286 réponses à ce sujet

[dreman9999]

Yaos wrote...

NO.
Just, no.
It wouldn't be creative nor clever.

1) incomplete game
2) invalidated closure scenes (anderson and TIM) (how stupid would it have been to see them again after such a scene.)
3) It reduces the already silly number of Starkid choices from 3 to 1.
4) It'd make any 66% people that chose the blue or green ending loose their shepard's story because "they didn't figure it out". Mass Effect is not about these kind of devices
5) "Gotya! All a dream!" scenes are not creative. They're cheap.

1.EC already shows that it is.
2.The concept is that it's a trick...
3.It would change it to 2....To be indoctrinated or not.
4....Or play the end of the game as an indoctrinated agent and having to do a Saren at the end of the game...http://www.youtube.c...pQDE0BcM#t=124s
5.No, it make the ending a "it's all a trick"...What is happening can ether be in Shepards head or a hallutionation of what Shep sees.

[dreman9999]

IsaacShep wrote...

Perhaps. But if it's true, it means the trilogy had 1 single ending and only 1 actual choice.

Why do people keep saying this? Use some imationation....It does mean there is just one choice.....It means a diffent end....2 endings. One as a Shepard that keep him mind and the other as a reaper agent....The reaper agent one would end like this...http://www.youtube.c...pQDE0BcM#t=124s, but the player perseption would be what Saren's IS.

[Nassegris]

Deceiving, upsetting, alienating your customers with a poorly implemented non-ending that goes against everything you’ve promised and completely fails to give any conclusion is not creative or clever.

It’s dumb.

The theory itself, as thought up by fans, is clever – but the way it is presented (or not presented) in the game is idiotic. It’s wishy-washy and doesn’t engage. It’s not there enough to be good and would only have been excusable to any kind of degree if the game had continued after the Destroy option and we’d have had a real end to give the previous drabble some kind of context.

Throwing in half-baked, unfinished plots into your game right at the end is not the way to do it. I wish people would stop calling it genius – it might have been if done right, but it just wasn’t.

[Seboist]

Boy, the IT supporters sure have lost all grasp of reality at this point. The creators of a pulp schlock series of semi-reboots that has less cohesion and planning than a fighting game series like Blazblue and that involves metaphorically jacking the player off in the most juvenile manner possible (Alliance committee on Earth) and who created a deus ex machina plot device that makes the Triforce plot in Zelda look brilliant would do something so subtle as have Shepard indoctrinated? ROFLMAO!

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

dreman9999 wrote...

IsaacShep wrote...

Perhaps. But if it's true, it means the trilogy had 1 single ending and only 1 actual choice.

Why do people keep saying this? Use some imationation....It does mean there is just one choice.....It means a diffent end....2 endings. One as a Shepard that keep him mind and the other as a reaper agent....The reaper agent one would end like this...http://www.youtube.c...pQDE0BcM#t=124s, but the player perseption would be what Saren's IS.

No. There is only one right succesful choice. Something that runs counter to the endings of the last two games.

Imagine if saving the Collector base resulted in Shepard falling to his death.

[PlumPaul93]

Imperium Alpha wrote...

-IF- IT is true. There is only one way to see it and it is that BioWare took the idea from people that didn't like the ending so they can shut them up. There is nothing to believe they would have want to do IT in the first place as leak script and everything else go againts it.

Bingo.

[KingZayd]

Lizardviking wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

IsaacShep wrote...

Perhaps. But if it's true, it means the trilogy had 1 single ending and only 1 actual choice.

Why do people keep saying this? Use some imationation....It does mean there is just one choice.....It means a diffent end....2 endings. One as a Shepard that keep him mind and the other as a reaper agent....The reaper agent one would end like this...http://www.youtube.c...pQDE0BcM#t=124s, but the player perseption would be what Saren's IS.

No. There is only one right succesful choice. Something that runs counter to the endings of the last two games.

Imagine if saving the Collector base resulted in Shepard falling to his death.

