376 réponses à ce sujet

[vixvicco]

Doesn't it pretty much 'ascend' you? Or make you a Reaper?It implied that to me. Personally, just not appealing. Would rather destroy than control.

[111987]

vixvicco wrote...

Doesn't it pretty much 'ascend' you? Or make you a Reaper?It implied that to me. Personally, just not appealing. Would rather destroy than control.

It makes Shepard the Catalyst.

[Hadeedak]

Control is not for everyone. It's a gamble. It ALSO kills Shepard as opposed to synthetics, the Citadel, and blowing up the relays.

[Rm80]

the problem I have with control ending is that the control ending does not break the cycle...

If the main objective is not anymore to kill the reapers but to end the cycle then the blue choice does not work, because if synthesis will always rebel over their creators and destroy them, then organics will still need to be harvested by reapers only this time it will be your shepard comanding the reapers to do the the harvesting.... stupid godchild and his stupid new rules.....

Modifié par Rm80, 13 mai 2012 - 05:59 .

[vixvicco]

111987 wrote...

vixvicco wrote...

Doesn't it pretty much 'ascend' you? Or make you a Reaper?It implied that to me. Personally, just not appealing. Would rather destroy than control.

It makes Shepard the Catalyst.

Oh I see. That makes sense now. Interesting..

[Vox Draco]

vixvicco wrote...

111987 wrote...

vixvicco wrote...

Doesn't it pretty much 'ascend' you? Or make you a Reaper?It implied that to me. Personally, just not appealing. Would rather destroy than control.

It makes Shepard the Catalyst.

Oh I see. That makes sense now. Interesting..

Or it merges him with the catalyst? Or makes the catalyst Shepard's superior? Shep asks: The Reapers will obey me? Catalyst says: Yes! ("But after you have lost everything you have and are dead...and you are uploaded into our machinery...I will show you the true meaning of indoctrination, Cmdr. shepard...or may I call you SHEPHERD! THIS WILL HURT YOU!" *maniacal laugh*)

The catalyst often says "us" when referring to the Reapers, but also seperates them from himself, calling them his "solution"... tricky tricky...every word he says is open for speculation? How far will your control reach? A gamble, as said above...with the entire galaxy at stake. I hope your Shepard's a lucky one!

That's why I don't bother with reaper-propaganda and this last effort of leading Shepard astray from her path...Shepard shoots the tubes, which as I see it is the alternate route to activate the crucible (the straight way would have been the console before the elevator of light)...my Interpretation at least, I like it to some extend...

[Hadeedak]

Nice fan fiction. I read it differently. I prefer the heroic sacrifice aspect of control as opposed to the more pragmatic destroy.

The big problem with the endings is that you can read whatever you want into it.

[KotorEffect3]

I just don't trust the control ending. It isn't as bad as synthesis because it doesn't rewrite everybody's dna but it doesn't solve anything either. The reapers are still alive and the citadel itself is still intact.

[Hadeedak]

KotorEffect3 wrote...

I just don't trust the control ending. It isn't as bad as synthesis because it doesn't rewrite everybody's dna but it doesn't solve anything either. The reapers are still alive and the citadel itself is still intact.

That's kind of the point, near as I can tell.

Synthesis does its crazy thing, and maybe that's good or bad. It kills Shepard. It blows up the relays and the Citadel, but EDI and Joker sure look happy at the end. Reapers leave. Shepard became a legend by ending the threat of the Reapers.

Control does its machine programming thing. It kills Shepard. You keep the relays, Citadel and synthetics. Reapers leave. Shepard became a legend by ending the threat of the Reapers.

Destroy does its explodey thing. Shepard might live! You blow up the Citadel, the relays, and the geth, plus or minus other synthetics as headcanoned. Reapers die. If you really mess it up, you kill the whole Earth. Shepard became a legend by ending the threat of the Reapers.

Modifié par Hadeedak, 13 mai 2012 - 06:28 .

[darthnick427]

Because you basically merge yourself with the Catalyst. What's stopping you from him convincing you that the their solution is right and sending the reapers back in a few thousand years.

[Vox Draco]

Hadeedak wrote...

Nice fan fiction. I read it differently. I prefer the heroic sacrifice aspect of control as opposed to the more pragmatic destroy.

The big problem with the endings is that you can read whatever you want into it.

I tried this way of thinking, but I failed. It jsut doesn't work with the catalyst introducing himself as the Reaper-King. Actually he says "put a bullet to your head, and when you're dead everything will be alright. I simply cannot make a sacrifice based on this. And I do not consider suicide as heroic, and that's basically green and blue...killing yourself based upon wishful thinking and the words of a serial killer...

I just fail to see how people can interpret anything "heroic" into this, but of course as you say everyone is free to choose their own head-canon. 

In fact I really hope that, if this mess of an ending stays in place with the EC...they don't do too much clarification. It may get even worse... 

[KotorEffect3]

Hadeedak wrote...

KotorEffect3 wrote...

I just don't trust the control ending. It isn't as bad as synthesis because it doesn't rewrite everybody's dna but it doesn't solve anything either. The reapers are still alive and the citadel itself is still intact.

