242 réponses à ce sujet

[Emzamination]

SalsaDMA wrote...

Emzamination wrote...

Terror_K wrote...

Emzamination wrote...

Knowles left while they were still brainstorming ideas for Da2, thats not respectable.

Why not? He saw where things were going then and  simply went, "I'm out, guys" because he knew it wasn't for him. Would it have been better for him to half-ass it through the rest of the project when it clearly didn't interest him? Are you saying it's better to have people working on a game that have no passion for it and that they should simply stick with it and stay the course because they worked on the original one?

If he had left once they had a solid project going then thats understandable but the guy left while IDEAS were still being passed around.It just says dudes a wuss who can't respect other people have thoughts and theories besides his own.The game is called Dragon age, not Brian's Age.

Did you even read the blog he made back then? He clearly stated it was because of the direction the game should be headed that he decided to not work on it. Also, he didn't leave the company right away, but instead got assigned to various 'dead projects' that werent anywhere on the priority list of Bioware before he decided he had had enough.

I wouldn't say it was as much him saying "I don't like this, I'm leaving" as it was him saying "I don't want to make this type of game" and then getting pushed out by the company in a way that was easier on their monetary obligations.

So basicly, you are saying you can't respect a person for not making a game he doesn't feel he can appreciate?

That's silly, imo.

Its ok don't feel bad, House couldn't back up his statement with sources either.

[Lumikki]

CSMone01 wrote...

"I've already got your money, dude."

Hehe, They never got my money, because I never buyed the ME3. My reason is Origin.

How ever, I think Bioware does listen well about they customers.

Problem is that business comes first in EA. Too many companies have forgot that consumer satisfaction with product is everyting. Too much weight making money, too little to make customers happy. Loosing customers isn't good business.

Modifié par Lumikki, 06 mai 2012 - 09:41 .

[Emzamination]

SalsaDMA wrote...

Emzamination wrote...

iNyxs wrote...

Too much fanboyism on this thread, you can't even say a word or make a point without "internet warriors" going bat sh** crazy on you.

I love how "Meat heads" feel the need to downgrade and label anyone they can't win an argument against. soooo cute  

Cue picture of jedi master looking at your post and saying:

"The hypocrisy is strong in this one..."

Your sense of perception is a credit to the order, master salsa 

[SalsaDMA]

Emzamination wrote...

SalsaDMA wrote...

jreezy wrote...

Terror_K wrote...

Emzamination wrote...

Knowles left while they were still brainstorming ideas for Da2, thats not respectable.

Why not? He saw where things were going then and  simply went, "I'm out, guys" because he knew it wasn't for him. Would it have been better for him to half-ass it through the rest of the project when it clearly didn't interest him? Are you saying it's better to have people working on a game that have no passion for it and that they should simply stick with it and stay the course because they worked on the original one?

Discussing things with someone with "BSN Loyalist" and "BioWare Before Dishonor" in their sig might be a waste of time.

Awesome comment

Biased

You're right. Your sig does make you show as being biased

[SalsaDMA]

Emzamination wrote...

SalsaDMA wrote...

Emzamination wrote...

Terror_K wrote...

Emzamination wrote...

Knowles left while they were still brainstorming ideas for Da2, thats not respectable.

Why not? He saw where things were going then and  simply went, "I'm out, guys" because he knew it wasn't for him. Would it have been better for him to half-ass it through the rest of the project when it clearly didn't interest him? Are you saying it's better to have people working on a game that have no passion for it and that they should simply stick with it and stay the course because they worked on the original one?

If he had left once they had a solid project going then thats understandable but the guy left while IDEAS were still being passed around.It just says dudes a wuss who can't respect other people have thoughts and theories besides his own.The game is called Dragon age, not Brian's Age.

Did you even read the blog he made back then? He clearly stated it was because of the direction the game should be headed that he decided to not work on it. Also, he didn't leave the company right away, but instead got assigned to various 'dead projects' that werent anywhere on the priority list of Bioware before he decided he had had enough.

