332 réponses à ce sujet

[Agugaboo]

Agugaboo wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

Agugaboo wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

Agugaboo wrote...

Gorkan86 wrote...

elecmanexe001 wrote...

No where in IT does it suggest friends are indoctrinated.... and they spent far less time near Reapers then you did.

I mention IT specifically to make it clear that if Shepard can be indoctrinated, then his companions too. They have not been with him constantly, but in most encounters with the reaper tech they were present.

Now that would be an epic, horrible end to the series. Shepard has a boss battle with indoctrinated squadmates that he brought for the final mission.

In my case that would be Liara and Garrus...
Imagine fighting ME1 Saren husk and a Banshee at the same time, and knowing exactly who they are.

Guess who Marauder Shields was? (lol jk, but THAT would be a way to give a bittersweet ending. Forcing you to kill your friends to save the galaxy)

If this were the case I'd bring Javik and Kaidan. Oh wait, I've never bothered to save Kaidan in ME1.
[Takes cover from flames.]

I haven't used Javik (although I did buy the DLC some timeafter Tuchanka. Unfortunately, student accomodation internet  prevents me from getting it authorised. By the time I got home, I saw the ending). Kaidan's already dead too.
And really, your whole squad should be running down there with you, since apparently this is the most important mission.

Also, that's just metagaming which i frown upon  Garrus and Liara were with me, but if i was doing the metagaming thing based on people I wouldn't mind dying as much then Ashley and... Jack. If based on who i think would be easy to kill, then can I take joker? erm, probably the same actually. Maybe Tali, since I don't know if the reapers can even use Quarians.

STILL havent bought From Ashes  DLC, just to clarify. Holding the line! It's okay if you bought it though. Will buy if EC is redeeming. No big deal. Yeah Ashley would be my third choice, although she really has given Kaidan a run for his money given the whole distrust thing and drunkenness. I intend to spare Kaidan on my current ME1 playthrough to give him a chance.

Edit: #$^%@ close together edit and quote button 

Modifié par Agugaboo, 12 mai 2012 - 11:38 .

[KingZayd]

7he Island Head wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

7he Island Head wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

Agugaboo wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

Agugaboo wrote...

Gorkan86 wrote...

elecmanexe001 wrote...

No where in IT does it suggest friends are indoctrinated.... and they spent far less time near Reapers then you did.

I mention IT specifically to make it clear that if Shepard can be indoctrinated, then his companions too. They have not been with him constantly, but in most encounters with the reaper tech they were present.

Now that would be an epic, horrible end to the series. Shepard has a boss battle with indoctrinated squadmates that he brought for the final mission.

In my case that would be Liara and Garrus...
Imagine fighting ME1 Saren husk and a Banshee at the same time, and knowing exactly who they are.

Guess who Marauder Shields was? (lol jk, but THAT would be a way to give a bittersweet ending. Forcing you to kill your friends to save the galaxy)

If this were the case I'd bring Javik and Kaidan. Oh wait, I've never bothered to save Kaidan in ME1.
[Takes cover from flames.]

I haven't used Javik (although I did buy the DLC some timeafter Tuchanka. Unfortunately, student accomodation internet  prevents me from getting it authorised. By the time I got home, I saw the ending). Kaidan's already dead too.
And really, your whole squad should be running down there with you, since apparently this is the most important mission.

Also, that's just metagaming which i frown upon  Garrus and Liara were with me, but if i was doing the metagaming thing based on people I wouldn't mind dying as much then Ashley and... Jack. If based on who i think would be easy to kill, then can I take joker? erm, probably the same actually. Maybe Tali, since I don't know if the reapers can even use Quarians.

Wut if you bring Grunt and Wrex? Shep would never win 

AHA! that's why you have no Krogan squadmates! mystery solved Also I have faith that the same technique to beat the banshees can be used: Blast with the Graal Stakegun repeatedly, and when they get close.. RUN. Same technique i used for Brutes actually (just with more jumping to dodge them).

