1114 réponses à ce sujet

[Geneaux486]

Bill Casey wrote...
The ending being indoctrination is subtle like a brick...

"Shepard has become a legend by ending the Reaper threat." is subtle like a brick.  The ending being indoctrination is wishful headcannon.

Modifié par Geneaux486, 10 mai 2012 - 06:24 .

[balance5050]

 

[Hadeedak]

That message is odd simply because in this game alone, we apparently needed word of god to tell us it was over and we won.

And can I note once again that I'm not sure a game developer reusing models is proof of ANYTHING? And how creepy it would look if Shepard had normal eyes while his/her face is disolving?



Hey, look, it's my Shepard! In this shot, her eyes aren't TIM eyes OR normal! Clearly that must mean something! But what?

Modifié par Hadeedak, 10 mai 2012 - 06:29 .

[Geneaux486]

Hadeedak wrote...

That message is odd simply because in this game alone, we apparently needed word of god to tell us it was over and we won.

Yeah, it's like Bioware knew in advance that people would go into denial about it.

 And how creepy it would look if Shepard had normal eyes while his/her face is disolving?

Well the similarity in their eyes is actually a valid observation.  I mean think about it, the Illusive Man had those eyes the entire time you knew him, even before he started jamming Reaper tech into his body.  Can it really be coincidence that Shepard has those same eyes?  I suspect Shepard may have some Cerberus tech in his body.  Mostly because we saw that one time Cerberus put some Cerberus tech in Shepard's body.

Modifié par Geneaux486, 10 mai 2012 - 06:31 .

[SubAstris]

There is no failure, only the choice of your Shepard. What s/he chooses is defined as "right" or "wrong" within the ME universe

[balance5050]

Geneaux486 wrote...

Hadeedak wrote...

That message is odd simply because in this game alone, we apparently needed word of god to tell us it was over and we won.

Yeah, it's like Bioware knew in advance that people would go into denial about it.

Well, considering it was all just a story told to Buzz Aldrin's grandson, that makes sense.

[KingZayd]

Hadeedak wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

jreezy wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Hadeedak wrote...

Well, with TIM babbling control control control and the starchild calling it control...

And Anderson going destroydestroydestroy and the starchild calling it destroy...

It rather makes sense to have Shepard associate those two. Unless I'm missing something, the starchild doesn't TELL Shepard to swandive into the beam, either. And what's really happening AS PRESENTED IN GAME is pretty clearly delineated from Shepard's TIM/Anderson flash, followed by the JOKER/ANDERSON/ME1 LI or OH HEY LIARA AGAIN.

The dream sequences we know aren't happening are given to us in lovely sepia tone.

The point is he tells you your choices without actually telling you how to mechanically activate them. Shepard just knows, somehow.

Game mechanic heuristics is the answer here.

So basically "it's not meant to make sense"?

Or "It makes sense, but it doesn't necessarily mean Shepard's being indoctrinated. There are many spins on it."

Control has exposed handgrips. Destroy... well, what were you planning on doing to the tube otherwise?

that's what he meant by game mechanic heuristics?

He only knows that that side's control because he sees it. Same for Destroy with the tube. Hey what if he thought he had to grab the tube? or try and add his energy to it... by i don't know.. going Super Saiyan?  Why would he come to the assumption that he was meant to shoot the tube? He doesn't stop to ask the Starchild "erm.. am i meant to shoot that tube there or something? because ... i dunno".

How thoughtful of the earlier cycles to put some sort of beacon that shows Shepard what to do when this AI nobody knew about says the relevant word (destroy, control). Couldn't they just have included a remote? or an instruction manual?

[balance5050]

SubAstris wrote...

There is no failure, only the choice of your Shepard. What s/he chooses is defined as "right" or "wrong" within the ME universe

"Choices" end in "game over's" all the time. Not saying the ending choices are wrong. but there are wrong choices in this game.

Modifié par balance5050, 10 mai 2012 - 06:30 .

[Hadeedak]

Psh, remotes are for primitives.

[Geneaux486]

balance5050 wrote...

SubAstris wrote...

