225 réponses à ce sujet

[wickedgoodreed]

I love both characters, but I don't think Traynor has the...moral flexibility required to be a good Shadow Broker. She thinks cracking Turian comm traffic after the missing platoon incident "would be wrong." I can only imagine how she'd react to everything Liara digs up for the Private Messages terminal. xD

That said, if someone had told me back in ME1 that Liara would take a level in badass and become the galaxy's most notorious information broker, I would have laughed the blue off their ass...

[Garlador]

The Cheat wrote...

Noatz wrote...

Liara's network of informants is severely depleted by the time of ME3 due to many of them being dead at the hand of or on the run from the Reapers. Even in the heydey of the Shadow Broker it could never get any really concrete intel on Cerberus either; they're extremely quick to contact Shepard in ME1 when he/she comes across some Cerberus research data. The only way you find Cerberus in ME3 is by tracking Kai Leng right after you encounter him on Thessia. Ragging on Liara for not being able to find them is stupid since the SB has never been able to do that even when its network has been at maximum efficacy.

Well if you look at it that way, then the SB's profile is contradicted in this manner between ME and ME2, since the SB apparently has access to how many cigarettes TIM smokes in a day.

Beat me to it. The former SB knew how many cigs TIM smoked, as well as who, when, and where he was bedding interstellar beauties on a daily basis. The former SB knew TIM's buying habits right on down to his sex life.

Liara has zero idea about any Cerberus activites whatsoever.

As a character, I have no preference, one or the other, but as an information broker? Liara came up short. Even her initial act of finding plans for the Crucible could've been accomplished with her prior, archeologist job...

[BigEvil]

Makrys wrote...

Another Liara hate thread? Seriously? Whatever. People always pick on whoever's on top.

It's strange, most of my Shepard's seem to like it when Liara's on top.

[Dendio1]

Traynors ONLY lines were when she found something to move the plot along. Liara had tons of dialogue unrelated to the missions. The devs decided to give traynore some love instead of overly relying on the shadow brokers skills

If they just had Liara find everything this thread would be complaining about that.

Modifié par Dendio1, 08 mai 2012 - 05:47 .

[cbqueue]

BigEvil wrote...

Makrys wrote...

Another Liara hate thread? Seriously? Whatever. People always pick on whoever's on top.

It's strange, most of my Shepard's seem to like it when Liara's on top.

i see what you did there 

but any who, root of the problem, poor writing. In ME3 , it would seem Traynor out performed Liara , ME2 Liara was cold and calculating and had a LOT of intel. so i say information gathering battle off!!!

[Dendio1]

cbqueue wrote...

BigEvil wrote...

Makrys wrote...

Another Liara hate thread? Seriously? Whatever. People always pick on whoever's on top.

It's strange, most of my Shepard's seem to like it when Liara's on top.

i see what you did there 

but any who, root of the problem, poor writing. In ME3 , it would seem Traynor out performed Liara , ME2 Liara was cold and calculating and had a LOT of intel. so i say information gathering battle off!!!

No. Poor writing would be making the shadow broker find everything, leaving traynor with next to zero lines.

The shadow broker already provides you with information about every mission, important individuals and finds the central goal in the crucible.

Stop nit picking. Its better to have traynor be relevant rather than have Liara do everything.

Edit: add my shepard to the list of those who like Liara on top

Modifié par Dendio1, 08 mai 2012 - 05:50 .

[Lookout1390]

Needs more lesbian sandwiches with femShep/Liara/Traynor

[Dendio1]

I wanted traynor for my male shep. Why the hate. We can be friends with benefits Traynor...you know like jack in me2

[Eain]

I love that super redundant wall with 50 monitors on it too. It does nothing, ever. Liara's just wasting her time standing around in that ****** chamber of hers while Traynor saves the galaxy with a single 14 inch holomonitor and a cup of coffee.

Poor girl doesn't even get a chair, whereas Liara has a bunch aswell as a two person bed. Talk about unfair. If I were Traynor I'd be kicking a massive ruckuss. Living out of a shoebox? Lol. Take a lift downstairs, woman, and look at what Liara's keeping from you.

