Uhm... no idea.
Though here's something else, if the Reaper General (StarKid) is in the Citadel already, why do they bother with sending ANY reapers there in the first place?!
StarKid: *Yawn* Oh look, time to start wiping the slate clean..... and.... the relays are down, the Citadel is closed, Keepers are now gathering the organics onboard and downloading data from all computers onboard. Hey! Harbinger. This data here says theres a tastey morsel over there, be a dear and reap them eh?
Does anyone have an answer to the Citadel plot hole.
Débuté par
Prosarian
, mai 03 2012 06:14
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#27
Posté 03 mai 2012 - 07:15
Zandercode
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Some good points have been brought up but as for why they didn't take the Citadel right away and never used it to shut down the relay network, it's the same reason Sovereign had to plan all that time and gather up allies like Saren and the geth. The Protheans "reprogrammed" the keepers to ignore the Reapers' orders. The Reapers needed a new Saren to get on board and keep the arms open and transfer control and all that. That's basically what the Illusive Man and Cerberus became: Saren and his geth, only difference is that Saren and the geth were doing it willingly while Cerb/TIM were kind of tricked into it, thinking they were going to be able to use the Citadel + Crucible to control the Reapers. So basically, what the Reapers were waiting for was for Cerb/TIM to get their act together, especially after the failed coup.
#28
Posté 03 mai 2012 - 07:17
Zandercode
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As for why the Star Child couldn't just do it himself, good point, though he does say "The Crucible changed me" so I assume that also means it gave him some sort of direct influence he didn't have before. Not the best explanation but the Star Child never was the best idea...
#29
Posté 03 mai 2012 - 07:18
Prosarian
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Zandercode, are you the same guy who posted all the Mass Effect missing tracks on Youtube?
#30
Posté 03 mai 2012 - 07:18
Samtheman63
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ThisKotorEffect3 wrote...
They didn't need the citadel right away, in previous cycles it was their backdoor to the galaxy.
And it couldn't be more obvious
#31
Posté 03 mai 2012 - 07:19
grey_wind
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This is a ton of fan-******, and I hate that the Reapers never seized the Citadel, but I'll play devil's advocate.
1) Between Hackett, the STG and Liara (as the new SB), it's more than likely that the Reaper IFF which Shepard obtained was distributed (most likely secretly) amongst most of the major militaries in the galaxy, or would have been once the invasion started. As a result, the Reapers may simply have not bothered seizing the Citadel because they knew that cutting off galactic travel was not going to stop the galaxy from uniting for long (this is of course presuming that the IFF allows you to bypass the relay lockdown).
2) Unlike the Protheans who used the Citadel as their empire's centre, the only people of any importance on the Citadel are diplomats in this cycle. Seizing the citadel would hurt the galaxy, but not in any major way cripple the galactic governments that made taking the Citadel a priority.
3) The Reapers likely didn't need the Citadel's extensive information network because Harbinger likely already collected enough info form the Collectors in regards to who are high priority targets (like the Turians) and the locations of most important worlds for their harvesting.
1) Between Hackett, the STG and Liara (as the new SB), it's more than likely that the Reaper IFF which Shepard obtained was distributed (most likely secretly) amongst most of the major militaries in the galaxy, or would have been once the invasion started. As a result, the Reapers may simply have not bothered seizing the Citadel because they knew that cutting off galactic travel was not going to stop the galaxy from uniting for long (this is of course presuming that the IFF allows you to bypass the relay lockdown).
2) Unlike the Protheans who used the Citadel as their empire's centre, the only people of any importance on the Citadel are diplomats in this cycle. Seizing the citadel would hurt the galaxy, but not in any major way cripple the galactic governments that made taking the Citadel a priority.
3) The Reapers likely didn't need the Citadel's extensive information network because Harbinger likely already collected enough info form the Collectors in regards to who are high priority targets (like the Turians) and the locations of most important worlds for their harvesting.