I wouldn't say it was as much him saying "I don't like this, I'm leaving" as it was him saying "I don't want to make this type of game" and then getting pushed out by the company in a way that was easier on their monetary obligations.

So basicly, you are saying you can't respect a person for not making a game he doesn't feel he can appreciate?

That's silly, imo.

Its ok don't feel bad, House couldn't back up his statement with sources either.

You're too lazy to google?

Here, let me be a friendly chap then.

Typing: brent knowles
and already there the autosearching feature came up witht he correct link as the second link.

Here ya go: http://blog.brentkno...08-summer-2009/

As I said, earlier. You're being silly now

[Emzamination]

SalsaDMA wrote...

You're right. Your sig does make you show as being biased

So wearing my loyalty to the company on my sleeve is considered biased? I dare say the only difference between you and I is my sig is actually visible 

[Emzamination]

SalsaDMA wrote...

You're too lazy to google?

Here, let me be a friendly chap then.

Typing: brent knowles
and already there the autosearching feature came up witht he correct link as the second link.

Here ya go: http://blog.brentkno...08-summer-2009/

As I said, earlier. You're being silly now

*sigh* Skip down to mikes post here  happy trails buckaroo

O and btw Da2 turned out nothing like his blog stated 

Modifié par Emzamination, 06 mai 2012 - 09:51 .

[SalsaDMA]

Emzamination wrote...

SalsaDMA wrote...

You're right. Your sig does make you show as being biased

So wearing my loyalty to the company on my sleeve is considered biased? I dare say the only difference between you and I is my sig is actually visible 

Incorrect.

But you've obviously set your mind already

[SalsaDMA]

Emzamination wrote...

SalsaDMA wrote...

You're too lazy to google?

Here, let me be a friendly chap then.

Typing: brent knowles
and already there the autosearching feature came up witht he correct link as the second link.

Here ya go: http://blog.brentkno...08-summer-2009/

As I said, earlier. You're being silly now

*sigh* Skip down to mikes post here  happy trails buckaroo

O and btw Da2 turned out nothing like his blog stated 

Feel free to actually read the blog

[Terror_K]

Emzamination wrote...

SalsaDMA wrote...

You're right. Your sig does make you show as being biased [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/blushing.png[/smilie]

So wearing my loyalty to the company on my sleeve is considered biased? I dare say the only difference between you and I is my sig is actually visible [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/blushing.png[/smilie]

When you wear it like that it says you're making a statement about it and trying to make a point. It basically tells everybody, "I support BioWare no matter what they do because they are BioWare."

I also like "BioWare before Dishonor" because BioWare is dishonourable. The amount of lies, deceptive PR speak, deliberately misleading statements and the way they've gone about things like the ME3 character import, EMS issues and misusing/spinning negative quotes about the endings into positive ones for advertising alone shows that they have no real respect for not only their fans, but also the Mass Effect IP that once started out so well.

And yet there are people here who seem to be willing to defend them to their final breath for some reason. As I've said before, I'm surprised they have any fans at all these days considering how far they've fallen in such a short period and the fact they just seem to be getting worse by the week.

Modifié par Terror_K, 06 mai 2012 - 09:56 .

[Emzamination]

SalsaDMA wrote...

Emzamination wrote...

SalsaDMA wrote...

You're too lazy to google?

Here, let me be a friendly chap then.

Typing: brent knowles
and already there the autosearching feature came up witht he correct link as the second link.

Here ya go: http://blog.brentkno...08-summer-2009/

As I said, earlier. You're being silly now

*sigh* Skip down to mikes post here  happy trails buckaroo

O and btw Da2 turned out nothing like his blog stated 

Feel free to actually read the blog

O I'm done but you take the extra hour if you need to reread and comprehend, Its always a pleasure salsa and thanks for the back up mike.  Check mate

[Emzamination]

Terror_K wrote...

Emzamination wrote...

SalsaDMA wrote...