I miss Krogan squad mates :'(  

 I use that technique you described pretty much on everything.... pew pew pew then RUN!!!

Ah,, I was a vanguard, so I was just charging around blasting people/husks in the face and then using biotic charge, to replenish shields when I was taking damage\\ had just been grenaded. Then heavy melee if whoever I charged was still alive (folllowed by more melee if necessary).  Used Nova if swarmed. Rinse and Repeat. So much fun!

And yes the Krogan are awesome. 2 of my favourite moments are: Wrex's landing on Surkesh, and Grunt's "last stand" which wasn't quite so final.

Modifié par KingZayd, 12 mai 2012 - 11:40 .

[balance5050]

7he Island Head wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

vurtual3 wrote...

A major flaw with IT theory is it says 2/3 endings were wrong. Actually wrong. Do you honestly think that's what BW went for?!

They went for it in the rest of the series by continuosly telling you that NO ONE can control the reapers....

And synthesis, only mention of anything remotly close is

A. Saren

B. Soverign

C Harbinger

D. Project overlord

If those two choices are valid then it INVALIDATES the rest of the game.

Which do you prefer? The first 99% of the Mass Effect trilogy or the last 15 minutes?

Outside of the IT, in mass effect cannon the Starkid can control the reapers

He is a reaper... "I know you've thought about destroying us."

Modifié par balance5050, 12 mai 2012 - 11:41 .

[7he Island Head]

Agugaboo wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

Agugaboo wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

Agugaboo wrote...

Gorkan86 wrote...

elecmanexe001 wrote...

No where in IT does it suggest friends are indoctrinated.... and they spent far less time near Reapers then you did.

I mention IT specifically to make it clear that if Shepard can be indoctrinated, then his companions too. They have not been with him constantly, but in most encounters with the reaper tech they were present.

Now that would be an epic, horrible end to the series. Shepard has a boss battle with indoctrinated squadmates that he brought for the final mission.

In my case that would be Liara and Garrus...
Imagine fighting ME1 Saren husk and a Banshee at the same time, and knowing exactly who they are.

Guess who Marauder Shields was? (lol jk, but THAT would be a way to give a bittersweet ending. Forcing you to kill your friends to save the galaxy)

If this were the case I'd bring Javik and Kaidan. Oh wait, I've never bothered to save Kaidan in ME1.
[Takes cover from flames.]

I haven't used Javik (although I did buy the DLC some timeafter Tuchanka. Unfortunately, student accomodation internet  prevents me from getting it authorised. By the time I got home, I saw the ending). Kaidan's already dead too.
And really, your whole squad should be running down there with you, since apparently this is the most important mission.

Also, that's just metagaming which i frown upon  Garrus and Liara were with me, but if i was doing the metagaming thing based on people I wouldn't mind dying as much then Ashley and... Jack. If based on who i think would be easy to kill, then can I take joker? erm, probably the same actually. Maybe Tali, since I don't know if the reapers can even use Quarians.

STILL havent bought From Ashes  DLC, just to clarify. Holding the line! It's okay if you bought it though. No big deal. Yeah Ashley would be my third choice, although she really has given Kaidan a run for his money given the whole distrust thing and drunkenness. I intend to spare Kaidan on my current ME1 playthrough to give him a chance.

From the Ashes is fun, it shouldn't have been DLC. I was holding the line, but then I wanted more squadies 

[Kaelef]

elecmanexe001 wrote...

Kaelef wrote...

It's not that I don't understand the reasoning and logic behind IT.  I get it.  Within the ME universe, it totally makes sense and, if anything, it would be really unlikely if Shepard weren't indoctronicated after all his exposure to the bad guys.

The thing is that, out here in the real world, IT would make for an incredibly bad and unsatisfying story. I think that's the biggest problem most of the other "anti-IT" people have with it, also, but I could be wrong.  Regardless, I can't think of a way of taking the ending ME3 gave us, turning that into "Shep was indoctrinated", and somehow ending up with a good ending out of that.

