's ending) I would have been happy with that too.  

We'll probably see a simplified version of this in the EC branched off of the current endings at least in my best case scenario.

[humes spork]

Ecrulis wrote...

Watch in the next 5 years how many shows try to copy Game of Thrones...

HA! so true and I will have to facepalm every time I see one

Oh yeah, like trends in fiction spontaneously poofed into existence straight from the ether.

Get real, if you want to be cynical you can trace practically the entire of modern science fiction and horror back to one memetic bottleneck, a weekend in 1816 when Lord Byron, Mary Shelley, Percy Byshhe Shelley, and Claire Clairmont got ****faced and high together at Lake Geneva.

Modifié par humes spork, 30 avril 2012 - 05:56 .

[Oldbones2]

Kunari801 wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

Kunari801 wrote...

StrelokCH wrote...

... Why not make it like Neverwinter Nights 2 Mask of the Betrayer? Make a happy unicorn ending, make an evil ending where you end up as Satan and make the rest something between mostly good and mostly bad. That's a good M.O. for game endings...  

That's pretty much what I expected and would have been happy with that.   There would have been discussions about which one was "Best" instead of the arguements we have now. 

Hubris.

Hubris everywhere!

When BW said there would be "multiple" endings I pretty must expected a range of endings from "Reapers Win" to "Reapers are dead and Shepard lives" with one or two where Shepard dies killing the Reapers.  I expected it from BW based on their past performance in the ME games.  

The "Catalyst" I thought was going to end up being Shepard and him having to sacrifice himself to activate it.  So mid-way in game --at worst-- I expected no ending where Shepard could live and as long as his death was a last heroic act (like dying in ME2's ending) I would have been happy with that too.  

How stupid of you to expect what Bioware up and told us we would be given (though the term here should be SOLD)

And much like you by the midpoint of the game I could read the writting on the wall, I knew Shepard was headed for death, and though it broke my heart, I accepted it. 

But his death is so pointless and it does such a brutal job of invalidating everything he and I have done together, that I just can't accept it. 

[Taboo]

humes spork wrote...

Ecrulis wrote...

Watch in the next 5 years how many shows try to copy Game of Thrones...

HA! so true and I will have to facepalm every time I see one

Oh yeah, like trends in fiction spontaneously poofed into existence straight from the ether.

Get real, if you want to be cynical you can trace practically the entire of modern science fiction and horror back to one memetic bottleneck, a weekend in 1816 when Lord Byron, Mary Shelley, Percy Byshhe Shelley, and Claire Clairmont got ****faced and high.

Entirely accurate. You win.

[VoraciousBeaver]

nitefyre410 wrote...

Victia wrote...

*snip* 

Those where the days - i miss them so much, thanks for the article link was a very interestsing read and I agree with it.

My problem is, all trends come to an end you would think that some companies/writers etc would just jump ship before it starts to sink (which it will)

 

I think thats one of the reason why I gravitate towards the anime side of things more... I can just find more  variety(though they have their trends that are annoying) 

Still can name  in the past 5 years  3 shows the came out  that all have different endings from Downer to Bittersweeter to  Happy ending. 

How can I say about some the  westerns shows and other media..    Everything is starting to become copy and paste.  I don;t mean plots  or stories but the styles... everyone is going for dark and edge thing because  X show was succesfull because of it. 

Watch in the next 5 years how many shows try to copy Game of Thrones...

Haha, yeah. Anime is definitely eclectic. I suppose that has something to do with the limitless possibilites granted by animation.

The dark and edgy themes are quite common these days. But that's not exactly a bad thing, in my opinion. Take two other HBO shows for example--"The Wire" and "The Sopranos." Both have these themes. These are two of the greatest shows of all time. Though I will give a lot more credit to The Wire for its better use of those themes. But I suppose I'm just contributing to your point with this. Whoops.

EDIT : Clarifying so Mr. Hume doesn't make me cry--these themes are certainly not new. Just saying that they're seemingly more common(at least on TV, anyway).

Modifié par VoraciousBeaver, 30 avril 2012 - 06:11 .

[Kunari801]

humes spork wrote...
Get real, if you want to be cynical you can trace practically the entire of modern science fiction and horror back to one memetic bottleneck, a weekend in 1816 when Lord Byron, Mary Shelley, Percy Byshhe Shelley, and Claire Clairmont got ****faced and high. 

I can agree somewhat, but I don't think Jules Verne's work is derivative of that night. 

[Devil Mingy]

ahandsomeshark wrote...

Lol now I'm curious into what kind of films Hudson watches to think the ending would stand up to a film critique. I would say most of my critiquing of video games stems from my knowledge of how stories are handled in films vs video games.

Going by the Mass Effect 3 ending and the goal for controversy and speculations... I'd say Southland Tales, especially the Cannes cut.

Modifié par Devil Mingy, 30 avril 2012 - 05:57 .

[Ecrulis]

Oh yeah, like trends in fiction spontaneously poofed into existence straight from the ether.

Get real, if you want to be cynical you can trace practically the entire of modern science fiction and horror back to one memetic bottleneck, a weekend in 1816 when Lord Byron, Mary Shelley, Percy Byshhe Shelley, and Claire Clairmont got ****faced and high together at Lake Geneva.

This had me rolling thank you.