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[The Angry One]

... why would Sovereign open the relay?

Oh, the Citadel relay. Because he was still gaining control of all the Citadel's systems, don't you listen?

Modifié par The Angry One, 07 mai 2012 - 04:12 .

[Kanaris]

dreman9999 wrote...

JPN17 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

erilben wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

Optimystic_X wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

3 guesses as to who made the Keepers what they are and your first two don't count.

Did you even play ME1? They were reprogrammed before the game even started.

The signal was reprogrammed. Not the Keepers. The Keepers had mutated to only obey the Citadel already.
Regardless, the Reapers cannot directly alter them? They can't simply issue commands from the Citadel? LIKE SOVEREIGN WAS GOING TO DO IN ME1? Have YOU played ME1?

Don't accuse others of ignorance while displaying it yourself.

But that's the point..The reapers are shwon tha they can't just take control back just like that. Why would they suddenly  be able to do that out of the blue?

Sovereign shuts down the relays at the end of ME1. Why can't the other Reapers do that?

No, he did not....If he did. 5th fleet would never get there to fight Sovegin. Sovergin never gain control of the relaies...Replay ME1 and get your facts straight.

www.youtube.com/watch

That was Saren that got control of the relay, not Sovergin. if it was Sovingn he would of open the citadel relay.

So soverign just attached himself to the citadel tower cause he didn't want to float in space?

You sir are in denial <_<

[humes spork]

JPN17 wrote...

Cerberus damn near took the citadel with ease, if they could, then the reapers would be able to do so as well with minimal effort. It also doesn't make any sense that the Citadel would be less protected at the end of the game. If anything it should be better protected after the Cerberus attack.

Why do people keep asserting the Cerberus coup was a large-scale, conventional assault? The game's codex, dialog and datapads during the coup mission itself directly contradict that notion.

They smuggled men and materiel onto the Citadel with the aid of sleeper agents in C-Sec, then initiated surgical strikes with a small force. That's it.

[KingZayd]

The Angry One wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

seeing what the damage was is what the diagnostic checks are for isn't it? If not, what damage are you referring to? and

How are they going to run a diagnostic from outside?

When did I say they were going to do that?

The Angry One wrote... 

please could you also elaborate on what you been by them being compromised?

Anything. The organics could have important information. What if they find out how to use the Citadel against them and shut down the relay network? Even at 30 ly/day they're not going to harvest the galaxy very fast.

Organics are everywhere in this galaxy. How are they going to use the Citadel against them? Shutting down the relay network is what the reapers typically did anyway, to isolate the worlds. Reapers are patient.

The Angry One wrote... 

as far as I can tell, fixing the broken trap and entry point isn't a priority  when the trap and entry point can't be used this cycle.

Why not? It could be used before, and Sovereign was minutes away. That Vigil's virus did any lasting damage is an assumption (if it did, there would be no immediate need to take down Sovereign).
Even if it did, they built the system. They can fix it.

In this cycle? Because the reapers are already here, they don't need another entry point, and they can't use it as a trap this cycle, because once they've taken the Citadel, they have the Citadel.

I don't think Vigil's virus did any lasting damage.

[dreman9999]

The Angry One wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

1.After it was left unguarded.

No.

2.Yes, it was unprotected. Everythting was sent to the final battle...It was unguarded. One force was sent to cerberus. The reast were sent to get ready for the finall attack on earth.

The attack on Cerberus was before this. Also, do you really think they were stupid enough to leave the Citadel unguarded after it had already been attacked once?

3.Because he used Saren to do it...You get that  he had a clear reason of doing it. Also, Saren was tryng to open the citadel Relay. No hook Sovergin to the citadel.

Saren's only role was to get Sovereign inside the Citadel.
Sovereign was directly connected to the Citadel, you are wrong.