If someone has an example of how this could be done, I'd be interested in seeing it.  Considering what I've seen so far, I'd be willing to bet that I'll find the given example(s) really unsatisfying.  But who knows.  Anything's possible.

All I can really ask is, have you enjoyed Bioware's story of Mass Effect up to this point with perhaps minor descrepancies here and there? I would imagine they could pull it off quite. The best explanation to it being a hallucination at least in part is that what you see is you versus your own consiousness, your choosing not to give into TIM as he has hounded you with the idea of control for so long, you are reinforced in your beliefs through Anderson, and so on. Alternatively only pieces of what happened could be illusions... thing of alternate reality games, overlaying over the world. There are a variety of ways they can go about using the idea we can only hope it turns out to be a better option then we have now.

Look, this is all opinion...

I feel that making our character, Shepard, susceptible to indoctrination only brings the entire Mass Effect experience into question.  Up until now, Shepard has basically been immune to indoctrination.  We accept that as one of the little "holes" in the ME universe, just as we accept that it's possible to travel much faster than light, and that it's possible for a single person to foil the plans of the all-powerful reapers on multiple occassions - it makes the story possible and fun.

But IT would take that away.  IT would tell us that even the powerful Shepard can be controlled through indoctrination to the point where he can't tell the difference between reality and fiction.  Once we lose that bit of Shepard "specialness", then all bets are off.  How do we know Shepard was in full control of his mental faculties at any point since first getting up-close-and-personal with Saren and Sovereign?  Even Matriarch Benezia fell victim to their influence, and she's a member of one of the most intelligent, powerful groups in the galaxy!

Now, there's no proof Shepard was "under the influence" that early on, but where it's unthinkable without IT, post-IT it becomes a real possibility.  People can (and probably will) start finding evidence that he was being controlled that early on, just as people have found evidence to support IT in the ME3 ending.

Can you see why some of us would much rather a different solution to the ME3 ending mess was found?  One that doesn't involve Shepard losing control of his mind?

[DJBare]

7he Island Head wrote...

The biggest problem with the IT, is that control is a renegade option. And if you pick control you lose! That means that being a renegade is not a viable way to fight the reapers. If the IT is true it is another unfair treatment of renegade players. Just like the rachni and everything else!
   

I think you kinda missed the point with IT, none of the choices matter with regard to the reapers, the choices are NOT real, the destroy option just allows Shepard to break free of the indoctrination attempt and wake up.

[KingZayd]

Agugaboo wrote...

Agugaboo wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

Agugaboo wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

Agugaboo wrote...

Gorkan86 wrote...

elecmanexe001 wrote...

No where in IT does it suggest friends are indoctrinated.... and they spent far less time near Reapers then you did.

I mention IT specifically to make it clear that if Shepard can be indoctrinated, then his companions too. They have not been with him constantly, but in most encounters with the reaper tech they were present.

Now that would be an epic, horrible end to the series. Shepard has a boss battle with indoctrinated squadmates that he brought for the final mission.

In my case that would be Liara and Garrus...
Imagine fighting ME1 Saren husk and a Banshee at the same time, and knowing exactly who they are.

Guess who Marauder Shields was? (lol jk, but THAT would be a way to give a bittersweet ending. Forcing you to kill your friends to save the galaxy)

If this were the case I'd bring Javik and Kaidan. Oh wait, I've never bothered to save Kaidan in ME1.
[Takes cover from flames.]

I haven't used Javik (although I did buy the DLC some timeafter Tuchanka. Unfortunately, student accomodation internet  prevents me from getting it authorised. By the time I got home, I saw the ending). Kaidan's already dead too.
And really, your whole squad should be running down there with you, since apparently this is the most important mission.

Also, that's just metagaming which i frown upon  Garrus and Liara were with me, but if i was doing the metagaming thing based on people I wouldn't mind dying as much then Ashley and... Jack. If based on who i think would be easy to kill, then can I take joker? erm, probably the same actually. Maybe Tali, since I don't know if the reapers can even use Quarians.

