219 réponses à ce sujet

[Varbog]

I just want to know what's up with all the random caps in the OP.

[MesonicCashew]

MarchWaltz wrote...

www.youtube.com/watch 

Wow lmao that is really annoying I'd have to mute the tv. 

[Maria Caliban]

Lime The Dragon wrote...

prazision wrote...

- Following that, The Role of A Vanguard is to Get In Faces and Kill Things.  Vanguards on any level, including Gold, will typically have a lot of kills and a lot of points.  That is Their Job because they are Good At It (if they know how to play the class, of course).

- Following that, Yes, Vanguards Die More Than Other classes.  That is Not Because They Are Bad, it is because They Are Getting In Faces And Killing Things.  I just killed the entire first spawn of the wave, but got killed by a Marauder I didn't notice.  Don't be a jerk and refuse to revive me - I did you a huge favor by killing those guys!

First, let me start off by saying your concept of proper punctuation is absolutely horrible.

I see one comma splice. I rather like the use of an en dash instead of a period in the last sentence as the lack of a full pause coupled with the exclamation point makes it energetic.

[N7 Banshee Bait]

prazision wrote...



- If you think that it is a Bad Thing that someone is killing more things than you, then you Do Not Understand Teamwork.  If all you want to do is top out the points board, take your Widow X to Bronze and solo it.  I GUARANTEE you will be the points leader!

THIS^

[Silvair]

Maria Caliban wrote...

Lime The Dragon wrote...

prazision wrote...

- Following that, The Role of A Vanguard is to Get In Faces and Kill Things.  Vanguards on any level, including Gold, will typically have a lot of kills and a lot of points.  That is Their Job because they are Good At It (if they know how to play the class, of course).

- Following that, Yes, Vanguards Die More Than Other classes.  That is Not Because They Are Bad, it is because They Are Getting In Faces And Killing Things.  I just killed the entire first spawn of the wave, but got killed by a Marauder I didn't notice.  Don't be a jerk and refuse to revive me - I did you a huge favor by killing those guys!

First, let me start off by saying your concept of proper punctuation is absolutely horrible.

I see one comma splice. I rather like the use of an en dash instead of a period in the last sentence as the lack of a full pause coupled with the exclamation point makes it energetic.

More about there being like 7 randomly capitalized words in every sentence.

[Prawny]

prazision wrote...

On a board full of people who have No Grasp of Basic Grammar or Spelling, it seems a bit silly to argue about me using capital letters to Denote Emphasis or Add Humor.

WIZARD

At least we don't type in title case when it isn't necessary. However; ifYouLikeRandomCapitalisationMayISuggestCamelCase?

[prazision]

This derail has officially become Stupid.

Let's talk about cars.

[eye basher]

why do people keep saying the vanguard glitches out if your not host i've taken the vanguard class to level 20 twice and i've never glitched with a vanguard and i always avoid being the host.

[Silvair]

WaffleCrab wrote...

Silvair wrote...


1)  Its not really efficient, either.  Again, if everyone on the team benefits or contributs to Biotic explosions, then sure.  But BE isnt compatible with say, engineers, soldiers, and infiltrators.

DING DING DING! we have a winner for lobotomy lottery. Get your **** right and read this topic here: 

http://social.biowar...3/index/9629730

2)  I mentioned stasis because it is not only useful for the whole team, but its useful without shaking the screen or scattering enemies.  Biotics are fine in a team full of power users.  But the classes who use guns, its terrible because it keeps scattering the enemies that they need to shoot to kill.

IF your that ****ing close to a BE to shake your screen, means you either. A.) Got your ass saved by that biotic or B.) you suck so much with your sniper rifle that you walk up to the enemies to get the shot.

Either way, dont take it out on the users, moan at BW to remove the shake, i dont moan at the players i **** at BW. i do a support ticket EVERY ****ing week just to bug em about the shaking thing, and i keep telling people to do the same till they get rid of it. But dont **** at people who want to play the game they too paid for, You had acces to the demo, if you did not play it before purchasing and didnt know about the BE shake, blame only yourself for it.

3)  So let me get this straight.  I'm selfish....for wanting to play and enjoy the game I payed 80 bucks for?  Hows THAT work?  Anyways.  I specialize in high risk/high reward playstyles, so I tend to be able to pull off melee.  lol>  Its cute hearing someone say that I HAVE to like working with vanguards, then turn around and try to call ME selfish.

