324 réponses à ce sujet

[Siansonea]

termokanden wrote...

Siansonea II wrote...

So you missed the whole bit about how "until you've put out a game you can't really have a decent conversation about games"? l33tist much?

Again, I thought he was talking about making games, and that was where you didn't know until you had tried it. I acknowledge that this may be a misinterpretation, given that the sound quality was poor and I was a bit distracted by the blend of jokes and possibly serious statements.

Just don't be too quick to judge before it's clear what people are saying. People are actively searching the internet for new interviews and speeches to dissect involving BioWare employees. This is why I'm being extra, extra careful before I cry foul.

In case you are interested in my opinion, check out the rest of my original post.

The overall tone of the presentation is problematic too. 'Scathing wit' only works in certain circumstances, and only when expertly handled by someone who is primarily a commentator, not a participant. When you are being filmed at one of these things, one thing that should be going through your head is "hey, this is reaching a wider audience, not just these schmoes sitting here". So dial back on the condescension, the derision, and the contempt for your customer. Don't slam the Internet. Don't slam anybody, if you can help it. Know your limits as a stand-up comic, especially if it doesn't say "stand-up comic" on your business card. It's bad enough we get flippant contempt from Chris Priestly and Stanley Woo on a regular basis, and they're just the guys running the social network. But if you've got the word "creative" somewhere in your title and you come off as a total jack@ss? That's REALLY bad for business.

Modifié par Siansonea II, 01 mai 2012 - 06:19 .

[Giga Drill BREAKER]

well I hope he enjoys his opinion, I'll enjoy my money that I won't be spending on EA and Bioware products

[Taboo]

Heh, Stanley hasn't been back since his comment on the endings was thrown back into his face with literal evidence.

[Jostle]

The Angry One wrote...

Tali-vas-normandy wrote...

ShepnTali wrote...

So, Roger Ebert should STFU 'cause he doesn't make movies?

I thaught he was an actor?

He is a screenwriter. However according to Barnett's logic he still isn't qualified to make criticisms, as he hasn't as far as I know written for a Hollywood blockbuster. So who is he to talk about Hollywood blockbusters right?

The funny thing here is, Paul, as far as I know, isn't intimently involved in actually making a game. He is a PR hype guy, and I don't think he even touches art or coding. So to what level does even he agree with his own opinion?

[Dracorequiem]

Kunari801 wrote...

John Epler wrote...

As with all BioWare staff, his opinion is his own.

I'm of the school of thought that 'if you consume a product, you are welcome to criticize and critique it'. That doesn't mean that, occasionally, you aren't going to necessarily understand something that's rather specialized - but why would you? It's not your job to know about things like production and resource costs. That's the job of the company - all you need to know is 'did I enjoy the product' and 'what parts of the game did I or did I not enjoy'.

Thanks for posting John.  I hope most folks at BW subscribe to your "school of thought".

I agree, thanks for getting in here and responding! And for the friendly reminder that not everyone shares his opinions, it's what we needed to hear, I think.

Also on an unrelated note, looking forward to the next DA project

[Kulthar Drax]

I've made games in the past, and I'm still working on games now. I still think the ending is terrible, but my opinion probably still won't count as I don't work for EA.

[TK EL_]

See its because of people like Barnett that I would love to see a full blown boycott actually happen in my lifetime, particularly in gaming. Where even the lowest common denominator of consumer puts his foot down. I know the publisher(especially the big ones) will try to spin it to look less damaging, like releasing number of copies shipped as opposed to number of copies sold or buying quantities of their own game but internally, they would know the score

[rma2110]

I'm getting sick of developers and publishers looking down on the people stupid enough to pay for their crap. I never thought BioWare would one of those developers, and now I regret my former loyalty.

[termokanden]

Siansonea II wrote...

The overall tone of the presentation is problematic too. 'Scathing wit' only works in certain circumstances, and only when expertly handled by someone who is primarily a commentator, not a participant. When you are being filmed at one of these things, one thing that should be going through your head is "hey, this is reaching a wider audience, not just these schmoes sitting here". So dial back on the condescension, the derision, and the contempt for your customer. Don't slam the Internet. Don't slam anybody, if you can help it. Know your limits as a stand-up comic, especially if it doesn't say "stand-up comic" on your business card.

No doubt this reflects poorly on the company. But I wouldn't go as far as to say it somehow proves that BioWare hates their customers (I know this isn't what you said, by the way). I'm trying to keep my head cool because a lot of people are going completely nuts on BSN. Some of it is justified, a lot of it is not. Perhaps some of the comments you mention were in response to the all out assault on BioWare on these forums. It may not professional to retaliate, but I can't imagine it's easy to keep being civil in this situation.

I'll let their products do the talking.

Modifié par termokanden, 01 mai 2012 - 06:32 .

[Gmandam]

Yeah well done EA cause you know insulting your fan base and calling their opinions worthless if not annoying is really going to make you look clever. Bravo well done. It really takes talent to fail this bad.

I'll have you know that the fact that we don't know about game making (Some of us anyway) only perhaps makes our though on the coding aspect of the game less valid. The story criticisms though everyone can criticize those and every opinion is equally as valid. Seeing has the majority of the issues regarding ME3 are story based I think this guy is being a bit of a moron.

[AlexXIV]

rma2110 wrote...

I'm getting sick of developers and publishers looking down on the people stupid enough to pay for their crap. I never thought BioWare would one of those developers, and now I regret my former loyalty.

The sad thing is, most developers are pretty decent. But the guys who owned Bioware thought it would be cool to get a warm chair at EA. But hey, they created Bioware, they can also ... you know.

Modifié par AlexXIV, 01 mai 2012 - 06:32 .