There is no failure, only the choice of your Shepard. What s/he chooses is defined as "right" or "wrong" within the ME universe

"Choices" end in "game over's" all the time.

These don't.  They end in success.

[balance5050]

It's nice that this thread is nice and healthy..... good refresh rate.

[Geneaux486]

jreezy wrote...

Not what I'm getting. This: "A player should be able to identify their score/status/goal in the game" is the reason for the visions. Game mechanic heuristics at work.

He's stringing you along. 

[Bill Casey]

Geneaux486 wrote...

Well the similarity in their eyes is actually a valid observation.  I mean think about it, the Illusive Man had those eyes the entire time you knew him, even before he started jamming Reaper tech into his body.  Can it really be coincidence that Shepard has those same eyes?  I suspect Shepard may have some Cerberus tech in his body.  Mostly because we saw that one time Cerberus put some Cerberus tech in Shepard's body.

The Illusive Man got those eyes from touching a Reaper artifact...

[KingZayd]

jreezy wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

jreezy wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Hadeedak wrote...

Well, with TIM babbling control control control and the starchild calling it control...

And Anderson going destroydestroydestroy and the starchild calling it destroy...

It rather makes sense to have Shepard associate those two. Unless I'm missing something, the starchild doesn't TELL Shepard to swandive into the beam, either. And what's really happening AS PRESENTED IN GAME is pretty clearly delineated from Shepard's TIM/Anderson flash, followed by the JOKER/ANDERSON/ME1 LI or OH HEY LIARA AGAIN.

The dream sequences we know aren't happening are given to us in lovely sepia tone.

The point is he tells you your choices without actually telling you how to mechanically activate them. Shepard just knows, somehow.

Game mechanic heuristics is the answer here.

So basically "it's not meant to make sense"?

Not what I'm getting at. This: "A player should be able to identify their score/status/goal in the game" is the reason for the visions. Game mechanic heuristics at work.

Wouldn't it be simple to just have the Starchild point out the relevant tube and tell you that you need to shoot it?

And the point still remains, YOU might see what needs to be done. But Shepard's still clueless as far as the story goes. Unless Shepard sees them too.

Modifié par KingZayd, 10 mai 2012 - 06:35 .

[AxStapleton]

Critical mission failure is the best ending.

[Hadeedak]

Yeah, it's fun.

Now, we know Shepard has ocular implants, because renegade Shepard gets glowy eyes. (Sucks to be you, destroy Shepard. Maybe your eyes explode). We also know the Catalyst is more or less Reaper tech. There's two explanations -- Shepard being ripped apart reveals the underworkings of his/her eyes or exposure to reaper tech messes with her. In either case... Well, word of god says Shepard ends the reaper threat.

[balance5050]

AxStapleton wrote...

Critical mission failure is the best ending.

Nope, Maruder Shields.

[Hadeedak]

KingZayd wrote...

jreezy wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

jreezy wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Hadeedak wrote...

Well, with TIM babbling control control control and the starchild calling it control...

And Anderson going destroydestroydestroy and the starchild calling it destroy...

It rather makes sense to have Shepard associate those two. Unless I'm missing something, the starchild doesn't TELL Shepard to swandive into the beam, either. And what's really happening AS PRESENTED IN GAME is pretty clearly delineated from Shepard's TIM/Anderson flash, followed by the JOKER/ANDERSON/ME1 LI or OH HEY LIARA AGAIN.

The dream sequences we know aren't happening are given to us in lovely sepia tone.

The point is he tells you your choices without actually telling you how to mechanically activate them. Shepard just knows, somehow.

Game mechanic heuristics is the answer here.

So basically "it's not meant to make sense"?

Not what I'm getting at. This: "A player should be able to identify their score/status/goal in the game" is the reason for the visions. Game mechanic heuristics at work.

Wouldn't it be simple to just have the Starchild point out the relevant tube and tell you that you need to shoot it?

And the point still remains, YOU might see what needs to be done. But Shepard's still clueless as far as the story goes. Unless Shepard sees them too.

Look at how many people managed to walk into synthesis in this thread alone. Hell, I freaked out my first time, thinking I'd picked destroy. If anything, they should have been MORE obvious. Maybe an "Are you sure?"

