278 réponses à ce sujet

[J0HNL3I]

after thessia

[Chinirojo]

grimlock122 wrote...

 when shep went up the elevator to that glowing winey brat

[guybrush threepwad]

The very beginning I thought was terribly written, the worst piece of content I'd ever experienced from Bioware at the time. Everyone was an idiot for some reason, terrible dialogue, also introduced to the very disappointing auto-dialogue and lack of conversation options. That meeting or whatever it was we went to felt like a South Park parody, with Randy Marsh as the panicking guy in charge. The reapers attack strategy made little sense and the game keeps telling you saving Earth is so important and I can't help but wonder why. Like later in the game when you first meet the council you talk about getting a fleet to rescue Earth, and then you tell them about the super weapon. So which is it, get the fleets together to rescue Earth or make the super weapon and rescue everyone?

And back to the beginning, after the prologue we get to Mars and discover the deus ex machina never hinted at before in the 2 prior games crucible device. And I can't help but wonder why. Why the hell would you purposely build this game around such an amateur plot device. This had to be a conscious choice and not an accident.

Tuchanka and Rannoch were very good and inspired some hope for the rest of the game and helped me forget about the bad start but it just crashed and burned.

[Peregrin25]

The Birdman wrote...

I would have to go with the Citadel Coup. It wasn't really necessary and nothing was really accomplished story-wise. The whole mission was probably just as excuse to kill off Udina.

Not to mention a means of introducing Kai Leng a character that could have stayed in the novels and out of the game. I think his character was kind of lacking and not very interesting. BioWare could have done better!

[nitefyre410]

Peregrin25 wrote...

The Birdman wrote...

I would have to go with the Citadel Coup. It wasn't really necessary and nothing was really accomplished story-wise. The whole mission was probably just as excuse to kill off Udina.

Not to mention a means of introducing Kai Leng a character that could have stayed in the novels and out of the game. I think his character was kind of lacking and not very interesting. BioWare could have done better!

  

You can introduce a charater like him but you have to give him some kind of exposition  from the begining of the game.  They did  do this and compounded by the fact that he was poorly written on top of that... just makes it worsts.  

This game needed to be at least 60 hours not 30...

[Linksys17]

The menu that asks if I want to play Mass Effect 3 as a RPG .-.

[Peregrin25]

nitefyre410 wrote...

Peregrin25 wrote...

The Birdman wrote...

I would have to go with the Citadel Coup. It wasn't really necessary and nothing was really accomplished story-wise. The whole mission was probably just as excuse to kill off Udina.

Not to mention a means of introducing Kai Leng a character that could have stayed in the novels and out of the game. I think his character was kind of lacking and not very interesting. BioWare could have done better!

  

You can introduce a charater like him but you have to give him some kind of exposition  from the begining of the game.  They did  do this and compounded by the fact that he was poorly written on top of that... just makes it worsts.  

This game needed to be at least 60 hours not 30...

I agree, the scale of the story involved does need more play time. I mean for real, you are fighting the fight to save the entire galaxy. The story already hade a rich plot and setting. There was so much more that could have been done. Things that would have made the game more intense and dramatic. I do kind of blame the multiplayer for that though. Well it's partly to blame.

[Breakdown Boy]

IanPolaris wrote...

You know how many time Shepard has to use his heavy weapons to defeat Donnovan Hock?

ZERO.

Once the shields go down, about 3-4 shots from a good sniper rifle will do the job.  There is no reason to think it shouldn't have worked against Kai Leng's gunship as well.

As for the sunglare, that was OVERT PLOT ARMOR.  An inflitrator in particular can (and does) take out targets in glare or smoke.  Stop excusing the inexcusable.

-Polaris

Edit PS:  If you want the fact that Shepard can fail to have meaning, then Shepard (and you) should actually fail.  You don't fail at Thessia.  The entire thing feels like a bad DM pulling a cheap plot stunt to keep his plot going the way it could.  There are many ways that Shepard could have failed an unwinnable situation that still felt like losing (see Virmire) but this definately wasn't it.  The only thing I felt was cheated after Thessia.

