score never bothers me. I got 129k the last night, just after a match where I got 117k. None of it would have mattered if the team never worked together to get through it all, including an extraction. My points came from teamwork. I've never seen a person score 100k+ all by themselves in any of the games I've played.
False carry claims coming from Infiltrators/Geth Infiltrators...
Débuté par
Stardusk
, mai 13 2012 10:19
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#77
Posté 13 mai 2012 - 04:05
KaeserZen
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I have to agree with the OP on this one. Infiltrators topping the scoreboard, with sometimes a large gap is not a 100% clear indication about who is carrying who.
I actually kind of expect the infils to top the scoreboard, taking out the strongest ennemies quickly.
@Disciple : Abe and you probably carried this game. It's not that your score is too high, it's the Adept scores that are too low, they should have been able to synch their tactics and detonate a lot more together.
Carrying in my humble opinion is not only about having a far better score, it's as someone pointed out already : winning when what your team does is actually helping the AI more than it is helping your own team.
Carrying is when you start to wonder whether you should revive a guy, because he is so much of a liability that it'd be better to focus on dealing with the mobs. Carrying is when you have to move to support the guys that are already in a very defendable position, because they are having such a hard time holding their ground.
Carrying is when you keep repeatedly dying, because the three team members are focusing their fire at the Cerberus Trooper and the Centurions that are in cover in the killzone, while you take on the bulk of the force that is flanking the team, before you decide to bail out, and they all die.
Carrying is when one of your team mates rushes to revive a fallen squadmate, directly in the LOS of a turret when the combat log still displays the kill, and when your third team mate goes to revive them both, with the combat log displaying BOTH kills.
Carrying is when you see a power specced Asari Adept sporting a Widow and a Claymore.
In a nutshell, carrying is not about the carrier being elite, but about the rest lacking common sense.
I actually kind of expect the infils to top the scoreboard, taking out the strongest ennemies quickly.
@Disciple : Abe and you probably carried this game. It's not that your score is too high, it's the Adept scores that are too low, they should have been able to synch their tactics and detonate a lot more together.
Carrying in my humble opinion is not only about having a far better score, it's as someone pointed out already : winning when what your team does is actually helping the AI more than it is helping your own team.
Carrying is when you start to wonder whether you should revive a guy, because he is so much of a liability that it'd be better to focus on dealing with the mobs. Carrying is when you have to move to support the guys that are already in a very defendable position, because they are having such a hard time holding their ground.
Carrying is when you keep repeatedly dying, because the three team members are focusing their fire at the Cerberus Trooper and the Centurions that are in cover in the killzone, while you take on the bulk of the force that is flanking the team, before you decide to bail out, and they all die.
Carrying is when one of your team mates rushes to revive a fallen squadmate, directly in the LOS of a turret when the combat log still displays the kill, and when your third team mate goes to revive them both, with the combat log displaying BOTH kills.
Carrying is when you see a power specced Asari Adept sporting a Widow and a Claymore.
In a nutshell, carrying is not about the carrier being elite, but about the rest lacking common sense.
#78
Posté 13 mai 2012 - 04:06
SlimJim0725
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So running every objective, reviving everyone even though I am running from the flank (I prefer to cover teammates backs rather then kill everything), only cloak when shooting/reviving/capping objectives, and soloing waves 7 to 9 because 3 teammates couldn't handle 1 phantom while I was taking on 1-3 phantoms and at least 1 atlas can't qualify as carrying? What if 2 of the others were running infiltrators and seeing their loadout didn't give me faith to use another class, but I wanted to give them a chance?
Sorry not everyone can play every class as amazing as you, but it should not take away from their effort regardless of what they use. I am not talking about those matches where teammates play well as a team and teammates are not downing/dying 40 times a match. I am talking about the matches that are pretty much FUBAR from the start and it isn't all easy mode. Before you say anything either, I will play other classes if I know I have a good team or another good infiltrator if something were to go wrong and they had to handle business.
Example: Last night vs Reapers I was running a host HV and the last of the 4 objective hacks were in a bad spot where 3 Brutes were about to charge. I held them off long to where the GI grabbed it and got away before 1 of them instakilled me. He went on to solo the wave and put up like 147k score where the rest of us biotics had 60 to 80k score. I would say I somewhat got carried because without his effort to solo that wave we wouldn't have made extraction.
