616 réponses à ce sujet

[Anacronian Stryx]

UltimateTobi wrote...

I enjoyed the video. I love how you gathered every bit of information.

I might add, which adds to IT: how the hell did TIM get onto the Citadel? Theoretically, he must've sneaked after Shepard, Anderson and the rest of the forces, or he must've been already on the Citadel. Honestly, both doesn't make sense to me. So, TIM being there adds to the IT. He could've never been there, except it's a struggle in Shep's mind.

He could have been on the citadel before the reapers captured it after all he's not on his base when shep is there.

[CavScout]

Refara wrote...

This may have been mentioned earlier, but I noticed this replaying the opening part of ME3 to test out some textures, and noticed something. If the boy isn't real, why did they wait for him to get inside the shuttle before leaving, they could have left way earlier if he wasn't really there.

Kinda disheartening for me, since I really, REALLY like the IT.

Any suggestions on how the IT could counter argue this, I'm afraid I don't know the specifics on indoctrination so I don't know how to explain it.

Fortunately for those who believe in Indoctrination Theory, nothing can actually disprove Indoctrination Theory. Anything that could is just called part of Indoctrination Theory.

[balance5050]

 

[Ownaholic]

CavScout wrote...

Refara wrote...

This may have been mentioned earlier, but I noticed this replaying the opening part of ME3 to test out some textures, and noticed something. If the boy isn't real, why did they wait for him to get inside the shuttle before leaving, they could have left way earlier if he wasn't really there.

Kinda disheartening for me, since I really, REALLY like the IT.

Any suggestions on how the IT could counter argue this, I'm afraid I don't know the specifics on indoctrination so I don't know how to explain it.

Fortunately for those who believe in Indoctrination Theory, nothing can actually disprove Indoctrination Theory. Anything that could is just called part of Indoctrination Theory.

Not true. I've talked about this before; and I think I may have even responded to that post already to be honest. But I'll do it again because I can't remember.

Basically, if you watch, the solder is helping a person on-board before the boy even gets in. Then the Reaper lands. Then the three soldiers outside are shooting at it while all of the passengers in the shuttle are being secured. The boy crawls inside (not helped by the soldier, who just helped an adult aboard), then doesn't sit or get strapped in or anything (When the adults were).
If you look, it appears as though one of the soldiers looks back at the shuttle, almost in a motion to say "go", or something along those lines. It's very brief, but it's there. The shuttle looked to be waiting for the soldiers fighting the reapers, and a last split-second decision was made for those three soldiers to stay and fight.

[Jere85]

Very nice vid

[Aaleel]

Hmm I'm sorry to have to do this but, there's a huge flaw with this entire thing.

1) You went into great detail about how Shepard's armor changing is proof of dreaming and the IT, you debunked the idea that the armor could be burned. How Bioware wouldn't be this lazy about the armor.

2) Then you went into great detail about how Shepard could not have survived the Crucible and Citadel exploding, and how he/she had to be dreaming on Earth, and showed in great detail how Shepard was buried in London Rubble and has survived.

If all of this is true then why does Shepard still have on the WRONG armor. If all of this were true Shepard would have woken up in the armor he/she had on when they ran down the hill. So if wrong armor=dreaming, then Shepard woke up in his/her own mind which makes no sense. If it's reality back on Earth like you said, then the whole premise turns in on itself because the armor wouldn't still be the same.

Modifié par Aaleel, 11 mai 2012 - 12:43 .

[balance5050]

Aaleel wrote...

Hmm I'm sorry to have to do this but, there's a huge flaw with this entire thing.

1) You went into great detail about how Shepard's armor changing is proof of dreaming and the IT, you debunked the idea that the armor could be burned. How Bioware wouldn't be this lazy about the armor.

2) Then you went into great detail about how Shepard could not have survived the Crucible and Citadel exploding, and how he/she had to be dreaming on Earth, and showed in great detail how Shepard was buried in London Rubble and has survived.

If all of this is true then why does Shepard still have on the WRONG armor. If all of this were true Shepard would have woken up in the armor he/she had on when they ran down the hill. So if wrong armor=dreaming, then Shepard woke up in his/her own mind which makes no sense. If it's reality back on Earth like you said, then the whole premise turns in on itself because the armor wouldn't still be the same.

He is still in an inconclusive dream state when he wakes up because even though there are concrete slabs from Earth, there are geth/reaper cables in that scene as well, so it's still a big bowl of WTF, all we do know is that he is still, in fact, alive in that final scene.