1. Yes.
2. It was during the perperation of this.
3. No, it was not the Geth could do that. The main problem was the keepers and the citadel fleet. Sovegin can hook up on his own. The citadel relay had to be over ran at the control panel to work. Saren was a few buttom presses away.

[The Angry One]

Actually it doesn't matter who locked the relays, Saren or Sovereign. The point is, the Citadel controls the relays, and did control the relays, regardless of what was done to the Keepers.
Morever it controls the relays even with Vigil's virus. In fact that's the whole point of Vigil's virus, to usurp control, not damage systems.

[JPN17]

humes spork wrote...

JPN17 wrote...

Cerberus damn near took the citadel with ease, if they could, then the reapers would be able to do so as well with minimal effort. It also doesn't make any sense that the Citadel would be less protected at the end of the game. If anything it should be better protected after the Cerberus attack.

Why do people keep asserting the Cerberus coup was a large-scale, conventional assault? The game's codex, dialog and datapads during the coup mission itself directly contradict that notion.

They smuggled men and materiel onto the Citadel with the aid of sleeper agents in C-Sec, then initiated surgical strikes with a small force. That's it.

And the reapers couldn't have done that with their own indoctrinated agents?

[The Angry One]

dreman9999 wrote...

1. Yes.

Prove it.

2. It was during the perperation of this.

Which has nothing to do with the Citadel fleet.

3. No, it was not the Geth could do that. The main problem was the keepers and the citadel fleet. Sovegin can hook up on his own. The citadel relay had to be over ran at the control panel to work. Saren was a few buttom presses away.

So what?

[The Angry One]

JPN17 wrote...

And the reapers couldn't have done that with their own indoctrinated agents?

Gee if only the Reapers had a completely indoctrinated agent standing around right next to a master control panel.

[TheLostGenius]

TIM points this out. Some kind of evolutionary trial. Got a feeling the writers have something big planned...for a second trilogy.

[incinerator950]

JPN17 wrote...

humes spork wrote...

JPN17 wrote...

Cerberus damn near took the citadel with ease, if they could, then the reapers would be able to do so as well with minimal effort. It also doesn't make any sense that the Citadel would be less protected at the end of the game. If anything it should be better protected after the Cerberus attack.

Why do people keep asserting the Cerberus coup was a large-scale, conventional assault? The game's codex, dialog and datapads during the coup mission itself directly contradict that notion.

They smuggled men and materiel onto the Citadel with the aid of sleeper agents in C-Sec, then initiated surgical strikes with a small force. That's it.

And the reapers couldn't have done that with their own indoctrinated agents?

Technically Cerberus are the indoctrinated agents.

[dreman9999]

Kanaris wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

JPN17 wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

erilben wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

Optimystic_X wrote...

The Angry One wrote...

3 guesses as to who made the Keepers what they are and your first two don't count.

Did you even play ME1? They were reprogrammed before the game even started.

The signal was reprogrammed. Not the Keepers. The Keepers had mutated to only obey the Citadel already.
Regardless, the Reapers cannot directly alter them? They can't simply issue commands from the Citadel? LIKE SOVEREIGN WAS GOING TO DO IN ME1? Have YOU played ME1?

Don't accuse others of ignorance while displaying it yourself.

But that's the point..The reapers are shwon tha they can't just take control back just like that. Why would they suddenly  be able to do that out of the blue?

Sovereign shuts down the relays at the end of ME1. Why can't the other Reapers do that?

No, he did not....If he did. 5th fleet would never get there to fight Sovegin. Sovergin never gain control of the relaies...Replay ME1 and get your facts straight.

www.youtube.com/watch

That was Saren that got control of the relay, not Sovergin. if it was Sovingn he would of open the citadel relay.

So soverign just attached himself to the citadel tower cause he didn't want to float in space?

You sir are in denial <_<

And yet he still need Saren to over ride the keepers. I would say that he was only there to get into the system once eveny thing was open to his so he can lock all the relay once it open to him...It was not open to him yet. If it was, he would open the citadel realy. If he was connect to the system like you said he was, the battle would of already be lost.

