219 réponses à ce sujet

[JustinSonic]

Vanguards are my favorite! I usually don't encounter problems when I'm not hosting and playing Vanguard, nor do I when I'm in a match with Vanguards who aren't hosting. I think a glitch has happened now and then, but it's a small percentile.

I like Vanguards to be used right. Spamguards (aka Novaguards), can become annoying in some regards, but I like to mix it up now and then and use the Vanguard the way it should be played: a good mix of biotic and weapon powers. The only instance where I rely on biotics is my Spamguard, or my Drell Vanguard (kinda).

[Yajuu Omoi]

I personally leave the vanguards alone, if they run off on the other side of the map and kill things, cool. i'll pop head of the ones they don't see/hit.
Its the vantards that run off BEFORE the enemies spawn...causing them to spawn in the WORST places...ie directly behind me...on the other side of the map from the ******...so i get slaughterd before they can make it back...
THOSE are the ones that i quit on and or kick out.
But otherwise i enjoy having a GOOD vanguard user on my team.

[Annoyed Dragon]

Personally I don't hate Vanguards ...

I just think their crazy.

The sight of them going off to be slaughted while expecting other players to go on a suicide mission to revive him/her.

Though I always think "Is it a bird or plane, no its a flamming maniac with shotgun" can't help but laugh when I see them go.

[WizeMan305]

The way the Vanguard is built often attracts the type of people that abuse his abilities rather than make him useful. The most memorable Vanguard I ran into laughed at the idea of using a shotgun when he saw an Asari Vanguard with a disciple. Got upset when a random person put a kick vote on him after taking more than 5 mins to ready up, and proceeded to say "Now cause of you none of you B****s are going to be getting kills." This was a bronze game I had just started playing ME MP and well... He went down on wave 6 used a med gel, went down less than a minute later, used another med gel, then went down, grunted then left.. I thought it was funny.

I have seen it used effectively providing proper distraction for the other teams and using biotic charge to zoom to rezz a person or capture an objective. Vanguards like that are far and few in between but they are an asset to the team.

Modifié par WizeMan305, 06 mai 2012 - 06:56 .

[GodlessPaladin]

prazision wrote...

GodlessPaladin wrote...

I think that's rather bad advice.  You should charge banshees ruthlessly if you have a biotic support team.  And using a Claymore is not a bad idea.

A demonstration:  www.youtube.com/watch?v=yMv-9VpdMqc

There can be more than one Good Advice.  I was merely giving Some Good Advice.

Of course you can do absurd things like clear Gold with a team of Drell Vanguards armed with nothing but Raptors.  Just because you "can" do something doesn't mean everyone can!

In this case it's not an issue of can, it's an issue of should.  Setting off chains of biotic explosions on banshees, for example, is important to making a Human Vanguard worth having around.

Modifié par GodlessPaladin, 06 mai 2012 - 07:05 .

[jaDanger]

I don't get how a class that has the ability to fully recharge it's shields is always excused for dying because it plays aggresively. I play aggressively, as a vanguard and otherwise and rarely go down. I also think nova is a painfully overused power, after the first 3 waves its stupid to use a power that depletes your shields, even with invincibilty frames and the recharge boost, instead use a light shotgun to compliment your power damage and use charge to keep from ever going down. Another over-rated power is barrier, your better speccing for durability and then using charge as often as possible. I've been in small rooms on gold alone with 3 brutes and a banshee and come out as the last man standing with this barrier ignoring backup carnage maxing battlemaster style.
All that said, i don't play that much vanguard relative to other classes.

[Homey C-Dawg]

Trakarg wrote...

Homey C-Dawg wrote...

4 Human vanguards with a good connection to each other is the fastest way to beat gold.

Replace one vanguard with a reave spammer and you'll finish faster.

How bout a justicar? With her dmg reduction from reave she can get right in there with them and pop her warp bubble.

Damn, now I wanna do this. 

[Siansonea]

I don't mind Vanguards, I'm just not good at playing Vanguards. The only once I can even halfway play is the Asari Vanguard. The humans and drell are unplayable for me even on Bronze, I just die constantly. I'm much better at playing Adepts and Engineers. I'm also terrible at Infiltrators. I don't know why I'm so bad at Vanguards, they are a "power spam" class for the most part. It's just that it seems like whenever I play a Vanguard, I end up not being very much help to my team. :/

[FortunePaw]

This is how useful a krogan vanguard in gold.

