181 réponses à ce sujet

[jpraelster93]

An English Gamer wrote...

vixvicco wrote...

G Kevin wrote...

I would pay for alternate endings DLC. Only if done right though.

 Don't pay for it. They should have done it correctly from the start.

Yes, because demanding them create a fully fledged DLC for free was always a realistic option compared to this bunch of cutscenes.
Quite frankly if we were ever to get the ending we wanted post-launch we were going to have to pay for it. Besides. £8 isn't that much.

endings shouldnt be something that is extra 

[Mass effect 2 forever]

Devil Mingy wrote...


To paraphrase a quote from Bioware's PAX conference, they didn't know we wanted closure.

[An English Gamer]

jpraelster93 wrote...

An English Gamer wrote...

vixvicco wrote...

G Kevin wrote...

I would pay for alternate endings DLC. Only if done right though.

 Don't pay for it. They should have done it correctly from the start.

Yes, because demanding them create a fully fledged DLC for free was always a realistic option compared to this bunch of cutscenes.
Quite frankly if we were ever to get the ending we wanted post-launch we were going to have to pay for it. Besides. £8 isn't that much.

endings shouldnt be something that is extra 

But in this instance they would have to be.

[Subject M]

People, I don't know about you, but I actually find this stubborn attitude from Bioware devs outright sad.
Up until ME3, the mass effect series was my favorite sci-fi game series, one that seemed to go down in history as a mile stone and set a new standard, like a new original Star Wars trilogy.

Talk about severed fate. Its all very sad, especially Biowares stubborn reluctance to fix the problems and secure their and the MEs place of honor gaming history.

I mean, What Is Going On?!

[Subject M]

I think there is a good chance that the fans would donate the money needed if Bioware presented us with a detailed plan, specifications and a budget for an Mass Effect 3 - Enhanced edition. (less auto- dialogue, more choices, more cut-scenes of recruited war assets in action, new endings that reflected what you had achieved that resulted in the catalyst (harbinger in disguise perhaps) either retreating (paragon) or is destroyed and with it the rest of the reapers (renegade), better side quests etc..

[Ingvarr Stormbird]

Suggest BW makes a project on Kickstarter?

[Subject M]

Baa Baa wrote...

This is something that I don't understand on BioWare's part. Movies get released all the time with alternate endings that just weren't right for theaters, why can't BioWare give us an alternate ending to the game? It wouldn't ****** off the people who enjoy the ending, and the people who dislike/hated the ending can be pleased as well (if they spend a good amount of time on it). Another thing I dislike about them deciding not to give us a new or changed ending is the fact that they think that it will damage them in some way. Bethesda did this with Fallout 3 and that wasn't even a terrible ending, it was just very meh. And look at them, Bethesda is known as one of the best gaming companies out there and it hasn't negatively affected them. All BioWare needs to do is make an alt ending dlc and not an update. This way pro enders can get what they want, and people who dislike the ending can get what they want. Just my two cents.

Oh and I just couldn't help but share this vid...
Thanks for reading

Baa Baa, I think that an important part of the reason is the very same type reasons why George Lucas defends Jar jar binks, how the young Skywalker acts and is portrayed, the Disney-colored landscapes an the other stuff in the new Star Wars movies that makes them horrible and utterly disjointed in comparison to the first trilogy (even though I guess the Ewoks in Episode IV were a ominous sign of things to come):

A completely different understanding or take on what quality, thematic and taste is then what mot other fans have developed in relation to the series.

This coupled of running out of time an not wanting to give any admittance of guilt.  That is my guess anyway. Though the real question is: how could this happen?

[Subject M]

Ingvarr Stormbird wrote...

Suggest BW makes a project on Kickstarter?

If they actually listen to the fans and stay true to the story and thematics of ME1-ME2, at least nothing bad can come out of it.

[Someone With Mass]

Devil Mingy wrote...
To paraphrase a quote from Bioware's PAX conference, they didn't know we wanted closure.

But...they were the ones promising it from the very start. The hell?

[chemiclord]

jpraelster93 wrote...

endings shouldnt be something that is extra 

This.

The last thing I want to do is give gaming companies the idea that they can publish a broken product, then ask customers to pay extra to fix it later.

[grandmasterub]

Bioware through their actions has ensured that many of their gamers will never purchase a bioware product again. I personally won't, and I'll make sure never to buy a BW product for my kids either. 2 generations of lost sales because theyre too proud, stubborn, and stupid to give this game a better ending.

[PPF65]

RavenEchoseven wrote...

BioWare doesn't want to set that precedent for themselves. Regardless of what others have done, if they relent once, they'll be expected to do so again. They are standing by their creation, regardless of fan backlash. Keep in mind that the majority of professional critics are supporting BioWare in this stance.