[Aaleel]

balance5050 wrote...

Aaleel wrote...

Hmm I'm sorry to have to do this but, there's a huge flaw with this entire thing.

1) You went into great detail about how Shepard's armor changing is proof of dreaming and the IT, you debunked the idea that the armor could be burned. How Bioware wouldn't be this lazy about the armor.

2) Then you went into great detail about how Shepard could not have survived the Crucible and Citadel exploding, and how he/she had to be dreaming on Earth, and showed in great detail how Shepard was buried in London Rubble and has survived.

If all of this is true then why does Shepard still have on the WRONG armor. If all of this were true Shepard would have woken up in the armor he/she had on when they ran down the hill. So if wrong armor=dreaming, then Shepard woke up in his/her own mind which makes no sense. If it's reality back on Earth like you said, then the whole premise turns in on itself because the armor wouldn't still be the same.

He is still in an inconclusive dream state when he wakes up because even though there are concrete slabs from Earth, there are geth/reaper cables in that scene as well, so it's still a big bowl of WTF, all we do know is that he is still, in fact, alive in that final scene.

No, No.  The creator went into GREAT detail to show that is was London rubble, the overturned Mako, the London style building that you saw while you ran through London (Showed examples).  Based on the Documentary you're back on Earth waking up.

Waking up in your won mind makes no sense, and what proof would you have that Shepard is in fact alive if he/she is still dreaming. And please don't tell me what a booklet or a game file says.  Use what was in the actual game.

[balance5050]

Aaleel wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Aaleel wrote...

Hmm I'm sorry to have to do this but, there's a huge flaw with this entire thing.

1) You went into great detail about how Shepard's armor changing is proof of dreaming and the IT, you debunked the idea that the armor could be burned. How Bioware wouldn't be this lazy about the armor.

2) Then you went into great detail about how Shepard could not have survived the Crucible and Citadel exploding, and how he/she had to be dreaming on Earth, and showed in great detail how Shepard was buried in London Rubble and has survived.

If all of this is true then why does Shepard still have on the WRONG armor. If all of this were true Shepard would have woken up in the armor he/she had on when they ran down the hill. So if wrong armor=dreaming, then Shepard woke up in his/her own mind which makes no sense. If it's reality back on Earth like you said, then the whole premise turns in on itself because the armor wouldn't still be the same.

He is still in an inconclusive dream state when he wakes up because even though there are concrete slabs from Earth, there are geth/reaper cables in that scene as well, so it's still a big bowl of WTF, all we do know is that he is still, in fact, alive in that final scene.

No, No.  The creator went into GREAT detail to show that is was London rubble, the overturned Mako, the London style building that you saw while you ran through London (Showed examples).  Based on the Documentary you're back on Earth waking up.

Waking up in your won mind makes no sense, and what proof would you have that Shepard is in fact alive if he/she is still dreaming. And please don't tell me what a booklet or a game file says.  Use what was in the actual game.

He was knocked out by Hartbinger's beam, he's bound to have some burns.

[shepskisaac]

balance5050 wrote...

He was knocked out by Hartbinger's beam, he's bound to have some burns.

It's the same armor that he has after the beam-blast. The author disproved one of his arguments all by himself, in another argument.

[Ownaholic]

Aaleel wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Aaleel wrote...

Hmm I'm sorry to have to do this but, there's a huge flaw with this entire thing.

1) You went into great detail about how Shepard's armor changing is proof of dreaming and the IT, you debunked the idea that the armor could be burned. How Bioware wouldn't be this lazy about the armor.

2) Then you went into great detail about how Shepard could not have survived the Crucible and Citadel exploding, and how he/she had to be dreaming on Earth, and showed in great detail how Shepard was buried in London Rubble and has survived.

If all of this is true then why does Shepard still have on the WRONG armor. If all of this were true Shepard would have woken up in the armor he/she had on when they ran down the hill. So if wrong armor=dreaming, then Shepard woke up in his/her own mind which makes no sense. If it's reality back on Earth like you said, then the whole premise turns in on itself because the armor wouldn't still be the same.

He is still in an inconclusive dream state when he wakes up because even though there are concrete slabs from Earth, there are geth/reaper cables in that scene as well, so it's still a big bowl of WTF, all we do know is that he is still, in fact, alive in that final scene.

No, No.  The creator went into GREAT detail to show that is was London rubble, the overturned Mako, the London style building that you saw while you ran through London (Showed examples).  Based on the Documentary you're back on Earth waking up.