[dreman9999]

incinerator950 wrote...

JPN17 wrote...

humes spork wrote...

JPN17 wrote...

Cerberus damn near took the citadel with ease, if they could, then the reapers would be able to do so as well with minimal effort. It also doesn't make any sense that the Citadel would be less protected at the end of the game. If anything it should be better protected after the Cerberus attack.

Why do people keep asserting the Cerberus coup was a large-scale, conventional assault? The game's codex, dialog and datapads during the coup mission itself directly contradict that notion.

They smuggled men and materiel onto the Citadel with the aid of sleeper agents in C-Sec, then initiated surgical strikes with a small force. That's it.

And the reapers couldn't have done that with their own indoctrinated agents?

Technically Cerberus are the indoctrinated agents.

That's the speculaiton. It could be ether or.

[The Angry One]

dreman9999 wrote...
And yet he still need Saren to over ride the keepers. I would say that he was only there to get into the system once eveny thing was open to his so he can lock all the relay once it open to him...It was not open to him yet. If it was, he would open the citadel realy. If he was connect to the system like you said he was, the battle would of already be lost.

Sigh. He needed Saren to make sure he could get in.

[KingZayd]

The Angry One wrote...

JPN17 wrote...

And the reapers couldn't have done that with their own indoctrinated agents?

Gee if only the Reapers had a completely indoctrinated agent standing around right next to a master control panel.

Because he was like that throughout the game? No. He was doing his own thing at first. He wasn't always a pawn of the reapers.

[KingZayd]

incinerator950 wrote...

JPN17 wrote...

humes spork wrote...

JPN17 wrote...

Cerberus damn near took the citadel with ease, if they could, then the reapers would be able to do so as well with minimal effort. It also doesn't make any sense that the Citadel would be less protected at the end of the game. If anything it should be better protected after the Cerberus attack.

Why do people keep asserting the Cerberus coup was a large-scale, conventional assault? The game's codex, dialog and datapads during the coup mission itself directly contradict that notion.

They smuggled men and materiel onto the Citadel with the aid of sleeper agents in C-Sec, then initiated surgical strikes with a small force. That's it.

And the reapers couldn't have done that with their own indoctrinated agents?

Technically Cerberus are the indoctrinated agents.

Only when TIM ended up deliberately helping the reapers. Which was shortly before the reapers took the Citadel.

[incinerator950]

KingZayd wrote...

Because he was like that throughout the game? No. He was doing his own thing at first. He wasn't always a pawn of the reapers.

No, its been generaly accepted that TIM has been indoctrinated to some degree after ME 2.  Probably from the Reaper tech sitting in his base.  

[dreman9999]

The Angry One wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

1. Yes.

Prove it.

2. It was during the perperation of this.

Which has nothing to do with the Citadel fleet.

3. No, it was not the Geth could do that. The main problem was the keepers and the citadel fleet. Sovegin can hook up on his own. The citadel relay had to be over ran at the control panel to work. Saren was a few buttom presses away.

So what?

1.The conversation with hachett before going after cerberus.
2. The citadel fleet is from eveny council fleet in the galxey. Of course it has somthing to do with the citadel fleet.
3. Point being that they needed some at the system to let them in....Which is why they can just get into the system

[humes spork]

JPN17 wrote...

And the reapers couldn't have done that with their own indoctrinated agents?

You really missed that whole "TIM, and Cerberus by extension and later literally, were indoctrinated" thing didn't you.

Let me quote straight from the codex, 

[Udina's] actions played right into the Reapers' plans: even if the coup failed, it would damage Citadel governance. If it succeeded, his plan to retake Earth would likely have turned into a military blunder that Council forces could ill afford.

I mean, for as much as people whine, **** and moan about "why didn't the Reapers take the Citadel?" right there's your damn answer.

