81 réponses à ce sujet

[Micah3sixty]

I've heard over the mic and read several times from some peeps on BSN that Asari Justicar Adepts are either not viable on Gold, or aren't viable without other biotics to combo off of.  Having become fairly proficient with my Justicar Adept over the past several weeks, trying out various offensive, defensive and mixed builds, I can confidently say that this notion of Justicars not being viable in Gold on their own is a myth.  

Yesterday in a random Gold PuG for Unknown/Unknown, my Justicar Adept landed on a team with a lv 20 Geth Infiltrator, a lv 19 Salarian Engineer, and a lv 18 Human Sentinel.  After ready-ing up, we ended up with Reapers on Dagger.  While the Human Sentinel is basically an Asari Adept lacking Stasis, we didn't combo off each other all that much.  

That match started off a little rough with the Salarian Engineer armed with a Widow going off by himself near the lower LZ-pickup by the ammo crate, to end up going down several times in the early waves.  The Geth Infiltrator also went around doing his own thing first several waves.  Granted, for waves 1 and 2 that isn't much of a problem since there aren't any heavies (Banshees, Ravagers etc).  However, near the end of Wave 4, both of them went down on opposite sides of the map while the Sentinel and I were taking out heavies in the tower and couldn't get to either of them before they bled out.  One of them raged over the mic about us being dumb #@cks for not reviving them and that "it was no wonder you never extract on Gold!"  Me and the Sent stayed quiet and dualled the rest of that wave in short order.

Our squad stuck together a lot better after that wave, successfully hacking the open platform point outside the long hall for wave 6 and taking down 4 Banshee "targets of interest" for wave 10.  All said and done, we had 3/4 partial extraction since the LZ was overrun with 2 brutes and 2 banshees taking me down and time running out half way through being revived.  The viability of the Justicar Adept on Gold with none to minor biotic support showed up strong on the end score board:



I had a very similarly scoring match on Geth/Gold/Glacier with a squad comprised of two Salarian Engineers, a Geth infiltrator and my Justicar Adept, and a final score for my Justicar again nearly double the 2nd place Infiltrator.  Justicars are very viable, high damage death dealers on Gold whether being the lone biotic or on a full team of biotics.

My build over this weekend:

Biotic Sphere: Radius (4), Enemy Weakness (5), Warp (6)
Reave: Radius (4), Damage Reduction (5), Damage, Reduction, Duration (6)
Pull: Radius (4)
Justicar: Damage & Capacity (4)
Fitness: Durability (4), Shield Recharge (5), Fitness Expert (6)

Weapon: Talon III with AP and EB mods
Equipment: AP ammo III, Pistol Amp III, Power Modulator III


Edit to add image:

Modifié par Micah3sixty, 30 avril 2012 - 04:31 .

[Brokusan]

Yeah, i agree justicars are good, but dont brag about it till you post a score that isn't from a farming map like FBD/Reaper or FBW/Geth. Try doing glacier on gold against reaper without any other biotics... i would love to see it done, cant say it'll be easy

[vivanto]

Who said they're not viable?

Glacier would actually be even easier, almost as much as Reactor, Justicars really shine on CQC maps.

[Micah3sixty]

Brokusan wrote...

Yeah, i agree justicars are good, but dont brag about it till you post a score that isn't from a farming map like FBD/Reaper or FBW/Geth. Try doing glacier on gold against reaper without any other biotics... i would love to see it done, cant say it'll be easy

Not trying to brag, just dispelling the justicar non-viability myth.  I didn't realize people think of Dagger/ Reapers as a farming map.  I have done Glacier/Reapers/Gold but so far only with teams of other biotics where most of us score pretty similarly.

[Micah3sixty]

vivanto wrote...

Who said they're not viable?

Glacier would actually be even easier, almost as much as Reactor, Justicars really shine on CQC maps.

There were several threads soon after the DLC was released about being disappointed in the Justicar and her not being viable without other adepts.  I also heard it in the Geth/Glacier/Gold run mentioned above as the lobby leader wanted me to use an engineer/infiltrator class instead.  I stuck with my goto Justicar and showed them.  Granted it was a farming run, but still it was my own comboing and bubble enemy damage buff that led out in the end.