Waking up in your won mind makes no sense, and what proof would you have that Shepard is in fact alive if he/she is still dreaming. And please don't tell me what a booklet or a game file says.  Use what was in the actual game.

I went into GREAT detail? Please, I made the video; try not to put words in my mouth. It's just childish.
I talked for maybe 5-10 minutes, tops, about the armor segment. It is the weakest argument of the entire theory, and yet you're using it and proclaiming like it is big enough to discount the rest of the evidence in the theory?

Sorry to break it to you, but game files are FROM the game. And the "booklets" are official documents by Bioware. So...I'm not understanding your logic at all.

If you don't like the documentary, that's fine. The reason I made this video from an arbitrary point of view was so people could also not believe in it.
But why waste your time trying to argue a biased opinion with no backing whatsoever? You're just coming off as arrogant and rude.

Furthermore, let me know when you come up with an argument against a strong part of the theory. Not weak tidbits that I barely spent any time on at all.

Modifié par Ownaholic, 11 mai 2012 - 02:08 .

[justafan]

Just finished, great video, keep up the good work.

[MrPuschel]

Everyone should believe what he want to. But my problem with this whole thing is: It gives the signal to Bioware that they can totally **** up everything from now on, people will believe that they're "just clever". And that's just so....wrong.

The video as such is the same as every other video on youtube who trys to convince people. Use music and lots of renders and fancy scenes to pretend professionalism. Also it uses "proofed fact" far, far, FAR to much that i could take it for serious.

[Aaleel]

Ownaholic wrote...

Aaleel wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Aaleel wrote...

Hmm I'm sorry to have to do this but, there's a huge flaw with this entire thing.

1) You went into great detail about how Shepard's armor changing is proof of dreaming and the IT, you debunked the idea that the armor could be burned. How Bioware wouldn't be this lazy about the armor.

2) Then you went into great detail about how Shepard could not have survived the Crucible and Citadel exploding, and how he/she had to be dreaming on Earth, and showed in great detail how Shepard was buried in London Rubble and has survived.

If all of this is true then why does Shepard still have on the WRONG armor. If all of this were true Shepard would have woken up in the armor he/she had on when they ran down the hill. So if wrong armor=dreaming, then Shepard woke up in his/her own mind which makes no sense. If it's reality back on Earth like you said, then the whole premise turns in on itself because the armor wouldn't still be the same.

He is still in an inconclusive dream state when he wakes up because even though there are concrete slabs from Earth, there are geth/reaper cables in that scene as well, so it's still a big bowl of WTF, all we do know is that he is still, in fact, alive in that final scene.

No, No.  The creator went into GREAT detail to show that is was London rubble, the overturned Mako, the London style building that you saw while you ran through London (Showed examples).  Based on the Documentary you're back on Earth waking up.

Waking up in your won mind makes no sense, and what proof would you have that Shepard is in fact alive if he/she is still dreaming. And please don't tell me what a booklet or a game file says.  Use what was in the actual game.

I went into GREAT detail? Please, I made the video; try not to put words in my mouth. It's just childish.
I talked for maybe 5-10 minutes, tops, about the armor segment. It is the weakest argument of the entire theory, and yet you're using it and proclaiming like it is big enough to discount the rest of the evidence in the theory?

Sorry to break it to you, but game files are FROM the game. And the "booklets" are official documents by Bioware. So...I'm not understanding your logic at all.

If you don't like the documentary, that's fine. The reason I made this video from an arbitrary point of view was so people could also not believe in it.
But why waste your time trying to argue a biased opinion with no backing whatsoever? You're just coming off as arrogant and rude.

Furthermore, let me know when you come up with an argument against a strong part of the theory. Not weak tidbits that I barely spent any time on at all.

Wow someone is mad.  Funny you call someone else childish when you're the one throwing around insults.  You shouldn't post vids on a public forum if you're going to be this thinned skin.  Especially if you're going to say stuff like "Suck on that naysayers" in the vid.

I already posted my other problems with the vid, but as long as IT supports can use well it is a dream so it's possible, you can pretty much make up whatever you want and say it's true.

Using game files and booklets not in the actual game or it's lore makes no sense.  It's like having a choice that decides if someone lives or dies, finding out which is which and then arguing one choice is better because it allows the person to live.  It's metagaming, it's external from the game itself.

So explain why Shepard has different armor on waking up on Earth, since you already debated it's not due to laziness on Bioware's part.