Then dont, there is a choice given to you, dont play with vanguards, simple as that. But if you get into a game with one, dont **** at the user. You dont have to like working with em, but you sure are one dumb SoB if you cant realize the fact that the game has only 2 classes that specialize in direct and sustained assault. soldier and vanguard. and the rest are support one way or another, that is your own fault if you cant handle that, yet again.

Quit obsessing over kill counts and points, and think about the teamwork and dynamics.  If you are only concerned about killing people quickly, which you are, then sure, Vanguards work.  Assuming you don't have anyone on your team who isnt a biotic, anyway.  For people trying to have fun matches, though, they are terrible teammates, because they make it much harder for everyone else to function because the enemies keep getting scattered every few seconds.

very few good vanguards i play with obsess over the points or kill counts, they take the path that leads to least amount of time spent on the mission, as everyone should be. Hell i dont do it either. i am perfectly happy hanging in my teams flank killing straglers/making sure team has an exit if things get hairy.

Fact of the matter is, Biotics were designed for single player so certain geeks could have some star wars with their star trek.  Not meant to work with other players.  Its a solo class.

It winds up overshadowing or just flat out disrupting the rest of the team.  Mostly the latter, sometimes the former, not fun to team with either way.

Your mp manifest tells me a good story about you, your just starting the game so you dont know jack**** how things work. First of all. Biotics are a CC with their forte being handling the armored units as biotics are the most powerfull against armor, where engineers are the shield and barrier shaver specialists. and Infiltrators are the elimination/close range melee support that are at their best taking down things that get too close or potential hazards at range before they flank the team. and sentinels they are the master of nothing but good at anything class being the flexible choice between anti armor and anti barrier/shield.

Saying biotics are ment for single players only is a statement only a ignorant, spoiled, Bratty kid, would make.

Hell. most people think that BE is the most op thing in the game, i hate say. but they are wrong. a skillfull engineer or soldier can set off fire explosions every few seconds. and fire explosions do even more damage with slightly higher radius.  But you dont hear people moaning about them. BECAUSE IT IS THE ROLE THEY CAN FULLFILL!!

now go back to your teen angst.

Oh the irony.  Tis thick as steel.

1)  I love how you try to say I'm an ignorant, spoiled bratty kid, while you make an entire rant that makes you sound like one.  You sound as if you are around 14, 15 years old or so, judging by the way you talk.

2)  How in the world does my MP manifest in any way signify I'm "Just starting out"?  I've been playing since launch, kiddo lol.

3)  My point still stands that vanguards (biotics in general, really) are incredibly aggravating to work with because they disrupt teamwork to just go in and do their own thing, forcing everyone else to work around them.  And the screen shaking/enemy bouncing from nearly all biotic attacks makes it annoying to snipe.

Now.  Keep in mind that its HUMAN vanguards that are the pain, and anyone who uses Shockwave.  Everything else, I'm okay with.

But I'll just flat kick human vanguards, I'm not having any of that rot.

[Xarathox]

BellaStrega wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

Xarathox wrote...

I know. <_<

I make it a point to biotic charge their stasis bubbles just so I can ruin their easy headshot they lined up.

I rather like it when people Charge my Stasis bubble.

This. I don't understand why people think if they detonate my stasis bubbles that it would bother me. I swear there are times I'd pay people money to follow me around and either set up combos for me to detonate or detonate my combos. And then some guy's all "haha, I ruined your headshot!" I'd just say "Keep it up. Boom, baby, boom."

Because I've met quite a few AA "snipers" who've messaged me after a match to **** about me setting off their stasis bubbles because they're all about/only about getting those easy headshots.

Thus, my personal doctrine to detonate any and all biotic effects I can when on my kroguard. I like 'splosions, and many other biotics do too, but a lot of them dislike others setting their 'splosions off.

[wolfwarp]

Just use your head. Don't anyhow charge and die.

[Sinapus]

Xarathox wrote...

BellaStrega wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

Xarathox wrote...

I know. <_<

I make it a point to biotic charge their stasis bubbles just so I can ruin their easy headshot they lined up.

I rather like it when people Charge my Stasis bubble.