[Bill Casey]

Hadeedak wrote...

Yeah, it's fun.

Now, we know Shepard has ocular implants, because renegade Shepard gets glowy eyes. (Sucks to be you, destroy Shepard. Maybe your eyes explode). We also know the Catalyst is more or less Reaper tech. There's two explanations -- Shepard being ripped apart reveals the underworkings of his/her eyes or exposure to reaper tech messes with her. In either case... Well, word of god says Shepard ends the reaper threat.

Those aren't Shepard's ocular implants, though...

Modifié par Bill Casey, 10 mai 2012 - 06:37 .

[Hadeedak]

balance5050 wrote...

AxStapleton wrote...

Critical mission failure is the best ending.

Nope, Maruder Shields.

Real Shepards die on the husks first.

My boyfriend got shot by TIM. I laughed at him.

[Hadeedak]

Bill Casey wrote...

Hadeedak wrote...

Yeah, it's fun.

Now, we know Shepard has ocular implants, because renegade Shepard gets glowy eyes. (Sucks to be you, destroy Shepard. Maybe your eyes explode). We also know the Catalyst is more or less Reaper tech. There's two explanations -- Shepard being ripped apart reveals the underworkings of his/her eyes or exposure to reaper tech messes with her. In either case... Well, word of god says Shepard ends the reaper threat.

Those aren't Shepard's ocular implants, though...

And you're sure of this why?

[KingZayd]

Hadeedak wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

jreezy wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

jreezy wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Hadeedak wrote...

Well, with TIM babbling control control control and the starchild calling it control...

And Anderson going destroydestroydestroy and the starchild calling it destroy...

It rather makes sense to have Shepard associate those two. Unless I'm missing something, the starchild doesn't TELL Shepard to swandive into the beam, either. And what's really happening AS PRESENTED IN GAME is pretty clearly delineated from Shepard's TIM/Anderson flash, followed by the JOKER/ANDERSON/ME1 LI or OH HEY LIARA AGAIN.

The dream sequences we know aren't happening are given to us in lovely sepia tone.

The point is he tells you your choices without actually telling you how to mechanically activate them. Shepard just knows, somehow.

Game mechanic heuristics is the answer here.

So basically "it's not meant to make sense"?

Not what I'm getting at. This: "A player should be able to identify their score/status/goal in the game" is the reason for the visions. Game mechanic heuristics at work.

Wouldn't it be simple to just have the Starchild point out the relevant tube and tell you that you need to shoot it?

And the point still remains, YOU might see what needs to be done. But Shepard's still clueless as far as the story goes. Unless Shepard sees them too.

Look at how many people managed to walk into synthesis in this thread alone. Hell, I freaked out my first time, thinking I'd picked destroy. If anything, they should have been MORE obvious. Maybe an "Are you sure?"

I did too, mainly because I tried shooting the Starchild first, and ended up forgetting where to go for destroy.

I agree, we should know where to go, but so should Shepard (or else it doesn't make sense). So does Shepard see these visions too? if so, where do they come from? If not, how does he know what to do?

[Bill Casey]

Hadeedak wrote...
And you're sure of this why? [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/wink.png[/smilie]

You can see Shepard's occular implants if you're renegade enough...
They are not the same design...

This isn't even up for debate...
You are objectively wrong on this point...

Shepard has the illusive man's eyes in these scenes...
Take that for what you will...

Modifié par Bill Casey, 10 mai 2012 - 06:41 .

[balance5050]

Hadeedak wrote...

Yeah, it's fun.

Now, we know Shepard has ocular implants, because renegade Shepard gets glowy eyes. (Sucks to be you, destroy Shepard. Maybe your eyes explode). We also know the Catalyst is more or less Reaper tech. There's two explanations -- Shepard being ripped apart reveals the underworkings of his/her eyes or exposure to reaper tech messes with her. In either case... Well, word of god says Shepard ends the reaper threat.

Problem with that is renegade shep eyes are a different pattern all together.

Renegade has 2 dots on top with one on the bottom, Indoctrinated eyes are vice-versa