STILL havent bought From Ashes  DLC, just to clarify. Holding the line! It's okay if you bought it though. Will buy if EC is redeeming. No big deal. Yeah Ashley would be my third choice, although she really has given Kaidan a run for his money given the whole distrust thing and drunkenness. I intend to spare Kaidan on my current ME1 playthrough to give him a chance.

Edit: #$^%@ close together edit and quote button 

Haha, I typically don't like using DLC stuff in the main game as I feel as usually I feel DLC things are usually meant as expansion or to give you a boost. Obviously with a game like Mass Effect, leaving the DLC for the very end doesn't work quite as well. And after Tuchanka, I thought "hey for a fiver, I don't mind getting more of this"

[jijeebo]

EsterCloat wrote...

Agugaboo wrote...

EsterCloat wrote...

Agugaboo wrote...

or dinosaurs,

And who doesn't like dinosaurs? Am I right or am I right?

Eexactly
*snip*

We owe a lot to the dinosaurs. Look at this ancient photo.


Godspeed our ancient reptilian saviors.

That made my day.

[Agugaboo]

EsterCloat wrote...

Agugaboo wrote...

EsterCloat wrote...

Agugaboo wrote...

or dinosaurs,

And who doesn't like dinosaurs? Am I right or am I right?

Eexactly
*snip*

We owe a lot to the dinosaurs. Look at this ancient photo.


Godspeed our ancient reptilian saviors.

So THAT'S what happened. :lol:

Edit: jijeebo:ph34r:

Modifié par Agugaboo, 12 mai 2012 - 11:44 .

[Nauks]

ohupthis wrote...
Sounds like both teams are still in denial, huh? LOL

To some degree or another I guess and I may even be sliping in a little hyperbole here and there!
I for one know full well that I.T. may be false, and what ever evidence toward it still found in game may be left-overs from something they dropped at the 11th hour (even though the 11th hour content still looks valid according to the I.T. just not the same)

But seldom do I see an anti-IT argument that doesn't simply spout "you're delusional" - "Bad writing" - "Bioware is Lazy" etc, without at least allowing the possibility for I.T. to even be considered remotely true.

Modifié par Nauks, 12 mai 2012 - 11:48 .

[MetioricTest]

Kaelef wrote...

elecmanexe001 wrote...

Kaelef wrote...

It's
not that I don't understand the reasoning and logic behind IT.  I get
it.  Within the ME universe, it totally makes sense and, if anything, it
would be really unlikely if Shepard weren't indoctronicated after all his exposure to the bad guys.

The thing is that, out here in the real world, IT would make for an incredibly bad and unsatisfying story. I think that's the biggest problem most of the other "anti-IT" people have with it, also, but I could be wrong.  Regardless, I
can't think of a way of taking the ending ME3 gave us, turning that
into "Shep was indoctrinated", and somehow ending up with a good ending
out of that.

If someone has an example of how this
could be done, I'd be interested in seeing it.  Considering what I've
seen so far, I'd be willing to bet that I'll find the given example(s)
really unsatisfying.  But who knows.  Anything's possible.

All I can really ask is, have you enjoyed Bioware's story of Mass
Effect up to this point with perhaps minor descrepancies here and there?
I would imagine they could pull it off quite. The best explanation to
it being a hallucination at least in part is that what you see is
you versus your own consiousness, your choosing not to give into TIM as
he has hounded you with the idea of control for so long, you are
reinforced in your beliefs through Anderson, and so on. Alternatively
only pieces of what happened could be illusions... thing of alternate
reality games, overlaying over the world. There are a variety of ways
they can go about using the idea we can only hope it turns out to be a
better option then we have now.

Look, this is all opinion...