This. I don't understand why people think if they detonate my stasis bubbles that it would bother me. I swear there are times I'd pay people money to follow me around and either set up combos for me to detonate or detonate my combos. And then some guy's all "haha, I ruined your headshot!" I'd just say "Keep it up. Boom, baby, boom."

Because I've met quite a few AA "snipers" who've messaged me after a match to **** about me setting off their stasis bubbles because they're all about/only about getting those easy headshots.

Thus, my personal doctrine to detonate any and all biotic effects I can when on my kroguard. I like 'splosions, and many other biotics do too, but a lot of them dislike others setting their 'splosions off.

Silly me, my AA carries a Phalanx X w/AP and magazine upgrade mods. Tend to use throw or warp +throw more. Stasis is for phantoms or hunters or rocket troopers or similar. (Haven't got bubble on my current AA yet. Getting there.)

I tend to prefer the engineer and sometimes the Infiltrator, but I have played the vanguard a bit.

My vanguard tactics are a matter of being... cautiously aggressive is the best way I can describe it, even if it sounds contradictory. Think charging/hitting the enemy w/a place to run to cover and not always spamming nova as opposed to the usual charge/nova spam into huge groups that probably irritates other players. You can keep the enemy occupied by using cover and picking off the edges of a crowd pretty good and whittle them down rather than charge into the middle and die when you don't time things right.

Sometimes you might even consider... hanging back and shooting some clusters of enemies instead of charging in.


(...or just hang around the Infiltrators that camp in that room on Dagger. Since some of them just stay there and snipe w/o looking behind them to see if an enemy is walking up behind them. That sometimes happens to me when I play infiltrator, though I try to move around a bit more.)

Modifié par Sinapus, 07 mai 2012 - 12:33 .

[Permafrost27]

 I have no problem with Vanguards joining my Gold matches, assuming they meet all other personal criteria (decent weapon / class lvl 15+).

I personally really like the abilities and playstyle of the Asari Vanguard but don't play her as much as I'd like to because I seem to get afflicted by the float out of level anti-gravity bug after a couple waves of biotic charging.

Kind of a bummer

[Malkeor]

MesonicCashew wrote...

MarchWaltz wrote...

www.youtube.com/watch 

Wow lmao that is really annoying I'd have to mute the tv. 

ToS battle music!!!!!!

That does look crazy fun though, i'll have to try it if I can get some people together to go with it.

[Xarathox]

Sinapus wrote...

Xarathox wrote...

BellaStrega wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

Xarathox wrote...

I know. <_<

I make it a point to biotic charge their stasis bubbles just so I can ruin their easy headshot they lined up.

I rather like it when people Charge my Stasis bubble.

This. I don't understand why people think if they detonate my stasis bubbles that it would bother me. I swear there are times I'd pay people money to follow me around and either set up combos for me to detonate or detonate my combos. And then some guy's all "haha, I ruined your headshot!" I'd just say "Keep it up. Boom, baby, boom."

Because I've met quite a few AA "snipers" who've messaged me after a match to **** about me setting off their stasis bubbles because they're all about/only about getting those easy headshots.

Thus, my personal doctrine to detonate any and all biotic effects I can when on my kroguard. I like 'splosions, and many other biotics do too, but a lot of them dislike others setting their 'splosions off.

Silly me, my AA carries a Phalanx X w/AP and magazine upgrade mods. Tend to use throw or warp +throw more. Stasis is for phantoms or hunters or rocket troopers or similar. (Haven't got bubble on my current AA yet. Getting there.)

I tend to prefer the engineer and sometimes the Infiltrator, but I have played the vanguard a bit.

My vanguard tactics are a matter of being... cautiously aggressive is the best way I can describe it, even if it sounds contradictory. Think charging/hitting the enemy w/a place to run to cover and not always spamming nova as opposed to the usual charge/nova spam into huge groups that probably irritates other players. You can keep the enemy occupied by using cover and picking off the edges of a crowd pretty good and whittle them down rather than charge into the middle and die when you don't time things right.

Sometimes you might even consider... hanging back and shooting some clusters of enemies instead of charging in.


(...or just hang around the Infiltrators that camp in that room on Dagger. Since some of them just stay there and snipe w/o looking behind them to see if an enemy is walking up behind them. That sometimes happens to me when I play infiltrator, though I try to move around a bit more.)

Hmm, seems I may have come across as an unwitting tool with no idea how to play. My bad.

