41 réponses à ce sujet

[Kahninovre]

Alot of gamers play for graphics which is a shame but it's the way it is.

[Kail Ashton]

Yes expecting good visuals in a visual medium is silly! why even have graphics at all what preteniousness~! why you could just read a book instead! or play i dunno those board game things nerds do in their mom's basements D&D i dunno, i had a nintendo as a kid

[David Gaider]

Kail Ashton wrote...
Yes expecting good visuals in a visual medium is silly! why even have graphics at all what preteniousness~! why you could just read a book instead! or play i dunno those board game things nerds do in their mom's basements D&D i dunno, i had a nintendo as a kid

Kind of proudly flying the confrontational ignorance flag there, I see.

Knock it off, please.

[the_one_54321]

nightscrawl wrote...
So why is a book on the table OK to be destroyed, but the table or bookcase itself is not?

You don't get codex entries or quest information from a bookshelf or table, typically. There's a processing limitation with simulating particle and solids physics. It's not a shooter or fighting game, after all.

[ElitePinecone]

There's something to be said that in forums, the concept of zots just doesn't exist.

[Maria Caliban]

Kahninovre wrote...

Alot of gamers play for graphics which is a shame but it's the way it is.

I don't think it's a shame. Video games are a mixed media and neglecting visuals means it's a poorer game overall.

BioWare pours a lot of time and energy into facial work and cinematic moments. Bethesda pours a lot of time and energy into its environment. When people talk about their RPGs, I think they're responding as much to that as they are to the rulesets and camera.

[brushyourteeth]

Maria Caliban wrote...

Kahninovre wrote...

Alot of gamers play for graphics which is a shame but it's the way it is.

I don't think it's a shame. Video games are a mixed media and neglecting visuals means it's a poorer game overall.

BioWare pours a lot of time and energy into facial work and cinematic moments. Bethesda pours a lot of time and energy into its environment. When people talk about their RPGs, I think they're responding as much to that as they are to the rulesets and camera.

Well said!

[nightscrawl]

the_one_54321 wrote...

nightscrawl wrote...
So why is a book on the table OK to be destroyed, but the table or bookcase itself is not?

You don't get codex entries or quest information from a bookshelf or table, typically. There's a processing limitation with simulating particle and solids physics. It's not a shooter or fighting game, after all.

My point was that selective destruction of the environment seems silly. So if you can't have realistic destruction of the environment from a spell like Inferno, there shouldn't be any at all. I know the next argument will be "But it's fantasy, it's not supposed to simulate real life like some shooter taking place in Afghanistan!" That's a false argument because there ARE limited laws of physics that exist in all games, pre-defined by the game's creators, like gravity.

[the_one_54321]

The selective destruction would serve a specific purpose. That is, to make you think about what your actions might cause you to lose in useful items.

Universally applied physics simulation of destructible objects would only serve as eye candy.

[nightscrawl]

the_one_54321 wrote...

The selective destruction would serve a specific purpose. That is, to make you think about what your actions might cause you to lose in useful items.

Universally applied physics simulation of destructible objects would only serve as eye candy.

People would probably just reload once they realized they destroyed something they needed, which would then just cause irritation that they couldn't use the spells/abilities they want because of something as gimmicky as not destroying a codex.

I could see this mechanic being part of an achievement or something though. For example, there is currently an achievement for finding all of the codex entires by the Band of Three in a single playthrough. If something like that is important to you, you would take extra care to not use spells that would destroy such objects.

[Yrkoon]

Rorschachinstein wrote...

Even Skyrim didn't burn books. Seriously, just drop a book on a fire and you can pick it up all over again.

Indeed.

I personally don't think  that level of environment interaction is a great idea, despite the fact that I'm a huge fan of  realistic physics in games.

What I would like, though,  is  for Bioware to try and encorporate  the effects of force on objects.  Because I always found that cool.  And Skyrim DOES do that.  Do a Fus Ro Dah on a bookshelf or table and  the books/bottles  will fly off it and tumble to the ground.

In a game like Dragon age, such a thing would be tremendously satisfying.    Imagine the possibilities:  You're in Orlais.  You're a Mage.    You walk into some snobby Nobleman's house.  You  notice how impeccably fancy and orderly the dining room is.  So you start firing off all your big AOE spells.  a few minutes later, the dining room is a mess.  Plates and glasses are on the ground, chairs are knocked over,  candles are scattered all over the place. Even the Cheese wheels are rolling around on the floor.

Modifié par Yrkoon, 02 mai 2012 - 10:13 .

[PsychoBlonde]

the_one_54321 wrote...

No-friendly-fire also applies to relevant objects in the area? I don't like this. Preferably, I'd like to see a room hit by a devastating AoE spell be devastated. I know that maybe this would be just asking for too much, so the idea is rather that some objects that are known to be important or useful in some way can be destructible.

Dude, you don't even get friendly fire on people passing by, you can have a huge fight in the middle of their lunch break and they won't even get out of the way.

[PsychoBlonde]

Yrkoon wrote...
Even the Cheese wheels are rolling around on the floor.

And no one notices!

Frankly, Skyrim has its own bits of interactable absurdity.  Like putting buckets over people's heads so you can cheat the stealth mechanism.

I wouldn't mind if DA3 has some "old school" interactables, though, where you can click on them and put them through a couple of state changes.  That might be kind of neat.  They could even have puzzles and exploration elements based on that kind of thing--you go in the library, there's books all over the floor, so you click wildly on all of them, putting the books back on the shelves, and look, a trap door is revealed.

Having interactables of this kind might also make finding codex entries or whatever a bit more of a fun mini-game, because it wouldn't just be a matter of holding down the Tab key.  It'd also be nice if Tab made interactables glow but not pop a label.

Granted, if they decide to keep the codex, I'd like to see more codex entries come from sources other than clicking on things, like investigate options in dialog, killing certain foes, maybe putting on certain pieces of gear.  Sadly, the games as they exist now kind of lack gameplay elements, so thinking of existing options that could be used is difficult.

I do hope they find ways to include more gameplay elements in The Next Thing.

[upsettingshorts]

Gameplay/story segregation.

Destructible environments seem to only be implemented in games where its visual presence would actually dramatically effect gameplay, such as in shooters.

It's a fundamentally different experience looking for cover in a shooter with destructible environments, especially if you're hiding from say... a tank.

[LolaLei]

Maybe they are fire proof books? Y'know, so the Mages don't set them alight, lol.

[Sylvius the Mad]

the_one_54321 wrote...

You designate the specific objects of note to be destructible or not, by certain kinds of AoE abilities.

I don't know that this would be incredibly difficult or not.

NWN2 did it.  If you threw a fireball into a room, any interactive container and the stuff inside it might be destroyed.

[Sylvius the Mad]

PsychoBlonde wrote...

Frankly, Skyrim has its own bits of interactable absurdity.  Like putting buckets over people's heads so you can cheat the stealth mechanism.

I need to try that.

Upsettingshorts wrote...

Gameplay/story segregation.

Destructible environments seem to only be implemented in games where its visual presence would actually dramatically effect gameplay, such as in shooters.

Loot affects gameplay.  Destructible loot (again, like NWN2 had) would be an excellent feature.

Modifié par Sylvius the Mad, 02 mai 2012 - 08:40 .