434 réponses à ce sujet

[The Angry One]

The Night Mammoth wrote...

strive wrote...

I agree is painfully retarded how the humans manage to get owned that badly.

I think it is more annoying how Mary Sue humanity is. Having extremes on both sides is annoying, but with the way the trends had gone throughout the last two games I was expecting one dreadnaught manned by Hackett to take out half a dozen Sovereign class Reapers or something stupid.

A happy medium would have been nice. 

Maybe something to actually give some sort of reason for Admiral Hackett to be in his position as head of the fleet. 

No because we had to have Hackett pushing the Crucible as our only solution while yelling "There's no hope!" every 5 minutes going to the extreme that he forgot the entire battle with Sovereign. <_<

[lillitheris]

The Angry One wrote...

Edolix wrote...

Perhaps, but that lack of firepower could easily compromise any existing strategies that Hackett could have used.

I'll use that example you used in your original post, about the turians and their FTL tactic. The turians have a truckload of dreadnaughts spread across all of their fleets so this was naturally a very viable tactic for them.

The number of dreadnoughts used in the tactic isn't specified. Also, you're ignoring being able to use cruisers for this tactic, while frigates can repel Destroyers.

Did you miss the part about concentrated fire in the description about the turians? A single dreadnought cannot fire rapidly enough to get past the Reaper shields.

(Also, again, the part about turians being attacked after the SA fleets. This gives time to figure out new tactics. Or, if you want to argue that the turians didn‘t come up with it after the attack on the SA fleets, do you mind explaining why they didn’t share it with everyone else?)

I’m also pretty sure that the description of the craft being a destroyer is an error, given that they can be brought down by ground units but meh.

Modifié par lillitheris, 12 mai 2012 - 02:26 .

[Cobretti ftw]

Maybe the turians could have learned from the human failure.. its also a possibility.

[SparkyRich]

Hackett just figures if he can delay long enough Shepard will win it for him.

[Ingvarr Stormbird]

SparkyRich wrote...

Hackett just figures if he can delay long enough Shepard will win it for him.

... and then he will just steal credit for it, after Shep's dead. Like he stole final speech ("let me handle that for you").
That's why he's hiding behind armed guards while surrounded by allies ("what if somebody's indoctrinated? my retirement will be ruined!"). Paranoia much?

Modifié par Ingvarr Stormbird, 12 mai 2012 - 02:27 .

[The Angry One]

lillitheris wrote...


Did you miss the part about concentrated fire in the description about the turians? A single dreadnought cannot fire rapidly enough to get past the Reaper shields.

Yes. So? How does this exclude being able to use cruisers to support? Thanix cannons fire every 5 seconds and are supposed to be far more effective than mass accelerators against barriers.

[The Angry One]

Cobretti ftw wrote...

Maybe the turians could have learned from the human failure.. its also a possibility.

Nothing the Turians did hints at that, even if there was time to review the fall of Earth before Palaven was hit.

For example, using unmanned drones to scout an unknown, powerful force? Basic tactics.
The FTL ambush? Basic understanding of mass effect physics, bigger objects will turn slower.

[Chaoswind]

I am admiral Hackett and I am senile!!!

He forgot how to fight the reapers...

Anyways would make sense if a renegade shep with the council dead had better codex entries for the humans? I would love to have admiral (the dude that dies if you sent his fleet to save the council) managed to score a few victories (his codex entry portraits him as a tactical mastermind...)

[Wulfram]

What strategic objective do you believe Hackett would achieve by risking his fleet in an engagement with the numerically and technologically superior Reaper screening force?

Modifié par Wulfram, 12 mai 2012 - 02:31 .

[Fixers0]

strive wrote...

Maybe the defense committee demanded some ships over Earth to possibly save their own hides for an evacuation if Shepard was correct? Maybe for world/political leaders we well? I have no idea why he split his armada up so many different ways.

And here comes the Retcon, why the hell is the Alliance defence Committee located on earth? As Arcturus is the Capital and Center of the Systems Alliance, 

As a side note, the Alliance Military was actually one of the strongest in the galaxy due to the use of stealth vessels, Carriers and tactical flexibitly, hell Four alliance ships wer capable of deafting the entire Cerberus fleet. 

[Noelemahc]

The Angry One wrote...

lillitheris wrote...


Did you miss the part about concentrated fire in the description about the turians? A single dreadnought cannot fire rapidly enough to get past the Reaper shields.

Yes. So? How does this exclude being able to use cruisers to support? Thanix cannons fire every 5 seconds and are supposed to be far more effective than mass accelerators against barriers.

More specifically, if frigates with Thanix = cruisers without Thanix; then cruisers with Thanix should have no problem whittling down at least a Destroyer, if not something larger. Again, nukes and Thanix are conveniently forgotten whenever necessary for humans to lose.

[Wulfram]

Fixers0 wrote...

