533 réponses à ce sujet

[Cantina]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

Cantina wrote...

I only draw the line when the Anders/Karl relationship is hidden from the female Hawke. Its not about Anders sexuality, its about revealing information into his past. If you reveal such information to a male Hawke and not to a female Hawke, it creates confusion. So, if your male, it happened, but if your female it did not happen. Which is it?!

It happened regardless, he just didn't want to tell Femhawke.

This is part of his character.  The question is why would he tell Manhawke but not Femhawke?  It's not about confusion but characterization.

Cantina wrote...

Information about a companion's past should be revealed to whatever sex you choose to play. It should be up to the player female or male to decide if hearing that information bothers them and to tell the companion that. 

But Anders made that decision.  

That's his character.  Why do you think that is?   

To me it seems more like its outside of his character then in his character.

Its OK to tell a female Hawke that he shares a different level of intimacy with a male spirit, but its not OK, to be up front about his previous relationship with Karl?!

IF Karl was not in the game, OK, I can handle him not telling a female Hawke, but he was in the game. Understanding why Anders went to such lengths to help his friend escape the Circle and his reaction after brings a sense of being closer to Anders.

[upsettingshorts]

Cantina wrote...

To me it seems more like its outside of his character then in his character.

Its OK to tell a female Hawke that he shares a different level of intimacy with a male spirit, but its not OK, to be up front about his previous relationship with Karl?!

A woman just met a guy.  He tells her about his ex-boyfriend.  Are they more or less likely to consider him a possible romantic interest?  Do you feel as though most women would respond in this way? 

There were people on the Mass Effect boards who were uncomfortable with bisexual Kaidan even without an explicit former ex-boyfriend.  People have weird hangups, and Anders really really isn't good with rejection.

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 02 mai 2012 - 09:12 .

[ReallyRue]

To answer the OP,
-I'd like companions to have more comments about your chosen LI in banters. That was always funny in DAO. I was disappointed that Bethany/Carver in particular didn't have much to say (in Legacy and MotA). I'd have thought siblings would give Hawke the hardest time about it, hah.

-LIs should be able to leave if you do something that contradicts completely with their morals. That happened with Anders (I think), and Leliana would turn on you if you defiled the Ashes, even while in a romance with her.

-I quite like the odd bits of dialogue that reflect that Hawke's in a relationship with them, like Anders/Merrill being relieved at Hawke's safety after meeting with the Arishok with Aveline. More tidbits like that is good.

- In regard to the current discussion, I'd like the romanceable characters to continue to be main-character-sexual/all-bi, whatever you want to call it. I don't see a good reason for them not to be. And if it was to be restricted, then it should be to straight/bi/gay, not just straight/bi or straight/gay. After all, realism and replayability are the main complaints about all-bi LIs, right? So while they're at it, the LI choice should be further restricted by your characters' personality/morals. Anders/Merrill shouldn't want Hawke if s/he hates mages and Fenris/Sebastian shouldn't want Hawke if s/he's a blood mage.

[Maria Caliban]

Cantina wrote...

I only draw the line when the Anders/Karl relationship is hidden from the female Hawke. Its not about Anders sexuality, its about revealing information into his past. If you reveal such information to a male Hawke and not to a female Hawke, it creates confusion. So, if your male, it happened, but if your female it did not happen. Which is it?!

According to Zevran, having sex with another man is sometimes looked down on. There are bisexual guys who are hesitant to tell their female partners that they're attracted to men.

[TEWR]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

Cantina wrote...

To me it seems more like its outside of his character then in his character.

Its OK to tell a female Hawke that he shares a different level of intimacy with a male spirit, but its not OK, to be up front about his previous relationship with Karl?!

A woman just met a guy.  He tells her about his ex-boyfriend.  Are they more or less likely to consider him a possible romantic interest?  Do you feel as though most women would respond in this way? 

There were people on the Mass Effect boards who were uncomfortable with bisexual Kaidan even without an explicit former ex-boyfriend.  People have weird hangups, and Anders really really isn't good with rejection.

You could probably say something similar about Anders telling a Male Hawke about Karl.

Guy meets other guy. Second guy tells first guy about relationship with other guy, without even knowing the sexual preference of first guy or how he feels about same-sex pairings.

Of course, there's also the argument that maybe Hawke will understand and that's why Anders told him.

This is part of why I think it should be left to the player to find out this type of information, or at least have Anders get to know Hawke well enough before he talks about it on his own.