Actually forget it.  Since you don't want to have a civil discussion anymore, and you just want to hear positive feedback I just won't waste the time.



 

[balance5050]

Aaleel wrote...

Wow someone is mad.  Funny you call someone else childish when you're the one throwing around insults.  You shouldn't post vids on a public forum if you're going to be this thinned skin.  Especially if you're going to say stuff like "Suck on that naysayers" in the vid.

I already posted my other problems with the vid, but as long as IT supports can use well it is a dream so it's possible, you can pretty much make up whatever you want and say it's true.

Using game files and booklets not in the actual game or it's lore makes no sense.  It's like having a choice that decides if someone lives or dies, finding out which is which and then arguing one choice is better because it allows the person to live.  It's metagaming, it's external from the game itself.

So explain why Shepard has different armor on waking up on Earth, since you already debated it's not due to laziness on Bioware's part.

Actually forget it.  Since you don't want to have a civil discussion anymore, and you just want to hear positive feedback I just won't waste the time.



 

Naysayers always seem so angry. Just because you can't see it like we do is no reason to throw a hissy fit.

Harbinger's beam hit him... so his armor is burned. What's hard to understand about this?

Modifié par balance5050, 11 mai 2012 - 02:31 .

[hoodaticus]

Thorn Harvestar wrote...

IsaacShep wrote...

Fingertrip wrote...
... I take it you didn't take the video with an open-mind. The Armor bits & pieces was pretty much elaboratedly discussed, and not just a no-brainer "yes".

Dude, there are like 15 armors in the game, good luck thinking they were ever going to make burnt version of each armor

I personally give less weight to the items that can be explained away by laziness, but things like the Indoctrinated Eyes design is the opposite of laziness. It's something they had to deliberately do, and they drew attention to it. 

The bleeding wound on Shepard's side is a similar example, in that they deliberately draw your attention to this pretty awful wound that wasn't really even visible prior to shooting Anderson in that same spot.

These are the strange things that give me doubt about the reality of the scenes I am seeing. Granted, the Eyes thing could be a sign that something is up even if Shepard is not in a dream-state.

Exactly.  It's almost as if they actually programmed an indoctrination scene when they were going down that path, and gave up when they couldn't find a way to smooth over the ergonomics of having a dialog wheel while being indoctrinated.  Pressed for time, they repurposed it - but were incapable of removing the original intent of the artists involved, from their art.

If this is true, and they ran out of time to finish the game, they may have repurposed the indoc chapter of the story as the end of the story.  This implies that the original vision for the game was much longer, and much, much more epic.

We all wanted that game.  I think Bioware should make ME4 to give us the final chapters that they ran out of time to write.

Or they could do what I truly want, and spare no talent and imagination in making Shepard the Odysseus of this millennium, and themselves its Homer.  Let the stories go on forever as long as there is a masterpiece that can still be forged from it.

Modifié par hoodaticus, 11 mai 2012 - 02:33 .

[Aaleel]

balance5050 wrote...

Aaleel wrote...

Wow someone is mad.  Funny you call someone else childish when you're the one throwing around insults.  You shouldn't post vids on a public forum if you're going to be this thinned skin.  Especially if you're going to say stuff like "Suck on that naysayers" in the vid.

I already posted my other problems with the vid, but as long as IT supports can use well it is a dream so it's possible, you can pretty much make up whatever you want and say it's true.

Using game files and booklets not in the actual game or it's lore makes no sense.  It's like having a choice that decides if someone lives or dies, finding out which is which and then arguing one choice is better because it allows the person to live.  It's metagaming, it's external from the game itself.

So explain why Shepard has different armor on waking up on Earth, since you already debated it's not due to laziness on Bioware's part.

Actually forget it.  Since you don't want to have a civil discussion anymore, and you just want to hear positive feedback I just won't waste the time.



 

Naysayers always seem so angry. Just because you can't see it like we do is no reason to throw a hissy fit.

Harbinger's beam hit him... so his armor is burned. What's hard to understand about this?

I'm not angry at all.  I just have no time for people who are happy as long as people are telling them how good something is, but get ugly when someone has something against what they're saying.  I still haven't thrown an insult the OP way.

And the OP argued that the armor is not burned, not me.  He said it.  So he argued himself into the corner as far as that premise is concerned.  

[balance5050]

Aaleel wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Aaleel wrote...

Wow someone is mad.  Funny you call someone else childish when you're the one throwing around insults.  You shouldn't post vids on a public forum if you're going to be this thinned skin.  Especially if you're going to say stuff like "Suck on that naysayers" in the vid.