As a side note, the Alliance Military was actually one of the strongest in the galaxy due to the use of stealth vessels, Carriers and tactical flexibitly

The Turians have Carriers too.  And the Salarians have stealth Dreadnoughts.

hell Four alliance ships wer capable of deafting the entire Cerberus fleet.

Where do you get that from, and why should it be impressive?  They're just Cerberus.

[The Angry One]

Wulfram wrote...

What strategic objective do you believe Hackett would achieve by risking his fleet in an engagement with the numerically and technologically superior Reaper screening force?

Saving Arcturus Station long enough to evacuate personnel and resources, as well as not losing the second and fourth fleets entirely.

[Cobretti ftw]

=/ another great character that bioware destroyed =/

[Ingvarr Stormbird]

Imperium Alpha wrote...
Writers decide Humanity had to get roflstomp by the Reapers in the beginning of the game.

If I remember correctly, Batarians got proper roflstomp.

[Grimwick]

lillitheris wrote...

Well, yes, obviously they were all dumbasses. They should have built huge walls around all relays.

In defense of the earthlings, it must be noted that they were the first to be attacked (Edit: first of the two, if this is unclear). The turians actually had time to organize for defense – and, by decree of the council, had the largest fleet.

This. The Alliance fleets are poorly managed definitely and the codex contains many inconsistancies as to the battle - but Hackett isn't as dreadful as you make out, OP, when they have less dreadnoughts to begin with and less warning.

[SoloPala]

It bothers the hell out of me what they did with the Alliance at the start, the codex says the alliance follows Sun Tzu's doctrine of "Attempt to defend everything and you defend nothing" so the alliance uses their bases on colonies as scouts rather than defensive positions to track enemy movements and then thats exactly what the alliance does, spreads its fleets ****ing everywhere, and they get annihilated, lol.

[SoloPala]

Grimwick wrote...

lillitheris wrote...

Well, yes, obviously they were all dumbasses. They should have built huge walls around all relays.

In defense of the earthlings, it must be noted that they were the first to be attacked (Edit: first of the two, if this is unclear). The turians actually had time to organize for defense – and, by decree of the council, had the largest fleet.

This. The Alliance fleets are poorly managed definitely and the codex contains many inconsistancies as to the battle - but Hackett isn't as dreadful as you make out, OP, when they have less dreadnoughts to begin with and less warning.

Dreadnaughts are not the Alliance strength, carriers are, also we're supposed to believe that no one was paying attention to the Batarians when they got annihilated by the Reapers, herpity derpity.

[Ingvarr Stormbird]

lillitheris wrote...

Well, yes, obviously they were all dumbasses. They should have built huge walls around all relays.

Maybe not walls, but actually they could've built very powerful fortresses in the vicinity of the relay - enough to obliterate enemies as they arrive, before they even get the chance to scan their surroundings.
This is actually quite a staple of sci-fi. If you have something like a warp gate in strategic place, you protect it by stationary defences very easely.

Modifié par Ingvarr Stormbird, 12 mai 2012 - 02:42 .

[Fixers0]

Wulfram wrote...
The Turians have Carriers too.  And the Salarians have stealth Dreadnoughts.

That's because bioware doens't know their own codex and Mass Effect 1 , besides one Alliance cruiser is worth more then one of the most powerfull dreadnoughts in the Galaxy.

Wulfram wrote...
Where do you get that from, and why should it be impressive?

The scematic just before the assault shows us four Alliance vessels when Hackett's ordering the attack.

[The Angry One]

Grimwick wrote...

This. The Alliance fleets are poorly managed definitely and the codex contains many inconsistancies as to the battle - but Hackett isn't as dreadful as you make out, OP, when they have less dreadnoughts to begin with and less warning.

They knew the Batarians had just gone dark.
They knew SOMETHING horrifically powerful was coming, and Hackett had enough info  to know it was the Reapers.

Yet, Alliance forces were spread out, the fleets at Arcturus were caught with their pants down and I don't know what the hell the fourth fleet was doing, spread out in orbit of Earth.. and what the hell was that cruiser doing over Vancouver?

Oh yeah and while all of this is happening the defence commitee on Earth are running around like headless chickens expecting Shepard to pull out a strategy out of her ass.

[Ingvarr Stormbird]

The Angry One wrote...
and what the hell was that cruiser doing over Vancouver?

I've got news for you, it was actually a dreadnought 

Modifié par Ingvarr Stormbird, 12 mai 2012 - 02:45 .

[Wulfram]

The Angry One wrote...

Saving Arcturus Station long enough to evacuate personnel and resources,

45,000 people?  Strategically insignificant by any sane measure, particularly compared to the main concentration of the Alliance Navy.

as well as not losing the second and fourth fleets entirely.

What?  After you've somehow defeated the 12 Dreadnoughts with your inferior force, you're going to send the remnants in a charge through the relay to engage the many times more powerful Reaper force heading to Earth?