I actually tend to play defensively on my krogaurd, provided the pug is stationary. When on maps (like condor) and the pugs move, I move with them the best I can, but if they all just split up...I go nuts (as safely as I can I might add) and just zip across the map like a mad man. It's during these types of matches I make it a priorety to detonate biotics, and especially AA "snipers" stasis bubbles (they're so easy to see).

In other words: If I'm playing with 3 rambos, I do my best to force them into some type of teamplay...even if it kills me (or them).

Edit: anywho, you've talked me into booting up my ScreamBox (seriously, can't MS make a quiter fan for these things?) for some "zoom zoom" fun for tonight.

Modifié par Xarathox, 07 mai 2012 - 12:58 .

[Maria Caliban]

Silvair wrote...

Maria Caliban wrote...

Lime The Dragon wrote...

prazision wrote...

- Following that, The Role of A Vanguard is to Get In Faces and Kill Things.  Vanguards on any level, including Gold, will typically have a lot of kills and a lot of points.  That is Their Job because they are Good At It (if they know how to play the class, of course).

- Following that, Yes, Vanguards Die More Than Other classes.  That is Not Because They Are Bad, it is because They Are Getting In Faces And Killing Things.  I just killed the entire first spawn of the wave, but got killed by a Marauder I didn't notice.  Don't be a jerk and refuse to revive me - I did you a huge favor by killing those guys!

First, let me start off by saying your concept of proper punctuation is absolutely horrible.

I see one comma splice. I rather like the use of an en dash instead of a period in the last sentence as the lack of a full pause coupled with the exclamation point makes it energetic.

More about there being like 7 randomly capitalized words in every sentence.

That's not punctuation.

[Epique Phael767]

 Dying a lot is the result of inefficiency, which kills teams, OP.

[prazision]

Epique Phael767 wrote...

 Dying a lot is the result of inefficiency, which kills teams, OP.

High risk, high reward.  If a skilled Vanguard makes a mistake (nobody is perfect) and dies, do not refuse to resurrect them purely on the basis that they are a Vanguard.

[Sinapus]

Xarathox wrote...

Sinapus wrote...

Xarathox wrote...
Because I've met quite a few AA "snipers" who've messaged me after a match to **** about me setting off their stasis bubbles because they're all about/only about getting those easy headshots.

Thus, my personal doctrine to detonate any and all biotic effects I can when on my kroguard. I like 'splosions, and many other biotics do too, but a lot of them dislike others setting their 'splosions off.

Silly me, my AA carries a Phalanx X w/AP and magazine upgrade mods. Tend to use throw or warp +throw more. Stasis is for phantoms or hunters or rocket troopers or similar. (Haven't got bubble on my current AA yet. Getting there.)

I tend to prefer the engineer and sometimes the Infiltrator, but I have played the vanguard a bit.

My vanguard tactics are a matter of being... cautiously aggressive is the best way I can describe it, even if it sounds contradictory. Think charging/hitting the enemy w/a place to run to cover and not always spamming nova as opposed to the usual charge/nova spam into huge groups that probably irritates other players. You can keep the enemy occupied by using cover and picking off the edges of a crowd pretty good and whittle them down rather than charge into the middle and die when you don't time things right.

Sometimes you might even consider... hanging back and shooting some clusters of enemies instead of charging in.


(...or just hang around the Infiltrators that camp in that room on Dagger. Since some of them just stay there and snipe w/o looking behind them to see if an enemy is walking up behind them. That sometimes happens to me when I play infiltrator, though I try to move around a bit more.)

Hmm, seems I may have come across as an unwitting tool with no idea how to play. My bad.

You didn't. I was simply noting that my AA doesn't carry a sniper rifle and I gave a description of my usual tactics as a vanguard. Though I see my switching to using "you" while describing those tactics might lead to that. Ergh.

I actually tend to play defensively on my krogaurd, provided the pug is stationary. When on maps (like condor) and the pugs move, I move with them the best I can, but if they all just split up...I go nuts (as safely as I can I might add) and just zip across the map like a mad man. It's during these types of matches I make it a priorety to detonate biotics, and especially AA "snipers" stasis bubbles (they're so easy to see).

In other words: If I'm playing with 3 rambos, I do my best to force them into some type of teamplay...even if it kills me (or them).

The explosions should help.

[Xarathox]

Sinapus wrote...