Did Bioware not say that it was meant to be difficult to get the best ending?

And would have been so bad if saving the Collector base had some unintended consequences in ME3?

Why can't your choice at the end of ME3 have unintended consequences?

[Johcande XX]

I don't understand for the life of me why there is such divisiveness between IT subscribers and skeptics.

The only real conflict I can understand was whether you liked the way ME3 ended or not. At face value ME3 has 3 endings, kinda, which are mostly the same and far less than the 16 or so we were told we were going to see. With IT ME3 has 0 endings, which is still less than the 16 that . . . blah blah blah.

Personally both of the scenarios above cause me to hate the way that the ME3 story was finished. I'm one of the skeptics, and I think that IT is giving BioWare WAY more credit than they deserve; but hey, if IT can retcon that atrocity that was the Crucible + Star Child, then I'll gladly admit I was wrong.

[Tyrannosaurus Rex]

KingZayd wrote...

Lizardviking wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

IsaacShep wrote...

Perhaps. But if it's true, it means the trilogy had 1 single ending and only 1 actual choice.

Why do people keep saying this? Use some imationation....It does mean there is just one choice.....It means a diffent end....2 endings. One as a Shepard that keep him mind and the other as a reaper agent....The reaper agent one would end like this...http://www.youtube.c...pQDE0BcM#t=124s, but the player perseption would be what Saren's IS.

No. There is only one right succesful choice. Something that runs counter to the endings of the last two games.

Imagine if saving the Collector base resulted in Shepard falling to his death.

Did Bioware not say that it was meant to be difficult to get the best ending?

And would have been so bad if saving the Collector base had some unintended consequences in ME3?

Why can't your choice at the end of ME3 have unintended consequences?

Because the last two games granted us multiple succesful options with no real right choice at the end? We could choose to sacrifice the Destiny ascension or save it for example, either way we won and our choice was rewarded. ME2 had bad endings but they were simply tied to our preformance throughout the endgame, not the actual end choice itself.

[Darth_Trethon]

Seboist wrote...

Boy, the IT supporters sure have lost all grasp of reality at this point. The creators of a pulp schlock series of semi-reboots that has less cohesion and planning than a fighting game series like Blazblue and that involves metaphorically jacking the player off in the most juvenile manner possible (Alliance committee on Earth) and who created a deus ex machina plot device that makes the Triforce plot in Zelda look brilliant would do something so subtle as have Shepard indoctrinated? ROFLMAO!

One thing.....the final hours app clearly shows BioWare DID plan to have the player lose control of Shepard who would fall under reaper control for a portion at the end of the game.....though they claim this was cut because it proved too difficult to develop. Yet it serves to show you are just plain wrong.....you can hate other portions of the game all you like it still doesn't change annything.....they DID intend for indoctrination to happen.

[PlumPaul93]

Johcande XX wrote...

I don't understand for the life of me why there is such divisiveness between IT subscribers and skeptics..

1.The arrogance the IT believers have.

2.The "IT is the only way the endings can be salvaged" BS to further their agenda.

3.The IT spamming is annoying.

Those are some of the reasons there is such divisiveness IMO.

Modifié par PlumPaul82393, 09 mai 2012 - 09:21 .

[gmboy902]

I'd say very devious, if they intend on making us pay for a "true" ending.

Also, very stupid, because they should let us know we were indoctrinated at the end of the game (in a short clip, even, perhaps we could stand up in front of the Reaper beam, discord in the music, cut to black). Plus they spent a lot of resources for a fake ending.

Either way, not a justifiable choice.

[Darth_Trethon]

Imperium Alpha wrote...

-IF- IT is true. There is only one way to see it and it is that BioWare took the idea from people that didn't like the ending so they can shut them up. There is nothing to believe they would have want to do IT in the first place as leak script and everything else go againts it.

lolwut? What have you been smoking? First of all the IT has never been a fan iodea....we simply connected the dots bioware made and placed in front of us. Second the final hours app clearly PROVES without doubt that BioWare DID in fact plan to use indoctrination on Shepard at the end of the game. So your only "one way to see it" is just plain and simply WRONG.