You're right. Your sig does make you show as being biased [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/blushing.png[/smilie]

So wearing my loyalty to the company on my sleeve is considered biased? I dare say the only difference between you and I is my sig is actually visible [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/blushing.png[/smilie]

When you wear it like that it says you're making a statement about it and trying to make a point. It basically tells everybody, "I support BioWare no matter what they do because they are BioWare."

I also like "BioWare before Dishonor" because BioWare is dishonourable. The amount of lies, deceptive PR speak, deliberately misleading statements and the way they've gone about things like the ME3 character import, EMS issues and misusing/spinning negative quotes about the endings into positive ones for advertising alone shows that they have no real respect for not only their fans, but also the Mass Effect IP that once started out so well.

And yet there are people here who seem to be willing to defend them to their final breath for some reason. As I've said before, I'm surprised they have any fans at all these days considering how far they've fallen in such a short period and the fact they just seem to be getting worse by the week.

I think my sig is being misinterpreted  Same as the allers Avatar...Anyways I'd be willing to admit bioware was wrong if logical and concrete reasoning were presented.Pr...Everytime so much as an advertisement goes up, people yell pr, to be honest I don't think more than 5% of this forum actually knows what public relations is.

[Terror_K]

Emzamination wrote...
I think my sig is being misinterpreted  Same as the allers Avatar...Anyways I'd be willing to admit bioware was wrong if logical and concrete reasoning were presented.

Then I'm curious what your opinions are on the many lies we were told, the character import situation, the false advertising, the EMS misrepresentation, etc.

Pr...Everytime so much as an advertisement goes up, people yell pr, to be honest I don't think more than 5% of this forum actually knows what public relations is.

Considering how BioWare's PR department acts most of the time, I'd say that's rather in keeping with things on their side as well.

[Demon Velsper]

They listen in the same way I listen to thunder. I don't actually do anything about it.

[Emzamination]

Terror_K wrote...

Emzamination wrote...
I think my sig is being misinterpreted  Same as the allers Avatar...Anyways I'd be willing to admit bioware was wrong if logical and concrete reasoning were presented.

Then I'm curious what your opinions are on the many lies we were told, the character import situation, the false advertising, the EMS misrepresentation, etc.

Pr...Everytime so much as an advertisement goes up, people yell pr, to be honest I don't think more than 5% of this forum actually knows what public relations is.

Considering how BioWare's PR department acts most of the time, I'd say that's rather in keeping with things on their side as well.

Which lies? The character import issue was a wild card and bioware can't really be held responsible for that...mass effect has used 3 different engines to date since the start of the series.What false advertising? If you're talking about the 13 different endings then your beef is with drew, the lead writer who left as that was his promise and not biowares.The ems...are we talking about playthroughs with full me1 and 2 Dlc?

[Terror_K]

Demon Velsper wrote...

They listen in the same way I listen to thunder. I don't actually do anything about it.

Yep. As has been pointed out before, hearing and listening are entirely different things. If BioWare is doing one of them, it sure as hell isn't the latter.

Now of course somebody will point out, "just because they're listening doesn't mean they'll agree with what you have to say," and while that is a valid fact, consider the following.

BioWare are doing this whole "Extended Cut" thing. That means that they've at least acknowledged there's an issue here. This would indicate that they are "listening" at first glance. The problem is, if you're going to listen to the fans, you can't go about things partway or half-assed, and BioWare seem to be demonstrating this, as they have in the past. Many of the poor changes to ME2 from ME1, for instance, came about due to them hearing rather than listening, or at the most only listening partway.

BioWare are acknowledging that there's a problem with the endings, but they aren't acknowledging what the problem actually is. They aren't actually looking at what fans are saying, or if they are, they aren't taking it aboard. It's all very well to say, "they might not agree with you" and all, but if they agree that the issue is there and are making moves to make alternations due to it, then they have to acknowledge the full extent of the problem and properly analyse it. They can't just quick-fix this and do a patch job, because that'll just end up with more of the same issue rather than an actual solution that works, and it'll still be broken in the end.

