461 réponses à ce sujet

[fr33stylez]

Auralius Carolus wrote...

#2. Substitution, not exclusion, is Bioware's keystone method of progressing the lore in Mass Effect 3. There are over a dozen different characters that can die as a result of Shepard's actions/inactions and in the event that one is missing, another is there to take its place. All corresponding events will still occur as well, (i.e., Kirrahe will distract Kai on the Citadel if Thane dies in ME2, Alliance Special Forces will distroy the Alpha Relay for you, etc.). Therefore, if a critical event resulting in Shepard's indoctrination were to occur in DLC, the core of the lore, (the state of indoctrination), would not change simply because a given player didn't play "Arrival"; the specifics would be substituted in order to satisfy the base narrative.

I'm confused...so you're saying:

1) If your Shepard never played Arrival DLC
  a) Which results in Hackett sending an Alliance team to destroy the relay,
  Which means Shepard never was in contact with Object Rho on Project Base...

...Still means Shepard was in contact with Object Rho?

If what you're saying was true, the developers simply would've kept the intro of ME2 the same for all Shepards, i.e. Shepard plays Arrival whether or not YOUR Shepard actually played it. Rather, the developers distinctly made the choice to say Hackett ordered someone else to blow up the relay on Project Base, not Shepard. There is no opportunity for intreraction with Project Rho in this case. However, according to IT, Shepard is indoctrinated all the same.

You cannot point to Arrival and say all Shepards experience Object Rho when the game explicitly states otherwise.

Modifié par fr33stylez, 14 mai 2012 - 04:23 .

[111987]

fr33stylez wrote...

Auralius Carolus wrote...

#2. Substitution, not exclusion, is Bioware's keystone method of progressing the lore in Mass Effect 3. There are over a dozen different characters that can die as a result of Shepard's actions/inactions and in the event that one is missing, another is there to take its place. All corresponding events will still occur as well, (i.e., Kirrahe will distract Kai on the Citadel if Thane dies in ME2, Alliance Special Forces will distroy the Alpha Relay for you, etc.). Therefore, if a critical event resulting in Shepard's indoctrination were to occur in DLC, the core of the lore, (the state of indoctrination), would not change simply because a given player didn't play "Arrival"; the specifics would be substituted in order to satisfy the base narrative.

I'm confused...so you're saying:

1) If your Shepard never played Arrival DLC
  a) Which results in Hackett sending an Alliance team to destroy the relay,
  Which means Shepard never was in contact with Object Rho on Project Base...

...Still means Shepard was in contact with Object Rho?

If what you're saying was true, the developers simply would've kept the intro of ME2 the same for all Shepards, i.e. Shepard plays Arrival whether or not YOUR Shepard actually played it. Rather, the developers distinctly made the choice to say Hackett ordered someone else to blow up the relay on Project Base, not Shepard. There is no opportunity for intreraction with Project Rho in this case. However, according to IT, Shepard is indoctrinated all the same.

You cannot point to Arrival and say all Shepards experience Object Rho when the game explicitly states otherwise.

I believe he is saying that if Shep wasn't put into contact with Object Rho, BioWare would make up some other reason he was indoctrinated.

[blooregard]

fr33stylez wrote...

Auralius Carolus wrote...

#2. Substitution, not exclusion, is Bioware's keystone method of progressing the lore in Mass Effect 3. There are over a dozen different characters that can die as a result of Shepard's actions/inactions and in the event that one is missing, another is there to take its place. All corresponding events will still occur as well, (i.e., Kirrahe will distract Kai on the Citadel if Thane dies in ME2, Alliance Special Forces will distroy the Alpha Relay for you, etc.). Therefore, if a critical event resulting in Shepard's indoctrination were to occur in DLC, the core of the lore, (the state of indoctrination), would not change simply because a given player didn't play "Arrival"; the specifics would be substituted in order to satisfy the base narrative.

I'm confused...so you're saying:

1) If your Shepard never played Arrival DLC
  a) Which results in Hackett sending an Alliance team to destroy the relay,
  Which means Shepard never was in contact with Object Rho on Project Base...

...Still means Shepard was in contact with Object Rho?

If what you're saying was true, the developers simply would've kept the intro of ME2 the same for all Shepards, i.e. Shepard plays Arrival whether or not YOUR Shepard actually played it. Rather, the developers distinctly made the choice to say Hackett ordered someone else to blow up the relay on Project Base, not Shepard. There is no opportunity for intreraction with Project Rho in this case. However, according to IT, Shepard is indoctrinated all the same.

You cannot point to Arrival and say all Shepards experience Object Rho when the game explicitly states otherwise.