Tl;dr: Stuff happens and sometimes people carry others. class choice makes no difference IMO, not everyone is so amazing they can stand to run around for 35 mins to do a solo gold run. Players new to gold may be excited they did well and will claim carry. How does this hurt you in any way?
Sorry not everyone can play every class as amazing as you, but it should not take away from their effort regardless of what they use. I am not talking about those matches where teammates play well as a team and teammates are not downing/dying 40 times a match. I am talking about the matches that are pretty much FUBAR from the start and it isn't all easy mode. Before you say anything either, I will play other classes if I know I have a good team or another good infiltrator if something were to go wrong and they had to handle business.
Example: Last night vs Reapers I was running a host HV and the last of the 4 objective hacks were in a bad spot where 3 Brutes were about to charge. I held them off long to where the GI grabbed it and got away before 1 of them instakilled me. He went on to solo the wave and put up like 147k score where the rest of us biotics had 60 to 80k score. I would say I somewhat got carried because without his effort to solo that wave we wouldn't have made extraction.
Tl;dr: Stuff happens and sometimes people carry others. class choice makes no difference IMO, not everyone is so amazing they can stand to run around for 35 mins to do a solo gold run. Players new to gold may be excited they did well and will claim carry. How does this hurt you in any way?
#79
Posté 13 mai 2012 - 05:05
whateverman7
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overall i agree that score isnt a good indicator of carrying a team....i disagree about if you score/outscore people with a particular class, you're carrying a team....reason being score isnt a good indicator....i've played with those that only care about their score, and not whether the mission is successful.....so i let them score all they want by killing(on a side note: it's funny that with all the killing they do, they seem to not kill the targets when it's that objective lol), while i cover their flank, do objectives, etc.....cause that's all i care about: successful missions...
Modifié par whateverman7, 13 mai 2012 - 05:07 .
#80
Posté 13 mai 2012 - 05:10
ChapDev
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Carrying shouldn't have anything to do with your points anyway it should be putting in every effort to get them through the game your points can be crap at the end it doesn't matter.
Carrying for me is using every Medi-gel, Missile, Ammo pack and Field Op pack I have to use to get the team through, revive everyone I can and try and get them as far as I can not a points value.
That is my two cents on it anyway.
Carrying for me is using every Medi-gel, Missile, Ammo pack and Field Op pack I have to use to get the team through, revive everyone I can and try and get them as far as I can not a points value.
That is my two cents on it anyway.
#81
Posté 13 mai 2012 - 05:20
samb
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I am a pretty typical player. Like EVERYONE else on these broads I routinely quadruple the score of everyone else combined. I always carry the team because I'm all that. Oh and I have a massive penis. It's longer than my leg and thicker than a century old oak tree. Talking about my real penis too not my e-peen, because no one exaggerates their own skill and penis online.
#82
Posté 13 mai 2012 - 05:26
Los Tacos Bueno
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If this isn't proof of carry:
Plus, not saying they're bad, but I did help them get to their full extraction for this weekend and I feel good about it.
Plus, not saying they're bad, but I did help them get to their full extraction for this weekend and I feel good about it.
#83
Posté 13 mai 2012 - 05:47
Sakabaka
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My definition of "carry" would be performing a disproportionately large amount of objectives, which includes killing or hacking.
While score is not a perfect benchmark of team contribution, it does represent something around 75%+ of the game's objectives, which mainly involves killing. Though this doesn't represent revives/hacks very well, having a disproportionately large score at the end of the game does indicate the player contributed to a majority of the game's work.
One can pose an argument that simple killing is sometimes not the optimal solution, but 90% of the time, it still helps the team in some manner. I.e., alleviating pressure from search/disable objectives.
Geth Infiltrator, as the best character in game, makes this "carry" easy as it can do a disproportionate amount of killing. In some cases, the discrepancy between killing speed of the Geth Infiltrator and other classes can be so significant that even if the other class is played by a skilled individual, they will be unable to contribute significantly to the team effort. In this situation, while the Geth Infiltrator might be unnecessary to win, he still "carried" by doing the large majority of the work, as if the other three players had been replaced by lesser skilled individuals, the outcome would have been the same.
So, in my opinion, claims that Geth Infiltrators are "carrying" are technically true, but sometimes the carry isn't needed and in some cases, is "forced" by virtue of Geth Infiltrator killing speed.
TLDR version - If someone kills all enemies on the map and does all of the objectives, I feel that's still considered carrying even if you didn't need it. Geth Infiltrators are really good at doing this, even if you don't want them to.
