1357 réponses à ce sujet

[CavScout]

ev76 wrote...

KingZayd nicely put. Destroy option rejects indoctrination, choosing control or synthesis embraces it.

Only if one presumes indoctrination in the first place. Circular reasoning is circular....

[KingZayd]

CavScout wrote...

ev76 wrote...

The game ends when you make the final choice. Your either indoctrinated or you fought off indoctrination and destroyed the reapers.

Why is it the more poorly you do, gathering EMS, the better chances you have of destroying the Reapers? IE, you don't bother gathering military forces and destroy is the only option presented....

if you do that, you're basically Vega Shepard. Your pigheadedness prevents you from being swayed by the reaper indoctrination point. Congratulations! problem is you're probably still going to bleed out in London. It's not as if your army's gonna be able to help much.

[CavScout]

ohupthis wrote...

SubAstris wrote...

Lol wut, "superstituos awe", you're describing the Catalyst in accurate terms just to support IT. The Catalyst doesn't convibce you to pick anyway, just lays out the information you need to make an informed choice

Informed, my ass............you're picking blue or green is idiotic, that's for sure, and this isn't any substantiated proof, this is merely the star-twit, decieving you into false hope. Misguided hope, that you truly believe what that ingrate-kid is telling you.

How does the Catalyst deceive Shep?

[OH-UP-THIS!]

ev76 wrote...

Cavscout The destroy choice is still presented because Shepard is not indoctrinated, you are at the end stages of being indoctrinated. You will either become indoctrinated by choosing control or synthesis or you will literally destroy idoctrinations grasp and reapers by choosing that option.

Precisely.

[CavScout]

KingZayd wrote...

CavScout wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

CavScout wrote...

So you don't even believe the stuff you post about IT?

I beleive in different scenarios of I.T.

So, you believe whatever you want, actual evidence be dammed?

Nothing like arguing a point, having it contradict you and then claim it's not the only point you actually believe in...

No, his interpretation of the evidence is different.

No, he claimed in his image post that Shep was never on the Crucible/Citadel. Then later on wants to argue that the scene with TIM, Anderson and Shep actually happened... when it was a scene from the Crucible/Citadel.

[CavScout]

ohupthis wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

CavScout wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Point being he shouldn't have been able to control Shepard the way he did.

Yet, you are clearly wrong.

Or am I? Indoctrination is control of the mind not the body.

May I add something to this?

Subsequently, mind controls the body, hence shooting Anderson was NOT our idea, but TIM/Reaper, control!

Shep and Anderson appear pretty lucid in the scene. They have lost control of the bodies, not their minds.

[ev76]

Cavscout, excellent question in regards to low ems. I too have thought about that, now my theory is that since it is a basic rushed playthrough from a gaming standpoint (catalyst even asks, why are you here?) that having a low ems will not unlock the best presentation of the ending the developers where trying to establish. Since ems is based on how much time you spend in the game.

[OH-UP-THIS!]

Tigerman123 wrote...

I don't understand why people don't spam IT threads with that DLC ad you get at the end of the game, Bioware explicitly say that the Reapers are beaten, so what the hell is there to talk about?

This is actually a joke from Bioware, regarding anything post-game, there is nothing to add. EXCEPT AN EPILOGUE!!!!!!!!!!

[CavScout]

KingZayd wrote...

CavScout wrote...

ev76 wrote...

The game ends when you make the final choice. Your either indoctrinated or you fought off indoctrination and destroyed the reapers.

Why is it the more poorly you do, gathering EMS, the better chances you have of destroying the Reapers? IE, you don't bother gathering military forces and destroy is the only option presented....

if you do that, you're basically Vega Shepard. Your pigheadedness prevents you from being swayed by the reaper indoctrination point. Congratulations! problem is you're probably still going to bleed out in London. It's not as if your army's gonna be able to help much.

LOL, the more crappy you play the better off you are fighting indoctrindation...

[KingZayd]

ohupthis wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

CavScout wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Point being he shouldn't have been able to control Shepard the way he did.

Yet, you are clearly wrong.

Or am I? Indoctrination is control of the mind not the body.

May I add something to this?

Subsequently, mind controls the body, hence shooting Anderson was NOT our idea, but TIM/Reaper, control!

this is true: however, Shepard's mind wasn't being controlled in that scene. He was arguing with TIM and was even able to convince him to shoot his brains out. Unless you believe TIM secretly wanted to die/ The Reapers wanted their pawn to die. Could be interesting if it was meant to be a whole: Darth Sidious convincing Anakin to kill Count Dookou thing. I'm not sure why they'd do that though?

The body control can't be done without the mind control. And in that that level of mind control causes serious damage. Shepard doesn't seem particularly clever afterwards, but i wouldn't say he's had serious brain damage.

[CavScout]

ev76 wrote...

Cavscout, excellent question in regards to low ems. I too have thought about that, now my theory is that since it is a basic rushed playthrough from a gaming standpoint (catalyst even asks, why are you here?) that having a low ems will not unlock the best presentation of the ending the developers where trying to establish. Since ems is based on how much time you spend in the game.