But they already lied to us, long before this fan backlash. The said that there wouldn't be an A, B or C ending, but that is exactly what we got.

They said there would be many, diverging, different endings, and there wasn't.

Bioware lied, and THAT is the problem. This series has always been about choice for soooooooo long. But now... its bull****.

[daecath]

Afalstein wrote...

There are a couple arguments against Bioware giving out a different ending. The first is logistical--depending on the complexity of the ending you want (different endings? That reflect your different decisions?), such an ending could require a lot of coding, even alterations to earlier segments of the game. And if you want voices, they have to hire the voice actors all over again and do new CGI sequences... an awful lot for something that Bioware would (hopefully) give out for free.

The second is more abstract and principled. In terms of storywriting, the ending is as much a part of the story as anything else. You can't say the ending to, say, Inception is stupid and ought to be changed, because it's an integral part of the story that informs and affects everything that came before.

That being said, the ending to "Inception" is a clever and wholly consistent ending while the one to ME3? Not quite so much. So while a part of me dislikes the idea of Bioware rewriting an ending--and essentially most of a game's point--simply to please fans; another part of me is a somewhat displeased fan who would like a better ending.

Your second argument would be more valid if the ending of ME3 were actually consistant with the rest of the ME story. It's not. It does not follow from anything else in the rest of the series. It's completely disconnected, and replacing it with something that actually flows from the rest of the story would in no way harm either the rest of the story or their reputation.

[daecath]

Subject M wrote...

Ingvarr Stormbird wrote...

Suggest BW makes a project on Kickstarter?

If they actually listen to the fans and stay true to the story and thematics of ME1-ME2, at least nothing bad can come out of it.

It's a possibility. One that both sides would have to tread carefully into. Like making a paid DLC, it sets a potentially bad precedent saying that game companies can make extra money by screwing up and then having us pay them to fix it. We look like suckers for throwing good money after bad, they look like greedy b***ards for not fixing their own mistakes.

On the other hand, if handled well, it could be a win for both sides. It shows that BioWare actually listens to their fans on what we really want, and is willing to engage with the community. And it shows that a community is willing to support a game developer who respects them.

Of course, I seriously doubt it will happen. Too much bad blood on the part of the fans, too much risk of losing face on BioWare's part.

[Enigma457]

i dont understand it either im not trying to be a 12 year old fan boy but i want a better ending where shepard lives...where he/she is reunited with LI not some crappy breath then credits that some bull**** right there

[Keldon Northwind]

nhcre8tv1 wrote...

The RPGenius wrote...

It would set the dangerous precedent of giving the consumer a product he or she doesn't hate.

It sets a bad precident for other things if this were to happen again. People would be all like "WELL MASS EFFECT DID IT Y U NO U GUYS" and it gives a message out that all writers and studios can be pushed around, look at how we destroyed the Fallout 3 argument, when in reality it was the devs who changed it because THEY didn't like it, not because of the fan outcry, but that doesn't matter here, does it? No matter how you think of this, that WILL happen, and all writers would lose credibility.

Any game developer worth his salt will NEVER do what BioWare did and claim "artistic integrity". The two clowns who wrote the ending should never have done so to begin with.

Speaking of Fallout 3, when they fixed the ending the DLC was lauded as one of the greatest made for Fallout. I wouldn't say we, the fans, destroyed the argument. The ending didn't make any sense and we told them as much. Much like ME3's. Bethesda, however, listened and fixed it. Fixed it properly instead of just "adding closure" in the form of slides and text.

The Mad Hanar wrote...

You guys are demanding it.

Because the current ending is BS and makes zero sense.

They take pride in their work.

That's fine. The rest of the game was pretty bad ass up until the last 15 minutes.

It would cost a lot of money to do.

Then perhaps they should've done it right from the very start. Then we wouldn't be having this discussion.

It would set a precedent in the video game world.

I sure hope so. Creating an epic story just to end it with MORE questions when they promised closure for ALL characters is NOT the way to go. It would appear that whatever happened in the last few weeks of finishing up ME3, everyone suddenly had a massive brain-fart and decided that ignoring all your choices you've made during the previous games count for absolutely F all. Any game company worth their salt would NEVER do anything like this. It's like signing your own death warrant. BioWare has just done that.

It would be an insult to the writers.

The writers are a bunch of hacks. The ending is atrociously written and should never have seen the light of day. It's that simple.

It would take away resources from other things.

Multiplayer? Yeah, wouldn't miss that...

If I come across as angry, I apologise.

Modifié par Keldon Northwind, 08 mai 2012 - 10:53 .