While score is not a perfect benchmark of team contribution, it does represent something around 75%+ of the game's objectives, which mainly involves killing. Though this doesn't represent revives/hacks very well, having a disproportionately large score at the end of the game does indicate the player contributed to a majority of the game's work.
One can pose an argument that simple killing is sometimes not the optimal solution, but 90% of the time, it still helps the team in some manner. I.e., alleviating pressure from search/disable objectives.
Geth Infiltrator, as the best character in game, makes this "carry" easy as it can do a disproportionate amount of killing. In some cases, the discrepancy between killing speed of the Geth Infiltrator and other classes can be so significant that even if the other class is played by a skilled individual, they will be unable to contribute significantly to the team effort. In this situation, while the Geth Infiltrator might be unnecessary to win, he still "carried" by doing the large majority of the work, as if the other three players had been replaced by lesser skilled individuals, the outcome would have been the same.
So, in my opinion, claims that Geth Infiltrators are "carrying" are technically true, but sometimes the carry isn't needed and in some cases, is "forced" by virtue of Geth Infiltrator killing speed.
TLDR version - If someone kills all enemies on the map and does all of the objectives, I feel that's still considered carrying even if you didn't need it. Geth Infiltrators are really good at doing this, even if you don't want them to.
#84
Posté 13 mai 2012 - 05:56
nicethugbert
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Yeah, the rest of the team is playing decoy for them and incapacitating enemies, but, it's the infiltrator that is carrying. Yup, sure.
#85
Posté 13 mai 2012 - 06:50
Achossa
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Carrying is when you're doing the work of three and the other three are doing the work of one.
If you're playing reave and have two other triggering your every BE and you score 150k and they get 50 a piece, you didn't carry.
If you're playing reave and have two other triggering your every BE and you score 150k and they get 50 a piece, you didn't carry.
#86
Guest_death_for_sale_*
Posté 13 mai 2012 - 06:57
Guest_death_for_sale_*
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I find that I need to slow down on my infils. If you play an infiltrator and think you have to carry people, slow down and let the others pick up the slack. I mean, if I am rolling on my GI shotgun build or melee build, I find that I can kill so quickly that the others don't even get a chance to. If I slow down, then 90% of the time the other players will not only carry their own weight, but they will also have more fun.
#87
Posté 13 mai 2012 - 08:31
Disciple888
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KaeserZen wrote...
I have to agree with the OP on this one. Infiltrators topping the scoreboard, with sometimes a large gap is not a 100% clear indication about who is carrying who.
I actually kind of expect the infils to top the scoreboard, taking out the strongest ennemies quickly.
@Disciple : Abe and you probably carried this game. It's not that your score is too high, it's the Adept scores that are too low, they should have been able to synch their tactics and detonate a lot more together.
Well, one of the Adepts was Level 3 when he started playing with me, lol. And abe was actually the funniest, because he kept sending me messages throughout the games like "What's wrong with these guys? Do they know how to stick to cover?" and "Should I even bother reviving them?" I did have 15 revive medals one game and 10 the other, and I always do the objectives (unless a Drell Vanguard thinks he can do it better <_<)
#88
Posté 13 mai 2012 - 09:07
darkblade
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People **** about carrying me all the time....Im a QI you can see why they are wrong.
#89
Posté 13 mai 2012 - 09:50
Killahead
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I just played two gold games against the reapers. A player on my team used an asari justicar the first game, a geth infiltrator with the GPS the next. First game, he scores about 40 000 points. Even if you don't have another biotic user on your team, you can easily score at least twice as much with the AJ. Second game he uses the GI the GPS, scores 120 000 points.
Now, I've been told, when asking for other nerfs (among my requests a general infiltrator nerf), that I want to take away what's fun for other players, and that I shouldn't care because they are helping me win the game.
Guess what, it isn't fun to play in a gold game, trying to take out a couple of marauders and a ravager all shooting at you, only to have a GI pop out of cloak behind you with his charged up GPS and kill them all within three seconds. That just makes me feel dumb for enjoying the challenge, haha. He might as well have said "Haha, look at you, try-hard, why do you do that to yourself?" as he passed me and proceeded to put two brutes out of their misery without even breaking a sweat. They GI's don't leave anything behind, and I like killing the baddies, it's kind of what this game is about. Please, don't give me any of that "use it yourself" crap before thinking it through; I refuse to touch this setup for the same exact reasons that I don't like having it on my team: there's no challenge to it.