BioWare's problem seems to be that they can only take so much criticism before they just shut off and put their fingers in their ears and ignore it as if it wasn't there, and even go so far as to put down the fanbase who disagree with them and tell them that they're wrong (A certain dev, for instance, was famous of this in the wake of DA2). They become stubborn and distant, hiding behind terms like "artistic integrity" and the like. They'll be willing to admit that perhaps their execution of a particular thing wasn't fantastic, but they won't admit that something they did was outright bad or wrong or shouldn't be done, even if a large portion of the fanbase says it is. They'll cop to a certain amount of flack, but when it cuts too deep it's the fan's fault and they're wrong to feel that way.

[Terror_K]

Emzamination wrote...

Which lies?

How about just a few small examples, such as our choices mattering, there being a wide amount of really personal endings rather than just A, B or C, there being no magic Reaper off button macguffin, the fact that the demo was an anomaly with it's autodialogue and only two choices and that the full game had far more dialogue options on average and not so much autodialogue, the fact that ME3 was going to have them going crazy with consequences being the last part with really varied outcomes, etc.

Y'know... most of the stuff they said in that original Game Informer article from early last year.

The character import issue was a wild card and bioware can't really be held responsible for that...mass effect has used 3 different engines to date since the start of the series.

Are you friggin' joking?!! A wild card?! Can't be held responsible?!!

So you're saying that the third part of a trilogy designed around character importing shouldn't be properly tested to make sure it works properly before release? You're saying that when creating a CC for this third part that the designers shouldn't have not only made sure that the importing worked, but that it could accurately represent the face by having all the facial options from the prior games available, instead of.. 'yknow, having random facial options not even be there at all?

Seriously, this should have been one of the top priorities given what Mass Effect was supposed to be. And that's not even going into the fact that later on BioWare claimed it was patched and fixed when it wasn't and them proceded to lie about the issue entirely, and then when players found proof in their hunting and brought it up, BioWare just went silent on the matter entirely with the previous lie still stinking up the joint as it festered in the corner.

Also, there's not that big of a difference between Unreal Engine 3.0 and 3.5 and their modified variants of it that add the "RPG Layer" as I believe they call it. It's still essentially the same engine across all three games, albeit with some tweaks.

They are responsible, they made the game! And not only did they totally screw the pooch doing it, but they've continued to lie and mislead players about it since. They're as responsible for it as much as I'd be responsible for murder if I held a gun up to your face and pulled the trigger.

What false advertising? If you're talking about the 13 different endings then your beef is with drew, the lead writer who left as that was his promise and not biowares.The ems...are we talking about playthroughs with full me1 and 2 Dlc?

They are false advertising ME3 long after Drew left the project. Even the Better Business Bureau confirmed that they had, mostly due to their claims of how divergent the endings were compared to what we got. My main beef is with the more recent example where they use a quote about people's reaction to the endings to try and put a positive spin on it.

As for the EMS, that's another case of lies and false advertising: them claiming that the best outcome and highest EMS could be obtained via the Single Player only for players to get the best ending, when instead that's not the case and it's impossible to get the 4000 or 5000 needed points without playing multiplayer.

Again, how can you defend a company who has shoveled lie after lie after lie at us?

Modifié par Terror_K, 06 mai 2012 - 11:32 .

[Emzamination]

Terror_K wrote...

Emzamination wrote...

Which lies?

How about just a few small examples, such as our choices mattering, there being a wide amount of really personal endings rather than just A, B or C, there being no magic Reaper off button macguffin, the fact that the demo was an anomaly with it's autodialogue and only two choices and that the full game had far more dialogue options on average and not so much autodialogue, the fact that ME3 was going to have them going crazy with consequences being the last part with really varied outcomes, etc.

Y'know... most of the stuff they said in that original Game Informer article from early last year.

The character import issue was a wild card and bioware can't really be held responsible for that...mass effect has used 3 different engines to date since the start of the series.