[daecath]

I'm wondering if they aren't changing it because they don't know how to fix it. Maybe they got to the end and didn't have a clue where to go with it. I firmly believe that they had this clever plan to show Shepard being indoctrinated. There is simply too much that only makes sense if that was where they were going. However, they got to a point and couldn't do anything with it, so they changed what they had to make it literal, and we ended up with this. And they still don't have a clue what to do, so they are sticking to what they have. Maybe they aren't going to make anything better because they simply can't. And if they can, I dare them to prove it.

[Gruntburner]

Doing so would be a logistical nightmare and would cost a lot of resources of something that would never pay off. To be honest too many people have said that they have lost trust in Bioware to make any effort worth it, because ME3 will always be remembered as "That game with the terrible ending." No DLC will change that view in the eyes of the fanbase. Lastly there is the group who actually like the ending (BLASPHEMY!!!) or merely tolerate it (I am in that group) who believe that outright changing the ending is wrong.

[daecath]

The Mad Hanar wrote...
You guys are demanding it.

Yes, heaven forbid that a company give their customers what they want.

The Mad Hanar wrote...
They take pride in their work.

So? Parents take pride in the scribbles of their kids all the time. Doesn't mean that they deserve to hang in a museum somewhere.

The Mad Hanar wrote...
It would cost a lot of money to do.

So? It's their mess, they should clean it up.

The Mad Hanar wrote...
It would set a precedent in the video game world.

Yeah, it's not like any video game has ever made significant changes based on fan feedback before. Well, unless you count Fallout 3. Or the Witcher 2. Or anytime a patch is released to fix a bug that the fans discover. Simply consider the ending as just another bug to be fixed.

The Mad Hanar wrote...
It would be an insult to the writers.

As opposed to the insult that the ending was to the players? 
"No ABC ending..." well, unless you decide to label the three choices as ABC. "Wildly different endings based on your decisions..." except that the endings are exactly the same and your decisions have no impact on them whatsoever.

Then there's the fact that the premise of the ending goes against all the rest of the story. "The created will always turn against their creators," except the geth who were defending themselves, the presidium AI that was defending itself (sort of), the Luna VI that was screwed up by an experiment and eventually became EDI, the rogue VI factory that got a virus... wait, were any of these willful decisions to turn on their creators? No? Then where the **** did starbrat get his information, because it wasn't from this game.

Not to mention all the space magic - TIM developing a power to control Anderson and Shepard that not even the reapers had; destroy energy that is smart enough to spare biotics, quarians, and toasters, but not Shepard, EDI, or the geth; synthesis ending that introduces a concept of machines somehow having dna, and a wave of energy that can make complex alterations to dna to make it a hybridized form, as well as generating complex matter such as circuitry and organic tissue.

I'm paying their salaries, not the other way around, so if one of us should be insulted, it's them.

The Mad Hanar wrote...
It would take away resources from other things.

Sso instead of holding them accountable for fixing their screwup, and providing the experience that we paid for, that they promised; they should go on to make even more money. "I'm sorry that there was a hair in your soup, but the chef is too busy making food for the rest of the resteraunt, so you'll just have to eat it."

[Xx_Belzak_xX]

Even a 'senile hanar' would know the endings are atrocious. For a team of 'professional writers' the endings were anything but. I could have crapped out a better ending, and I'm just an amateur writer. No, they don't have to make a new ending, but if they actually had any "artistic integrity", they would make a new ending, or at least acknowledging their error (instead of blowing their fans off as they have for the past couple months.). I don't know any other 'professionals' that would approve that rubbish. Stephanie Meyer doesn't count either. She'd like anything with sparkles or pretty colors.

Modifié par Xx_Belzak_xX, 08 mai 2012 - 11:08 .

[Keldon Northwind]

The Mad Hanar wrote...

@ Kelden Northwind, the writers are hacks? Yet the games were badass except for the last fifteen minutes? It seems like you don't understand why the games were badass.

By resources to other things I meant DLC for both the SP and the MP.

The two people who wrote the ending is who I'm referring to. The rest of the game is quite enjoyable.

Resourcers for MP or SP should be put on hold until the ending gets a complete makeover. Star brat needs to go. You simply do not put a toon in you've heard nothing about in two games previously who then has outrageous claims and forces you into three choices that are as outrages as the very notion of putting star brat in the game to begin with.

[eddieoctane]

The Mad Hanar wrote...

You guys are demanding it.

They take pride in their work.

It would cost a lot of money to do.

It would set a precedent in the video game world.

It would be an insult to the writers.

It would take away resources from other things.

Also, it would take all power away from devs. They'd have to ask fans permission to do anything.

Well, we are demanding it,

but pride is a sin,

and the prcendent was set more than a century ago.

The writers insulted the fans intelligence repeatedly,

and reources were taken from the SP campaign to tack on an MP no one was asking for.

And the devs gave the ME players power that they suddenly took away. No one likes an indian giver.