I think ME: Conviction which was written by Mac Walters states that Shepard destroying the alpha relay is canon as to why the game says differently I don't know

[Tom Lehrer]

blooregard wrote...

I think ME: Conviction which was written by Mac Walters states that Shepard destroying the alpha relay is canon as to why the game says differently I don't know

Well there is your problem. That guy cant keep his hat on straight let alone ME lore.

[Geomon19]

jijeebo wrote...
your imagination is impressive.

That's the first thing you've said in this entire thread that has made sense. Thank you sir/madam.

[blooregard]

Tom Lehrer wrote...

blooregard wrote...

I think ME: Conviction which was written by Mac Walters states that Shepard destroying the alpha relay is canon as to why the game says differently I don't know

Well there is your problem. That guy cant keep his hat on straight let alone ME lore.

Well we have Mac who wrote something that states that Shepard popped the Bahak system which would greatly support indoctrination theory then we have the beginning of the game that states that (provided you didn't play arrival) Shepard didn't pop the Bahak system.

Since I believe bioware has said things in the past like Arrival is the perfect transition into ME3 and such I'm inclined to believe ME: Conviction's interpretation that Shepard blew up the alpha Relay

[Auralius Carolus]

111987 wrote...

fr33stylez wrote...

Auralius Carolus wrote...

#2. Substitution, not exclusion, is Bioware's keystone method of progressing the lore in Mass Effect 3. There are over a dozen different characters that can die as a result of Shepard's actions/inactions and in the event that one is missing, another is there to take its place. All corresponding events will still occur as well, (i.e., Kirrahe will distract Kai on the Citadel if Thane dies in ME2, Alliance Special Forces will distroy the Alpha Relay for you, etc.). Therefore, if a critical event resulting in Shepard's indoctrination were to occur in DLC, the core of the lore, (the state of indoctrination), would not change simply because a given player didn't play "Arrival"; the specifics would be substituted in order to satisfy the base narrative.

I'm confused...so you're saying:

1) If your Shepard never played Arrival DLC
  a) Which results in Hackett sending an Alliance team to destroy the relay,
  Which means Shepard never was in contact with Object Rho on Project Base...

...Still means Shepard was in contact with Object Rho?

If what you're saying was true, the developers simply would've kept the intro of ME2 the same for all Shepards, i.e. Shepard plays Arrival whether or not YOUR Shepard actually played it. Rather, the developers distinctly made the choice to say Hackett ordered someone else to blow up the relay on Project Base, not Shepard. There is no opportunity for intreraction with Project Rho in this case. However, according to IT, Shepard is indoctrinated all the same.

You cannot point to Arrival and say all Shepards experience Object Rho when the game explicitly states otherwise.

I believe he is saying that if Shep wasn't put into contact with Object Rho, BioWare would make up some other reason he was indoctrinated.

That's exactly what I'm saying. I've added emphasis to my earlier quote for clarity, as it is really not that difficult to comprehend.

Bioware has performed this substitution/mild alteration trick time after time in this game, both for vanilla choices and past DLC consideration. Simply because someone did not play Arrival, will not stop Bioware from instituting IT in everyone's gameplay if that has been their goal all along. The biggest difference would likely be the clear, defining moment of nanite implantation and the potential of hearing Harbinger declare, "Struggle if you wish, your mind will be mine."

[Elyiia]

111987 wrote...

I believe he is saying that if Shep wasn't put into contact with Object Rho, BioWare would make up some other reason he was indoctrinated.

Which would have been in game. Otherwise it pretty much is "Hey remember that time you went to X, lol indoctrinated."

[dreman9999]

Elyiia wrote...

111987 wrote...

I believe he is saying that if Shep wasn't put into contact with Object Rho, BioWare would make up some other reason he was indoctrinated.

Which would have been in game. Otherwise it pretty much is "Hey remember that time you went to X, lol indoctrinated."

That wast he 3 years of on and off contact with reaper tech.

[Elyiia]

dreman9999 wrote...

Elyiia wrote...

111987 wrote...

I believe he is saying that if Shep wasn't put into contact with Object Rho, BioWare would make up some other reason he was indoctrinated.

Which would have been in game. Otherwise it pretty much is "Hey remember that time you went to X, lol indoctrinated."

That wast he 3 years of on and off contact with reaper tech.

Shepard hasn't even been alive for three years and no Reaper tech was used in bringing Shepard back.

[dreman9999]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Many of those shouldn't count simply because they aren't established sources of indoctrination. Reaper troops and Dragon's Teeth aren't established indoctrination means, nor has the Collector Ship, Collector Base or proto-Reaper even been established to have the capacity to indoctrinat anyone, nor did Shepard's team ever voice any warning signs.