Are you friggin' joking?!! A wild card?! Can't be held responsible?!!

So you're saying that the third part of a trilogy designed around character importing shouldn't be properly tested to make sure it works properly before release? You're saying that when creating a CC for this third part that the designers shouldn't have not only made sure that the importing worked, but that it could accurately represent the face by having all the facial options from the prior games available, instead of.. 'yknow, having random facial options not even be there at all?

Seriously, this should have been one of the top priorities given what Mass Effect was supposed to be. And that's not even going into the fact that later on BioWare claimed it was patched and fixed when it wasn't and them proceded to lie about the issue entirely, and then when players found proof in their hunting and brought it up, BioWare just went silent on the matter entirely with the previous lie still stinking up the joint as it festered in the corner.

Also, there's not that big of a difference between Unreal Engine 3.0 and 3.5 and their modified variants of it that add the "RPG Layer" as I believe they call it. It's still essentially the same engine across all three games, albeit with some tweaks.

They are responsible, they made the game! And not only did they totally screw the pooch doing it, but they've continued to lie and mislead players about it since. They're as responsible for it as much as I'd be responsible for murder if I held a gun up to your face and pulled the trigger.

What false advertising? If you're talking about the 13 different endings then your beef is with drew, the lead writer who left as that was his promise and not biowares.The ems...are we talking about playthroughs with full me1 and 2 Dlc?

They are false advertising ME3 long after Drew left the project. Even the Better Business Bureau confirmed that they had, mostly due to their claims of how divergent the endings were compared to what we got. My main beef is with the more recent example where they use a quote about people's reaction to the endings to try and put a positive spin on it.

As for the EMS, that's another case of lies and false advertising: them claiming that the best outcome and highest EMS could be obtained via the Single Player only for players to get the best ending, when instead that's not the case and it's impossible to get the 4000 or 5000 needed points without playing multiplayer.

Again, how can you defend a company who has shoveled lie after lie after lie at us?

Every choice we made throughout the trilogy was either aimed at getting allies or support for the final fight which we got, nothing more.The only thing that was leaked about the variety of different endings was some people would live and some would die during the final mission depending on shepards choices throughout the trilogy, not missing out there.I'd like to address why the ending made sense but this is the non spoilers section .  I've hated auto dialogue with a burning passion ever since I first encountered it in awakening and always will, it is a cancer that kills games, I agree with you there.

Bioware made the game but they did not make the engine so yeah, they aren't responsible for that.I agree that they should thoroughly test every game for bugs before release.All in all the face import wasn't a big deal since you're shep would've looked like a shep you could create in default anyway, even if imported.

Why shouldn't they have a little positive advertising? Do you expect them to bare every lash the angry fans give them in shame?The problem with the retakers is they have the attitude "If I'm not happy with your ending bioware, you're not going to be happy" which is completely Absurd seeing as the employes at bioware have differing brains and feelings as varied as the rest of us.

I've made it to 4000 ems with all dlc on sp, not impossible.Why do you need 5000?

[abaris]

Terror_K wrote...

BioWare are doing this whole "Extended Cut" thing. That means that they've at least acknowledged there's an issue here. This would indicate that they are "listening" at first glance. The problem is, if you're going to listen to the fans, you can't go about things partway or half-assed, and BioWare seem to be demonstrating this, as they have in the past. Many of the poor changes to ME2 from ME1, for instance, came about due to them hearing rather than listening, or at the most only listening partway.

They're not listening to fan feedback or boards. They are listening to their market research.

And the above shows us two things.

First, there has been a clashback. They have suffered losses or they haven't at least met their economical expactations. That's why they're reacting.

Second, they haven't suffered enough to warrant a total reroll of the endings which would be much more expensive than just adding a bunch of cutscenes.

They expect this to blow over and they're probably right. In a few months time, the majority of casuals will have moved on, maybe using the multiplayer part off and on. And that's what they're banking on. They massively support multiplayer right now because it's an easy way to gain revenue. A few maps, packs and classes are easily created and with microtransactions going on there's quite a tidy sum to be made.