That's kind of the point, near as I can tell.

Synthesis does its crazy thing, and maybe that's good or bad. It kills Shepard. It blows up the relays and the Citadel, but EDI and Joker sure look happy at the end. Reapers leave. Shepard became a legend by ending the threat of the Reapers.

Control does its machine programming thing. It kills Shepard. You keep the relays, Citadel and synthetics. Reapers leave. Shepard became a legend by ending the threat of the Reapers.

Destroy does its explodey thing. Shepard might live! You blow up the Citadel, the relays, and the geth, plus or minus other synthetics as headcanoned. Reapers die. If you really mess it up, you kill the whole Earth. Shepard became a legend by ending the threat of the Reapers.

Despite screwing over the geth and edi, destroy is the best ending because it ends the reaper threat for good.  The impression that I get from control is that it merely postpones the inevitable reaping.

[mass perfection]

You say that Control is good because of peace with the Reapers then why not pick Synthesis?

[palker]

By choosing control you are validating everything what Illusive man did and said therefore bad choice.

[Ieldra]

palker wrote...
By choosing control you are validating everything what Illusive man did and said therefore bad choice.

Nonsense. You validate his goal, but neither his methods nor his reasons for wanting to control the Reapers. Far from "everything".

I think the Mass Effect trilogy makes a point of showing that antagonists can sometimes have good ideas. Thinking that because X did A and A was bad, B which X also did must also be bad is an association fallacy. The fact that one thing TIM did was bad is completely irrelevant to the question whether another thing he did was bad. 

Modifié par Ieldra2, 13 mai 2012 - 07:37 .

[jtav]

Question for those who say Control is bad because TIM endorsed it: Was Lazarus bad?

[Vox Draco]

jtav wrote...

Question for those who say Control is bad because TIM endorsed it: Was Lazarus bad?

No, I think it wasn't. But first neither we or Shepard had actually a say in this..and second just because Lazarus might be good doesn't make control the Reapers good, too...

I do not see the point of this question, sorry...

[jtav]

To debunk the association fallacy. TIM wanting something doesn't make it bad.

[PerhapsDeadMaybeNot]

Why is control wrong?

Because, as a principle, no man should have that much power. It is not that power corrupts, (which, in case you did not know, happens rather frequently) it is just that the risks are too high. The leviathan dlc showed that the catalyst originally tried to do what it was programmed and preserve organic life, but after time and time again of organics being destroyed by synthetic life, it superseeded its original programming. What makes you think that would not happen again? What makes you think that shepard will not decide to destroy in order to protect? History seems to repeat itself, does it not? Should ANYONE take that risk?

Modifié par PerhapsDeadMaybeNot, 20 septembre 2012 - 10:37 .

[BassStyles]

I chose control initially, because it fell more in line with the Shepard I played as. Controlling the Reapers and having it coexist with the rest of the galaxy might be hard for other species to comprehend because well the exact same people who are helping rebuild everything are the exact same people who took so much from everyone. But Shepard was able to quell hostilities between other species, the Reapers was the last in his legacy. The Ultimate do good if you will.

But after reading some of the previous arguments, the Control is a gamble. I'm not crazy about Synthesis because I feel it takes away people's free will. I just decided for a whole galaxy that rewriting their DNA (maybe memories too?) was for the betterment for everyone. Plus the Catalyst said that it isn't always successful. Plus that's why I thought Control was better, because I wouldn't wipe out poor EDI (poor Joker) and all synthetics. That's not fair either. But everyone understood that destroying the Reapers was the desired final resolution. Never did I hear someone say, "Oh yea, peace negotiations would work well" so Control almost seems too hard to comprehend. I can't imagine making peace with Alqaida... At least not all at once.

So really Destroy is a guaranteed. BUT you just chose for all synthetics to cease. That goes against my Shep's play style. But I romanced Miranda and I promised I'd see her again so I can't keep the old gal waiting. So Destroy it is.

[Xenharmonic]

The Illusive Man wasn't too bad before indoctrination.

Could it be possible that if he took control (even tho the Catalyst denied it was possible) his indoctrination would vanish and he'd be himself again?

[Village_Idiot]

Modifié par Shadrach 88, 20 septembre 2012 - 12:02 .

[Memnon]

This is 15 pages long, so I'm sure this has been already discussed - but the reason I find Control to be a terrible choice is because the Reapers are still intact, and they still have a controller in AI Shepard.

This ENTIRE destructive cycle was initiated by an AI that went nuts - so now we're going to place our faith in ANOTHER AI? It's almost comical to see this pattern. The Leviathans saw their minions building AI, and the AI turning on them and killing them; so the Leviathans build an AI, and it turns on them and kills them - along with the entire galaxy; And now we're supposed to place our faith in another AI????? Seriously?????

Modifié par Stornskar, 20 septembre 2012 - 12:09 .

[D24O]

CONTROL IS BAD BECAUSE I DDIN;T CHOOSE IT AND BCEAUSE IT MAKES INDOCTRINATED AGENTS THAT REVIVE OLD THREADS

[PerhapsDeadMaybeNot]

^yes....like yourself?