Udina takes over the Citadel with indoctrinated forces. Or hell, maybe even indoctrinated himself through Cerberus contact. Udina then proceeds to command the Citadel fleet to Earth, leaving it defenseless and an easy mark for Reaper forces.

[KingZayd]

incinerator950 wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

Because he was like that throughout the game? No. He was doing his own thing at first. He wasn't always a pawn of the reapers.

No, its been generaly accepted that TIM has been indoctrinated to some degree after ME 2.  Probably from the Reaper tech sitting in his base.  

To SOME degree. He wasn't the reapers' female dog (I'm not sure if that word is allowed?) until nearer the end of the game. Watch the videos in Cerberus base about 15 mins in: 


in fact I believe the reaper taint was introduced in Mass Effect Evolution. He's just been fighting it all this time.

Modifié par KingZayd, 07 mai 2012 - 04:26 .

[Kanaris]

The Angry One wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...
And yet he still need Saren to over ride the keepers. I would say that he was only there to get into the system once eveny thing was open to his so he can lock all the relay once it open to him...It was not open to him yet. If it was, he would open the citadel realy. If he was connect to the system like you said he was, the battle would of already be lost.

Sigh. He needed Saren to make sure he could get in.

Exactly Saren and the Geths only role was to make sure the races in the Citatel COULDN'T close the citadel arms before Soverign could get inside.

Modifié par Kanaris, 07 mai 2012 - 04:26 .

[dreman9999]

The Angry One wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...
And yet he still need Saren to over ride the keepers. I would say that he was only there to get into the system once eveny thing was open to his so he can lock all the relay once it open to him...It was not open to him yet. If it was, he would open the citadel realy. If he was connect to the system like you said he was, the battle would of already be lost.

Sigh. He needed Saren to make sure he could get in.

Which is my point. He is not in yet and need someone to let him in. Meaning he does not have control of the relays or citadel yet. If the relay is locked...It's Saren that did it. 

[humes spork]

incinerator950 wrote...

No, its been generaly accepted that TIM has been indoctrinated to some degree after ME 2.  Probably from the Reaper tech sitting in his base.

Read Mass Effect: Evolution. TIM's been a high-functioning indoctrinated since the First Contact War and his run-in with Saren and Desolas.

[Kanaris]

Am I the only one getting a Migrain trying to explain this? 

[JPN17]

incinerator950 wrote...

JPN17 wrote...

humes spork wrote...

JPN17 wrote...

Cerberus damn near took the citadel with ease, if they could, then the reapers would be able to do so as well with minimal effort. It also doesn't make any sense that the Citadel would be less protected at the end of the game. If anything it should be better protected after the Cerberus attack.

Why do people keep asserting the Cerberus coup was a large-scale, conventional assault? The game's codex, dialog and datapads during the coup mission itself directly contradict that notion.

They smuggled men and materiel onto the Citadel with the aid of sleeper agents in C-Sec, then initiated surgical strikes with a small force. That's it.

And the reapers couldn't have done that with their own indoctrinated agents?

Technically Cerberus are the indoctrinated agents.

Sure, but the reapers pretty much let Cerberus do their own thing off to the side, just to kind of throw a wrench into the state of the galaxy, to keep them infighting, which is exaclty what the reapers want. When Cerberus assualts the Citadel, they do so alone. My point is that the reapers could have just as easily planted their own agents, sprung the attack and then taken the Citadel. At that point they could shut down the relay network and isolate the galaxy. No more organics regrouping or moving resources. And this is just speculative on my part, but if the nebula where the crucible was being constructed was really isolated and far away from any star systems, then there's a really good chance that they all would have died and the majority of the milky way fleet would be taken care of. Like I said I have no proof of that though. Just an idea. But the main point here is that to me it makes the most sense for the reapers to take the citadel as soon as possible. They can't surprise the galaxy this time I get that. But the surprise really wasn't that big of a deal to begin with. The main reason for their success was the isolation of the civilizations of the galaxy.