[deatharmonic]

Emzamination wrote...


I've made it to 4000 ems with all dlc on sp, not impossible.Why do you need 5000?

Are you able to post a print screen or take a pic of all your assets?

I think amongst the focus of multiplayer seeming necessary to get all ending people have missed the fact it seems you need dlc too. I dont know about anyone else but the fact you might have to purchase dlc (which should be optional) to access the endings i think is wrong - endings should be achievable within the vanilla SP alone

[Terror_K]

Emzamination wrote...

Every choice we made throughout the trilogy was either aimed at getting allies or support for the final fight which we got, nothing more.The only thing that was leaked about the variety of different endings was some people would live and some would die during the final mission depending on shepards choices throughout the trilogy, not missing out there.I'd like to address why the ending made sense but this is the non spoilers section .

How does that explain our choices mattering or having varied outcomes at all? They claimed they would, but then we get railroaded every time. The Rachni Queen choice is the most obvious one: something that should have mattered simply not in the end. It's all the same. And the fact that everything just basically points to your EMS in the end rather than anything meaningful or significant is a detriment, not a positive. It makes everything hollow and reduces it down to a simple, arbitrary number. What you did doesn't matter... just topping up that number is all that counts.

Bioware made the game but they did not make the engine so yeah, they aren't responsible for that.I agree that they should thoroughly test every game for bugs before release.All in all the face import wasn't a big deal since you're shep would've looked like a shep you could create in default anyway, even if imported.

Except it's been proven you can't. Aside from the fact that players shouldn't have to jump through hoops to recreate their face because BioWare should have done it properly the first time, it's been proven that some faces are simply impossible to recreate in ME3 because options are just plain missing. You can't complete a puzzle when you don't have all the pieces.

Why shouldn't they have a little positive advertising? Do you expect them to bare every lash the angry fans give them in shame?T he problem with the retakers is they have the attitude "If I'm not happy with your ending bioware, you're not going to be happy" which is completely Absurd seeing as the employes at bioware have differing brains and feelings as varied as the rest of us.

Positive advertising is one thing. Taking a quote about fans' reactions to the ending completely out of context and flipping it on its head with direct intent via false advertising is another entirely. I don't expect EA and BioWare to admit through their advertising that the endings were largely (dare I say, almost universally) hated by the fans to sell the game, but misrepresenting a quote like that is underhanded, dishonest and unethical. Sure... talk up you game to sell it by all means, one expects that... but don't take fan outcry and misrepresent it to mean fan love. That's an insult to everybody who wasn't happy with the product (not that the product itself wasn't in the first place).

I've made it to 4000 ems with all dlc on sp, not impossible.Why do you need 5000?

You can't of, it's been proven to be impossible. Even making all the "right" calls, the highest one can get is around 3750 I believe, with the 50% detractor than can't be raised without multiplayer or some other outside boost. 4000 is the minimum threshhold to get the best ending... 5000 if a certain choice isn't made.

[ME 3]

From what i've read over this thread, I gather that Father_Jerusalem is a massive pro-ender.
Don't call us whiney fans or you can expect the same to be said of you, A Bioware A*se kisser.

[TheRealJayDee]

Emzamination wrote...

The character import issue was a wild card and bioware can't really be held responsible for that...mass effect has used 3 different engines to date since the start of the series.

You have got to be kidding me...

Emzamination wrote...

Bioware made the game but they did not make the engine so yeah, they aren't responsible for that.I agree that they should thoroughly test every game for bugs before release.All in all the face import wasn't a big deal since you're shep would've looked like a shep you could create in default anyway, even if imported.

...no, for real, even you can't be serious about this...

Modifié par TheRealJayDee, 06 mai 2012 - 01:10 .

[Chrillze]

Reading Emzamination's posts makes my poor little head explode.

[fchopin]

Emzamination wrote...

I've made it to 4000 ems with all dlc on sp, not impossible.

I do not believe you.