Xarathox wrote...

Sinapus wrote...

Xarathox wrote...
Because I've met quite a few AA "snipers" who've messaged me after a match to **** about me setting off their stasis bubbles because they're all about/only about getting those easy headshots.

Thus, my personal doctrine to detonate any and all biotic effects I can when on my kroguard. I like 'splosions, and many other biotics do too, but a lot of them dislike others setting their 'splosions off.

Silly me, my AA carries a Phalanx X w/AP and magazine upgrade mods. Tend to use throw or warp +throw more. Stasis is for phantoms or hunters or rocket troopers or similar. (Haven't got bubble on my current AA yet. Getting there.)

I tend to prefer the engineer and sometimes the Infiltrator, but I have played the vanguard a bit.

My vanguard tactics are a matter of being... cautiously aggressive is the best way I can describe it, even if it sounds contradictory. Think charging/hitting the enemy w/a place to run to cover and not always spamming nova as opposed to the usual charge/nova spam into huge groups that probably irritates other players. You can keep the enemy occupied by using cover and picking off the edges of a crowd pretty good and whittle them down rather than charge into the middle and die when you don't time things right.

Sometimes you might even consider... hanging back and shooting some clusters of enemies instead of charging in.


(...or just hang around the Infiltrators that camp in that room on Dagger. Since some of them just stay there and snipe w/o looking behind them to see if an enemy is walking up behind them. That sometimes happens to me when I play infiltrator, though I try to move around a bit more.)

Hmm, seems I may have come across as an unwitting tool with no idea how to play. My bad.

You didn't. I was simply noting that my AA doesn't carry a sniper rifle and I gave a description of my usual tactics as a vanguard. Though I see my switching to using "you" while describing those tactics might lead to that. Ergh.

I actually tend to play defensively on my krogaurd, provided the pug is stationary. When on maps (like condor) and the pugs move, I move with them the best I can, but if they all just split up...I go nuts (as safely as I can I might add) and just zip across the map like a mad man. It's during these types of matches I make it a priorety to detonate biotics, and especially AA "snipers" stasis bubbles (they're so easy to see).

In other words: If I'm playing with 3 rambos, I do my best to force them into some type of teamplay...even if it kills me (or them).

The explosions should help.

[WaffleCrab]

Silvair wrote...

WaffleCrab wrote...

Silvair wrote...


1)  Its not really efficient, either.  Again, if everyone on the team benefits or contributs to Biotic explosions, then sure.  But BE isnt compatible with say, engineers, soldiers, and infiltrators.

DING DING DING! we have a winner for lobotomy lottery. Get your **** right and read this topic here: 

http://social.biowar...3/index/9629730

2)  I mentioned stasis because it is not only useful for the whole team, but its useful without shaking the screen or scattering enemies.  Biotics are fine in a team full of power users.  But the classes who use guns, its terrible because it keeps scattering the enemies that they need to shoot to kill.

IF your that ****ing close to a BE to shake your screen, means you either. A.) Got your ass saved by that biotic or B.) you suck so much with your sniper rifle that you walk up to the enemies to get the shot.

Either way, dont take it out on the users, moan at BW to remove the shake, i dont moan at the players i **** at BW. i do a support ticket EVERY ****ing week just to bug em about the shaking thing, and i keep telling people to do the same till they get rid of it. But dont **** at people who want to play the game they too paid for, You had acces to the demo, if you did not play it before purchasing and didnt know about the BE shake, blame only yourself for it.

3)  So let me get this straight.  I'm selfish....for wanting to play and enjoy the game I payed 80 bucks for?  Hows THAT work?  Anyways.  I specialize in high risk/high reward playstyles, so I tend to be able to pull off melee.  lol>  Its cute hearing someone say that I HAVE to like working with vanguards, then turn around and try to call ME selfish.

Then dont, there is a choice given to you, dont play with vanguards, simple as that. But if you get into a game with one, dont **** at the user. You dont have to like working with em, but you sure are one dumb SoB if you cant realize the fact that the game has only 2 classes that specialize in direct and sustained assault. soldier and vanguard. and the rest are support one way or another, that is your own fault if you cant handle that, yet again.

