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[cbutz]

I agree, miranda and jack should have gotten more. Jack should have came up after her mission and got a li scene. Miranda should have came up after sanct, should have had cloaure to the cerb arch and a more fleshed out romance.

Jacob should have a rewrite, samra content should have recognized the romance. Thane should have been treated as a li. Basically the me 2specific squad should get more content...all of them. Honeatly, if we want to get more content we have to be united. I think weekes hinted at that as well

[MattFini]

cbutz wrote...

I agree, miranda and jack should have gotten more. Jack should have came up after her mission and got a li scene. Miranda should have came up after sanct, should have had cloaure to the cerb arch and a more fleshed out romance.

Jacob should have a rewrite, samra content should have recognized the romance. Thane should have been treated as a li. Basically the me 2specific squad should get more content...all of them. Honeatly, if we want to get more content we have to be united. I think weekes hinted at that as well

There's obvious justification for why almost ALL of the ME2 folks should've had more ties to the overall story. 

I just think it would've been great to see Jack and Miranda on the Normandy since so much of the game establishes Cerberus as the secondary villain.  Both of them are opposite sides of the Cerberus coin (one benefitted, the other suffered) and watching them deal with the ways in which TIM was assaulting the galaxy would've given the story a lot more drama.  

Assaulting the final base with the two of them would've been awesome.  Plus, as I've said before, their chemistry is great.  Would've been SOOOOOOOOO satisfying to watch the two of them finally come to some kind of mutual, begrudging understanding - or even friendship.  

Modifié par MattFini, 02 mai 2012 - 06:38 .

[MisterJB]

Had there been a proper Cerberus arc comparable to Tuchanka and Rannoch's, Miranda and Jack should have been essential figures on both sides of the debate (for and against preservation of Cerberus) much like Mordin/Wrex and Tali/Legion.

[MattFini]

^ Ah, good call.

[Mark Mays]

The "romances" I experienced on my playthroughs weren't all that substantial to begin with. I thought Jack and Miranda's reactions (character flaws, if you will, whatever emotional armor you had to breakthrough) were kind of high school-ish. Their reactions were not what you'd expect from a mission centered executive or a jaded merc. I guess the devs just thought it would be fun for those women to act like petulant brats if they didn't get their way.

That said, if you romanced Jack you got a lot of fan service during the academy mission. After that, well . . . But in terms of the plot, it made sense that you'd be separated from Jack if she was looking after her students and continuing their training. And I suppose from a dev standpoint it made sense because that would be a lot of extra work to bring her and her team onboard the ship.

For Miranda it would make more sense to bring her onboard if you wanted to help her. And it would make more sense for her if she had to run errands hither and yon to help her sister. That whole side mission is begging for a LotSB type DLC.

Never played femshep, so I don't know about Thane or Jacob as LI. So Thane's appearances were nice for me. Jacob, I liked him, but why is he standing in the middle of the hospital the entire time? Shouldn't he have at least left to help with the Crucible? Annoying!

Having romanced Ashley in one playthrough I was underwhelmed. I didn't play ME1 so she meant nothing to me personally. I rarely took her as a squadmate on missions. I'd sub Jack or Miranda for her easily. Maybe I need a save where I've saved Kaidan.

Modifié par Mark Mays, 02 mai 2012 - 06:43 .

[MattFini]

Mark Mays wrote...

The "romances" I experienced on my playthroughs weren't all that substantial to begin with. I thought Jack and Miranda's reactions (character flaws, if you will, whatever emotional armor you had to breakthrough) were kind of high school-ish. Their reactions were not what you'd expect from a mission centered executive or a jaded merc. I guess the devs just thought it would be fun for those women to act like petulant brats if they didn't get their way.

Really?  I think they're probably two of the best-written characters in the trilogy.

Jack got a lot of power and built up a ton of rage as a result of her abuse at the Teltin facilty.  When a kid gets any kind of power and lacks the proper guidance they're going to run unchecked.  I'd imagine the more power you have, the worse you'd be with such a nasty background.  It's not surprising that she turned violent.  I guess you could argue that it's a little too easy to break through her armor, but this is a video game, after all.  I personally found her limited role in ME3 to be very gratifying - knowing that I helped her get that way.

I'd say the same for Miranda.  She's a cold and calculating Cerberus operative (one who thinks nothing of executing a traitor in cold blood) but to gradually learn there's more to her is what makes her such a memorable character.  Her icy exterior is harder to crack than Jack's, but I also thought the end of her loyalty mission is very sweet and rewarding becuase of this.  You can almost feel Miranda change a little bit.  I think it literally took me this long in my first playthrough to come around to her, but now she's one of my favorite ME characters.  

Maybe the fight between the women was a poor mechanic in retrospect as if you fail to resolve it in both their favors, one of them does act like a spoiled brat.  I'll give you that.   

That said, if you romanced Jack you got a lot of fan service during the academy mission. After that, well . . . But in terms of the plot, it made sense that you'd be separated from Jack if she was looking after her students and continuing their training. And I suppose from a dev standpoint it made sense because that would be a lot of extra work to bring her and her team onboard the ship.

Well that's definitely why Jack ended up being written this way, I'm sure.  So they could easily keep her off the Normandy.  The problem is that it's a thin excuse, and it's not like Liara or Garrus' presences aboard your ship are that much more convincing.  But they could've just as easily written Jack back into the action had they wanted to.

For Miranda it would make more sense to bring her onboard if you wanted to help her. And it would make more sense for her if she had to run errands hither and yon to help her sister. That whole side mission is begging for a LotSB type DLC.