I already posted my other problems with the vid, but as long as IT supports can use well it is a dream so it's possible, you can pretty much make up whatever you want and say it's true.

Using game files and booklets not in the actual game or it's lore makes no sense.  It's like having a choice that decides if someone lives or dies, finding out which is which and then arguing one choice is better because it allows the person to live.  It's metagaming, it's external from the game itself.

So explain why Shepard has different armor on waking up on Earth, since you already debated it's not due to laziness on Bioware's part.

Actually forget it.  Since you don't want to have a civil discussion anymore, and you just want to hear positive feedback I just won't waste the time.



 

Naysayers always seem so angry. Just because you can't see it like we do is no reason to throw a hissy fit.

Harbinger's beam hit him... so his armor is burned. What's hard to understand about this?

I'm not angry at all.  I just have no time for people who are happy as long as people are telling them how good something is, but get ugly when someone has something against what they're saying.  I still haven't thrown an insult the OP way.

And the OP argued that the armor is not burned, not me.  He said it.  So he argued himself into the corner as far as that premise is concerned.  

You obviously do have time because you do it all day long.

EDIT: and now your complaint has been noted, maybe YOU should make a video about it...

Modifié par balance5050, 11 mai 2012 - 02:37 .

[shadowspecialist]

Anyone ever give the thought that maybe Shep wears armored underwear? Maybe the customized armor is charred and burnt off, but what's left, is the underwear. I know shep is an elite type commando and all, but come on, with the armor you wear, who wants to chafe in that going commando? I know I would be wearing underwear, but not the regular cotton kind, I would wear armored underwear.

[hoodaticus]

shadowspecialist wrote...

Anyone ever give the thought that maybe Shep wears armored underwear? Maybe the customized armor is charred and burnt off, but what's left, is the underwear. I know shep is an elite type commando and all, but come on, with the armor you wear, who wants to chafe in that going commando? I know I would be wearing underwear, but not the regular cotton kind, I would wear armored underwear.

It's probably a chastity belt installed by Ashley Williams.

[Torrible]

shadowspecialist wrote...

Anyone ever give the thought that maybe Shep wears armored underwear? Maybe the customized armor is charred and burnt off, but what's left, is the underwear. I know shep is an elite type commando and all, but come on, with the armor you wear, who wants to chafe in that going commando? I know I would be wearing underwear, but not the regular cotton kind, I would wear armored underwear.

This. It's not charred armor, more like whatever's underneath that armor. See the pic below. The innerwear is black no matter how you customise the N7 armor (more obvious if the armor is white).


  

[Bill Casey]

shadowspecialist wrote...

Anyone ever give the thought that maybe Shep wears armored underwear?

I have...

I've stated multiple times Shepard is standing in outer space in his underwear talking to a dead kid who says he's the Reaper King...

[CavScout]

Ownaholic wrote...

CavScout wrote...

Refara wrote...

This may have been mentioned earlier, but I noticed this replaying the opening part of ME3 to test out some textures, and noticed something. If the boy isn't real, why did they wait for him to get inside the shuttle before leaving, they could have left way earlier if he wasn't really there.

Kinda disheartening for me, since I really, REALLY like the IT.

Any suggestions on how the IT could counter argue this, I'm afraid I don't know the specifics on indoctrination so I don't know how to explain it.

Fortunately for those who believe in Indoctrination Theory, nothing can actually disprove Indoctrination Theory. Anything that could is just called part of Indoctrination Theory.

Not true. I've talked about this before; and I think I may have even responded to that post already to be honest. But I'll do it again because I can't remember.

Basically, if you watch, the solder is helping a person on-board before the boy even gets in. Then the Reaper lands. Then the three soldiers outside are shooting at it while all of the passengers in the shuttle are being secured. The boy crawls inside (not helped by the soldier, who just helped an adult aboard), then doesn't sit or get strapped in or anything (When the adults were).
If you look, it appears as though one of the soldiers looks back at the shuttle, almost in a motion to say "go", or something along those lines. It's very brief, but it's there. The shuttle looked to be waiting for the soldiers fighting the reapers, and a last split-second decision was made for those three soldiers to stay and fight.

It is true. IT folks just dismiss whatever is inconvenient by claiming it is IT related. I mean, look at this point you cling to. You assume IT because soldiers in a FIREFIGHT don't help a boy up into a shuttle he easily got into himself. It's not because they're in a fight, no it's because of some elaborate conspiracy by BW...