Yet, even with low EMS, you are still being indoctrinated. The entire chapter aboard the Citadel and Catalyst is all in your mind. Shep is not there. If this is true, why is the EMS the only option? Hell, in any playthrough why is Destroy an option? It's all fake... why do the Reapers give you the ability to vape them?

[KingZayd]

CavScout wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

CavScout wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

CavScout wrote...

So you don't even believe the stuff you post about IT?

I beleive in different scenarios of I.T.

So, you believe whatever you want, actual evidence be dammed?

Nothing like arguing a point, having it contradict you and then claim it's not the only point you actually believe in...

No, his interpretation of the evidence is different.

No, he claimed in his image post that Shep was never on the Crucible/Citadel. Then later on wants to argue that the scene with TIM, Anderson and Shep actually happened... when it was a scene from the Crucible/Citadel.

are you referring to the 2 links he provided? the ones he said he took some elements of?

[KingZayd]

CavScout wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

CavScout wrote...

ev76 wrote...

The game ends when you make the final choice. Your either indoctrinated or you fought off indoctrination and destroyed the reapers.

Why is it the more poorly you do, gathering EMS, the better chances you have of destroying the Reapers? IE, you don't bother gathering military forces and destroy is the only option presented....

if you do that, you're basically Vega Shepard. Your pigheadedness prevents you from being swayed by the reaper indoctrination point. Congratulations! problem is you're probably still going to bleed out in London. It's not as if your army's gonna be able to help much.

LOL, the more crappy you play the better off you are fighting indoctrindation...

Yeah, but you suck even more at fighting the reapers. Which means beating indoctrination is terrible.

Also, if you play just a little worse and have saved the collector base, your only option is control.

[OH-UP-THIS!]

CavScout wrote...

ev76 wrote...

Cavscout The destroy choice is still presented because Shepard is not indoctrinated, you are at the end stages of being indoctrinated. You will either become indoctrinated by choosing control or synthesis or you will literally destroy idoctrinations grasp and reapers by choosing that option.

According to IT, it's all fake anyways. It's a dream. Why offer an actuall solution? Hell, why is Destroy sometimes the ONLY option?

IT wants us to believe the Shep is so far along in indoctrination that he can't see reality but yet we are to believe the Reapers actually allow him to stop them.

EVERY Indoctrinated subject WE have encountered through ALL 3 friggen games, has HAD moments of RESISTING indoc, how is that so hard to see? Saren resisted long enough, to shoot himself. Benezia gave us VITAL information, in a MOMENT of resistance!!!!!!!!

WAKE THE F***-UP, GAH!! Why, oh why IS it NOT possible to beotch-slap through the internet?

[ev76]

Yes Cavscout you are in the process of being indoctrinated, only it is not presented in the best fashion because again you rushed through playing the game.

[dreamgazer]

CavScout wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

CavScout wrote...

ev76 wrote...

The game ends when you make the final choice. Your either indoctrinated or you fought off indoctrination and destroyed the reapers.

Why is it the more poorly you do, gathering EMS, the better chances you have of destroying the Reapers? IE, you don't bother gathering military forces and destroy is the only option presented....

if you do that, you're basically Vega Shepard. Your pigheadedness prevents you from being swayed by the reaper indoctrination point. Congratulations! problem is you're probably still going to bleed out in London. It's not as if your army's gonna be able to help much.

LOL, the more crappy you play the better off you are fighting indoctrindation...

Negative. The way I've interpreted IT, if the whole sprawl of it ends up happening: the crappier you do, the less-formidable of a beacon to galactic existence you are.  Therefore, they care less whether you actually pass the test or not. 

[nitefyre410]

 


So starting to sound like this guy. 

And this week are Indoctrination Theory - was the extinction of the dinosaurs proof   of Shepards  Indocrination  by the Reapers in the Mass Effect 3. 

[ev76]

Cavscout last post above this one I made is in response to the low ems questions and opinions.

[balance5050]

ohupthis wrote...

CavScout wrote...

ev76 wrote...

Cavscout The destroy choice is still presented because Shepard is not indoctrinated, you are at the end stages of being indoctrinated. You will either become indoctrinated by choosing control or synthesis or you will literally destroy idoctrinations grasp and reapers by choosing that option.

According to IT, it's all fake anyways. It's a dream. Why offer an actuall solution? Hell, why is Destroy sometimes the ONLY option?

IT wants us to believe the Shep is so far along in indoctrination that he can't see reality but yet we are to believe the Reapers actually allow him to stop them.

EVERY Indoctrinated subject WE have encountered through ALL 3 friggen games, has HAD moments of RESISTING indoc, how is that so hard to see? Saren resisted long enough, to shoot himself. Benezia gave us VITAL information, in a MOMENT of resistance!!!!!!!!

WAKE THE F***-UP, GAH!! Why, oh why IS it NOT possible to beotch-slap through the internet?