#32
Posté 03 mai 2012 - 07:19
The Angry One
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Samtheman63 wrote...
ThisKotorEffect3 wrote...
They didn't need the citadel right away, in previous cycles it was their backdoor to the galaxy.
And it couldn't be more obvious
To trolls, and please don't pretend you aren't, your posts are quite infamous here.
To everyone else, the holes in this are immediately apparent.
Modifié par The Angry One, 03 mai 2012 - 07:20 .
#33
Posté 03 mai 2012 - 07:20
Prosarian
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Zandercode wrote...
Some good points have been brought up but as for why they didn't take the Citadel right away and never used it to shut down the relay network, it's the same reason Sovereign had to plan all that time and gather up allies like Saren and the geth. The Protheans "reprogrammed" the keepers to ignore the Reapers' orders. The Reapers needed a new Saren to get on board and keep the arms open and transfer control and all that. That's basically what the Illusive Man and Cerberus became: Saren and his geth, only difference is that Saren and the geth were doing it willingly while Cerb/TIM were kind of tricked into it, thinking they were going to be able to use the Citadel + Crucible to control the Reapers. So basically, what the Reapers were waiting for was for Cerb/TIM to get their act together, especially after the failed coup.
They just needed someone to press a few buttons while some Reaper latched onto it and did their thing. Your average Marauder (under DIRECT CONTROL) could have done it.
The Reapers probably have other indoctrinated servants as well.
#34
Posté 03 mai 2012 - 07:20
Samtheman63
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TrollThe Angry One wrote...
Samtheman63 wrote...
ThisKotorEffect3 wrote...
They didn't need the citadel right away, in previous cycles it was their backdoor to the galaxy.
And it couldn't be more obvious
To trolls.
To everyone else, the holes in this are immediately apparent.
#35
Posté 03 mai 2012 - 07:20
Ticonderoga117
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Zandercode wrote...
As for why the Star Child couldn't just do it himself, good point, though he does say "The Crucible changed me" so I assume that also means it gave him some sort of direct influence he didn't have before. Not the best explanation but the Star Child never was the best idea...
Well yeah, but the only way it changed him was by hooking up this huge honking Eezo Reactor/battery thing onto the Citadel. That's it. It didn't magically make him aware or more able to do things, just add a big power source to him. And the StarKid is the WORSE IDEA I have ever seen in a video game. Especially since they add in the fact that he controls the Reapers.
#36
Posté 03 mai 2012 - 07:24
KotorEffect3
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The Angry One wrote...
Samtheman63 wrote...
ThisKotorEffect3 wrote...
They didn't need the citadel right away, in previous cycles it was their backdoor to the galaxy.
And it couldn't be more obvious
To trolls, and please don't pretend you aren't, your posts are quite infamous here.
To everyone else, the holes in this are immediately apparent.
Apparently anyone that disagrees with the angsty one is a troll now.
#37
Posté 03 mai 2012 - 07:24
JPN17
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I thought it would have been great if the reapers took the Citadel and shut down the relay network, but the relay network isn't actually shut down, it's just the relays now only respond to reaper IFF's which would allow the Normandy to continue to move system to system and from there they could have used to conduit on Ilos to infiltrate the Citadel and re-open the relay network. Or something to that effect. Sounds good to me anyway.
Instead yeah there's no explanation for why the reapers took pretty much everything but the citadel and also why they never did shut down the relay network. It's implied that the reason the reapers were so successful was that they isolated every system so no one had a huge force to counter the reapers with and they just went world by world. They didn't do that this time though because...yeah.
Instead yeah there's no explanation for why the reapers took pretty much everything but the citadel and also why they never did shut down the relay network. It's implied that the reason the reapers were so successful was that they isolated every system so no one had a huge force to counter the reapers with and they just went world by world. They didn't do that this time though because...yeah.