[kobayashi-maru]

IsaacShep wrote...

Perhaps. But if it's true, it means the trilogy had 1 single ending and only 1 actual choice.

I hate to say it but if only. The ending choice of the pevious game where save/sacrifice council and destroy/ save collector base. The variations came from previous choices made and the epilogue reflected this. As it stands ME3 diverges from this formula (it's about the characters, stupid) and goes for the deus ex ending which is more plot and philosophically based.

It should have been win or lose depending on your choices, followed by varied epilogues. If lose then next cycle wins using info in time capsule meaning that a future ME game set thousands of years later would not be constricted by the everyone half synthetic/Reapers controlled/ synthetic life destroyed, endings. Either way Reapers lose just depends on when in timeline.

[KingZayd]

Lizardviking wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

Lizardviking wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

IsaacShep wrote...

Perhaps. But if it's true, it means the trilogy had 1 single ending and only 1 actual choice.

Why do people keep saying this? Use some imationation....It does mean there is just one choice.....It means a diffent end....2 endings. One as a Shepard that keep him mind and the other as a reaper agent....The reaper agent one would end like this...http://www.youtube.c...pQDE0BcM#t=124s, but the player perseption would be what Saren's IS.

No. There is only one right succesful choice. Something that runs counter to the endings of the last two games.

Imagine if saving the Collector base resulted in Shepard falling to his death.

Did Bioware not say that it was meant to be difficult to get the best ending?

And would have been so bad if saving the Collector base had some unintended consequences in ME3?

Why can't your choice at the end of ME3 have unintended consequences?

Because the last two games granted us multiple succesful options with no real right choice at the end? We could choose to sacrifice the Destiny ascension or save it for example, either way we won and our choice was rewarded. ME2 had bad endings but they were simply tied to our preformance throughout the endgame, not the actual end choice itself.

In ME2, you could fail catastrophically by having everyone die. You could also kill yourself by having relations with Morinth.

A lot of people suspected that your choice with the collector base and the council would have some important impact at some point. It's not a good thing that they didn't.

By having no consequences (intended consequences or not) , your decisions are meaningless.

[Seboist]

Darth_Trethon wrote...

Seboist wrote...

Boy, the IT supporters sure have lost all grasp of reality at this point. The creators of a pulp schlock series of semi-reboots that has less cohesion and planning than a fighting game series like Blazblue and that involves metaphorically jacking the player off in the most juvenile manner possible (Alliance committee on Earth) and who created a deus ex machina plot device that makes the Triforce plot in Zelda look brilliant would do something so subtle as have Shepard indoctrinated? ROFLMAO!

One thing.....the final hours app clearly shows BioWare DID plan to have the player lose control of Shepard who would fall under reaper control for a portion at the end of the game.....though they claim this was cut because it proved too difficult to develop. Yet it serves to show you are just plain wrong.....you can hate other portions of the game all you like it still doesn't change annything.....they DID intend for indoctrination to happen.

Give it up fanboy, this series is an utter joke when it comes to writing and game design. If this moronic "IT theory" was correct then it would have actually have been in the game as they would have made use of Shepard being zapped by Object Rho and/or revealed Lazarus tech was Reaper derived but that would mean these games would have an actual continuity and lord knows Bioware doesn't like that.

These colored endings are the logical conclusion to a horrible crucible plot that was bad from the get-go! Deal with it and move on.

[KingZayd]

PlumPaul82393 wrote...

Johcande XX wrote...

I don't understand for the life of me why there is such divisiveness between IT subscribers and skeptics..

1.The arrogance the IT believers have.

2.The "IT is the only way the endings can be salvaged" BS to further their agenda.

3.The IT spamming is annoying.

Those are some of the reasons there is such divisiveness IMO.

1. The arrogance the anti ITers have.

2. The "Bioware would never do IT" BS to further their agenda.

3. The Anti-IT spamming is annoying,

These reasons are just as valid.