[Ry3 Sjursen]

I think Justicars are great on Gold, as long as it isn't against Geth. I know I have a hard time against Geth on Gold with my Justicar...

[BYC]

They are fine by themselves.

But they are superb with other biotics. I had a krogan vanguard in a game recently, and he really took advantage of my sphere and exploded a ton of things with the charge.

[Torguemada]

vivanto wrote...
Who said they're not viable?

Most likely people who are stupid and or bad.
Reave alone is killer on any difficulty recardless of team comp, addidn't sphere to that just makes her even better.
But ofcource their even better with a full biotic team, but that goes for every single biotic in the game.

Modifié par Torguemada, 30 avril 2012 - 04:50 .

[Brizcar]

I've only just started playing gold and always use the Justicar , funnily enough i have rarely been in  a game with other biotic users . Most games i've had the other 3 players have all been tech based classes . No biotic combos hasn't been a problem , my favourite game was with a SI , GE and GI . I teamed up with the GE , his turret was set for healing and my bubble is specced for defense . We obviously lacked damage synergy but we had loads of survivability and  still kicked butt anyway :happy:

[Peer of the Empire]

Sadly, they are best used with a Falcon. Then they can provide their own covering fire to setup their own biotic detonations

[Methanoid666]

the final score is far from an accurate way to see how they perform, it just means they tagged a lot of enemies with reave the same way a manguard tags a lot of opponents with nova or an engineer that spams overload.

anyone can easily go out of their way to deliberatly suck bigtime with an overload spec engineer or manguard and still rack in points like crazy with zero skill or actual useful teamplay, yet they would look impressive on the final scores.

asari justicar tells a similar tale.

Modifié par Methanoid666, 30 avril 2012 - 04:59 .

[SeijiTataki]

Personally, I don't use Pull at all and just drop the points into training skills for the additional power centric evolves and just spam Reaves from cover while using fire support to take down small enemies. If I have someone to combo off of, great; if I don't, I can still soften up mid-and-weak targets, and use the bubble on the big targets to do self-detonations.

I generally get 100-120k, still topping the charts but shifting the points out to the other players, since i'm not killing as quickly or dealing the full killing blows; but it allows me to basically area-deny groups of enemies from a range, and to 'fire and forget' with reave and hit multiple groups at a time.

I imagine your build is probably slightly more capable at scoring and clearing groups; I lean toward making the Justicar more survival and support, and I seem to be doing well -- actually, I've come to prefer this play style over the normal Asari Adept.

[TheKingBoar]

I would agree, for me the AJA is extrodinarily powerful. I would recommend trying a build spec'd to bubble/reave only and just ignore pull. If you select the warp evolution of bubble you basically never have to worry about priming enemies and can just sit behind cover spamming reave and whatever gun you chose. All that matters is competent bubble placement which generally isn't too hard to figure out.

[uzivatel]

Its not that hard. The opposite actually. Even I  managed to finish Gold using Justicar with almost zero biotic support from the Turian Sentinel.
I expect some major Justicar nerfing in some of the ucomming balance changes...

Modifié par uzivatel, 30 avril 2012 - 05:05 .

[Totally_Mad_Rat]

AJA is awesome, especially against Reapers. I use 6/6/6/5/3 build. I'm very used to DA gold runs so I didn't need more fitness. Pull detonation bonus is something I can't skip.

[BraveLToaster]

They have Reave, so they're viable whether or not they can easily detonate. Area staggers and good damage over time that stacks is pretty damn useful.

[Wesus]

You didnt make the extraction. I r disappointed.

[Paulus magintie]

When ever I play on gold I always use my justicar due to my shield ability. The only time I ever heard a team member shout "Sheilds down" was when my sheild vanished which reminded me to put one back up.

My pull and reave ability kicks ass to. Put it this way I was on FBW/GG and I was stuck in a corner the only things I could kill was from the stair way, or what ever came through the side door which wasn't much.

