Aller au contenu

Photo

Myth busting: Asari Justicar Adept viability on Gold without biotic support


  • Veuillez vous connecter pour répondre
81 réponses à ce sujet

#51
SeijiTataki

SeijiTataki
  • Members
  • 502 messages

Paulus magintie wrote...
"shrug"

I don't see the point in sticking to just one weapons, there have been many situations 2 weapons have saved my ass. (Basically anything with armour) which pull does nothing against and only reave is effective.

I know people would prefer me to "specialize" but I like to play to deal with any situation. All I can do is reave on brutes and things if I did what you told me to do, well I like to shoot back and something trying to kill me.

Thanks for the advice though but this load out works great for me.


Even if you want to stick with your existing build;
All you can do now is just spam reave on brutes, anyway - yes, pull can hit some 'things', but you're basically investing in neither reave nor pull. If you wanted to use both, drop the points from training to get reave and or pull up higher; since you're using them to do biotics, you're going to benefit from using the improvement.

Regardless of the above to specialize further into biotics, lift damage is still inferior to expose, because of how little time things spend in the air and how quickly they can become resistant to it, so there's no reason to not just make them take more damage while lifted. You will never kill anything on gold through the tick damage, and you will never weaken then more than the 25% damage taken from the debuff.

You're already using a low ranked phaeston, so your power cooldown is suffering; throw away the SMG, and just learn the best way to hit up ammo boxes or when to use your own ammo consumables. The weight from the SMG is totally not worth the benefit - the only SMGs worth using for a damage sidearm are the Hurricane, the Hornet and maybe the Tempest - and none of them actually benefit from Ultralight Materials, the cooldown screen lies. The only weapon that (currently) benefits from ULM is the Geth SMG, and it's still not that great for a damage dealer.

If you really want to use an AR, and you're committed to the weight class, you may as well consider switching to either the Vindicator or the Mattock, with the Mattock heavily preferred. The Vindicator's lighter, but the Mattock has much better damage for the punch - regardless of which you pick, they're doing more damage for firing cycles against enemies than the Phaeston, because the Phaeston's fully automatic damage gets heavily punished for hitting anything with armor. Even if you slap an AP mod or AP Ammo on it, it's not going to compare to the same as using either of the other burst-fire ARs for damage per firing cycle. 

There's lots of small adjustments you could make within your own existing spec distribution even if you are absolutely 100% committed to not readjusting point distributions that will improve your ability to get by.

#52
Disciple888

Disciple888
  • Members
  • 1 773 messages
I love the Justicar, but Biotic Sphere is bugged. I died multiple times on Glacier yesterday attempting to throw it up in the enemies' face, and it just wouldn't appear. You have to give them a little space. ugh.

#53
SeijiTataki

SeijiTataki
  • Members
  • 502 messages

Disciple888 wrote...

I love the Justicar, but Biotic Sphere is bugged. I died multiple times on Glacier yesterday attempting to throw it up in the enemies' face, and it just wouldn't appear. You have to give them a little space. ugh.


Known bug of the bubble; because you cast it on yourself, and not on your target, when the targetting crosshair turns red you can't cast it, because the bubble fails to acknowledge that you don't want it to cast on your target (like most abilities will do). You have to point at the ground, the air, the wall, or something else that isn't the thing in front of you.

#54
tzabaothg

tzabaothg
  • Members
  • 272 messages
There are better options than Justicar if you do not have a coordinated team of biotics.

As pointed out before there was a sentinel and the match ran long.

I will take Drell any day of the week over Justicar. Even if you are swimming in idiots you can still put the hurt out without having to wait for them to come to you.

Repost your scores in a competitive team with no other biotics and that should give you a better idea how useless Justicar can be.

#55
Biotic_Warlock

Biotic_Warlock
  • Members
  • 7 852 messages
I usually need someone with warp or throw.

And someone to heal... i run out of medigels!

#56
LiquidFooFoo

LiquidFooFoo
  • Members
  • 47 messages

tzabaothg wrote...

Repost your scores in a competitive team with no other biotics and that should give you a better idea how useless Justicar can be.


You are basing the utiltiy of Justicars on scores alone. By that metric all engineers are useless too. People should play whatever they deem to be fun, as long as their choice and playstyle doesn't drag the team down it's all good.

Modifié par LiquidFooFoo, 30 avril 2012 - 06:54 .