Now, I've come to terms with the fact that Bioware won't look into the TC cooldown mechanism because so many enjoy the class the way it is, but this combo, the GI with the GPS, is just downright silly. I probably will have to accept the general awesomeness of the GI, but when wielding a GPS, any player can take it to gold and dominate. At least the melee builds involve some risk.
GPS is a silly gun in general, and Bioware should do something about it. Everyone knows how good the GI is. Together, they make a mockery of gold.
Now, I've been told, when asking for other nerfs (among my requests a general infiltrator nerf), that I want to take away what's fun for other players, and that I shouldn't care because they are helping me win the game.
Guess what, it isn't fun to play in a gold game, trying to take out a couple of marauders and a ravager all shooting at you, only to have a GI pop out of cloak behind you with his charged up GPS and kill them all within three seconds. That just makes me feel dumb for enjoying the challenge, haha. He might as well have said "Haha, look at you, try-hard, why do you do that to yourself?" as he passed me and proceeded to put two brutes out of their misery without even breaking a sweat. They GI's don't leave anything behind, and I like killing the baddies, it's kind of what this game is about. Please, don't give me any of that "use it yourself" crap before thinking it through; I refuse to touch this setup for the same exact reasons that I don't like having it on my team: there's no challenge to it.
Now, I've come to terms with the fact that Bioware won't look into the TC cooldown mechanism because so many enjoy the class the way it is, but this combo, the GI with the GPS, is just downright silly. I probably will have to accept the general awesomeness of the GI, but when wielding a GPS, any player can take it to gold and dominate. At least the melee builds involve some risk.
GPS is a silly gun in general, and Bioware should do something about it. Everyone knows how good the GI is. Together, they make a mockery of gold.
#90
Posté 13 mai 2012 - 09:55
Stardusk
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Killahead wrote...
I just played two gold games against the reapers. A player on my team used an asari justicar the first game, a geth infiltrator with the GPS the next. First game, he scores about 40 000 points. Even if you don't have another biotic user on your team, you can easily score at least twice as much with the AJ. Second game he uses the GI the GPS, scores 120 000 points.
Now, I've been told, when asking for other nerfs (among my requests a general infiltrator nerf), that I want to take away what's fun for other players, and that I shouldn't care because they are helping me win the game.
Guess what, it isn't fun to play in a gold game, trying to take out a couple of marauders and a ravager all shooting at you, only to have a GI pop out of cloak behind you with his charged up GPS and kill them all within three seconds. That just makes me feel dumb for enjoying the challenge, haha. He might as well have said "Haha, look at you, try-hard, why do you do that to yourself?" as he passed me and proceeded to put two brutes out of their misery without even breaking a sweat. They GI's don't leave anything behind, and I like killing the baddies, it's kind of what this game is about. Please, don't give me any of that "use it yourself" crap before thinking it through; I refuse to touch this setup for the same exact reasons that I don't like having it on my team: there's no challenge to it.
Now, I've come to terms with the fact that Bioware won't look into the TC cooldown mechanism because so many enjoy the class the way it is, but this combo, the GI with the GPS, is just downright silly. I probably will have to accept the general awesomeness of the GI, but when wielding a GPS, any player can take it to gold and dominate. At least the melee builds involve some risk.
GPS is a silly gun in general, and Bioware should do something about it. Everyone knows how good the GI is. Together, they make a mockery of gold.
GPS, bleh...
#91
Posté 13 mai 2012 - 10:17
Felhand
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This about sums up my last gold game: I outstriped everyone by at least 60k, I was doing 90% of the revives, I was the guy shooting the hunters as they snuck around behind the rest of my team, I was the one obliterating primes, I was the one using one of my missiles to save everyone on wave 6 map objective and all three on wave 10 for kill objectives (Used old fashioned bullets for the fourth guy.).
So did I feel like I carried someone? No, I dragged them kicking and screaming by there freaking ankles strapped a bib around there necks and forced fed them credits while making choo-choo sounds.
Did I enjoy it? Of course I did, my ego is THIS big! O.O
So did I feel like I carried someone? No, I dragged them kicking and screaming by there freaking ankles strapped a bib around there necks and forced fed them credits while making choo-choo sounds.
Did I enjoy it? Of course I did, my ego is THIS big! O.O
Modifié par Felhand, 13 mai 2012 - 10:45 .