That's assuming the gunship at Thessia did not have shields, also take into account your possition which is under fire with you having no where to go. Also with Hock you were facing Ecplise mercs, not a super assassin with reaper upgrades.

Shep was caught in a bad position and got owned, it happens. Sure maybe there is better ways of doing it, but I can't see how this could 'ruin' your experience.

Like I said (which you missed), this was probably the most realistic scene with a gunship, in real life small arms fire does not take down an armoured gunships.

What happens is this: You're in a battle, you busy winning, then KL changes the game by blowing the collums.

But why don't you write a fanfic about this part of the game (where you come up with one of your many different ways of this going down differently) and then send me a link.

Modifié par Breakdown Boy, 08 mai 2012 - 12:03 .

[shodiswe]

AntonioA9011 wrote...

The Birdman wrote...

I would have to go with the Citadel Coup. It wasn't really necessary and nothing was really accomplished story-wise. The whole mission was probably just as excuse to kill off Udina.

Exactly. You would think after the Geth and Saren rolled up in the Citadel and took **** over, they would have spent more money on their defense systems. It certainly seemed that way in ME2. Actually, the Citadel in ME2 seemed impregnable. But, alas, like the rest of ME2, ME3 just 'pretended it didn't happen'.

Defences are pointless if you got traitors on the inside... corrupt or indoctrinated C-sec officers and even a councilor... Seriously Udian could just have given Cerberus free access and no customs checks. Then they rushed into the C-sec offices, shut down all security comms and systems, even took over some of the C-sec security systems.

It would take a while for C-sec to respond with no comms and lot's of locked security doors and elevators.

It's not that hard to immagine, transports that are cleared by a councilor and approvedwithout a security sweep.. Traitors on the inside of C-sec. Before anyone knows whats goign on Cerberus troops are rushing the offices and gunning down unarmored C-sec officers all while traitors within C-sec lines up shot towards the back of their co-workers heads.

Why? The reapers probably planted a notion that the humanity hostile council had to die and The Illusive man took the bait.. He's just their puppet.

And Cerberus being hostile on mars? nothing strange there, shepard quit cerberus when s/he handed him/herself over to the alliance along with the Normandy. Noone quits Cerberus, if youre no longer of any use then you are killed or killed or if the illusive man likes you, turned into a mindless assault trooper I guess..

The assault on earth, retake earth mission is where it really started to go down hill, it wasnt that bad but it didn't feel quite as "epic" as I thought it would, maybe I had too hyped expectations about it... Anyway, the mission needed some more polish and a lot of the war assets you recruit never show up before or after the end. However that wasn't enough to get me chocked... What got me chocked was the endign with the catalyst... That conversation made no sense and considering how much I wanted a proper showdown with the reapers it dissapointed me... No boss fight... well I could buy that if the conversation options are epic and satisfying... However most of the conversation was the catalyst telling shepard what s/he could do. so no epic show down was provided.. Shepard getting badly wounded by Harbinger... well..  Iguess that was an atempt to show shepards incredible resolve and strength that allowed shepard to get to the beam. so yes... the ultimate test of determination... maybe... However..  I never got a proper showdown with the reapers... and even if shepard can't do mcuh abotu the reapers besides picking the provided options I really think shepard shoudl have been given the option of telling the reapers what every sentient for the last few million years would have loved to tell them to their face...

Also the information given about the different options seems lacking, not that I think anyone should trust a reaper... Which is also a design problem imo.. Shepard seems to trust that thing.. the magic elevator was the steep cliff where the downhill trip ended...

[Dantexr3]

It actually starts going downhill, with the Prologue and Mars. Then it goes up like infinite+1 with Tuchanka and Rannoch. After that, it's all a downhill since Thessia.

[PSUHammer]

AntonioA9011 wrote...

grey_wind wrote...