Yes they areastablished...
http://masseffect.wi...#Indoctrination 
 Ultimately, the Reaper gains the ability to use the victim's body to amplify its signals 

And for dragons teeth...
http://masseffect.wi...ing_Survey_Team 

[Raiil]

dreman9999 wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Many of those shouldn't count simply because they aren't established sources of indoctrination. Reaper troops and Dragon's Teeth aren't established indoctrination means, nor has the Collector Ship, Collector Base or proto-Reaper even been established to have the capacity to indoctrinat anyone, nor did Shepard's team ever voice any warning signs.

Yes they areastablished...
http://masseffect.wi...#Indoctrination 
 Ultimately, the Reaper gains the ability to use the victim's body to amplify its signals 

And for dragons teeth...
http://masseffect.wi...ing_Survey_Team 

That's not what he's saying. No one's arguing that it's possible, but things like Dragon's Teeth aren't proved to be remote indoctrination devices. Insofar as we know, Dragon's Teeth must physically rip through the body in order to work, and nothing states- even remotely- that Collector Ships have the passive indoctrination powers that the dead Reaper bodies do. We don't know if they're made of the same material or for the same purpose.

[dreman9999]

Elyiia wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Elyiia wrote...

111987 wrote...

I believe he is saying that if Shep wasn't put into contact with Object Rho, BioWare would make up some other reason he was indoctrinated.

Which would have been in game. Otherwise it pretty much is "Hey remember that time you went to X, lol indoctrinated."

That wast he 3 years of on and off contact with reaper tech.

Shepard hasn't even been alive for three years and no Reaper tech was used in bringing Shepard back.

2 years...But reaperindoctination still work when yourdead...Look at Saren..You stillhave everything in ME1 from eden prime, virmire, every indoctriantedagent and husk, the battle of the citadel. Then there's Everytime you fight the collectors in ME2,the dead reaper,the collector base andthe baby reaper. Added all the reaper forces you fight in ME3.

[Sisterofshane]

dreman9999 wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Many of those shouldn't count simply because they aren't established sources of indoctrination. Reaper troops and Dragon's Teeth aren't established indoctrination means, nor has the Collector Ship, Collector Base or proto-Reaper even been established to have the capacity to indoctrinat anyone, nor did Shepard's team ever voice any warning signs.

Yes they areastablished...
http://masseffect.wi...#Indoctrination 
 Ultimately, the Reaper gains the ability to use the victim's body to amplify its signals 

And for dragons teeth...
http://masseffect.wi...ing_Survey_Team 

Actually, in the middle of the largest cavern where you find the Exo Geni scientists, there is an object remarkably similar to Object Rho with a large glowing orb in the center. I always figured that was what indoctrinated the scientists, who then (like in the derelict Reaper), implaed themselves upon the dragons teeth.

The only reason I remember that was because Garrus specifically says (in reference to what brainwashed the scientists) "Well, whatever it was, it's long gone now." and I thought to myself : "Um, no it's not, it's sitting right out here in the middle of the cave"

[dreman9999]

Valentia X wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Many of those shouldn't count simply because they aren't established sources of indoctrination. Reaper troops and Dragon's Teeth aren't established indoctrination means, nor has the Collector Ship, Collector Base or proto-Reaper even been established to have the capacity to indoctrinat anyone, nor did Shepard's team ever voice any warning signs.

Yes they areastablished...
http://masseffect.wi...#Indoctrination 
 Ultimately, the Reaper gains the ability to use the victim's body to amplify its signals 

And for dragons teeth...
http://masseffect.wi...ing_Survey_Team 

That's not what he's saying. No one's arguing that it's possible, but things like Dragon's Teeth aren't proved to be remote indoctrination devices. Insofar as we know, Dragon's Teeth must physically rip through the body in order to work, and nothing states- even remotely- that Collector Ships have the passive indoctrination powers that the dead Reaper bodies do. We don't know if they're made of the same material or for the same purpose.

According to Trebin's data on the Galaxy Map, the planet seems to continually suffer communication problems. After the Mako makes planetfall, Shepard's team explores the surface and finds and disables a transmitter surrounded by crashed communication probes. The device had been transmitting tightbeam signals into geosynchronous orbit, disrupting the survey team's GPS satellites. It was this that caused them to crash. The squad then discovers the survey team's base, completely deserted. A log entry in one of the computers points them toward an excavation site where the survey team apparently found some sort of alien technology. Head over to the excavation site and enter it.The excavation site is a mine, so head down and to the first landing of sorts
Once the husks have been cleared out, the assignment is over.Head down in to both tunnels to discover stacks of dragon's teeth, but there's no explanation as to where they came from or who buried them here. One of your squadmates will say that they have heard of something similar to this and puts forward the theory that the alien technology they found transformed them, turning them into machine cultists. In each of the tunnels is a crate and there are two crates in the main chamber along with a med kit near the entrance of the main chamber.
......