And for the record, I believe either set of reasons is just as true as the other. That is, not completely.
1 for example, is too general for both groups. but is applicable to some in both groups.

Modifié par KingZayd, 09 mai 2012 - 09:33 .

[Tigerman123]

It isn't even remotely intelligent, crafting your contentious theory on the basis of vague circumstancial evidence, most of which consists of the inappropriate reuse of assets and concessions to gameplay by Bioware is prima facie and probably actual evidence of stupidity

[Darth_Trethon]

Seboist wrote...

Darth_Trethon wrote...

One thing.....the final hours app clearly shows BioWare DID plan to have the player lose control of Shepard who would fall under reaper control for a portion at the end of the game.....though they claim this was cut because it proved too difficult to develop. Yet it serves to show you are just plain wrong.....you can hate other portions of the game all you like it still doesn't change annything.....they DID intend for indoctrination to happen.

Give it up fanboy, this series is an utter joke when it comes to writing and game design. If this moronic "IT theory" was correct then it would have actually have been in the game as they would have made use of Shepard being zapped by Object Rho and/or revealed Lazarus tech was Reaper derived but that would mean these games would have an actual continuity and lord knows Bioware doesn't like that.

These colored endings are the logical conclusion to a horrible crucible plot that was bad from the get-go! Deal with it and move on.

Insults and hate.....from someone accusing BioWare of handling the opening level in a "juvenile" way....I am very impressed. <_<

If you hate the whole game or the series and not just the end why are you here? That makes less sense than the ME3 ending.

[Johcande XX]

Imperium Alpha wrote...

Johcande XX wrote...
Personally both of the scenarios above cause me to hate the way that the ME3 story was finished. I'm one of the skeptics, and I think that IT is giving BioWare WAY more credit than they deserve; but hey, if IT can retcon that atrocity that was the Crucible + Star Child, then I'll gladly admit I was wrong.

Not sure EA is ready to put that much money to rewrite the entire game 

Probably should have used parantheses since I was using a mathmatic analogy. 
I meant all the scenes with the Crucible and the Star Child.  (Crucible + Star Child) 
The majority of the game with just the Crucible was fine.

[PlumPaul93]

KingZayd wrote...1. The arrogance the anti ITers have.

2. The "Bioware would never do IT" BS to further their agenda.

3. The Anti-IT spamming is annoying,

These reasons are just as valid.

And for the record, I believe either set of reasons is just as true.
1 for example, is too general for both groups. but is applicable to some in both groups.

I can agree with 1, but for 2 I'd say it's more "Bioware isn't stupid enough to have an incomplete ending to a last game of an epic trilogy", and I don't believe 3 is correct. You (or at least I don't) see multiple threads made every day about how bad the IT is, while threads about how cools it is are made by the hour.

Modifié par PlumPaul82393, 09 mai 2012 - 09:36 .

[JediMasterSal_0]

Heh, Shepard was indoctrinated back in the original ME, when he got the visions from the "Prothean" beacon.

(Waits for flaming to occur...)

[dreman9999]

Lizardviking wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

IsaacShep wrote...

Perhaps. But if it's true, it means the trilogy had 1 single ending and only 1 actual choice.

Why do people keep saying this? Use some imationation....It does mean there is just one choice.....It means a diffent end....2 endings. One as a Shepard that keep him mind and the other as a reaper agent....The reaper agent one would end like this...http://www.youtube.c...pQDE0BcM#t=124s, but the player perseption would be what Saren's IS.

No. There is only one right succesful choice. Something that runs counter to the endings of the last two games.

Imagine if saving the Collector base resulted in Shepard falling to his death.

You not getting it. That would mean that the other choice kill Shepard. Based on IT it's all an illusion. Shepard is not really dieing...He only is if you take the ending as totaly real. The arguement is based on the premise that IT is real. That would make 3 choices to 2 and the fct that Shepard is not dead. It's not one right ending, just one ending that keep Shep alive at the end.