 Maybe when I realized my entire ME2 squad was being reduced to glorified cameos.

Couldn't agree with you more, man.

Um...Garrus, Tali and even Mordin would like to have a word with you about that!

[PSUHammer]

Peregrin25 wrote...

The Birdman wrote...

I would have to go with the Citadel Coup. It wasn't really necessary and nothing was really accomplished story-wise. The whole mission was probably just as excuse to kill off Udina.

Not to mention a means of introducing Kai Leng a character that could have stayed in the novels and out of the game. I think his character was kind of lacking and not very interesting. BioWare could have done better!

I took it as TIM being indoctrinated and just attempting to create havoc and assume control of tactical locations (Omega, Citadel, etc.).  If they could control the Citadel, they would have a great staging point to get refugees to Sanctuary.

[IanPolaris]

Breakdown Boy wrote...

IanPolaris wrote...

You know how many time Shepard has to use his heavy weapons to defeat Donnovan Hock?

ZERO.

Once the shields go down, about 3-4 shots from a good sniper rifle will do the job.  There is no reason to think it shouldn't have worked against Kai Leng's gunship as well.

As for the sunglare, that was OVERT PLOT ARMOR.  An inflitrator in particular can (and does) take out targets in glare or smoke.  Stop excusing the inexcusable.

-Polaris

Edit PS:  If you want the fact that Shepard can fail to have meaning, then Shepard (and you) should actually fail.  You don't fail at Thessia.  The entire thing feels like a bad DM pulling a cheap plot stunt to keep his plot going the way it could.  There are many ways that Shepard could have failed an unwinnable situation that still felt like losing (see Virmire) but this definately wasn't it.  The only thing I felt was cheated after Thessia.

That's assuming the gunship at Thessia did not have shields, also take into account your possition which is under fire with you having no where to go. Also with Hock you were facing Ecplise mercs, not a super assassin with reaper upgrades.

You can blow through shields no problem.  You see this over and over again in the game.  Also K-L just stands out in the open and you can still overload his shields while under fire while under cover...but plot armor BLATENTLY protects him.  If you are going to have combat game play, it needs to be consistant.  Also you faced a COMPANY of Eclipse Mercs and Eclipse Mercs are nothing to sneeze at. 

Shep was caught in a bad position and got owned, it happens. Sure maybe there is better ways of doing it, but I can't see how this could 'ruin' your experience.

BOLLUCKS!  That is pure unadultrated fecal matter.  Shepard was not owned.  Without plot armor, K-L AND his gunship would have easily been pwned under the same situation.  This wasn't a "bad situation".  This was pure contrivance from start ot finish.  In fact I don't even have to go very far to show how it should have been done.  Look at the battle with Saren.  Saren gets away so you "lose", but Saren is a guenuinely difficult opponent with lots of advantages that you don't have but make sense.  In short Saren isn't protected by plot armor until the very end where he 'gets away' but delays you long enough to stop you from saving your whole squad...and he does it with a reasonable plot device (essentially a flash bang grenade).  That battle was epic.  This was just L-A-M-E.

In short Shepard was never owned.  The DM (Bioware) took control of the narrative and kept you from winning and did so in an extremely ham fisted way. Bottom line.  There was no sense of defeat after Thessia.  Only the feeling of being cheated.

Like I said (which you missed), this was probably the most realistic scene with a gunship, in real life small arms fire does not take down an armoured gunships.

Bollucks.  A 0.50 cal military sniper rifle can easily take down a chopper or aircraft.  Ground fire can and has been very dangerous to aircraft including armored gunships.

What happens is this: You're in a battle, you busy winning, then KL changes the game by blowing the collums.

But why don't you write a fanfic about this part of the game (where you come up with one of your many different ways of this going down differently) and then send me a link.

I shouldn't have to do Bioware's job for them.  That was just insulting.

