265 réponses à ce sujet

[RoyalGambit]

DiebytheSword wrote...

The Abrahamic religions "scrambled to explain" does not equal "collapsed"

They are still around, in a greatly diminished role. As it has been pointed out, both Ashley and (dependant on choice) Commander Shepard can be Christians or at the minimal Diests.

I don't think he ment that those religions disappeared. Just that they diminished in relevance and popularity as you said. 

[ShepnTali]

Mordin also said this in ME2, I believe. It could be writers taking a shot, not cool, believe it's mythology, or simply working within their lore. Probably 2 and 3, but not shocked if 1 as well.

[The Protheans]

What is there to talk about, in the future everyone will think silly beliefs are apart of mythology.

[AlexXIV]

Mahrac wrote...

Legion got his name from the bible, that didn't cause a stir either (or I don't remember it).
Personally, I think it's because it wasn't a human that gave either of them their names

Well and Shepard. Or should I say 'The Shepherd'.

[poundoffleshaa]

The Angry One wrote...

You do know many Christians regard Adam and Eve and other the stories of the Old Testament as mythology don't you?

Same goes for many Jews, just saying.

[The Angry One]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

You do know many Christians regard Adam and Eve and other the stories of the Old Testament as mythology don't you?

But why not Lucy? Dr. Leakey referred to what he thought was the first hominid female as "Lucy." Why Eve? or would Lucy have gone over everyone's head?

You want to call a Krogan Lucy?
Okay sure why not. Then Wrex will burst in and declare that Lucy "has some 'splainin to do."

poundoffleshaa wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

You do know many Christians regard Adam and Eve and other the stories of the Old Testament as mythology don't you?

Same goes for many Jews, just saying.

Yeah, of course. Members of any religion will often focus only on the core beliefs, the mythology is just that.

Modifié par The Angry One, 01 mai 2012 - 08:27 .

[justafan]

Catroi wrote...

It's said in the ME1 codex that abrahamic religions collapsed after the discovery of other species, because they were unable to explain their existence

It also says that Cerberus assissinated a pope for political reasons, so at least one branch of Christianity is still kicking and has influence.

Not to mention Ashley is a monotheist (never says what kind, but pretty safe to assume its an Abrahamic one).

Also IIRC, the codex in question doesn't say they collapsed, only that they struggled to explain alien existence.

Modifié par justafan, 01 mai 2012 - 08:28 .

[AlexXIV]

The Protheans wrote...

What is there to talk about, in the future everyone will think silly beliefs are apart of mythology.

I am pretty sure alot of religious people will disagree with that. Not saying you're wrong. But that's the point of the OP. Disproving religion in a sci-fi franchise is probably a good way to get religious fanatics riled up against you.

[ckriley]

Mahrac wrote...

Legion got his name from the bible, that didn't cause a stir either (or I don't remember it).
Personally, I think it's because it wasn't a human that gave either of them their names

If I remember correctly, after Legion got his name, he just references that it's from the Bible, but I don't believe he ever said it was a mythology.  It's been a while since I played it though.

[mauro2222]

Epique Phael767 wrote...

Catroi wrote...

It's said in the ME1 codex that abrahamic religions collapsed after the discovery of other species, because they were unable to explain their existence

So why does Ashley claim to be christian in ME1?

She only said she believed in a higher entity.

[RoyalGambit]

MassiveEffects wrote...

RoyalGambit wrote...

Thought it was a nice touch. If you're looking at a culture's religions from the outside, they're all just myths and fairy tales. Plus, Mordin is the very model of a scientist Salarian, so you would expect him to take a rational approach to the subject of religion.

Getting too political here, need to stay neutral and whatnot to comply with forum rules.

Wasn't my intention. Just stating the fact that Mordin was acting the way you would expect, given his characterisation. 

[Mahrac]

AlexXIV wrote...

Mahrac wrote...

Legion got his name from the bible, that didn't cause a stir either (or I don't remember it).
Personally, I think it's because it wasn't a human that gave either of them their names

Well and Shepard. Or should I say 'The Shepherd'.

That never happened. and he just agrees, not a big distinction, but it might be why there's no flak

[PistolPete7556]

ckriley wrote...

Mahrac wrote...

Legion got his name from the bible, that didn't cause a stir either (or I don't remember it).
Personally, I think it's because it wasn't a human that gave either of them their names

If I remember correctly, after Legion got his name, he just references that it's from the Bible, but I don't believe he ever said it was a mythology.  It's been a while since I played it though.

