733 réponses à ce sujet

[SirCroft]

Can we all say, then, that we expect them to listen to us?
You know, it's not like they haven't been reading all that has been going on around here since March.
I think it's pretty stupid to ask "Hey, what do you think we'll do?". How on Earth will my prediction help you shape the EC?
The question is clearly "What do you want to see?".

Modifié par SirCroft, 11 mai 2012 - 07:11 .

[dreamgazer]

Kunari801 wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...

Shatterhand1701 wrote...

Bioware is planting their feet and only answering what they want to answer at this time. Is it honestly, SERIOUSLY too much to ask of ME fans to just wait and see what they give us?

No, it's not.  

They asked what we expected in the EC.  They asked.   

... and you have no idea what they're going to do with the response.  They asked, but that doesn't require for them to address the responses they receive.  

[Taboo]

dreamgazer wrote...

Kunari801 wrote...

dreamgazer wrote...

Shatterhand1701 wrote...

Bioware is planting their feet and only answering what they want to answer at this time. Is it honestly, SERIOUSLY too much to ask of ME fans to just wait and see what they give us?

No, it's not.  

They asked what we expected in the EC.  They asked.   

... and you have no idea what they're going to do with the response.  They asked, but that doesn't require for them to address the responses they receive.  

They HAVE been letting things trickle down which is a good sign.

But some of the things the other employees are saying are just not.........good.

[Mylia Stenetch]

Taboo-XX wrote...
The Extended Cut is an admission of guilt. That much I know. But the more recent information that has come to light is seeding thoughts that I've had for a while now.

What I see is something far worse than EA's interference.

Most stuff I have seen follow suits when I saw with games at NCSoft. They are being obtuse for a reason, and it is partially the higher ups (i put more money on that), and they are being vauge so they do not get slammed by anyone also to keep the media on it to make them look good etc.

This comes from my person expierence where working for an ISP and have to write up incident reports for people and trying to stamp out any leaks that come out from people inside, or a loud and annoying Radio station. To me this is the usual crap corporations put on us.

[Shatterhand1701]

dreamgazer wrote...

Shatterhand1701 wrote...

Bioware is planting their feet and only answering what they want to answer at this time. Is it honestly, SERIOUSLY too much to ask of ME fans to just wait and see what they give us?

No, it's not. 

I wouldn't think so either, but many here on the BSN insist it IS too much to ask, and that we "deserve" to be told what's going on RIGHT NOW and have the nerve to state it as a demand.  Don't get me wrong; I'd love to have at least some idea of what we're getting from the EC (other than the basic description we've been given already), but I'm certainly not going to have the arrogance to tell Bioware I "deserve" or "demand" answers.  People wonder why the gaming media has been casting such an unflattering glow upon the Retake movement; well, garbage like THAT is exactly the reason why.  Of course I'm not casting blame upon the entire movement, but its more strident members have been doing more to damage its reputation than put it in a position worthy of pride and prestige.

They're asking us what we expect out of the EC.  We're telling them, and that's all that is going to come out of it for now.  Demanding anything of Bioware or behaving in an aggressive or angry way toward them now will produce nothing of value for the fanbase.

Modifié par Shatterhand1701, 11 mai 2012 - 07:13 .

[sH0tgUn jUliA]

It is days like this I wish Twitter didn't exist. Here's the bottom line:

Trying to get a company or corporation to do what you want is like herding cats. They will do what they want.

Now marketing-speak when asking a client base what they "expect" gives the company an idea of what they need to fulfill, because unfulfilled expectations are bad for a company's business. They want the majority of their customers' expectations to be fulfilled if they are serious about this. Hence, using the word "expect" instead of the word "want".

You want a steak for dinner. You go out to dinner. You order your steak and tell the server you would like your rib eye steak cooked medium rare. Now you have expectations about medium rare in your mind: this is pink and a little bloody. That's what you expect. If you receive that, your expectation is fulfilled. If it comes to you with no pink, then your expectation is unfulfilled. The only way to fix this is to get you another steak that meets your expectations.

See how this works in marketing?

[Taboo]

I never said you could demand anything.

You do have every right to ask though.

[eddieoctane]

dreamgazer wrote...

They have accepted and listened to criticism; they're just not bending to the whims of angry naysayers who wish to alter their creative vision.

What happened to it being me telling my story through Shepard? BioWare made it my game as much as theirs and then took it away. The feelign of player agency was so novel that I couldn;t stop playing, and BiOWare snatched it away in the name of a concept that I don't think anyone in their offices actualyl understands. No one likes an indian giver. NO ONE. But since that's how BioWare wants to play it, I don't just want the $80 for my copy of ME3 anymore. I want the $250 I spent on the franchise as a whole.

[Kunari801]

Taboo-XX wrote...

The Extended Cut is an admission of guilt. That much I know. But the more recent information that has come to light is seeding thoughts that I've had for a while now.

What I see is something far worse than EA's interference.

It's a sunny Friday... we shouldn't be this depressed.   

This should be in the EC

 

[Shatterhand1701]

Taboo-XX wrote...

I never said you could demand anything.

You do have every right to ask though.

Of course you do.  Go ahead, ask away.  But no one has any business getting cocky or nasty when the responses don't come.  Bioware will give us information when they want to, and not a moment sooner.  They aren't going to give one-tenth of one sh*t what anyone here thinks they're entitled to because they paid money for Mass Effect 3.  They're giving this to us for free, and while that doesn't mean we shouldn't expect something that satisfies our frustration over the ending, by no stretch of the imagination does it mean we have the right to give them grief for a lack of extensive information.