I feel that making our character, Shepard, susceptible to indoctrination only brings the entire Mass Effect experience
into question.  Up until now, Shepard has basically been immune to
indoctrination.  We accept that as one of the little "holes" in the
ME universe, just as we accept that it's possible to travel much faster
than light, and that it's possible for a single person to foil the plans
of the all-powerful reapers on multiple occassions - it makes the story possible and fun.

But
IT would take that away.  IT would tell us that even the powerful
Shepard can be controlled through indoctrination to the point where he
can't tell the difference between reality and fiction.  Once we lose
that bit of Shepard "specialness", then all bets are off.  How do we
know Shepard was in full control of his mental faculties at any point
since first getting up-close-and-personal with Saren and Sovereign? 
Even Matriarch Benezia fell victim to their influence, and she's a
member of one of the most intelligent, powerful groups in the galaxy!

Now,
there's no proof Shepard was "under the influence" that early on, but
where it's unthinkable without IT, post-IT it becomes a real possibility. 
People can (and probably will) start finding evidence that he was being
controlled that early on, just as people have found evidence to support
IT in the ME3 ending.

Can you see why some of us would much rather a different solution to the ME3 ending mess was found?  One that doesn't involve Shepard losing control of his mind?

^ To be honest the whole "Shepard isn't immortal and it throws everything into question with no knowing of what could or couldn't happen next and constant questioning of his actions." sounds awesome. Not a bad thing at all.

In fact it makes him more of a hero.

Modifié par MetioricTest, 12 mai 2012 - 11:45 .

[Khaydarin135]

The problem is not with IT. Its just the ending and from any point of view.

From IT point of view : then we don't really know what happens in the end.
-Are we still at war with the reaper?
-Who wins?

From Literal point of view: Too many inconsistency
-Why are my team member in the normandy?
-How can shepard survive a fall from the citadel if he chose destroy?

The ending is either not finished or contains inconsistency... Choose your flavor.

[OH-UP-THIS!]

KingZayd wrote...

ohupthis wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

7he Island Head wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

You don't only wake up with destroy. You wake up with all 3. The difference is your mental state after waking up.

Is that ingame or in the IT?

IT. (hopefully ingame by Summer )

?????????

One version of breathing........................High EMS+Destroy= breathing

ONE, count it..............1, uno, single,etc.

Just beyond zero, on the plus side, one.

You don't see his corpse in the other endings do you? Beating indoctrination is not the same as Surviving. Why do you think the 2 are linked?

Because everything throughout the 3 games has always been about Stopping/killing/destroying the Reapers, if one is to accept control/synth, then you've simply given in to the Reapers, and are no longer a person with an actual body.

This was explained by star-twit, "control"=you will lose everything you have, "synth"=being absorbed into the collective.

[7he Island Head]

MetioricTest wrote...

Kaelef wrote...

elecmanexe001 wrote...

Kaelef wrote...

It's
not that I don't understand the reasoning and logic behind IT.  I get
it.  Within the ME universe, it totally makes sense and, if anything, it
would be really unlikely if Shepard weren't indoctronicated after all his exposure to the bad guys.

The thing is that, out here in the real world, IT would make for an incredibly bad and unsatisfying story. I think that's the biggest problem most of the other "anti-IT" people have with it, also, but I could be wrong.  Regardless, I
can't think of a way of taking the ending ME3 gave us, turning that
into "Shep was indoctrinated", and somehow ending up with a good ending
out of that.

If someone has an example of how this
could be done, I'd be interested in seeing it.  Considering what I've
seen so far, I'd be willing to bet that I'll find the given example(s)
really unsatisfying.  But who knows.  Anything's possible.

All I can really ask is, have you enjoyed Bioware's story of Mass
Effect up to this point with perhaps minor descrepancies here and there?
I would imagine they could pull it off quite. The best explanation to
it being a hallucination at least in part is that what you see is
you versus your own consiousness, your choosing not to give into TIM as
he has hounded you with the idea of control for so long, you are
reinforced in your beliefs through Anderson, and so on. Alternatively
only pieces of what happened could be illusions... thing of alternate
reality games, overlaying over the world. There are a variety of ways
they can go about using the idea we can only hope it turns out to be a
better option then we have now.