Yea he said Christian Bible and said it was from the book of Mark. Which it is

[ckriley]

MassiveEffects wrote...

RoyalGambit wrote...

Thought it was a nice touch. If you're looking at a culture's religions from the outside, they're all just myths and fairy tales. Plus, Mordin is the very model of a scientist Salarian, so you would expect him to take a rational approach to the subject of religion.

Getting too political here, need to stay neutral and whatnot to comply with forum rules.

Yes.  Let's please, please, please try to stay neutral here and avoid political and religious debates.  That was not the intent of this thread.  I was hoping we could have a grown up, mature discussion about an interesting aspect of the game that gave me a bit of a pause.

[frylock23]

Catroi wrote...

It's said in the ME1 codex that abrahamic religions collapsed after the discovery of other species, because they were unable to explain their existence

Which only goes to show that whoever wrote that Codex entry doesn't actually understand Christianity all that well. At least my definition of "Creation" doesn't stop at the extent of the atmosphere. Ah, well, to address your question. I found the depth and breadth of spirituality and religiousity in the game refreshing actually. Almost every character addresses his or her personal belief from Primarch Victus speaking of the spirits to Thane's prayer to the Asari and so on and so forth. I pretty much chalked it up to the idea that there are no atheists in foxholes, but I liked the tone. And, I would find it only natural that for a being of another race who grew up with another society who has its own notions of spiritual belief, Mordin would address the religious beliefs of Earth as a mythology because to him they would be. I wouldn't expect him to believe in them similar to how I might refer to the religious beliefs of Norse mythology or Hindu mythology even though they are active religions. It's nothing personal, they just aren't my personal beliefs.

And if anyone wants some interesting Sci-fi that attempts to address the question and what a modern religious person's thoughts on it might approximate, try Russell's "The Sparrow" and its sequel.  

Modifié par frylock23, 01 mai 2012 - 08:35 .

[MakeMineMako]

Catroi wrote...

It's said in the ME1 codex that abrahamic religions collapsed after the discovery of other species, because they were unable to explain their existence

No, it did not.

New beliefs sprang up, while the established religions tried to incorporate it into their dogma, remained silent, or just refused to accept was was found on Mars.

It did not say anything about the collaspe of the Abrahamic religions.

[Mahrac]

double post

Modifié par Mahrac, 01 mai 2012 - 08:31 .

[Grimwick]

The Angry One wrote...

You do know many Christians regard Adam and Eve and other the stories of the Old Testament as mythology don't you?

^^ It's very hard to describe it as anything other than mythology...

[RoyalGambit]

ckriley wrote...

MassiveEffects wrote...

RoyalGambit wrote...

Thought it was a nice touch. If you're looking at a culture's religions from the outside, they're all just myths and fairy tales. Plus, Mordin is the very model of a scientist Salarian, so you would expect him to take a rational approach to the subject of religion.

Getting too political here, need to stay neutral and whatnot to comply with forum rules.

Yes.  Let's please, please, please try to stay neutral here and avoid political and religious debates.  That was not the intent of this thread.  I was hoping we could have a grown up, mature discussion about an interesting aspect of the game that gave me a bit of a pause.

 
Repost, just so you don't misunderstand me: 

Wasn't my intention. Just stating the fact that Mordin was acting the way you would expect, given his characterisation. 

[Siansonea]

As far as I'm concerned, religion and mythology are synonyms.

[justafan]

It doesn't really matter what Mordin says, he's an Alien! Mordin says Salarians believe in reincarnation, so he is not obviously not a Christian/Jew/Muslim, and thus treats their beliefs as mythology. It would be like Ashley naming her gun "Atheme" and saying she got the idea from Asari mythology.

Edit:  Also, being a myth does not necessarily mean something is untrue.  A myth can be any culturally significant story that deals with issues of human existence or deities.  By definition the Bible, Quran, and Torah all contain "myths", but we as a society are so used to the myths of Greek deities, that we equate "myth" with  "made up" when that is simply not true.

Modifié par justafan, 01 mai 2012 - 08:39 .

[daecath]

To a Salarian, the story of Adam and Eve would be mythology. Just like the story of Zeus is mythology to us, but was religion to the ancient Greeks.

[ShepnTali]

Here we go....

[PistolPete7556]

daecath wrote...

To a Salarian, the story of Adam and Eve would be mythology. Just like the story of Zeus is mythology to us, but was religion to the ancient Greeks.

Yea that's pretty much how I took it