#92
Posté 13 mai 2012 - 10:23
N Malboeuf
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hmmm looks like a cheater score to me, I have sent lots of those to Bio, with vids of auto fire and shooting threw walls. just saying, what sticks out is they had 40k+ where noobs should have had less and this means you played with ppl with skill so carrying does not come to mind, cheating does thoLos Tacos Bueno wrote...
If this isn't proof of carry:
Plus, not saying they're bad, but I did help them get to their full extraction for this weekend and I feel good about it.
I'm not calling ya a cheator but only time I see those scores are when that happens
#93
Posté 13 mai 2012 - 10:28
Mystical_Gaming
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yeah I'm quite sure score =/= skill in this game. Everyone is an essential player on the team. I am a support role so scoring a ton is not my job. I keep the team alive by reviving or doing the objectives. My other teammates get the majority of kills while I throw support down. Like when I play as an Asari Vanguard all I do is use stasis on enemies to help teammates kill them faster. I don't care if I get the kill when the enemy has a sliver of health left or not, just as long as the enemy dies.
To say I have no skill because I got lowest score is hilarious. If I was playing as the main slayer on the team with a build made to kill and not support of course I could get a higher score. But I like helping out and being a support role. There is plenty of work to be done on the support role which many people don't seem to like to do, they just want to kill kill kill but I like to revive, get objectives done, and slow enemies down for teammates.
To say I have no skill because I got lowest score is hilarious. If I was playing as the main slayer on the team with a build made to kill and not support of course I could get a higher score. But I like helping out and being a support role. There is plenty of work to be done on the support role which many people don't seem to like to do, they just want to kill kill kill but I like to revive, get objectives done, and slow enemies down for teammates.
#94
Posté 13 mai 2012 - 10:33
SweetWilly013
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Oh hey another thread from stardusk complaining about infiltrators...
cool story bro
cool story bro
#95
Posté 13 mai 2012 - 10:41
Apl_Juice
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>_>
Carrying a team is when you're the sole survivor on multiple waves, having to deal with multiple enemies due to your team's ineptitude. Your score will end up reflecting that, yes, but it is NOT the other way around.
Simply having a higher score (even significantly higher) does not mean you carried the team. This is most apparent with GIs, as they can sprint around the map destroying entire spawns before anyone else has a chance to attack. In this case, your teammates aren't bad just because you're killing everything first; they're just lagging behind.
Carrying a team is when you're the sole survivor on multiple waves, having to deal with multiple enemies due to your team's ineptitude. Your score will end up reflecting that, yes, but it is NOT the other way around.
Simply having a higher score (even significantly higher) does not mean you carried the team. This is most apparent with GIs, as they can sprint around the map destroying entire spawns before anyone else has a chance to attack. In this case, your teammates aren't bad just because you're killing everything first; they're just lagging behind.
#96
Posté 13 mai 2012 - 11:17
Stardusk
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SweetWilly013 wrote...
Oh hey another thread from stardusk complaining about infiltrators...
cool story bro
Such threads are necessitated by the pernicious and false belief that Infiltrators outscoring their teammates are "carrying them".
#97
Posté 13 mai 2012 - 11:26
SweetWilly013
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Can't say I disagree though. Score is not an indicator of carrying in most cases. Reviving your teamates constantly while not being downed yourself? A little closer.
Modifié par SweetWilly013, 13 mai 2012 - 11:27 .
#98
Posté 13 mai 2012 - 11:49
TCGwasHERE
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I was playing with a proxy bomb spamming geth Infiltrator last night and he completely outcsored me, which never happens btw, and we were perfectly fine. he didn't carry ****. I agree Star
#99
Posté 13 mai 2012 - 11:54
Sacramentum
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Score doesn't matter in most cases. Some classes score higher than others. Quarian Inf scores low, Salarian inf scores high. Asari adept scores high, human soldier scores low. As long as they were helping, whats the problem?
#100
Posté 13 mai 2012 - 11:56
Sacramentum
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That seems fairly reasonable. I doubt he was cheating.N Malboeuf wrote...
hmmm looks like a cheater score to me, I have sent lots of those to Bio, with vids of auto fire and shooting threw walls. just saying, what sticks out is they had 40k+ where noobs should have had less and this means you played with ppl with skill so carrying does not come to mind, cheating does thoLos Tacos Bueno wrote...
If this isn't proof of carry:
Plus, not saying they're bad, but I did help them get to their full extraction for this weekend and I feel good about it.
I'm not calling ya a cheator but only time I see those scores are when that happens