Also, don't forget about Rana Thanoptis, who actually distanced herself from reaper tech after sudying it with Saren, she spant ME2 helping Okeer the Krogan, she then killed a bunch of people RIGHT when the reapers arrived.

This would show that indoctrination can lay dormant/ can be resisted fro a while.

Modifié par balance5050, 05 mai 2012 - 07:41 .

[OH-UP-THIS!]

SubAstris wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

SubAstris wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

I would say that the little dude who controls them seems kinda awe inspiring if you think about it no?

Are control and synthesis not portaryed as optimal compared to destroy?

No

No again, at least not by the Catalyst. It depends on the priorities and thoughts of one's Shepard

So it comes down to what the player knows and believes.... thank you.

Good to see you conceded that the Catalyst doesn't try to persuade you to choose one option or another

OH yes he most certainly does TRY to direct your choice, or more importantly tries to DISSUADE you from choosing Destroy. I will not explain this further, if'n you paid attention to that star-Twit you'd understand this premise.

[CavScout]

ohupthis wrote...

CavScout wrote...

ev76 wrote...

Cavscout The destroy choice is still presented because Shepard is not indoctrinated, you are at the end stages of being indoctrinated. You will either become indoctrinated by choosing control or synthesis or you will literally destroy idoctrinations grasp and reapers by choosing that option.

According to IT, it's all fake anyways. It's a dream. Why offer an actuall solution? Hell, why is Destroy sometimes the ONLY option?

IT wants us to believe the Shep is so far along in indoctrination that he can't see reality but yet we are to believe the Reapers actually allow him to stop them.

EVERY Indoctrinated subject WE have encountered through ALL 3 friggen games, has HAD moments of RESISTING indoc, how is that so hard to see? Saren resisted long enough, to shoot himself. Benezia gave us VITAL information, in a MOMENT of resistance!!!!!!!!

WAKE THE F***-UP, GAH!! Why, oh why IS it NOT possible to beotch-slap through the internet?

In IT, the entire scene on the Citadel/Crucible is a not real. Shep never snaps out of it. All the choices are made in the "dream state". According to IT he resists nothing... he simply picks one of the choices before him.

[CavScout]

dreamgazer wrote...

CavScout wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

CavScout wrote...

ev76 wrote...

The game ends when you make the final choice. Your either indoctrinated or you fought off indoctrination and destroyed the reapers.

Why is it the more poorly you do, gathering EMS, the better chances you have of destroying the Reapers? IE, you don't bother gathering military forces and destroy is the only option presented....

if you do that, you're basically Vega Shepard. Your pigheadedness prevents you from being swayed by the reaper indoctrination point. Congratulations! problem is you're probably still going to bleed out in London. It's not as if your army's gonna be able to help much.

LOL, the more crappy you play the better off you are fighting indoctrindation...

Negative. The way I've interpreted IT, if the whole sprawl of it ends up happening: the crappier you do, the less-formidable of a beacon to galactic existence you are.  Therefore, they care less whether you actually pass the test or not. 

... what? ...

[OH-UP-THIS!]

balance5050 wrote...

Tigerman123 wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Tigerman123 wrote...

I don't understand why people don't spam IT threads with that DLC ad you get at the end of the game, Bioware explicitly say that the Reapers are beaten, so what the hell is there to talk about?

"One more story"

Ever heard of a prequel? Authors aren't obliged to to write their stories in chronological order :/

Besides the ad and the Stargazer don't say that Shepard became a hero as result of something extraneous to the narrative, but as a result of events presented in the game...

Prequels suck and that's all I'll say about that.

QFT

And besides, with the way this nightmare is presented, I'm not buying anything related to this MESS!!!

[OH-UP-THIS!]

DTKT wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Tigerman123 wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Tigerman123 wrote...

I don't understand why people don't spam IT threads with that DLC ad you get at the end of the game, Bioware explicitly say that the Reapers are beaten, so what the hell is there to talk about?

"One more story"

Ever heard of a prequel? Authors aren't obliged to to write their stories in chronological order :/

Besides the ad and the Stargazer don't say that Shepard became a hero as result of something extraneous to the narrative, but as a result of events presented in the game...

Prequels suck and that's all I'll say about that.

That's a pretty poor argument.

"I don't like it so it can't be true!"

UH WHAT?!!

Could you find some jrpg forum to spew in, you're just being annoying for the sake of being annoying, go away.

[OH-UP-THIS!]

balance5050 wrote...

ohupthis wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

--smooth editing there....

Clarification can mean anything. IT just happens to not change the ending but only clarify them. No "massive battle and long missions" needed what so ever.

(Although that would be a pleasant surprise that would redeem bioware for most the fans.)

A few perhaps, but myself on the other hand, would NOT want some half-arsed battle-cut-scene, with Harby.

No don't put words in my mouth, all I want from this abomination is knowing what happened, as a result of EVERYTHING we just did, not some inane badly editted cut-scenes.

?
I wasn't putting words in your mouth.

No not you personally, sorry that came out wrong.

i was referring to our collective Anti-IT bunch.