#38
Posté 03 mai 2012 - 07:26
The Angry One
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KotorEffect3 wrote...
Apparently anyone that disagrees with the angsty one is a troll now.
No, people who spew insults and spam are trolls. You the former, he the latter.
#40
Posté 03 mai 2012 - 07:27
Clayless
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The Angry One wrote...
Okay, yeah. That works. Except for when they took it easily!
"Hey we took the Citadel easily, except they closed the indestructable arms, so we can't turn off the relays".
"So what was the point in doing that if it gives us no tactical advantage and instead caused us to delay our harvesting?"
"I dunno lol".
#41
Posté 03 mai 2012 - 07:28
Prosarian
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grey_wind wrote...
This is a ton of fan-******, and I hate that the Reapers never seized the Citadel, but I'll play devil's advocate.
1) Between Hackett, the STG and Liara (as the new SB), it's more than likely that the Reaper IFF which Shepard obtained was distributed (most likely secretly) amongst most of the major militaries in the galaxy, or would have been once the invasion started. As a result, the Reapers may simply have not bothered seizing the Citadel because they knew that cutting off galactic travel was not going to stop the galaxy from uniting for long (this is of course presuming that the IFF allows you to bypass the relay lockdown).
2) Unlike the Protheans who used the Citadel as their empire's centre, the only people of any importance on the Citadel are diplomats in this cycle. Seizing the citadel would hurt the galaxy, but not in any major way cripple the galactic governments that made taking the Citadel a priority.
3) The Reapers likely didn't need the Citadel's extensive information network because Harbinger likely already collected enough info form the Collectors in regards to who are high priority targets (like the Turians) and the locations of most important worlds for their harvesting.
Seems sensible, a little bit like my head canon. But all we have now are writer-made plot holes patched by fan-made speculation.
#42
Posté 03 mai 2012 - 07:29
Prosarian
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Our_Last_Scene wrote...
The Angry One wrote...
Okay, yeah. That works. Except for when they took it easily!
"Hey we took the Citadel easily, except they closed the indestructable arms, so we can't turn off the relays".
"So what was the point in doing that if it gives us no tactical advantage and instead caused us to delay our harvesting?"
"I dunno lol".
They have the beam that transports things directly into the Citadel, so the arms closing isn't really an issue.
#43
Posté 03 mai 2012 - 07:29
Ticonderoga117
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Our_Last_Scene wrote...
The Angry One wrote...
Okay, yeah. That works. Except for when they took it easily!
"Hey we took the Citadel easily, except they closed the indestructable arms, so we can't turn off the relays".
"So what was the point in doing that if it gives us no tactical advantage and instead caused us to delay our harvesting?"
"I dunno lol".
"Hey Boss, yeah, they closed the arms. Can you know... open them up? Or wait, can't you just take control of it anyway despite them being closed?"
Modifié par Ticonderoga117, 03 mai 2012 - 07:30 .
#44
Posté 03 mai 2012 - 07:30
The Angry One
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Our_Last_Scene wrote...
The Angry One wrote...
Okay, yeah. That works. Except for when they took it easily!
"Hey we took the Citadel easily, except they closed the indestructable arms, so we can't turn off the relays".
"So what was the point in doing that if it gives us no tactical advantage and instead caused us to delay our harvesting?"
"I dunno lol".
................................................................................................................................. what?
Did you think? Did you really? Oh my god. YOU THINK THE INHABITANTS CLOSED THE CITADEL, NOT THE REAPERS?
www.youtube.com/watch
#45
Posté 03 mai 2012 - 07:31
Laurencio
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Jenonax wrote...
Prosarian wrote...
The most important reason for the Reapers to take the citadel right away was to prevent the galactic species from organizing themselves and to shut down the relay network so they could deal with individual systems.
In terms of winning the war this is the biggest advantage they could possibly have.