I, and many others, have already pointed this out, but it bears repeating:  Miranda was SO.  DAMN.  HARD.  TO. KILL. in ME2 that I still cannot believe she wasn't a permanent, full-time squaddie from the get-go.  As much as I love Jack, Miranda is reallly the one who should've been a part of this game from the beginning.  It just seems like such a misstep to leave her out, and keep her actions so vague for most of the game. 

Maybe I need a save where I've saved Kaidan.

Yes you do.  If only so you can shoot him during the Citadel siege.  I already can't wait to start another playthrough so I can do exactly this. 

[MisterJB]

MattFini wrote...
  Maybe the fight between the women was a poor mechanic in retrospect as if you fail to resolve it in both their favors, one of them does act like a spoiled brat.  I'll give you that.   

I will disagree. I feel that both of their reactions was perfectly natural.This wasn't like in ME1 where the prime confrontation between Ashley and Liara amounts to Shepard deciding who he loves most.
Both of these women were attacking much of what defined the other for most of her life. It was hard to get more personal than that and, in such cinrcunstances, viewing Shepard taking sides as a betrayal is natural.
I can't account for Jack but, if Shepard does not pick Miranda, all she does is refuse to speak to him of personal matters anymore. 
On professional situations, before, during and after the missions, the topic is not brought up once. Exactly what I would expect from a mission-focused operative.

[cbutz]

I do agree that since Cerberus was such a large portion of ME 3 , you would think those who were affected most by Cerberus, Miranda and jack, would play a larger role int hat arch. Before the leak it almost felt like they were a given. Having Miranda and jack on Cronus would have been great. I mean I would have liked to see Miranda and jack workign together again, perhaps even work out their differences...maybe .

[MattFini]

MisterJB wrote...

MattFini wrote...
  Maybe the fight between the women was a poor mechanic in retrospect as if you fail to resolve it in both their favors, one of them does act like a spoiled brat.  I'll give you that.   

I will disagree. I feel that both of their reactions was perfectly natural.This wasn't like in ME1 where the prime confrontation between Ashley and Liara amounts to Shepard deciding who he loves most.
Both of these women were attacking much of what defined the other for most of her life. It was hard to get more personal than that and, in such cinrcunstances, viewing Shepard taking sides as a betrayal is natural.
I can't account for Jack but, if Shepard does not pick Miranda, all she does is refuse to speak to him of personal matters anymore. 
On professional situations, before, during and after the missions, the topic is not brought up once. Exactly what I would expect from a mission-focused operative.

You're absolutely right.  I retract my previous statement - I think that fight always annoyed me becuase of how difficult it was to resolve it, until I got the hang of it.

Jack's recation is more volatile, but not really.  

But with respect to their characters, you're right, it does make sense.  Well said.

Modifié par MattFini, 02 mai 2012 - 09:07 .

[Mark Mays]

The Miranda/Jack scrap just isn't realistic. It's a nice game you have to play to figure out if you want either to survive in service of some kind of Tenchi Muyo fantasy, but a catfight, really? The Legion/Tali conflict makes more sense.

And well Miranda's "I find it hard to trust" was about as stock as Jack's trust issues. Jack's issues come from a more reasonable place, still, it was stock for a "rebellious" character. Jack has a much clearer, better explained reason for having trust issues. It would have been more interesting to have gone a different route with her.

Okay for a video game I guess.

If you've established a romance w/ Miranda, she refuses to speak with you on personal matters, if you side with Jack, yes. That isn't realistic, sorry. It's a game mechanic. It isn't natural, especially if you've already established a bond IRL. People are rarely that "either or."

[Seifer006]

MindoirsSoleSurvivor wrote...

When I finished my first canon playthrough and my second canon playthrough of ME3 there was a gaping hole left in me. The fact that Miranda or Jack could not come up to the normandy and be with me one last time before the final mission like liara could in lair of the shadow broker. Everything felt incomplete and my romance arc for both characters felt unresolved. A holo of both of them does not make me feel like I finished the arc.

So Bioware, for the EC if you actually can, and have the funding for it, give the players who romanced Miranda and Jack more "closure", because that is the point of the EC right.

what you need to do for BW to even see this - is send a message to one of the BSN reps. or this thread won't even be seen. I'm in agreement be with you.

I was a big fan of Miranda and Subject Zer0 - and they only made "cameo" apperances in ME3. Like Zaeed, Harbinger, thane etc...

a lot of loss potential if you ask me.

I also would suggest you feel this out also. It's going to be sent to BW. I want them to listen to our constructive reasons of ME3.

[bobhampt]

Wuartz wrote...

Would be nice if Shepard still loved Thane after his death. Instead she just forgets about him.

Agreed, but like in ME2, before the suicide mission, my Shepard looked longingly at a picture of Ashly. Gone but not forgotten.

Modifié par bobhampt, 02 mai 2012 - 10:40 .

[kookie28]

I support this idea, OP.

[omgodzilla]

At the very least, they could fix that damn flashback bug. I'm sick of seeing Liara's face in the end. Also, a slide or two about each ME2 character would be nice if they decide to do a DAO style epilogue in the extended cut.

[D1ck1e]

I thought my playthrough was bugged after the dance scene with Jack, it just faded to black, then seemed to hang there a couple of seconds, then I was like; WTF, that's it?

I had to youtube it to see if It was a bug, that's how bad it was.

[I_Jedi]

Miranda's romance made me feel ripped off.