202 réponses à ce sujet

[shurikenmanta]

Gibb_Shepard wrote...

Lol. the same 3 or 4 people are the "pro-enders". They post so much that it feels like there might be a resistance movement out there. But there's not.

I take it that was directed at me? I actually don't like the ending, but I like the intolerance and melodrama of the hardcore antis even less.

[shurikenmanta]

AlanC9 wrote...

shurikenmanta wrote...
Come on, you guys cry foul when you're not given respect for your views, least you could do is extend the same to those who disagree with you.

Nah -- it's better to have people express this stuff rather than pretend to respect each other.

Fair enough, but - and I mean 'you' in the ambiguous sense, not the personal - good luck getting them to see the light if they think you're an arrogant douche.

[AlanC9]

If I had known in advance that the DR was perfectly safe and harmless, I would have objected to DA:O's ending too.

[AlanC9]

shurikenmanta wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

shurikenmanta wrote...
Come on, you guys cry foul when you're not given respect for your views, least you could do is extend the same to those who disagree with you.

Nah -- it's better to have people express this stuff rather than pretend to respect each other.

Fair enough, but - and I mean 'you' in the ambiguous sense, not the personal - good luck getting them to see the light if they think you're an arrogant douche.

Good point. But it's not like CARL_DF90 and I are actually ever going to convince each other of anything. Terror_K, now, has been able to sell me on a few ideas even though I don't agree with him about a lot of things.

[Amioran]

I would like Trigon, Slyguy and others that were in my thread now admit that they were wrong.

Since this is exactly what I said it would happen (as it is evidenced in this thread) and you said: "no, it's not possible, you make no senseee....."

Will they ever do it?

Let's see.

[shurikenmanta]

Amioran wrote...

I would like Trigon, Slyguy and others that were in my thread now admit that they were wrong.

Since this is exactly what I said it would happen (as it is evidenced in this thread) and you said: "no, it's not possible, you make no senseee....."

Will they ever do it?

Let's see.

Not if you phrase it like that, dude. ..

[Amioran]

shurikenmanta wrote...

Amioran wrote...

I would like Trigon, Slyguy and others that were in my thread now admit that they were wrong.

Since this is exactly what I said it would happen (as it is evidenced in this thread) and you said: "no, it's not possible, you make no senseee....."

Will they ever do it?

Let's see.

Not if you phrase it like that, dude. ..

I was in an hurry, but they know perfectly of what I speak about, don't worry.

[Vormaerin]

Bfler wrote...

There is an end in DA:O where the Archdemon is defeated, the hero and all of the party members, also the LI, are alive, one of the party members becomes king and the PC is considered as a real hero -> this is a perfect happy ending, but I have never read negative posts in the DA forum about it and people also choose the other variants f.e. sacrifice of the Warden.

Well, see, the Dark Ritual actually sounds like a bad idea.    And your "perfect happy ending" sounds more like selling out the future for a happy present.   Seriously, giving murderous witches control of the power of a demonic god just doesn't sound like a "win" outcome.   Sure, the demon child won't wreak havoc until after the Warden is likely to get the Calling, but its still an icky choice.

IMHO, the "Best" ending is letting Loghain join the Wardens and then have *him* sacrifice himself to kill the dragon.  That's the win-win.   You live, Loghain's allies aren't alienated by you whacking his head off, and there's no god child darkening the future.   And, as a bonus, that weak willed whiny bastard never gets anywhere near the kingship.


If they add an ending where Shepard betrays the future for his own happiness, then that would be equivalent to the 'take morrigan's offer' ending.'    

Modifié par Vormaerin, 03 mai 2012 - 10:00 .

[shurikenmanta]

Yeah, somehow I don't think Morrigan set out to conceive Andraste 2.0

[Bfler]

Vormaerin wrote...

Bfler wrote...

There is an end in DA:O where the Archdemon is defeated, the hero and all of the party members, also the LI, are alive, one of the party members becomes king and the PC is considered as a real hero -> this is a perfect happy ending, but I have never read negative posts in the DA forum about it and people also choose the other variants f.e. sacrifice of the Warden.

Well, see, the Dark Ritual actually sounds like a bad idea.    And your "perfect happy ending" sounds more like selling out the future for a happy present.   Seriously, giving murderous witches control of the power of a demonic god just doesn't sound like a "win" outcome.   Sure, the demon child won't wreak havoc until after the Warden is likely to get the Calling, but its still an icky choice.

IMHO, the "Best" ending is letting Loghain join the Wardens and then have *him* sacrifice himself to kill the dragon.  That's the win-win.   You live, Loghain's allies aren't alienated by you whacking his head off, and there's no god child darkening the future.   And, as a bonus, that weak willed whiny bastard never gets anywhere near the kingship.


