Tapkomet wrote...
Cuddlezarro wrote...
hoodaticus wrote...
AI's do not have souls, but sufficiently sophisticated ones would have rights if for no other reason than their capacity to suffer in some form.
people dont have souls either
Legion has a soul. Only gingers don't.
Modifié par EsterCloat, 13 mai 2012 - 08:56 .
Guy in the blue uniform sounds like Daro'Xen.Gogzilla wrote...
Bill Casey wrote...
Measure of a Man
This
Superstarsage wrote...
Considering the geth feel fear (regardless of whether you call it based on sheer calculations and that they didn't actually feel the EMOTION fear, they did not want to die)
Modifié par Shallyah, 13 mai 2012 - 09:08 .
Cuddlezarro wrote...
Tapkomet wrote...
Cuddlezarro wrote...
hoodaticus wrote...
AI's do not have souls, but sufficiently sophisticated ones would have rights if for no other reason than their capacity to suffer in some form.
people dont have souls either
Legion has a soul. Only gingers don't.
how can a video game character have a soul?
Modifié par Tapkomet, 13 mai 2012 - 09:09 .
Shallyah wrote...
Geth are an emulation, an imitation of life, not life.
Saying Geth are a form of life is as correct as saying that John Rambo or Indiana Jones are real people.
But in truth, Arnold Schwarzennegger and Harrison Ford are the real people, and those characters are mere interpretations, emulations, imitations. Just as much as the Quarians are the real people and the Geth are interpretations, emulations, and imitations of life.
Whoever doesn't want to see it has gone to deep into Sci-Fi and trespassed the line of Fantasy. Machines are not alive, no matter how hard you try to convince others that they're "sentient" and "sapient". Even if they were, those are not the defining traits of life. A heart pumping, a mother's caress, and a child's smile are the defining traits of life, of which the Geth, or any machines, have none. And if they did it'd be once again Space Magic, not anything that made any sense from any scientifical point of view.
Modifié par Lmaoboat, 13 mai 2012 - 09:28 .
Taboo-XX wrote...
And here is the man who claimed that Bioware supported Fascism.
Terrible trolling.
Tapkomet wrote...
Cuddlezarro wrote...
Tapkomet wrote...
Cuddlezarro wrote...
hoodaticus wrote...
AI's do not have souls, but sufficiently sophisticated ones would have rights if for no other reason than their capacity to suffer in some form.
people dont have souls either
Legion has a soul. Only gingers don't.
how can a video game character have a soul?
He has a video game soul. It's not as good as real (because it's fictional), but it gives access to video game Heaven. He was supposed to be shown at the end of the game (when the Normandy crashed, but they are actually dead).
Rane7685 wrote...
Shallyah wrote...
Geth are an emulation, an imitation of life, not life.
Saying Geth are a form of life is as correct as saying that John Rambo or Indiana Jones are real people.
But in truth, Arnold Schwarzennegger and Harrison Ford are the real people, and those characters are mere interpretations, emulations, imitations. Just as much as the Quarians are the real people and the Geth are interpretations, emulations, and imitations of life.
Whoever doesn't want to see it has gone to deep into Sci-Fi and trespassed the line of Fantasy. Machines are not alive, no matter how hard you try to convince others that they're "sentient" and "sapient". Even if they were, those are not the defining traits of life. A heart pumping, a mother's caress, and a child's smile are the defining traits of life, of which the Geth, or any machines, have none. And if they did it'd be once again Space Magic, not anything that made any sense from any scientifical point of view.
So if we arent meant to care about John Rambo or Indiana as they arent real should we simply be indifferent to this choice. I mean the quarians arent real either they only exist in this particular work of fiction. Why should we care who survives the geth or the quarians they are both make believe. So wipe out quarians or the geth who cares.
Shallyah wrote...
Rane7685 wrote...
Shallyah wrote...
Geth are an emulation, an imitation of life, not life.
Saying Geth are a form of life is as correct as saying that John Rambo or Indiana Jones are real people.
But in truth, Arnold Schwarzennegger and Harrison Ford are the real people, and those characters are mere interpretations, emulations, imitations. Just as much as the Quarians are the real people and the Geth are interpretations, emulations, and imitations of life.
Whoever doesn't want to see it has gone to deep into Sci-Fi and trespassed the line of Fantasy. Machines are not alive, no matter how hard you try to convince others that they're "sentient" and "sapient". Even if they were, those are not the defining traits of life. A heart pumping, a mother's caress, and a child's smile are the defining traits of life, of which the Geth, or any machines, have none. And if they did it'd be once again Space Magic, not anything that made any sense from any scientifical point of view.
So if we arent meant to care about John Rambo or Indiana as they arent real should we simply be indifferent to this choice. I mean the quarians arent real either they only exist in this particular work of fiction. Why should we care who survives the geth or the quarians they are both make believe. So wipe out quarians or the geth who cares.
Heh, well that's the paradox. Well fished.
The most acceptable point I've read today.
Shallyah wrote...
Superstarsage wrote...
Considering the geth feel fear (regardless of whether you call it based on sheer calculations and that they didn't actually feel the EMOTION fear, they did not want to die)
But that's the thing. They do not feel fear, they simply have self-preservation programs and protocols that run a diagnostic of the situation at hand and execute it.
You can argue that's not very diferent to how a human reacts, but I'll call you wrong. If I see a friend outmatched and outnumbered, I'll get over the fear to get hurt and jump at their necks to rip them appart. Something I probably wouldn't do if the person that is being outnumbered and outmatched is someone I don't like or don't know. If Geth #252 sees another Geth outnumbered he'll run an objective analysis of the situation based on its programmed protocols and act in consequence without any factors affecting its decission. It doesn't matter if the Geth that is outnumbered and outmatched is Geth #253 or Geth #12931 since they don't even know what being a friend means, their behavior always boils down to simple calcultions.
Also, it's not that Geth can disagree. It's just that some have diferent programs and logic processes that allow them to reach diferent conclussions. If for one machine 1+1 is 3, the machine is not wrong, because that is the only truth for that machine. The consensus exists so that in the end is decided that 1+1 is 2, because the majority of programs find that answer more accurate to the reality they were programmed for.
Iscariot125 wrote...
This argument tires me out. The only reason it exists is because of familiarity. Out entire arguments for the geth being "people" are entirely based on our assumptions about the closest analogue, which is us.
The argument against could be considered racism, as there was a similar time when we claimed blacks were animals, even though they showed similar traits to what we called "people."
It's called social change. Our definition of "people" changes with the majority, but there will always be a minority of people (and trolls) who refuse to adjust their views to conform to the evolving status quo.
Modifié par vixvicco, 13 mai 2012 - 10:05 .
Kaelef wrote...
The geth are not people. Soylent green is people.
Modifié par Total Biscuit, 13 mai 2012 - 10:37 .
Total Biscuit wrote...
Strictly speaking none of the other species in Mass Effect are 'people' that's a human word to describe other humans, not giant alien pink jelly fish with religious leanings that communicate with bioluminescent patterns, for instance.
The Geth, and all the other aliens, do however meet all the scientific criteria for being classed as both ALIVE, and SAPIENT. Which is really what we mean when we say 'people' anyway.
So either no, the Geth, Turians, Hanar and everyone one else that isn't a ****** Sapien aren't 'people', or yes, they all are, be they made of Dextro protein, or synthetic materials, or whatever.
Both are strictly speaking 'true', but only one makes you sound like a bigoted wanker.
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