#57
Micah3sixty

Micah3sixty
  • Members
  • 2 060 messages

TheKingBoar wrote...

Micah3sixty wrote...

In previous builds I did leave 0 points in pull, 3 points in pull and now 4 points in pull for Radius.  I can take out unshielded mobs much quicker from distance with area pull and area reave.  Pull > Reave kills much quicker than either a single Reave or a Reave > Reave stack.  Pull also comes in handy to quickly disable a unshielded Centurian, phantom, Trooper, or other threat to avoid being killed, to revive a fallen comrad, or to drop warp bubble for more explosions.  Pull also staggers shielded enemies which can be useful to fire more shots, or get into cover.  The 5th and 6th evolutions of Justicar are all passive since Power Damage bonus is either broke, or doesn't affect Bubble warp, Reave or explosions and headshot damage isn't as useful for CQC (my playstyle anyways) and most high level pistols do more damage with higher cooldowns than any AR with 30% weight reduction, or weapon damage bonus.


The problem with splitting your abilities like that (as others have said) is that you're weakining your BEs. Maybe if you did Bubble/Reave/Pull as 6's but then you're weaker on the other fronts. Not to mention that the bubble can setup 3 BE at a time, plus give you the really useful abilities of warp.

Especially if farming FBW/G/G, better to skip pull, at least 50% of the enemies will come through the bubble and be primed. I'd rather have a10% overall weapon damage boost then waste points on an ability that has limited use.


My full build is 6/6/4/4/6.  Since pull can only setup biotic explosions on unshielded/non-armor units, there's little gain in leveling it to 6 since Pull > Reave finishes off the unshielded target either from the BE or the DoT reave which will finish off any remaining bars of health.  On Gold with most factions, there are far too few pull-able targets anyways so it becomes more situational for disabling a Marauder or Centurian that is already unshielded but about to kill you.  I have also tried 6/6/0/6/6 and 6/6/3/5/6 and for my play style, my current 6/6/4/4/6 works best and has the most utility while remaining deadly at close range.

#58
TheKingBoar

TheKingBoar
  • Members
  • 284 messages

Micah3sixty wrote...

TheKingBoar wrote...

Micah3sixty wrote...

In previous builds I did leave 0 points in pull, 3 points in pull and now 4 points in pull for Radius.  I can take out unshielded mobs much quicker from distance with area pull and area reave.  Pull > Reave kills much quicker than either a single Reave or a Reave > Reave stack.  Pull also comes in handy to quickly disable a unshielded Centurian, phantom, Trooper, or other threat to avoid being killed, to revive a fallen comrad, or to drop warp bubble for more explosions.  Pull also staggers shielded enemies which can be useful to fire more shots, or get into cover.  The 5th and 6th evolutions of Justicar are all passive since Power Damage bonus is either broke, or doesn't affect Bubble warp, Reave or explosions and headshot damage isn't as useful for CQC (my playstyle anyways) and most high level pistols do more damage with higher cooldowns than any AR with 30% weight reduction, or weapon damage bonus.


The problem with splitting your abilities like that (as others have said) is that you're weakining your BEs. Maybe if you did Bubble/Reave/Pull as 6's but then you're weaker on the other fronts. Not to mention that the bubble can setup 3 BE at a time, plus give you the really useful abilities of warp.

Especially if farming FBW/G/G, better to skip pull, at least 50% of the enemies will come through the bubble and be primed. I'd rather have a10% overall weapon damage boost then waste points on an ability that has limited use.


My full build is 6/6/4/4/6.  Since pull can only setup biotic explosions on unshielded/non-armor units, there's little gain in leveling it to 6 since Pull > Reave finishes off the unshielded target either from the BE or the DoT reave which will finish off any remaining bars of health.  On Gold with most factions, there are far too few pull-able targets anyways so it becomes more situational for disabling a Marauder or Centurian that is already unshielded but about to kill you.  I have also tried 6/6/0/6/6 and 6/6/3/5/6 and for my play style, my current 6/6/4/4/6 works best and has the most utility while remaining deadly at close range.


It's an interesting build to be sure. I've tried the other two, but will give the 6/6/4/4/6 a go to see how I like that variant of it.

#59
Micah3sixty

Micah3sixty
  • Members
  • 2 060 messages

LiquidFooFoo wrote...

tzabaothg wrote...