Quit obsessing over kill counts and points, and think about the teamwork and dynamics.  If you are only concerned about killing people quickly, which you are, then sure, Vanguards work.  Assuming you don't have anyone on your team who isnt a biotic, anyway.  For people trying to have fun matches, though, they are terrible teammates, because they make it much harder for everyone else to function because the enemies keep getting scattered every few seconds.

very few good vanguards i play with obsess over the points or kill counts, they take the path that leads to least amount of time spent on the mission, as everyone should be. Hell i dont do it either. i am perfectly happy hanging in my teams flank killing straglers/making sure team has an exit if things get hairy.

Fact of the matter is, Biotics were designed for single player so certain geeks could have some star wars with their star trek.  Not meant to work with other players.  Its a solo class.

It winds up overshadowing or just flat out disrupting the rest of the team.  Mostly the latter, sometimes the former, not fun to team with either way.

Your mp manifest tells me a good story about you, your just starting the game so you dont know jack**** how things work. First of all. Biotics are a CC with their forte being handling the armored units as biotics are the most powerfull against armor, where engineers are the shield and barrier shaver specialists. and Infiltrators are the elimination/close range melee support that are at their best taking down things that get too close or potential hazards at range before they flank the team. and sentinels they are the master of nothing but good at anything class being the flexible choice between anti armor and anti barrier/shield.

Saying biotics are ment for single players only is a statement only a ignorant, spoiled, Bratty kid, would make.

Hell. most people think that BE is the most op thing in the game, i hate say. but they are wrong. a skillfull engineer or soldier can set off fire explosions every few seconds. and fire explosions do even more damage with slightly higher radius.  But you dont hear people moaning about them. BECAUSE IT IS THE ROLE THEY CAN FULLFILL!!

now go back to your teen angst.

Oh the irony.  Tis thick as steel.

1)  I love how you try to say I'm an ignorant, spoiled bratty kid, while you make an entire rant that makes you sound like one.  You sound as if you are around 14, 15 years old or so, judging by the way you talk.

2)  How in the world does my MP manifest in any way signify I'm "Just starting out"?  I've been playing since launch, kiddo lol.

3)  My point still stands that vanguards (biotics in general, really) are incredibly aggravating to work with because they disrupt teamwork to just go in and do their own thing, forcing everyone else to work around them.  And the screen shaking/enemy bouncing from nearly all biotic attacks makes it annoying to snipe.

Now.  Keep in mind that its HUMAN vanguards that are the pain, and anyone who uses Shockwave.  Everything else, I'm okay with.

But I'll just flat kick human vanguards, I'm not having any of that rot.

1.) I was not ranting, i was pointing out how you had no clue.

2.) the number of unlocks says your either havent played since start and only for the last 3-4 weeks or so. Or you havent played so frequently that your still learning the ropes. Your missing alot of the basic unlocks you easily get with just less than 80 hours of MP game play.

3.) your point... You mean your selfish view. I dont have a problem sniping with biotis around, because i dont suck so much, that the target or anything at all gets to my face, or i would have to go up their face to hit anything. And no, they do not disrupt teamwork, not as much as someone as obsessed as you, who has their eye glued to a scope all the time. There is a simple solution, learn to play with the class you choose or shut up. Or better yet, complain to BW about the screen shake.

I used to kick human vanguards too in light of the demo during the first week the game was out, but i got better.

[txmn1016]

8 Bears wrote...

I'm reluctant to play the Vanguard on Gold simply because of the glitch where you turn into a hot air balloon and explore an eternity of nothingness.

I encountered this as an engineer

[WaffleCrab]

txmn1016 wrote...

8 Bears wrote...

I'm reluctant to play the Vanguard on Gold simply because of the glitch where you turn into a hot air balloon and explore an eternity of nothingness.

I encountered this as an engineer

Heh i had that as the only inf. in the team  the crying was epic when they thought i wasnt reviving anyone on purpose xD i just simply couldnt. so i decided instead of replying, i just kept my silence, and laughed off the mic

[Credit2team]

Homey C-Dawg wrote...

4 Human vanguards with a good connection to each other is the fastest way to beat gold.

I disagree. Mix one drell adept or asari justicar for reave spam. then you'll have the fastest way to beat gold.

[DanteShredder]

i don't use vanguards on gold but i use them on silver (when i do play), personally i like being on the top of the list, but if im not it really isn't a big deal at all because either way im getting his points (unless its me and my friend and were competing for first then i start bring out the big guns) but anyways back 2 the point your completely right