As it stands, while the revelation does establish that Anders is bisexual based on his past, the way it's presented seems like it's done to say "He's bisexual" rather then "This is a part of his past".

The presentation of it, based on the relationship they had at that point, undermines slightly the information itself. That's not to say the information shouldn't be there. As I said, either at the player's discretion should it be told or have Anders at least create a better relationship between himself and Hawke before disclosing it, since at that point they've purely been business acquaintances.

The information is vital to Anders' character, but so is how it's presented.

Modifié par The Ethereal Writer Redux, 02 mai 2012 - 09:24 .

[Sutekh]

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

While I'm not against Anders revealing that information, I have to wonder why he revealed it to someone he didn't know very well. It seemed.... odd.

It seemed clear to me that he was testing the waters.

[Maria Caliban]

Sutekh wrote...

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

While I'm not against Anders revealing that information, I have to wonder why he revealed it to someone he didn't know very well. It seemed.... odd.

It seemed clear to me that he was testing the waters.

Leliana: I like your hair.
Anders: I like sex with men.

Stereotypical but kinda true.

[Cantina]

Maria Caliban wrote...

Sutekh wrote...

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

While I'm not against Anders revealing that information, I have to wonder why he revealed it to someone he didn't know very well. It seemed.... odd.

It seemed clear to me that he was testing the waters.

Leliana: I like your hair.
Anders: I like sex with men.

Stereotypical but kinda true.

I could make a dirty joke in regard to Leliana's comment, but ...I'll be quiet.



What about a marriage option for a romanced companion?

For?

Against?

[meanieweenie]

Cantina wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

Sutekh wrote...

The Ethereal Writer Redux wrote...

While I'm not against Anders revealing that information, I have to wonder why he revealed it to someone he didn't know very well. It seemed.... odd.

It seemed clear to me that he was testing the waters.

Leliana: I like your hair.
Anders: I like sex with men.

Stereotypical but kinda true.

I could make a dirty joke in regard to Leliana's comment, but ...I'll be quiet.



What about a marriage option for a romanced companion?

For?

Against?

I'm not against it if it comes at the end of things. It would seem anti-climactic otherwise, IMO. I like the chase.

[Curlain]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

Cantina wrote...

To me it seems more like its outside of his character then in his character.

Its OK to tell a female Hawke that he shares a different level of intimacy with a male spirit, but its not OK, to be up front about his previous relationship with Karl?!

A woman just met a guy.  He tells her about his ex-boyfriend.  Are they more or less likely to consider him a possible romantic interest?  Do you feel as though most women would respond in this way? 

There were people on the Mass Effect boards who were uncomfortable with bisexual Kaidan even without an explicit former ex-boyfriend.  People have weird hangups, and Anders really really isn't good with rejection.

This would be an example of where I wouldn't mind BioWare fully outlining what are the social norms and such opperating in various lands in Thedas.  As would this be a possibly likely hang-up (enough of Anders to worry about) in Thedas societies?  I would definitely like more development and clarity on the general social norms that says Fereldens subsribes to (even if individuals don't).  Is it like post-modern Western values, sterotypical 'medieval' values, a combination?  And if so, how does this break down?

[Lamepro]

I remember Anders in Dragon Age:Awakening wasn't hiting on men in the game.

[hoorayforicecream]

Lamepro wrote...

I remember Anders in Dragon Age:Awakening wasn't hiting on men in the game.

Perhaps because he hadn't found someone he was interested in.

[mousestalker]

Cantina wrote...
What about a marriage option for a romanced companion?

For?

Against?

Very much for. It would pretty neat if it weren't all the way at the end, so that you could adventure with your spouse. And of course, a wedding ceremony would be great fun!

[mesmerizedish]

Lamepro wrote...

I remember Anders in Dragon Age:Awakening wasn't hiting on men in the game.

Not men, just Nathaniel.

[TEWR]

Lamepro wrote...

I remember Anders in Dragon Age:Awakening wasn't hiting on men in the game.

Some people saw his banter with Nathaniel as flirting, prior to DAII's release where he was a bisexual LI.

Cantina wrote...

What about a marriage option for a romanced companion?

For?

Against?

For, but it depends on when it happens in a game. For DAII, such a thing would've been great near the end of Act III where tensions are high or in the expansion, had it been finished being developed and released.

Modifié par The Ethereal Writer Redux, 02 mai 2012 - 10:47 .

[Wulfram]

Cantina wrote...

What about a marriage option for a romanced companion?

For?

Against?