[crimzontearz]

actually Wnkr, I do....but it has todo with the ethics of the company in which I am interested and not direcly their product

[soulprovider]

 that is rather insulting, arrogance is the result of entitlement. 

I'm beginning to understand why people in other countries hate us so much, but i'm also beginning to understand that this is the result of 60 years of corruption of our values.

that man has no passion and this is the result of corporate greed, without passion you might as well be a leech.

Modifié par soulprovider, 01 mai 2012 - 06:34 .

[AlexXIV]

soulprovider wrote...

 that is rather insulting, arrogance is the result of entitlement. 

I'm beginning to understand why people in other countries hate us so much, but i'm also beginning to understand that this is the result of 50 years of corruption of our values.

that man has no passion and this is the result of corporate greed, without passion you might as well be a leech.

Yeah you Canadians are all corrupted.

[XwebraiderX]

Do yourself a favour: REMEMBER this interview before the next big EA game comes out. Then think again. Then, maybe, rent it first. If the game deserves it - buy it. I am all with you but the major error gamers (consumers) make since day 1: In the end they buy the new **** anyway. If you wanna make a difference, act different, from this day on.

We dont need a big shiny campaign boycotting EA, etc. If you feel disgusted by being almost called an idiot by a representative of a company, dont buy games then, even if it hurts you. Everyone matters. And after all: It should matter to YOU and only you.

Modifié par XwebraiderX, 01 mai 2012 - 06:36 .

[soulprovider]

AlexXIV wrote...

soulprovider wrote...

 that is rather insulting, arrogance is the result of entitlement. 

I'm beginning to understand why people in other countries hate us so much, but i'm also beginning to understand that this is the result of 50 years of corruption of our values.

that man has no passion and this is the result of corporate greed, without passion you might as well be a leech.

Yeah you Canadians are all corrupted.

canadians lol, was referring to the fact that EA is an american company and as such EA's arrogance and entitlement has leeched into bioware making them just as corrupt, sorry I ddin't get that across.

[XwebraiderX]

soulprovider wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...

soulprovider wrote...

 that is rather insulting, arrogance is the result of entitlement. 

I'm beginning to understand why people in other countries hate us so much, but i'm also beginning to understand that this is the result of 50 years of corruption of our values.

that man has no passion and this is the result of corporate greed, without passion you might as well be a leech.

Yeah you Canadians are all corrupted.

canadians lol, was referring to the fact that EA is an american company and as such EA's arrogance and entitlement has leeched into bioware making them just as corrupt, sorry I ddin't get that across.

He's trolling you. Ignore him.

[Akal Ashata Alis]

John Epler wrote...

As with all BioWare staff, his opinion is his own.

I'm of the school of thought that 'if you consume a product, you are welcome to criticize and critique it'..

Exactly. Well said. 

[XwebraiderX]

Akal Ashata Alis wrote...

John Epler wrote...

As with all BioWare staff, his opinion is his own.

I'm of the school of thought that 'if you consume a product, you are welcome to criticize and critique it'..

Exactly. Well said. 

That is wrong.

He represents his company.

If my boss catches me insulting a customer he will fire me and/or apologize to the customer.

[CuseGirl]

John Epler wrote...

As with all BioWare staff, his opinion is his own.

I'm of the school of thought that 'if you consume a product, you are welcome to criticize and critique it'. That doesn't mean that, occasionally, you aren't going to necessarily understand something that's rather specialized - but why would you? It's not your job to know about things like production and resource costs. That's the job of the company - all you need to know is 'did I enjoy the product' and 'what parts of the game did I or did I not enjoy'.

I think some people who viewed his speech just feel a tad insulted. And you're right, his opinion is own. The problem is his opinion doesn't hold water in regards to a lot of topics, particularly, video gaming, even though he's billed as a CREATIVE DIRECTOR of a video game company.

If a video game player plays a game and points out objective facts to support why he doesn't like a portion of the game (or the whole game), you can't say "well you've never made a game, so your opinion has little or less value". Because making a game doesn't change the fact that the player perceived the flaws in the product he consumed.

And for this speech to come out mere weeks after the Mass Effect 3 ending controversy, it's just slapping a raw scab.

[Taboo]

Do they just let people run loose out there?

I still can't believe this.

HE REPRESENTS BIOWARE AS EMPLOYEE.

Modifié par Taboo-XX, 01 mai 2012 - 06:45 .

[AlexXIV]

XwebraiderX wrote...

Akal Ashata Alis wrote...

John Epler wrote...

As with all BioWare staff, his opinion is his own.

I'm of the school of thought that 'if you consume a product, you are welcome to criticize and critique it'..

Exactly. Well said. 

That is wrong.

He represents his company.

If my boss catches me insulting a customer he will fire me and/or apologize to the customer.

Because you are unimportant. The higher you climb the ladder the more can you insult customers.

[Reorte]

So the people who cost a company money are important but the ones who give them money aren't. How on earth do such people get into senior positions?

[XwebraiderX]

AlexXIV wrote...

XwebraiderX wrote...

Akal Ashata Alis wrote...

John Epler wrote...

As with all BioWare staff, his opinion is his own.

I'm of the school of thought that 'if you consume a product, you are welcome to criticize and critique it'..

Exactly. Well said. 

That is wrong.

He represents his company.

If my boss catches me insulting a customer he will fire me and/or apologize to the customer.

Because you are unimportant. The higher you climb the ladder the more can you insult customers.

Uh... no? Aside from me not being unimportant for my company, that is just plain wrong. If at all, it is the other way around. At the "bottom" you can insult customers and hope your boss doesnt notice or doesnt give a ****.

If you are high up there, every word you say will get you into trouble because it is ampliefied by the media.