Repost your scores in a competitive team with no other biotics and that should give you a better idea how useless Justicar can be.


You are basing the utiltiy of Justicars on scores alone. By that metric all engineers are useless too. People should play whatever they deem to be fun, as long as their choice and playstyle doesn't drag the team down it's all good.


I'm not basing the "utility" of Justicars off of the score.  I'm demonstrating the viability of Justicars on Gold off of the score.  I've had equally weighted scores with a team of two engineers, an infiltrator and my Justicar so the Sentinel from this round wasn't helping my score all that much.  However, I do agree with your premise.  Score doesn't indicate utility, only damage dealt.  Salarian Engineers with Decoy or Geth Engineers with healing turrets are very helpful even if their individual score is near/at the bottom.

#60
GodlessPaladin

GodlessPaladin
  • Members
  • 4 187 messages
Who the heck said the Asari Justicar adept wasn't viable on gold without biotic support?  :huh:

Modifié par GodlessPaladin, 30 avril 2012 - 08:41 .


#61
Biotic_Warlock

Biotic_Warlock
  • Members
  • 7 852 messages
Scored top on justicar without biotic backup an hour ago.
Woooooooooooooooooooooo

Maybe cause of the last wave then i missiled 6 phantoms X_X

#62
LiquidFooFoo

LiquidFooFoo
  • Members
  • 47 messages

Micah3sixty wrote...

LiquidFooFoo wrote...

tzabaothg wrote...

Repost your scores in a competitive team with no other biotics and that should give you a better idea how useless Justicar can be.


You are basing the utiltiy of Justicars on scores alone. By that metric all engineers are useless too. People should play whatever they deem to be fun, as long as their choice and playstyle doesn't drag the team down it's all good.


I'm not basing the "utility" of Justicars off of the score.  I'm demonstrating the viability of Justicars on Gold off of the score.  I've had equally weighted scores with a team of two engineers, an infiltrator and my Justicar so the Sentinel from this round wasn't helping my score all that much.  However, I do agree with your premise.  Score doesn't indicate utility, only damage dealt.  Salarian Engineers with Decoy or Geth Engineers with healing turrets are very helpful even if their individual score is near/at the bottom.


You are replying to me, replying to someone else???? :crying:

#63
tonyng9

tonyng9
  • Members
  • 55 messages
People don't realize how strong reave is. You just cast it twice and the group of trash enemies are as good as dead. You can stay safely in cover. Usually the Justicar doesn't go up high on the scoreboard because someone else kills those enemies first. The AoE stunning/staggering ability of reave makes it comparable to Overload, except it does a ton of damage to non-shields while overload does a ton of damage to shields. They actually complement each other pretty well. For some reason people think overload is great, but reave is not. I think a lot of people just had a bad time playing the glass cannon drell adept and thought that reave is bad when it is actually the drell's low defenses (the Drell Adept would be so overpowered if he were not a glass cannon).

#64
tzabaothg

tzabaothg
  • Members
  • 272 messages

GodlessPaladin wrote...

Who the heck said the Asari Justicar adept wasn't viable on gold without biotic support?  :huh:


<-----

Your AJ video is against reapers, and you have 2 AA on your team. Both of these factors absolutely made you more effective.

Show me a video with a mix of competent non biotics (preferably one where the kill feed is legible).

#65
GodlessPaladin

GodlessPaladin
  • Members
  • 4 187 messages

tzabaothg wrote...

GodlessPaladin wrote...

Who the heck said the Asari Justicar adept wasn't viable on gold without biotic support?  :huh:


<-----

Your AJ video is against reapers, and you have 2 AA on your team. Both of these factors absolutely made you more effective.

Show me a video with a mix of competent non biotics (preferably one where the kill feed is legible).


EDIT:  Ah, apparently the arrow was referring to himself, not to me.  Nevermind.

Modifié par GodlessPaladin, 30 avril 2012 - 09:15 .


#66
tzabaothg

tzabaothg
  • Members
  • 272 messages

GodlessPaladin wrote...

tzabaothg wrote...

GodlessPaladin wrote...

Who the heck said the Asari Justicar adept wasn't viable on gold without biotic support?  :huh:


<-----

Your AJ video is against reapers, and you have 2 AA on your team. Both of these factors absolutely made you more effective.

Show me a video with a mix of competent non biotics (preferably one where the kill feed is legible).