If they add an ending where Shepard betrays the future for his own happiness, then that would be equivalent to the 'take morrigan's offer' ending.'    

You know that you can refuse the ritual? And you also assume that it could be a bad idea, you don't know what will happen in future. My scenario is the happy ending for the here and now. 

[Simocrates]

I didn't mind the ending, I think the way it was delivered was poor but that isn't the issue. I am against new endings because BioWare is now making an extended cinematic priority instead of giving us real content to add to re-playability. I would much prefer more missions and companions to be added than a few extra seconds of footage that we all know people are going to complain about anyway because they believe they should be able to write their own scripts for someone else's intellectual property.

[Jeric]

AlanC9 wrote...

Artemis_Entrari wrote...

Jeric wrote...
So my questions is, why are those that like the ending SO opposed to Bioware adding/creating NEW endings that reflect how people played the game? I think most people don’t want complete changes, I think most people what more options. Options that validate their choices!

I totally agree that there are lots of people out there that are completely happy with what they got, but would it really be so bad to include those that aren’t by adding a few endings. After all, isn’t the whole feel of the game about choices affecting the outcome?

I see him mention "choices affecting the outcome" and "Options that validate their choices", but I don't see "Happy endings with rainbows and unicorns" in there.

So I'm a bit curious, why do you seem to always suggest that those who want new endings or better endings are only after happy endings?

Because most of them are. I got the impression that the OP himself is from a later post. Hell, look at the way the thread's going.

And "choices affecting the outcome" are already in there, unless he was talking about lots of cutscenes showing the effect of choices (Vormaerin beat me to this). As for "options that validate their choices"... well, I had no clue what the OP meant by "validate" there. Still don't.

Look up the word "validate" and that might help.  But since it doesn't appear you have the time I'll explain a little better.

Validate- it's a verb based off an adjective called valid.  Here are 4 basic definitions.
1- Sound; just; well-founded (the end does not justify the options I choose through-out the game)
2- Producing the desired result (again, the ending has nothing to do with the choices I made through-out the game)
3. Having force, weight, or cogency (there is no weight or substance in the end that supports the choices I made)
4. Legally sound, effective, or binding (again, the choices I made have no effect on the outcome).

The ending is not effected in anyway by the choices I made throughout all 3 games.  Sure, there are some differences in-game, but in the end, it doesn't matter what you do. 

[Atakuma]

Jeric wrote...
The ending is not effected in anyway by the choices I made throughout all 3 games.  Sure, there are some differences in-game, but in the end, it doesn't matter what you do. 

I'd be interested in hearing an example of how you think your choices throughout the series should affect the ending, because I personally can't see how any of the choices you make would even be relevant to that situation.

[pprrff]

Here is why I don't actually want a new ending that is radically different:

1) The main reason is that I have already seen the ending, I can't just pretend that it didn't happen no matter how bad it is. Even if they come up with the best ending ever written in human history, it will not change my memory. I would be more bothered by the fact that writer rewrite canon than a bad canon.

2) I actually don't like the way the new ending are proposed. Whatever their merits are, I feel that people are forcing Bioware to write stories, which I am opposed. I don't want to defend them, I just don't fee right demanding authors to changes things the way people are doing it.

This is my opinion, I am not exactly Pro the current ending, but I am oppose to new ones.

[Tirigon]

Bfler wrote...

There is an end in DA:O where the Archdemon is defeated, the hero and all of the party members, also the LI, are alive, one of the party members becomes king and the PC is considered as a real hero -> this is a perfect happy ending, but I have never read negative posts in the DA forum about it and people also choose the other variants f.e. sacrifice of the Warden.

That is because in the DAO forums there used to be not nearly as many halfwits as in the ME forums.

I guess it is because DAO was not advertised as a half-shooter.

[Tirigon]

Amioran wrote...

I would like Trigon, Slyguy and others that were in my thread now admit that they were wrong.

Since this is exactly what I said it would happen (as it is evidenced in this thread) and you said: "no, it's not possible, you make no senseee....."

Will they ever do it?

Let's see.

You said, a majority would oppose new endings.

I see the OP, and 3 or 4 guys who do amongst 100s who dont.


Where have I been wrong?

[Jeric]

Atakuma wrote...

Jeric wrote...
The ending is not effected in anyway by the choices I made throughout all 3 games.  Sure, there are some differences in-game, but in the end, it doesn't matter what you do. 

I'd be interested in hearing an example of how you think your choices throughout the series should affect the ending, because I personally can't see how any of the choices you make would even be relevant to that situation.