Modifié par Eain, 08 mai 2012 - 05:57 .

[legion999]

Robhuzz wrote...

legion999 wrote...

Shepard: "So who told you about the females Wrex?"
Wrex: "Not Liara."

Yeah despite having such a wide info network Liara didn't seem to know alot. The beacon on Thessia comes to mind.

People don't generally respond well to certain all powerfull and all knowing characters in a series. Especially when the series isn't totally about said character and there are others as well.

Liara is my personal favorite character and LI but I'm glad they didn't up her mary sue factor by having her have all the answers to all the problems Shepard faced. It's good there were a few things she couldn't help with.

And yeah sure let Samantha become the new Shadow Broker. Shepard will be taking Liara on a very very long vacation after ME3 anyway, she won't have time for shadow brokery... things

She should of had some info aside from the Crucible. I agree that Liara finding everything wouldn't work but I do still think she should have given some more info/missions.

[l_dambrun]

No. Because Liara has discovered the crucible. Only way to stop the reapers. she doesn't have time to do anything else but to work on that project. Hopefully specialist Traynor can be usefull by tracking signals.

[Lookout1390]

Eain wrote...

I love that super redundant wall with 50 monitors on it too. It does nothing, ever. Liara's just wasting her time standing around in that ****** chamber of hers while Traynor saves the galaxy with a single 14 inch holomonitor and a cup of coffee.

Poor girl doesn't even get a chair, whereas Liara has a bunch aswell as a two person bed. Talk about unfair. If I were Traynor I'd be kicking a massive ruckuss. Living out of a shoebox? Lol. Take a lift downstairs, woman, and look at what Liara's keeping from you.

I gave her access to my shower, if she asked, I'd give her access to my bed too


edit: I mean for when she isn't having sex with my femshep, that is.

Modifié par Lookout1390, 08 mai 2012 - 06:02 .

[cbqueue]

 

Dendio1 wrote...

No. Poor writing would be making the shadow broker find everything, leaving traynor with next to zero lines.

The shadow broker already provides you with information about every mission, important individuals and finds the central goal in the crucible.

Stop nit picking. Its better to have traynor be relevant rather than have Liara do everything.

Edit: add my shepard to the list of those who like Liara on top

I get that but as the SB I expected Liara to intel that was more useful. her big find was the crucible and its purpose which as someone mention before she probably could have done with just her prothean studies alone.

The info that stems from every mission from just a quick look over, I admit i didnt read through them throughly, are just intercepted emails that I felt didnt really do much for me. but then again if Liara does it all what does Traynor do? Poor writing because  they added a character and then realized they had nothing for her to do. Although I will say it was a stroke of genius making her title comm specialist, because all her big finds if im not mistaken were based of communication intercepts and working magic on those, That lets her shine as a comm specialist and Liara can still be a good SB by getting random obscure data that no one would know otherwise.

Modifié par cbqueue, 08 mai 2012 - 06:14 .

[jeweledleah]

actually - Traynor would make a fantastic Shadow broker agent. being shadow broker is not just about acquiring information, its also about coordinating. and Sam could possibly learn to do that very well also, but I think Sam and Liara team would be best. they have complementary strengths IMO.

[incinerator950]

I'd rather have Kelly. She could have been written to just as easily use lost Cerberus Channels to find the information, just like how Traynor randomly pulled information from her ass when EDI did a lot of the work.

[EricHVela]

There's a comic in the LOLz thread that states the OP perfectly.

As for who else should be TSB? I prefer Traynor as she is. Last thing I want is her to be targeted by others.

In her position, nobody suspects her. Nobody except certain folks know from where Shepard's best intel comes. Even Anderson and Hackett are unaware. (At least, I don't recall a situation where Shepard admits that Traynor is the one that saves Kahlee or gives any key intel.)

[Storm258]

Pfwah, Liara IS the new Shadow Broker and it's good like that. Besides, her ressources on the Normandy are limited and she uses most of them for research on the Cruicible. Sure they could have let her discover the position of the Cerberus base, but then poor Traynor would have had no point at all.