Look, this is all opinion...

I feel that making our character, Shepard, susceptible to indoctrination only brings the entire Mass Effect experience
into question.  Up until now, Shepard has basically been immune to
indoctrination.  We accept that as one of the little "holes" in the
ME universe, just as we accept that it's possible to travel much faster
than light, and that it's possible for a single person to foil the plans
of the all-powerful reapers on multiple occassions - it makes the story possible and fun.

But
IT would take that away.  IT would tell us that even the powerful
Shepard can be controlled through indoctrination to the point where he
can't tell the difference between reality and fiction.  Once we lose
that bit of Shepard "specialness", then all bets are off.  How do we
know Shepard was in full control of his mental faculties at any point
since first getting up-close-and-personal with Saren and Sovereign? 
Even Matriarch Benezia fell victim to their influence, and she's a
member of one of the most intelligent, powerful groups in the galaxy!

Now,
there's no proof Shepard was "under the influence" that early on, but
where it's unthinkable without IT, post-IT it becomes a real possibility. 
People can (and probably will) start finding evidence that he was being
controlled that early on, just as people have found evidence to support
IT in the ME3 ending.

Can you see why some of us would much rather a different solution to the ME3 ending mess was found?  One that doesn't involve Shepard losing control of his mind?

^ To be honest the whole "Shepard isn't immortal and it throws everything into question with no knowing of what could or couldn't happen next and constant questioning of his actions." sounds awesome. Not a bad thing at all.

In fact it makes him more of a hero.

Has anyone looked into indoc evidence in ME1 and ME2?

[KingZayd]

Kaelef wrote...

elecmanexe001 wrote...

Kaelef wrote...

It's not that I don't understand the reasoning and logic behind IT.  I get it.  Within the ME universe, it totally makes sense and, if anything, it would be really unlikely if Shepard weren't indoctronicated after all his exposure to the bad guys.

The thing is that, out here in the real world, IT would make for an incredibly bad and unsatisfying story. I think that's the biggest problem most of the other "anti-IT" people have with it, also, but I could be wrong.  Regardless, I can't think of a way of taking the ending ME3 gave us, turning that into "Shep was indoctrinated", and somehow ending up with a good ending out of that.

If someone has an example of how this could be done, I'd be interested in seeing it.  Considering what I've seen so far, I'd be willing to bet that I'll find the given example(s) really unsatisfying.  But who knows.  Anything's possible.

All I can really ask is, have you enjoyed Bioware's story of Mass Effect up to this point with perhaps minor descrepancies here and there? I would imagine they could pull it off quite. The best explanation to it being a hallucination at least in part is that what you see is you versus your own consiousness, your choosing not to give into TIM as he has hounded you with the idea of control for so long, you are reinforced in your beliefs through Anderson, and so on. Alternatively only pieces of what happened could be illusions... thing of alternate reality games, overlaying over the world. There are a variety of ways they can go about using the idea we can only hope it turns out to be a better option then we have now.

Look, this is all opinion...

I feel that making our character, Shepard, susceptible to indoctrination only brings the entire Mass Effect experience into question.  Up until now, Shepard has basically been immune to indoctrination.  We accept that as one of the little "holes" in the ME universe, just as we accept that it's possible to travel much faster than light, and that it's possible for a single person to foil the plans of the all-powerful reapers on multiple occassions - it makes the story possible and fun.

But IT would take that away.  IT would tell us that even the powerful Shepard can be controlled through indoctrination to the point where he can't tell the difference between reality and fiction.  Once we lose that bit of Shepard "specialness", then all bets are off.  How do we know Shepard was in full control of his mental faculties at any point since first getting up-close-and-personal with Saren and Sovereign?  Even Matriarch Benezia fell victim to their influence, and she's a member of one of the most intelligent, powerful groups in the galaxy!