[Mcfly616]

Fingertrip wrote...

I feel sorry for Bioware for having to deal with these morons.

At least they cashed in quite nicely, so the VOCAL MINORITY really doesn't make two cents of a difference.

Hahahahahahahahaha


Still clinging to those straws, I see....


delusions of grandeur

[Taboo]

I have an expectation for them to be more responsible not to give me what I want.

I cannot have everything I want, that much I understand.

But the nonsense is beginning to drive me batty.

[dreamgazer]

Taboo-XX wrote...

The Extended Cut is an admission of guilt. That much I know. 

I disagree. Just because they want to try and more explicitly fill in certain gaps (if we're taking their EC marketing speak at face-value) doesn't mean that they're saying they're at fault, or that they necessarily did something wrong. There's a different between admission of guilt and wanting to try and satisfy a wider berth of their audience.  And they plainly stated that they're still proud of what they created.

Are they admitting, with the EC, that there's a problem? Yes, partially, but it's not an admission that it's their fault. 

Modifié par dreamgazer, 11 mai 2012 - 07:20 .

[Atakuma]

Taboo-XX wrote...

I never said you could demand anything.

You do have every right to ask though.

Of course you are, however Bioware are not obligated to answer.

[Kunari801]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

... Now marketing-speak when asking a client base what they "expect" gives the company an idea of what they need to fulfill, because unfulfilled expectations are bad for a company's business. They want the majority of their customers' expectations to be fulfilled if they are serious about this. Hence, using the word "expect" instead of the word "want".  

Then I'll post my "Expectation" in a pic.  I already posted my happy ending above, here is my bitter-sweet Shepard lives/dies in the arms of his LI.  

 

[Taboo]

Atakuma wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

I never said you could demand anything.

You do have every right to ask though.

Of course you are, however Bioware are not obligated to answer.

They are obligated to provide some sense of acknowledgement, which they have done, in part.

We've only met half way though.

[Kasterian]

Taboo-XX wrote...

  I didn't ask what you want. I asked what you expect. There is a difference.

Guess who will be the new "Shweppes égérie"

http://youtu.be/8wng-vKN2bE?t=51s

[Mcfly616]

My *** minority.....pass whatever you're smoking this way.....and if you aren't.smoking, you should probably talk to someone about your denial issues....

Or the voices in your head whispering to.you that the ending was in any way of high quality.....


Pretty much the exact opposite, as has been.demonstrated by public opinion, whether vocal or not

[Animositisomina]

Wait... what happened yesterday with Chris Priestly?

[Taboo]

dreamgazer wrote...

Taboo-XX wrote...

The Extended Cut is an admission of guilt. That much I know. 

Are they admitting, with the EC, that there's a problem? Yes, partially, but it's not an admission that it's their fault. 

They put the content in and should take responsibility for it.

The reactions are caused by the fans, but they were insitigated by the included content.

Both are at fault. One started the fire. The other merely decided to spread it.

[Kunari801]

Animositisomina wrote...

Wait... what happened yesterday with Chris Priestly?

http://social.biowar.../index/11982173 

[kobayashi-maru]

I share most of the worries people have about the EC, but it could work, we just don't know enough yet - although recent tweets are not hopeful.

The Abyss extended cut is a good example the final five minutes are the same bar one extra line of dialogue, but the extended footage previous to it not only clarifys many things but changes the ending without actually changing it. It is about context, but I just cannot see how ME can do the same.

For me it still comes down to feeling like I'm being called an idiot, for not getting the ending. I got it first time, I love art house cinema, bleak Russian dramas and the original Solaris. I do not need to been spoon feed answers but when the lead writer insinuates not only Galactic dark age but the suffering of those on Citadel, then now getting told that was never the intent and everyone lives and where did we get such a silly idea in the first place. It just makes my brain hurt.

[frylock23]

sH0tgUn jUliA wrote...

It is days like this I wish Twitter didn't exist. Here's the bottom line:

Trying to get a company or corporation to do what you want is like herding cats. They will do what they want.

Now marketing-speak when asking a client base what they "expect" gives the company an idea of what they need to fulfill, because unfulfilled expectations are bad for a company's business. They want the majority of their customers' expectations to be fulfilled if they are serious about this. Hence, using the word "expect" instead of the word "want".

You want a steak for dinner. You go out to dinner. You order your steak and tell the server you would like your rib eye steak cooked medium rare. Now you have expectations about medium rare in your mind: this is pink and a little bloody. That's what you expect. If you receive that, your expectation is fulfilled. If it comes to you with no pink, then your expectation is unfulfilled. The only way to fix this is to get you another steak that meets your expectations.

See how this works in marketing?

The problem with this is that our expectations here were based on a certain set of pre-release statements that made certain promises with the most infamous probably being "no A, B, C endings" which, it turns out, is exactly what we got.

So at what point do we trust them to deliver anything like what we expect especially when they were the ones who helped set those expectations in the first place with their own statements?

This isn't just a "we ordered the steak and didn't get it" this is "we were told we were receiving a medium rare steak and then it came medium well." Heck, it's more like "you were told it would be steak and now you get lobster or maybe just chicken."  Now, how do you feel about that?

Modifié par frylock23, 11 mai 2012 - 07:28 .

[Taboo]

The fire is still alight and it's burning into the night.......

A troubling thought.

One that............won't be going away in a few months.....

[Animositisomina]

Kunari801 wrote...

Animositisomina wrote...

Wait... what happened yesterday with Chris Priestly?

http://social.biowar.../index/11982173 

Not sure what the fuss is about then, based on that tweet from Chris.