Depends on the character.  I can't say most of the LIs in previous Dragon Age games have particularly seemed like people who'd put a high priority on marriage.

And the writers should probably be aware that it seems like a lot of players would run a mile at the first mention, going by some other discussions.  Though maybe that's just Mass Effect fans.

And doing it satisfactorily seems like it would take a bunch of resources.  I mean you'd want such a scene to be special, you can't do it in a half-assed way.  Maybe stick to proposals.

But I'm not against in principle.

Modifié par Wulfram, 02 mai 2012 - 10:44 .

[Dakota Strider]

Cantina wrote...

What about a marriage option for a romanced companion?

For?

Against?

I believe my Warden and Morrigan need to get married.  We would not want our Ancient God Child to be considered an illegitimate bastar*, 

[Dhiro]

I'm ok with marriage - they did that in The Old Republic, though personally I think that will bring them more trouble than it's worth, since it's a MMORPG.

I draw my line at children, though. No babies for me (unless they're ass-babies, I suppose).

[Scalett Dragonavicious]

I don't have a problem with marriage as long as everyone has an option. I would probably get married depending on my character but I know some people don't want it. It'd be really interesting to have some romances not want marriage at all, some need high influence to change their minds, and some break up with you if you refuse to marry them.... but again I can always pretend my characters get married if I must.

I did like the relationships they had available for Mass Effect 3 (aside from only one male option for straight FemShep). They had straight, bi, and gay, men and women. Personally I loved the scene where male shep got turned down by Traynor because she was gay. It was so awkward. Little things like that would be really awesome in the game.

Or another thing would be for Bioware to include a button during character creation that lets you choose your sexual orientation. Heterosexual, Homosexual, Bisexual, or Not Interested. That way those that don't want the romances at all could just take them out completely.

[ReallyRue]

Cantina wrote...
What about a marriage option for a romanced companion?

Well, they had that option for Alistair and a human noble, and I imagine it worked there. And it was stated with Sebastian too. I'd be fine with it personally, so long as it worked with the character. From Origins, for instance, Alistair and Leliana would make sense, but Zevran and Morrigan really wouldn't.

[Dakota Strider]

@ReallyRue. Regarding Morrigan, I think it would make sense for her, once she admits that she has fallen in love with the Warden (and after he rejoins her at the end of Witchhunt). She has always made it clear, that she did not want the Warden messing around with anyone else, whether it be Isabella at the brothel, or Leliana. As long as she and the Warden were together, she wanted a monogamous relationship.

I agree with your assessment of Alistair and Zevron. Leliana is another tricky one. She seems like the kind that would welcome marriage...but then again, she also seems to be the type of personality to live for the moment, and not want to be tied down. However, I get the impression she was the youngest of the LI's in DAO, and with a little maturity, she may very well be ready for marriage.

[ReallyRue]

Dakota Strider wrote...

@ReallyRue. Regarding Morrigan, I think it would make sense for her, once she admits that she has fallen in love with the Warden (and after he rejoins her at the end of Witchhunt). She has always made it clear, that she did not want the Warden messing around with anyone else, whether it be Isabella at the brothel, or Leliana. As long as she and the Warden were together, she wanted a monogamous relationship.

I agree with your assessment of Alistair and Zevron. Leliana is another tricky one. She seems like the kind that would welcome marriage...but then again, she also seems to be the type of personality to live for the moment, and not want to be tied down. However, I get the impression she was the youngest of the LI's in DAO, and with a little maturity, she may very well be ready for marriage.

Heh, well, I can't really argue one way or the other there, seeing as I only played through Morrigan and Leliana's romances once each. I don't think it was enough to get a good feel of their romantic attitudes, so I'm going on what I know of their characters in general.

[Pasquale1234]

Dakota Strider wrote...

I agree with your assessment of Alistair and Zevron. Leliana is another tricky one. She seems like the kind that would welcome marriage...but then again, she also seems to be the type of personality to live for the moment, and not want to be tied down. However, I get the impression she was the youngest of the LI's in DAO, and with a little maturity, she may very well be ready for marriage.

I disagree about Leliana, especially after what we learn of her in DA2.  She seems to have had other plans all along, and not the type that are very compatible with marriage.

She has quite a past - the whole history with Marjolaine, then becoming involved with the Chantry.  I think she may be quite a bit older than you might think, especially given this conversation:

Wynne: It is sometimes so hard to believe that you have been through so much, at such a young age.
Leliana: I think I look younger than I am.