I ended up coming 2nd to the Vanguard Krogan and he killed a hell of a lot more than I did

[joker_jack]

Paulus magintie wrote...

When ever I play on gold I always use my justicar due to my shield ability. The only time I ever heard a team member shout "Sheilds down" was when my sheild vanished which reminded me to put one back up.

My pull and reave ability kicks ass to. Put it this way I was on FBW/GG and I was stuck in a corner the only things I could kill was from the stair way, or what ever came through the side door which wasn't much.

I ended up coming 2nd to the Vanguard Krogan and he killed a hell of a lot more than I did

What is you spec for your AJ? I'm looking at other builds for mine.

[rmccowen]

I've never had a problem with my AJ in Gold. Even without other biotics, stacking DPS from area Reave means I take out groups of low-level mobs quickly and efficiently. The bubble keeps me protected and means any high-level mobs that get close are subject to detonations, and there stacking Reave means I'm dealing hundreds of DPS even if I'm around the corner or running away. Full-auto AR means I can reliably stack (and occasionally even detonate) ammo effects on top of Reave.

I generally take first or second place on the scoreboard, without any biotic support. With another biotic, it's just silly.

[Micah3sixty]

TheKingBoar wrote...

I would agree, for me the AJA is extrodinarily powerful. I would recommend trying a build spec'd to bubble/reave only and just ignore pull. If you select the warp evolution of bubble you basically never have to worry about priming enemies and can just sit behind cover spamming reave and whatever gun you chose. All that matters is competent bubble placement which generally isn't too hard to figure out.

In previous builds I did leave 0 points in pull, 3 points in pull and now 4 points in pull for Radius.  I can take out unshielded mobs much quicker from distance with area pull and area reave.  Pull > Reave kills much quicker than either a single Reave or a Reave > Reave stack.  Pull also comes in handy to quickly disable a unshielded Centurian, phantom, Trooper, or other threat to avoid being killed, to revive a fallen comrad, or to drop warp bubble for more explosions.  Pull also staggers shielded enemies which can be useful to fire more shots, or get into cover.  The 5th and 6th evolutions of Justicar are all passive since Power Damage bonus is either broke, or doesn't affect Bubble warp, Reave or explosions and headshot damage isn't as useful for CQC (my playstyle anyways) and most high level pistols do more damage with higher cooldowns than any AR with 30% weight reduction, or weapon damage bonus.

Modifié par Micah3sixty, 30 avril 2012 - 05:17 .

[A Wild Snorlax]

Dagger vs reapers is considered farming now? Ok if you say so lol.....

Anyway for most randoms that aren't great at the game justicars are not very good on gold without other biotics to combo with. A good player can make any class work, a mediocre player would have an easier time and be more effective with other classes.

[Nickle]

I like how you cut out the 28+ minutes on the time, from the screenshot.
You generally cannot score that highly unless your team is really slow.

[Micah3sixty]

Nickle wrote...

I like how you cut out the 28+ minutes on the time, from the screenshot.
You generally cannot score that highly unless your team is really slow.

Wasn't intentional actually.  The time was in the 30 minute range.  

[Paulus magintie]

joker_jack wrote...

Paulus magintie wrote...

When ever I play on gold I always use my justicar due to my shield ability. The only time I ever heard a team member shout "Sheilds down" was when my sheild vanished which reminded me to put one back up.

My pull and reave ability kicks ass to. Put it this way I was on FBW/GG and I was stuck in a corner the only things I could kill was from the stair way, or what ever came through the side door which wasn't much.

I ended up coming 2nd to the Vanguard Krogan and he killed a hell of a lot more than I did

What is you spec for your AJ? I'm looking at other builds for mine.

Sphere: 6 - Allied protection
Reave: 4 - Increase radius
Pull: 5 - Increase radius and damage
AJ: 5- Increase Assualt rifle damg + Power damage
Fitness: 6 - Increase everything to do with sheilds.

Weapon = Phaeston III

Recharge is +63% (I also have an SMG on her but its for back ups only.