Now, there's no proof Shepard was "under the influence" that early on, but where it's unthinkable without IT, post-IT it becomes a real possibility.  People can (and probably will) start finding evidence that he was being controlled that early on, just as people have found evidence to support IT in the ME3 ending.

Can you see why some of us would much rather a different solution to the ME3 ending mess was found?  One that doesn't involve Shepard losing control of his mind?

I can see what you're thinking, but i feel the opposite really. I feel that Saren (1.0, pre-indoctrination) was supposed to be every bit as formidable as Shepard was. I feel TIM is meant to be remarkably strong willed. I don't like the idea of Shepard being just naturally immune to indoctrination. I think he should end up in the same struggle. And either fail like the rest (and then we can see if Shepard is willing to make that ultimate sacrifice, suicide interrupt) or fight it, even just to buy him time to complete the damn mission.

Making Shepard JUST THAT STRONG, makes Saren and TIM look so weak in comparison.

Modifié par KingZayd, 12 mai 2012 - 11:47 .

[MetioricTest]

Khaydarin135 wrote...

The problem is not with IT. Its just the ending and from any point of view.

From IT point of view : then we don't really know what happens in the end.
-Are we still at war with the reaper?
-Who wins?

From Literal point of view: Too many inconsistency
-Why are my team member in the normandy?
-How can shepard survive a fall from the citadel if he chose destroy?

The ending is either not finished or contains inconsistency... Choose your flavor.

I choose that Shepard was knocked unconcious by Harby's beam and the whole ending was dreamed.

Meanwhile back in Reality  Garrus made it to the beam and killed all the Reapers.

Modifié par MetioricTest, 12 mai 2012 - 11:51 .

[KingZayd]

ohupthis wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

ohupthis wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

7he Island Head wrote...

KingZayd wrote...

You don't only wake up with destroy. You wake up with all 3. The difference is your mental state after waking up.

Is that ingame or in the IT?

IT. (hopefully ingame by Summer )

?????????

One version of breathing........................High EMS+Destroy= breathing

ONE, count it..............1, uno, single,etc.

Just beyond zero, on the plus side, one.

You don't see his corpse in the other endings do you? Beating indoctrination is not the same as Surviving. Why do you think the 2 are linked?

Because everything throughout the 3 games has always been about Stopping/killing/destroying the Reapers, if one is to accept control/synth, then you've simply given in to the Reapers, and are no longer a person with an actual body.

This was explained by star-twit, "control"=you will lose everything you have, "synth"=being absorbed into the collective.

You're still alive though, even if you're not "yourself"

[7he Island Head]

MetioricTest wrote...

Khaydarin135 wrote...

The problem is not with IT. Its just the ending and from any point of view.

From IT point of view : then we don't really know what happens in the end.
-Are we still at war with the reaper?
-Who wins?

From Literal point of view: Too many inconsistency
-Why are my team member in the normandy?
-How can shepard survive a fall from the citadel if he chose destroy?

The ending is either not finished or contains inconsistency... Choose your flavor.

I choose that Shepard was knocked on concious by Harby's beam and the whole ending was dreamed.

Meanwhile back in Reality  Garrus made it to the beam and killed all the Reapers.

That would be an ending I could fully support!

[DJBare]

Khaydarin135 wrote...

The problem is not with IT. Its just the ending and from any point of view.

From IT point of view : then we don't really know what happens in the end.
-Are we still at war with the reaper?
-Who wins?

No nobody has won anything, the battle is still on.

From Literal point of view: Too many inconsistency
-Why are my team member in the normandy?
-How can shepard survive a fall from the citadel if he chose destroy?

The ending is either not finished or contains inconsistency... Choose your flavor.

When taking IT into account, nothing of what you as the player witnesses after being by hit Harbinger laser is real, that includes the destruction of the relays and the normandy doing a runner and the the world it lands on, all of it is hallucination from Shepard point of view, all of it.