Exactly, and for this cycle, where the galaxy is being united more than ever before, you'd think one of them might have said, "you know, Harby, maybe we should nip this whole rebellion in the bud and just shut down the Relays. You know, like we've done every time before and has always been to our advantage."
What did the Reapers get bored and want to try something different this cycle?
With the Catalyst sort of being the Citadel you wouldn't really need direct Reaper involvement either.
#46
Posté 03 mai 2012 - 07:34
Clayless
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The Angry One wrote...
Our_Last_Scene wrote...
The Angry One wrote...
Okay, yeah. That works. Except for when they took it easily!
"Hey we took the Citadel easily, except they closed the indestructable arms, so we can't turn off the relays".
"So what was the point in doing that if it gives us no tactical advantage and instead caused us to delay our harvesting?"
"I dunno lol".
................................................................................................................................. what?
Did you think? Did you really? Oh my god. YOU THINK THE INHABITANTS CLOSED THE CITADEL, NOT THE REAPERS?
www.youtube.com/watch
What a trolly post from someone who is "barely here anymore" eh.
#47
Posté 03 mai 2012 - 07:35
survivor_686
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From a lore pov:
We just destroyed Alpha relay which was essentially a master relay that allowed jumping to any particular place. The protheans already disabled the relay which allowed the reapers to jump right into the citadel, so that was also out of the question.
Which means that they have to jump through each individual relay in order to get to the Citadel. That means at every single relay they have to fight the semi-coordinated fleets of the galaxy. That mans they take losses and have to harvest species in order to replenish themselves.
Of course Starchild throws all of that out of the window by just showing up. Maybe the Protheans disabled a portion of starchild?
We just destroyed Alpha relay which was essentially a master relay that allowed jumping to any particular place. The protheans already disabled the relay which allowed the reapers to jump right into the citadel, so that was also out of the question.
Which means that they have to jump through each individual relay in order to get to the Citadel. That means at every single relay they have to fight the semi-coordinated fleets of the galaxy. That mans they take losses and have to harvest species in order to replenish themselves.
Of course Starchild throws all of that out of the window by just showing up. Maybe the Protheans disabled a portion of starchild?
#48
Posté 03 mai 2012 - 07:35
edisnooM
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This entire issue makes the Catalyst's statement that "His solution won't work anymore" all the more puzzling. It seems like his solution only stopped working because he changed / actively sabotaged it.
If the Reapers had shut down the Relays, no one could have built the Crucible, cured the Genophage, stopped the Quarian Geth war, or mounted any sort of organized offense. Everyone would have more or less died where they stood.
Edit: Instead they make a beeline for Earth, despite the fact that apparently they'll need the Citadel eventually to build a Reaper anyway.
If the Reapers had shut down the Relays, no one could have built the Crucible, cured the Genophage, stopped the Quarian Geth war, or mounted any sort of organized offense. Everyone would have more or less died where they stood.
Edit: Instead they make a beeline for Earth, despite the fact that apparently they'll need the Citadel eventually to build a Reaper anyway.
Modifié par edisnooM, 03 mai 2012 - 07:38 .
#49
Posté 03 mai 2012 - 07:36
The Angry One
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Our_Last_Scene wrote...
What a trolly post from someone who is "barely here anymore" eh.
Ah yes, more personal attacks when you lose the argument. Bravo, you are an inspiration to ending-likers.
#50
Posté 03 mai 2012 - 07:38
Ticonderoga117
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edisnooM wrote...
This entire issue makes the Catalyst's statement that "His solution won't work anymore" all the more puzzling. It seems like his solution only stopped working because he changed / actively sabotaged it.
If the Reapers had shut down the Relays, no one could have built the Crucible, cured the Genophage, stopped the Quarian Geth war, or mounted any sort of organized offense. Everyone would have more or less died where they stood.
Exactly.
Maybe he wanted to die? You know, he's tired of being the Reaper's.... uhm... God? Wanted to say "to hell with it" and thus allowed Shepard to do what he did?