[Garlador]

ReggarBlane wrote...

There's a comic in the LOLz thread that states the OP perfectly.

As for who else should be TSB? I prefer Traynor as she is. Last thing I want is her to be targeted by others.

In her position, nobody suspects her. Nobody except certain folks know from where Shepard's best intel comes. Even Anderson and Hackett are unaware. (At least, I don't recall a situation where Shepard admits that Traynor is the one that saves Kahlee or gives any key intel.)

Liara can help you find your socks. See, she IS useful!

I get that A) people didn't want Liara to discover everything (she's already accused of being the writer's pet and a Mary Sue) and  they wanted Samantha to have something to do...

However...

A) Liara's JOB is to discover everything. That's entirely the point of being the Shadow Broker. They could have had a great story with Liara struggling with that job and its time requirements, versus what she desires to do and her desires to be with Shepard. Instead of being a "career woman", her job as the Shadow Broker becomes so insanely non-important, I legitimately wonder why she ever became one at all. You could erase her Shadow Broker sub-plot entirely, keep her as a Prothean expert, and the story would NOT HAVE CHANGED! That's really bad writing if something that big does not impact her or others in any substantiial way.

Samantha was, let's face it, written as an affirmative action gay character due to protests and requests for same-sex relationships. That's the only reason Kelly got snubbed with a cameo. That being said, they handled her insanely well... arguably TOO well. Out of every new character in the game, she's the only one that ever really goes out of her way to willingly spend time with Shepard as a friend, regardless of whether you want to sleep with her or not. She's friendly, smart, resourceful, clever, and she moves the plot along more than nearly any other character in the game. If Samantha had been in ME1 and was this good from the get-go, NOBODY would prefer Liara to her, personality-wise or job-wise. Samantha can not only get the job done, get the intel you need, but she still manages to find the time to build a believable friendship/romance with you in the THIRD ACT of a trilogy.

Props to Bioware for making Samantha a great character when it could have gone downhill with her very, very easily... but, maybe it's a necessary evil, Liara just doesn't look as good by comparison. Especially when you consider how much dialogue and cutscenes Liara gets and how little most of it matters.

[Kunari801]

The story made Liara a bad Shadow Broker. I like both Samantha and Liara

[Garlador]

Storm258 wrote...

Pfwah, Liara IS the new Shadow Broker and it's good like that. Besides, her ressources on the Normandy are limited and she uses most of them for research on the Cruicible. Sure they could have let her discover the position of the Cerberus base, but then poor Traynor would have had no point at all.

Samantha has even less resources and she found Cerberus anyway. And instead of Samantha having no point at all, poor Liara instead has no point at all.

[Storm258]

Garlador wrote...
Samantha has even less resources and she found Cerberus anyway. And instead of Samantha having no point at all, poor Liara instead has no point at all.

You know nothing about Samantha's resources. And Liara, no point?

[pseudonymic]

yet somehow, liara is involved with every turn of main events through the whole series...

[KotorEffect3]

Oh look the Liara haters are jealous that their chosen LI isn't as cool as she is.

[Garlador]

KotorEffect3 wrote...

Oh look the Liara haters are jealous that their chosen LI isn't as cool as she is.

Liara hater? Liara WAS my LI and I STILL don't know why she sucks as the Shadow Broker.

Storm258 wrote...

Garlador wrote...
Samantha has even less resources and she found Cerberus anyway. And instead of Samantha having no point at all, poor Liara instead has no point at all.

You know nothing about Samantha's resources. And Liara, no point?

No point as the SHADOW BROKER.

By all means, she's an excellent Prothean expert and her singularity is the sole reason she's in my squad...

... but what's the point of her being the Shadow Broker if she never does a single damn thing with that position that in no way whatsoever affects the story? Once again, her finding the Crucible could have easily been accomplished by her Prothean studies alone.

Modifié par Garlador, 08 mai 2012 - 07:30 .

[rubynorman]

Read the terminal and listen to Glyph please.