[Raiil]

dreman9999 wrote...

Elyiia wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Elyiia wrote...

111987 wrote...

I believe he is saying that if Shep wasn't put into contact with Object Rho, BioWare would make up some other reason he was indoctrinated.

Which would have been in game. Otherwise it pretty much is "Hey remember that time you went to X, lol indoctrinated."

That wast he 3 years of on and off contact with reaper tech.

Shepard hasn't even been alive for three years and no Reaper tech was used in bringing Shepard back.

2 years...But reaperindoctination still work when yourdead...Look at Saren..You stillhave everything in ME1 from eden prime, virmire, every indoctriantedagent and husk, the battle of the citadel. Then there's Everytime you fight the collectors in ME2,the dead reaper,the collector base andthe baby reaper. Added all the reaper forces you fight in ME3.

Sovie's using Saren's body is more akin to remote puppet manipulation. He's not controlling Saren's brain- it's dead, and in the case where you convince him to kill himself, pretty much gone. He's not telling Saren to 'move'; it looks more like he's simply manipulating pre-existing implants to move in a specific pattern so as to kill Shepard. Puppet strings.

[balance5050]

Valentia X wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Many of those shouldn't count simply because they aren't established sources of indoctrination. Reaper troops and Dragon's Teeth aren't established indoctrination means, nor has the Collector Ship, Collector Base or proto-Reaper even been established to have the capacity to indoctrinat anyone, nor did Shepard's team ever voice any warning signs.

Yes they areastablished...
http://masseffect.wi...#Indoctrination 
 Ultimately, the Reaper gains the ability to use the victim's body to amplify its signals 

And for dragons teeth...
http://masseffect.wi...ing_Survey_Team 

That's not what he's saying. No one's arguing that it's possible, but things like Dragon's Teeth aren't proved to be remote indoctrination devices. Insofar as we know, Dragon's Teeth must physically rip through the body in order to work, and nothing states- even remotely- that Collector Ships have the passive indoctrination powers that the dead Reaper bodies do. We don't know if they're made of the same material or for the same purpose.

"An excavation team in the Minos Wasteland on the planet Aequitas found a Reaper artifact that creates advanced husks. This device does not resemble dragon's teeth at all, instead featuring an orb of energy that turned the excavation team into husks with what appears to be a form of indoctrination, according to logs kept by the team, before it started creating more husks."

[Elyiia]

dreman9999 wrote...

Elyiia wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Elyiia wrote...

111987 wrote...

I believe he is saying that if Shep wasn't put into contact with Object Rho, BioWare would make up some other reason he was indoctrinated.

Which would have been in game. Otherwise it pretty much is "Hey remember that time you went to X, lol indoctrinated."

That wast he 3 years of on and off contact with reaper tech.

Shepard hasn't even been alive for three years and no Reaper tech was used in bringing Shepard back.

2 years...But reaperindoctination still work when yourdead...Look at Saren..You stillhave everything in ME1 from eden prime, virmire, every indoctriantedagent and husk, the battle of the citadel. Then there's Everytime you fight the collectors in ME2,the dead reaper,the collector base andthe baby reaper. Added all the reaper forces you fight in ME3.

Saren was dead prior to commiting suicide? News to me!
Shepard was dead for two years, there's no evidence to suggest that the Reaper nanites would have stayed in a corpse for two years. Also, you're missing the sixth months he was in lockdown, or are you trying to claim he was playing with Reaper tech there too?
The Collector base, seriously? You have no, and I repeat no, evidence that says the Collector base indoctrinates. Why would they build it to indoctrinate when organics are not supposed to reach it.

The leaps in logic are amazing.

[Raiil]

dreman9999 wrote...

Valentia X wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Many of those shouldn't count simply because they aren't established sources of indoctrination. Reaper troops and Dragon's Teeth aren't established indoctrination means, nor has the Collector Ship, Collector Base or proto-Reaper even been established to have the capacity to indoctrinat anyone, nor did Shepard's team ever voice any warning signs.