-Polaris

[MattFini]

Plenty of flaws in ME3 along the way, and overall the game isn't what *I* was hoping for in terms of an open-ended final chapter.

For example, my Renegade Shep had no beef with TIM at the end of ME2 so to be forced into turning against him kinda ruined the experience for me.

But ... I still thought ME3 was a very fun game, warts and all. As problematic as it is at times there has never been a more emotional experience for me in gaming. For me, I dig the entire game right up until the moment Priority: Earth starts.

From there it just feels slapped together. P:E feels empty, and I'm not talking about in an eerie way. I just feels incomplete, like the writers never finished making this segment interesting. It pales in comparison to the excellent Suicide Mission, but also to every other mission in ME3.

And that's why I really hope BioWare will change their mind and cook up a post-game DLC. Or an expansion pack. ME3 deserves an epic conclusion. We don't have one as of yet.

[Mythosaeon]

ME3 was different right from the get go. Had the ending not be so painful those differences might not have been so poignant. Bioware has progressively been moving away from making action RPG games to producing interactive RPG-ish cinematics. From the very opening drawn out escape from earth to the pointless robot chase scene on Mars the gameplay felt like a single track theme park. Much the story and content was very enjoyable along the way - but that railroad feeling persisted throughout the game, getting worse as the player reached the trainwreck of an ending.

Modifié par Mythosaeon, 08 mai 2012 - 12:25 .

[nitefyre410]

Peregrin25 wrote...

nitefyre410 wrote...

Peregrin25 wrote...

The Birdman wrote...

I would have to go with the Citadel Coup. It wasn't really necessary and nothing was really accomplished story-wise. The whole mission was probably just as excuse to kill off Udina.

Not to mention a means of introducing Kai Leng a character that could have stayed in the novels and out of the game. I think his character was kind of lacking and not very interesting. BioWare could have done better!

  

You can introduce a charater like him but you have to give him some kind of exposition  from the begining of the game.  They did  do this and compounded by the fact that he was poorly written on top of that... just makes it worsts.  

This game needed to be at least 60 hours not 30...

I agree, the scale of the story involved does need more play time. I mean for real, you are fighting the fight to save the entire galaxy. The story already hade a rich plot and setting. There was so much more that could have been done. Things that would have made the game more intense and dramatic. I do kind of blame the multiplayer for that though. Well it's partly to blame.

  


I would like to blame multiplayer for but there was another game series that introduce multiplayer in a very story centric game setting and that was Assassins Creed.    They  introduced multplayer flawlessly nothing suffered because of it, it was not forced on the player at all. It just added to the whole experience.   The Co-op has a peferct home considering there is a demand for it. Bioware screwed up with the EMS and Galactic Readiness trying to make people play multiplayer.    Multiplayer is always an added feature - new mode for funs and I have never seen a  game that tied it to the single play the way Mass Effect 3 - when they announced the Galactic Readiness  - I knew they are making a big ole mistake. 

Yes,   I agree this game could have been longer  and that has been one of my biggest complaints about all 3 games they all felt short like  Bioware  was trying to cram a 60 hours   worth of plot into 30 hours of gameplay.  I was expecting to go to the Prothean home world, a race against  Cerberus to figure the nature of the Crucible and the Catalyst...it all just felt lacking... .very lacking. 

[Knottedredloc]

Interactive Civilian wrote...

The game began going downhill at the start of ME2 when the good, tight, intriguing narrative of ME1 was given up for cliches, "rule of cool", and other such tropes.

ME3 is more of a sequel to ME2 than it is to ME1, so it continues on that downslope.

This isn't to say they aren't enjoyable games. They are great fun to play and they have a lot of great moments and great characters. The hundreds of hours I've sunk into ME2 speak for that. They just don't live up to the potential of story-telling greatness started in ME1. IMNSHO.

I agree with everything you said here.  My feelings exactly....

[PSUHammer]

IanPolaris wrote...

Breakdown Boy wrote...