[thefiresidecat]

prazision wrote...

DryR wrote...
kill stealing

You obviously didn't read my OP, or didn't understand it.

There is no such thing as "kill stealing".  This is a co-op game and High Scores Do Not Matter.

actually, because they are there they do matter. people tend to judge their teammates based on the points. you'll be accused of being carried if all of your kills are stolen. Even if you have the max badge for assists you're still liable to be vote kicked for coming in last in points. 

until they change the system it does matter how much you score. I would posit that vanguards are actually some of the worst for being entrenched in that system. people play the vanguard for the reason of being "top" in the leader board at the expense of requiring your teammates to revive you even though you're surrounded by 10 enemies. thus bringing your WHOLE team down with you if they go and rescue you, and then when the team doesn't come running out to rescue you, you rage quit... 

I dislike the vanguard attitude. it's one of the least team oriented attitudes out there. It's the Me me me character. 

[DnVill]

I only hate Vanguards if they join the game instead of hosting it. Joining a lobby as vanguard instead of hosting one deserves a kick.

[DoomRaiden]

personally, Vanguards own the scoreboard on Bronze but are useless on Gold lol

[Lime The Dragon]

prazision wrote...

- Following that, The Role of A Vanguard is to Get In Faces and Kill Things.  Vanguards on any level, including Gold, will typically have a lot of kills and a lot of points.  That is Their Job because they are Good At It (if they know how to play the class, of course).

- Following that, Yes, Vanguards Die More Than Other classes.  That is Not Because They Are Bad, it is because They Are Getting In Faces And Killing Things.  I just killed the entire first spawn of the wave, but got killed by a Marauder I didn't notice.  Don't be a jerk and refuse to revive me - I did you a huge favor by killing those guys!

First, let me start off by saying your concept of proper punctuation is absolutely horrible.

Second, any good Vanguard knows they have medi-gels for a reason. Asking your teammate to run through a swarm of enemies to revive you is more unintelligent than playing as a Vanguard and not using medi-gels.

Third, don't be a jerk and take it personally when the one player that's half-way across the map doesn't get revived.

Fourth, there's safety in numbers. A vanguard isn't part of the team when he's off doing his own thing. This is more specifically for silver or gold difficulties.

Fifth, if a Vanguard dies alot, then actually, yes, it does mean they're bad, because a good Vanguard knows when to use their charge, and get in the enemy's face, as opposed to running it like a suicidal maniac, such as most Vanguards do.

In conclusion, I don't hate Vanguards. I just hate 85% of the people that play as Vanguards. And if you don't have the versitility to play as anything other than a Vanguard, I'm glad I don't play with you.


Oh, and P.S...

prazision wrote...

- Following that, Each Team Member Has A Role.  A "team" does not mean "four Salarians with sniper rifles" because at some point you will start dying and you will either take forever to complete a wave because you have to keep running away, getting one shot off, running away, etc.

 

Atleast Salarians have survivability. If that 1 leftover character is a Vanguard, it's an almost guaranteed wipe on gold.

Modifié par Lime The Dragon, 06 mai 2012 - 06:06 .

[Grotto19]

I think the underling problem (aside from people who can't play Vanguards well and think they can) is that Vanguards are optimal in a mobile tactical group. If the whole team is on the move constantly I can't think of anything better than a Vanguard. However most players do not stay mobile, they tend to move from one camping spot to the next, and that is effective. Unfortunately this is the worst thing for Vanguard. A good Vanguard is like an attack dog when in a static party, he needs to wait on his leash growling until the right time and then blitz the way to safety or bounce those hunters out of the teams space.

[SilentCO1]

Well I'm still not reviving you if you go down halfway across the map.

[Aramina]

prazision wrote...

- This is a co-op game.  That means four people are working together to win.  Points are meaningless unless you are an insecure manchild (or womanchild).

Mostly agree with this, though perhaps a less insulting way of putting it? There are some people who get kicked because they "had a low" score. If you're playing with friends, then yes, points are meaningless, as you theoretically know each other's skill level, so you'd know that people are pulling their weight. In a PUG, you don't know if you're getting matched with one of those people that will kick for low score, so it becomes, if not important, at least something to take into consideration.

- Following that, the role of a Vanguard is to get in faces and kill things.  Vanguards on any level, including Gold, will typically have a lot of kills and a lot of points.  That is their job because they are good at it (if they know how to play the class, of course).