That's my point, the choices I made aren't relevant to any of the outcomes.  EVERY decision you make comes down to a small number that determines whether or not you get to see a 30 sec clip at the end.

And maybe I'm wrong, but I was under the impression that the things I do would affect the ending.

[AkiKishi]

Vormaerin wrote...

Bfler wrote...

There is an end in DA:O where the Archdemon is defeated, the hero and all of the party members, also the LI, are alive, one of the party members becomes king and the PC is considered as a real hero -> this is a perfect happy ending, but I have never read negative posts in the DA forum about it and people also choose the other variants f.e. sacrifice of the Warden.

Well, see, the Dark Ritual actually sounds like a bad idea.    And your "perfect happy ending" sounds more like selling out the future for a happy present.   Seriously, giving murderous witches control of the power of a demonic god just doesn't sound like a "win" outcome.   Sure, the demon child won't wreak havoc until after the Warden is likely to get the Calling, but its still an icky choice.

IMHO, the "Best" ending is letting Loghain join the Wardens and then have *him* sacrifice himself to kill the dragon.  That's the win-win.   You live, Loghain's allies aren't alienated by you whacking his head off, and there's no god child darkening the future.   And, as a bonus, that weak willed whiny bastard never gets anywhere near the kingship.


If they add an ending where Shepard betrays the future for his own happiness, then that would be equivalent to the 'take morrigan's offer' ending.'    

Thing with DA was you had options. Different people have different ideas of the perfect ending and the game will allow for those things.

While Shepards sacrificec was a meh sort of moment after which the same scene with a different colour overlay plays.. The Wardens is something of an epic. Faced with a choice between that and the eventual onset of the taint. It seemed like the best way to go.
Don't like the idea, you can bang Morrigan, that's hardly a punishment. Or just get someone else to take the fall FO3 style.

Compared to that ME3 was phoned in.

Modifié par BobSmith101, 03 mai 2012 - 04:00 .

[cyrslash1974]

pprrff wrote...

Here is why I don't actually want a new ending that is radically different:

1) The main reason is that I have already seen the ending, I can't just pretend that it didn't happen no matter how bad it is. Even if they come up with the best ending ever written in human history, it will not change my memory. I would be more bothered by the fact that writer rewrite canon than a bad canon.

2) I actually don't like the way the new ending are proposed. Whatever their merits are, I feel that people are forcing Bioware to write stories, which I am opposed. I don't want to defend them, I just don't fee right demanding authors to changes things the way people are doing it.

This is my opinion, I am not exactly Pro the current ending, but I am oppose to new ones.

I respect your opinion, however something is missing in the current end.

SPOILER


Obviously when I play ME games, I play my own story. I am Shepard. But in my story, I 've proved that Gueth (synthtetics) and Quarians (Organics) can be in peace.

 But StarChild said to me that peace between O and S is impossible ! In my own story, I would do all by best to convince him that this peace is possible, without changing their respective DNA and without my own sacrifice (I have already convinced thousand of synthetics, in ME2, when I ve managed the conflict between Tali and Legion).
 
In my own story, thanks to this evidence, I would show to StarChild that his solutions are now" stone age" solutions. I would ask StarChild to destroy only the reapers, without killing the synthetics and myself (yellow solution, new color) .

In this example, the artistic vision from Bioware is respected, as well as the scenaristic vision.


Sorry for my poor english...

[TheRealJayDee]

Vormaerin wrote...

Bfler wrote...

There is an end in DA:O where the Archdemon is defeated, the hero and all of the party members, also the LI, are alive, one of the party members becomes king and the PC is considered as a real hero -> this is a perfect happy ending, but I have never read negative posts in the DA forum about it and people also choose the other variants f.e. sacrifice of the Warden.

Well, see, the Dark Ritual actually sounds like a bad idea.    And your "perfect happy ending" sounds more like selling out the future for a happy present.   Seriously, giving murderous witches control of the power of a demonic god just doesn't sound like a "win" outcome.   Sure, the demon child won't wreak havoc until after the Warden is likely to get the Calling, but its still an icky choice.

IMHO, the "Best" ending is letting Loghain join the Wardens and then have *him* sacrifice himself to kill the dragon.  That's the win-win.   You live, Loghain's allies aren't alienated by you whacking his head off, and there's no god child darkening the future.   And, as a bonus, that weak willed whiny bastard never gets anywhere near the kingship.


If they add an ending where Shepard betrays the future for his own happiness, then that would be equivalent to the 'take morrigan's offer' ending.'    