The very FIRST AJ video I made involved me soloing Cerberus on Giant with my very first time trying out the class.  GTFO.

Moreover, you're outright lying with that little arrow there.  I never claimed that the biotic support was necessary.  In fact I said the exact opposite in the thread you're talking about.


Im not going anywhere, you GTFO.

That little arrow points to me, you asked who said AJ suck and I am more than happy to take credit for that statement. Maybe you should switch to decaf?

AA, DA, HS all will outperform AJ without additional biotic support. I have already subjected myself to several minutes of your video (does your video camera need glasses?) and my eyes hate you for it.

#67
GodlessPaladin

GodlessPaladin
  • Members
  • 4 187 messages

tzabaothg wrote...
That little arrow points to me, you asked who said AJ suck and I am more than happy to take credit for that statement.


I see, I thought you were saying I said it.  Sorry for the misinterpretation.

#68
tzabaothg

tzabaothg
  • Members
  • 272 messages

GodlessPaladin wrote...

tzabaothg wrote...
That little arrow points to me, you asked who said AJ suck and I am more than happy to take credit for that statement.


I see, I thought you were saying I said it.  Sorry for the misinterpretation.


NP. The point I am trying to make is AJ has substandard damage per biotic detonation based on the suck level of bubble warp.

Any biotic specced class will outdamage with each detonation regardless of weapon loadout. GPS helps account for your need to stay in close but again slows your power usage. Reave will net you mad points with any other biotic on the team, Drell can do the same but better and at range. Cluster grenades >>> Bubble.

Bubble also necessitates being in close, a good player can pull this off but I would wager the majority of players cannot. Your Vanguard video proves you have the necessary skill to make just about any spec work, that is not proof that that spec is optimal by any means.

#69
GodlessPaladin

GodlessPaladin
  • Members
  • 4 187 messages
Optimal isn't really the same as viable in my book. I wouldn't say the Salarian Engineer is optimal for much of anything, for example, just because it doesn't keep up with the murder train that certain other classes bring to the table and on an optimized team decoy doesn't even really have time to matter before the enemies are exterminated.

Without a biotic strike team, a Justicar is a very resilient tank that can dish out a lot of damage and can easily wipe out problematic enemies like Ravagers, Banshees, and Phantoms as well as easily clear crowds.  There's no way that's not viable.

Modifié par GodlessPaladin, 30 avril 2012 - 09:38 .


#70
Biotic_Warlock

Biotic_Warlock
  • Members
  • 7 852 messages
Try asari justicar on cerberus and solo a single phantom.
It's so possible! :D
Just don't get too close or try to aboid losing your shields.
Melee when she JUST loses her barrier, she flies.
FISHISH HER!!!!

edit: *finish her
But i liked the sound of fishishing.

Modifié par Biotic_Warlock, 30 avril 2012 - 09:31 .


#71
Achossa

Achossa
  • Members
  • 480 messages

Biotic_Warlock wrote...

Try asari justicar on cerberus and solo a single phantom.
It's so possible! :D
Just don't get too close or try to aboid losing your shields.
Melee when she JUST loses her barrier, she flies.
FISHISH HER!!!!

edit: *finish her
But i liked the sound of fishishing.

Actually when the barrier is down you pull evry time, no exceptions.

#72
CarlTheNoob

CarlTheNoob
  • Members
  • 85 messages
i get kicked a lot for using the original asari or human sentinel. what people don't realize is that i run the scoreboard 90 percent of the time with well over 100,000 points, with no other biotics to help because i know how to configure an asari and human sentinel for biotic explosions, and i know how to play the game.

#73
Achossa

Achossa
  • Members
  • 480 messages

CarlTheNoob wrote...

i get kicked a lot for using the original asari or human sentinel. what people don't realize is that i run the scoreboard 90 percent of the time with well over 100,000 points, with no other biotics to help because i know how to configure an asari and human sentinel for biotic explosions, and i know how to play the game.

(slightly sarcastic) Really, you do, how do you do it?

#74
whalewhisker

whalewhisker
  • Members
  • 1 058 messages

BraveLToaster wrote...

They have Reave, so they're viable whether or not they can easily detonate. Area staggers and good damage over time that stacks is pretty damn useful.


Pretty much this.

#75
marshalleck

marshalleck
  • Members
  • 15 645 messages
I can't believe this was ever a thread. Anyone with reave is gold viable.