I partly agree with this. A Vanguard's role really depends on the makeup of the rest of the team. For example, if there's a biotic on the team, the Vanguard's role is to stick with the biotic caster and set off their explosions. If there's no "caster" on the team and you're playing a Gold match, you need to rethink your role, especially against something like the Geth. Vanguards are very very good at distracting large numbers of enemies while your team takes care of the other spawn point. They are also very very good at getting rid of the minor enemies while your team focuses on the Phantom/Banshee/etc. And in a pinch, they can distract the Banshee and kill the Phantom/etc. if your team wasn't paying attention, giving them time to escape. This last one of course requires some understanding of when instakills trigger, but a good Vanguard should know this by heart anyway.

- Following that, yes, Vanguards die more than other classes.  That is not because they are bad, it is because they are getting in faces and killing things.  I just killed the entire first spawn of the wave, but got killed by a Marauder I didn't notice.  Don't be a jerk and refuse to revive me - I did you a huge favor by killing those guys!

They can die more often, but a good Vanguard should also be the one to pull their team out of the fire when they get suprised by a Pyro/Turret or the like. Yes, Vanguards CAN attack Turrets and come out of it alive, I've done it enough in Gold matches to know. More than 2 at a time is just stupid, but a few Turrets, and Pyros close together, are very doable. In short, if a Vanguard is dying a lot, they may not know how to play the class. If they die every wave....then they're a bad Vanguard.

Final note, I'm basing most of what I've said on the Manguard, which is what I have the most experience with. Obviously the other races will have some different strategies. And yes, I fixed all the capitalization, because I'm OCD about typing properly.

[Torni06]

A good vanguard combined with some kind of biotic for massive amount of biotic explosions is GODLY.

[Trakarg]

FortunePaw wrote...

This is how useful a krogan vanguard in gold.

I can get a scorebord picture of bottom scoring infiltrators, adepts, and engineers.

Does that mean the classes are bad?  No.  Dip****.

[Blissey1]

If you hate Vanguards, you Do Not Understand How This Game Works

...or they've just played with some really ******* bad vanguards. Vanguards are like hunters from WoW. Amazing when played right, but really easy to play wrong.

[El Immigrento]

Ive got to say, given that Ive only ever played as a Vanguard, Ive foud Ive been more of an asset than a hinderence, purely because a Vanguard (providing they dont die regularly) are the best people to revive you in a tight spot. I cant count how many times a squadmate has gone down in amongst the sh*t and ive zipped in, revived them (whilst losing all shield) then charged into the closest enemy for a full recharge and a quick escape for said downed man and myself. Im not gonna say I dont die, 'cos I do. But its a damn sight less than any salarian Ive played with!

[WaffleCrab]

El Immigrento wrote...

Ive got to say, given that Ive only ever played as a Vanguard, Ive foud Ive been more of an asset than a hinderence, purely because a Vanguard (providing they dont die regularly) are the best people to revive you in a tight spot. I cant count how many times a squadmate has gone down in amongst the sh*t and ive zipped in, revived them (whilst losing all shield) then charged into the closest enemy for a full recharge and a quick escape for said downed man and myself. Im not gonna say I dont die, 'cos I do. But its a damn sight less than any salarian Ive played with!

Vanguard has its place in the game yes, but apart from krogan vanguard. the best people to revive the team are salarian infiltrators(push a button for full shields every 2,5 sec.), batarian soldiers(omnidirectional instant stagger around them), asari justicars and turian sentinels

[Prawny]

Oh I see you've gone down in front of 3 Marauders, a Ravager and a Banshees, not to mention the various Cannibals roaming around. Let me break cover and revive you, because I have inpenetrable shields, and nothing shoots at me anyway.

[SHilton75]

Trick 1224 wrote...

You like capital letters

...in random places...

[prazision]

On a board full of people who have No Grasp of Basic Grammar or Spelling, it seems a bit silly to argue about me using capital letters to Denote Emphasis or Add Humor.

WIZARD

[Blissey1]

prazision wrote...

On a board full of people who have No Grasp of Basic Grammar or Spelling, it seems a bit silly to argue about me using capital letters to Denote Emphasis or Add Humor.

WIZARD

using caps to denote emphasis usually involves capitalizing the ENTIRE word, not just the first letter.