I've had lots of discussions with my friends about the different DA:O endings we got, and we have never reached any kind of consensus, yet everyone was extremely satisfied with their individual endings.

I can understand though why people would be unhappy about the DR being the "perfect" ending. By now I can't really disagree anymore, because I have lost any hope in Bioware to even try to make the choice have any meaning in future games.

Still, the fault lies not with the ending variations themselves, which I to this day consider great, but with the developer lacking the will and/or ability to build up on them. Which is shame, and in case of Mass Effect directly contradicts the very point of the trilogy.

[shurikenmanta]

Zanza86 wrote...

I didn't mind the ending, I think the way it was delivered was poor but that isn't the issue. I am against new endings because BioWare is now making an extended cinematic priority instead of giving us real content to add to re-playability. I would much prefer more missions and companions to be added than a few extra seconds of footage that we all know people are going to complain about anyway because they believe they should be able to write their own scripts for someone else's intellectual property.

Y'know, on that last point, there could be a strong case made for Bioware releasing some kind of modders' resource kit. I know it probably wouldn't happen, but with the amount of passion all the people who didn't like the ending have, surely people would flock to it to get their own ending going.

Heck, might even make some more cash from the deal when people switch to PC so they can mod the crap out of it (like I did to Fallout 3, lol).

[stonbw1]

I suppose I'd fall into the label of a 'pro ender'. But that's because I got the ending I was rather hoping for: my Shepard was able to say goodbye to squadmates and characters that he/she had become emotionally attached and devoted to, while making the ultimate sacrifice theoretically to benefit them. I loved LOST b/c of the relationships, not the answers; similarly, the odd (or nonexistent) answers at the end of ME3 didn't bother me much, since I felt resolved as to relationships. From my perspective, leave well enough alone.

[Artemis_Entrari]

Atakuma wrote...
I'd be interested in hearing an example of how you think your choices throughout the series should affect the ending, because I personally can't see how any of the choices you make would even be relevant to that situation.

One example I thought of immediately after reading your post.

Save the Destiny Ascension/let the Destiny Ascension get destroyed in ME1.

The result of that action in ME3 to show that choice "mattered":

If you did NOT save it -- At one point in that massive space battle, right as Shepard's trying to reach for the control panel to operate the Crucible, he hears over the comm chatter a distress call from the flagship with Admiral Hackett saying they're taking heavy fire.  The ships around it are trying to destroy the Reaper firing on Hackett's ship, but just don't have quite enough combined fire power to destroy it before it destroys Hackett's ship.  So Shepard hears frantic calls of "Admiral Hackett's flagship is gone!" as he reaches for the control panel.

If you DID save it -- Same situation, but just as Hackett's ship is frantically saying "we can't take much more of this", someone else screams "It's the Destiny Ascension!" and you see a cutscene of the Destiny Ascension providing that extra boost of fire power (most powerful ship in the fleet after all) needed to destroy the Reaper and save Hackett's ship, and Shepard hears a big roar of celebration from the comm chatter as an Asari voice cuts through the chatter and says, "We owed you that one, Alliance" in reference to the Normandy choosing to save them in ME1.

See?  Choice from the first game that directly affects an outcome we see during the final battle.  If that scenario played out, it would actually feel like an important choice we made in ME1 made a major impact on what happens during the final battle in ME3.  Hackett's flagship either lives or dies based on an important choice we made, and we actually see the consequences of it.

[FenrirENJIAN]

i just don't want the geth to die after all that "work" in me2 to get all peace points i'd rather not have them die or the quarians and so in the end my hand was forced for synthesis but then i read up on indoctrination theory and it makes sense. Also, since they said they are not adding more endings i hope they add on to the existing endings (if indoctrination theory is correct) then:

1. Destroy- continue from gasp scene
2. Control- it shows a reaper controlled shepard or some thing of the sort
3. Synthesis- all evolution would take time normally so then a species doesn't suffer as much as it would from sudden evolution as in what happens in these scenes. The differance between normal evolution and sudden evolution is that NE has several sacrifices over decades to centuries while in SE many, hundreds of thousands well in this case it would be cross species and that means millions of people would die if their bodies reject the new evolution. Or shepard becomes like saren or something to that extent. LOLZ

well anyways the truth is; all i want as a borderline anti-ender is clarification about what happens to shepard, at the end what happens to everyone else. what happens to to all the reapers and all the other races, and since i redid my ending are edi and the geth okay? 

P.S. SPACE MAGIC  isn't fun...actually at the end of control i was kinda queasy watching my fem shep dissolve  but then again that is "Dark" SPACE MAGIC 

Modifié par FenrirENJIAN, 03 mai 2012 - 07:04 .