Like I said (which you missed), this was probably the most realistic scene with a gunship, in real life small arms fire does not take down an armoured gunships.

Bollucks.  A 0.50 cal military sniper rifle can easily take down a chopper or aircraft.  Ground fire can and has been very dangerous to aircraft including armored gunships.

-Polaris

Not to mention you can easily take out multiple similar gunships in ME2 (Archangle quest and Samara's quest).  This didn't bother me as much as I understand that Bioware was trying to tell a story and they wanted these situations to end the way they did to advance the narrative.  Some people will hate it, others aren't bothered by it.

I tend to not get hung up on little things like this.

[nitefyre410]

Knottedredloc wrote...

Interactive Civilian wrote...

The game began going downhill at the start of ME2 when the good, tight, intriguing narrative of ME1 was given up for cliches, "rule of cool", and other such tropes.

ME3 is more of a sequel to ME2 than it is to ME1, so it continues on that downslope.

This isn't to say they aren't enjoyable games. They are great fun to play and they have a lot of great moments and great characters. The hundreds of hours I've sunk into ME2 speak for that. They just don't live up to the potential of story-telling greatness started in ME1. IMNSHO.

I agree with everything you said here.  My feelings exactly....

 


Everything  has Tropes ...its all about how they are used... 

Even ME 1 uses Tropes... there is nothing wrong with Rule of Cool... its how its used. 

Modifié par nitefyre410, 08 mai 2012 - 12:30 .

[PSUHammer]

Lyme Eilserv wrote...

Downhill? Thessia, I think. That's when some of the magic was lost. Things got progressively worse with Cerberus and especially Priority:Earth.

Seems everyone loves Tuchanka and Rannoch and I can't help but agree. The only thing missing from Rannoch was the Quarian unveiling. That could have been so amazing, Quarians stepping out of their ships and removing their helmets. That would be even more emotionally powerful if Tali was your LI.

But from the very beginning of the game was I disappointed by not having access to the companions from ME2. You went through hell with them and hijacked the Cerberus Normandy. At least some of them should remain with you out of sheer loyalty. I would much rather have started ME3 as an outlaw with my old crew and go from there. And yes, it would have been perfectly doable even if you hadn't played the previous games.

I know a number of people felt this way, regarding the ME2 squad (well, some of them as Garrus, Tali, Edi, and....to a smaller degree Mordin, play a large role in ME3), but, I thought Bioware did a good job of explaining where/what they went.  Zaheed is a merc and was a gun for hire...of course he would move on to the next contract.  Others had their own motivations and pull (Jack, Jacob, etc.) while some did come back (Garrus, Tali).

[Breakdown Boy]

IanPolaris wrote...



Bollucks.  A 0.50 cal military sniper rifle can easily take down a chopper or aircraft.  Ground fire can and has been very dangerous to aircraft including armored gunships.

Oh, maybe you should read the wiki for the Mil Mi-24 Russian attack helicopter which has been in operation since the early 70's.

Here is an extract

"The body is heavily armored and can resist impacts from .50 caliber (12.7 mm) rounds from all angles, including the titanium rotor blades.[citation needed] The cockpit is protected by ballistic-resistant windscreens and a titanium-armored tub.[7] The cockpit and crew compartment are overpressurized to protect the crew in NBC conditions."

The only effective way to take down one of these is a stinger missle (even then do you have follow a certain angle of attack), hence the delivery of said missle launchers to the Afghanistan forces during the soviet invasion of Afghanistan.

[BDelacroix]

I was suspicious when we suddenly heard of the magic cure machine plans on mars. I let it go, though. Then had fun for much of it until we got to the end part where we run off to confront the illusive man. The citadel was just moved, too. That and anything to do with that robot ninja boy was off. I still let it go, though I was let down when no matter what you did in 2, the terminator robot was in the illusive man's lab. I guess I mentioned that already.

So for me, it was obviously going downhill by the time we got to the Chronos station, though in retrospect hints of downward velocity began as early as the opening of the game.