Modifié par DJBare, 12 mai 2012 - 11:49 .

[MetioricTest]

Has anyone looked into indoc evidence in ME1 and ME2?

I don't even care about ME1 and ME2 in this context. I'm just saying I think the whole concept of Shepard being able to die or fail at any time and things might not be as they seem sounds like the makings of a fun and more suspenseful backdrop then Shepard is immortal, always right and always wins.

I think the IT is bogus BTW I'm just saying I don't think this concept is something to be degraded as a bad idea for a game.

[KingZayd]

MetioricTest wrote...

Khaydarin135 wrote...

The problem is not with IT. Its just the ending and from any point of view.

From IT point of view : then we don't really know what happens in the end.
-Are we still at war with the reaper?
-Who wins?

From Literal point of view: Too many inconsistency
-Why are my team member in the normandy?
-How can shepard survive a fall from the citadel if he chose destroy?

The ending is either not finished or contains inconsistency... Choose your flavor.

I choose that Shepard was knocked on concious by Harby's beam and the whole ending was dreamed.

Meanwhile back in Reality  Garrus made it to the beam and killed all the Reapers.

Haha, that's also my headcanon until the EC. Shepard isn't the only competent person on Earth after all.

[7he Island Head]

MetioricTest wrote...

Has anyone looked into indoc evidence in ME1 and ME2?

I don't even care about ME1 and ME2 in this context. I'm just saying I think the whole concept of Shepard being able to die or fail at any time and things might not be as they seem sounds like the makings of a fun and more suspenseful backdrop then Shepard is immortal, always right and always wins.

I think the IT is bogus BTW I'm just saying I don't think this concept is something to be degraded as a bad idea for a game.

One of the endings of ME2 is Shep dieing, it happens if your squad really sucks.... Don't ask how I know about it 

[Kaelef]

7he Island Head wrote...

Has anyone looked into indoc evidence in ME1 and ME2?

It's certain to be there. Partly because BW considered the possibility of Shepard being indoctrinated from very early on, but mostly because it's trivially easy to find evidence to support pretty much any assertion you feel like making.

[KingZayd]

DJBare wrote...

Khaydarin135 wrote...

The problem is not with IT. Its just the ending and from any point of view.

From IT point of view : then we don't really know what happens in the end.
-Are we still at war with the reaper?
-Who wins?

No nobody has won anything, the battle is still on.

From Literal point of view: Too many inconsistency
-Why are my team member in the normandy?
-How can shepard survive a fall from the citadel if he chose destroy?

The ending is either not finished or contains inconsistency... Choose your flavor.

When taking IT into account, nothing of what you as the player witnesses after being by hit Harbinger laser is real, that includes the destruction of the relays and the normandy doing a runner and the the world it lands on, all of it is hallucination from Shepard point of view, all of it.

Apart from the breath. (which i believe would happen in the other endings too)

[MetioricTest]

7he Island Head wrote...

MetioricTest wrote...

Has anyone looked into indoc evidence in ME1 and ME2?

I don't even care about ME1 and ME2 in this context. I'm just saying I think the whole concept of Shepard being able to die or fail at any time and things might not be as they seem sounds like the makings of a fun and more suspenseful backdrop then Shepard is immortal, always right and always wins.

I think the IT is bogus BTW I'm just saying I don't think this concept is something to be degraded as a bad idea for a game.

One of the endings of ME2 is Shep dieing, it happens if your squad really sucks.... Don't ask how I know about it 

I remember when Bioware annouced that ending wasn't cannon and a lot of fans complained. I was like "WTF, you really expect them to have an alternate option in 3 that kills off Shepard and has you play the final game as someone else?"

Sometimes I think people complain too much

It's certain to be there. Partly because BW considered
the possibility of Shepard being indoctrinated from very early on, but
mostly because it's trivially easy to find evidence to support pretty
much any assertion you feel like making.

Well he does spend like 2 days with Object Rho and then go around helping Ceberus for ages I guess.