Yes they areastablished...
http://masseffect.wi...#Indoctrination 
 Ultimately, the Reaper gains the ability to use the victim's body to amplify its signals 

And for dragons teeth...
http://masseffect.wi...ing_Survey_Team 

That's not what he's saying. No one's arguing that it's possible, but things like Dragon's Teeth aren't proved to be remote indoctrination devices. Insofar as we know, Dragon's Teeth must physically rip through the body in order to work, and nothing states- even remotely- that Collector Ships have the passive indoctrination powers that the dead Reaper bodies do. We don't know if they're made of the same material or for the same purpose.

According to Trebin's data on the Galaxy Map, the planet seems to continually suffer communication problems. After the Mako makes planetfall, Shepard's team explores the surface and finds and disables a transmitter surrounded by crashed communication probes. The device had been transmitting tightbeam signals into geosynchronous orbit, disrupting the survey team's GPS satellites. It was this that caused them to crash. The squad then discovers the survey team's base, completely deserted. A log entry in one of the computers points them toward an excavation site where the survey team apparently found some sort of alien technology. Head over to the excavation site and enter it.The excavation site is a mine, so head down and to the first landing of sorts
Once the husks have been cleared out, the assignment is over.Head down in to both tunnels to discover stacks of dragon's teeth, but there's no explanation as to where they came from or who buried them here. One of your squadmates will say that they have heard of something similar to this and puts forward the theory that the alien technology they found transformed them, turning them into machine cultists. In each of the tunnels is a crate and there are two crates in the main chamber along with a med kit near the entrance of the main chamber.
......

Which doesn't prove your point at all. Pre-existing dragon's teeth doesn't mean that they remotely turned them into husks; in fact, going by what we have visual proof on, it's more likely that they got stabbed by the teeth and then turned into the husks, as we have seen happen repeatedly in the game.

[Elyiia]

balance5050 wrote...

"An excavation team in the Minos Wasteland on the planet Aequitas found a Reaper artifact that creates advanced husks. This device does not resemble dragon's teeth at all, instead featuring an orb of energy that turned the excavation team into husks with what appears to be a form of indoctrination, according to logs kept by the team, before it started creating more husks."

Seriously? This device does not resemble dragon's teeth at all. They have different purposes, one does not prove the other indoctrinates by being there.

Modifié par Elyiia, 14 mai 2012 - 06:07 .

[Raiil]

balance5050 wrote...

Valentia X wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Many of those shouldn't count simply because they aren't established sources of indoctrination. Reaper troops and Dragon's Teeth aren't established indoctrination means, nor has the Collector Ship, Collector Base or proto-Reaper even been established to have the capacity to indoctrinat anyone, nor did Shepard's team ever voice any warning signs.

Yes they areastablished...
http://masseffect.wi...#Indoctrination 
 Ultimately, the Reaper gains the ability to use the victim's body to amplify its signals 

And for dragons teeth...
http://masseffect.wi...ing_Survey_Team 

That's not what he's saying. No one's arguing that it's possible, but things like Dragon's Teeth aren't proved to be remote indoctrination devices. Insofar as we know, Dragon's Teeth must physically rip through the body in order to work, and nothing states- even remotely- that Collector Ships have the passive indoctrination powers that the dead Reaper bodies do. We don't know if they're made of the same material or for the same purpose.

[color=rgb(255, 255, 255)">"An excavation team in the ] on the planet [/color]Aequitas found a Reaper artifact that creates advanced husks. This device does not resemble dragon's teeth at all, instead featuring an orb of energy that turned the excavation team into husks with what appears to be a form of indoctrination, according to logs kept by the team, before it started creating more husks."

And guess what- it's not dragon's teeth. And no one's arguing that remote indoctrination isn't possible. What is being said is that there is no proof that every Reaper creation is able to remotely indoctrinate. Everyone knows that there are devices in game- such as this orb, or Reaper bodies- that can indoctrinate you. But Reaper things that can indoctrinate passively =/= all reaper things can indoctrinate you.

[dreman9999]

Sisterofshane wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Many of those shouldn't count simply because they aren't established sources of indoctrination. Reaper troops and Dragon's Teeth aren't established indoctrination means, nor has the Collector Ship, Collector Base or proto-Reaper even been established to have the capacity to indoctrinat anyone, nor did Shepard's team ever voice any warning signs.

Yes they areastablished...
http://masseffect.wi...#Indoctrination 
 Ultimately, the Reaper gains the ability to use the victim's body to amplify its signals 

And for dragons teeth...
http://masseffect.wi...ing_Survey_Team 

Actually, in the middle of the largest cavern where you find the Exo Geni scientists, there is an object remarkably similar to Object Rho with a large glowing orb in the center. I always figured that was what indoctrinated the scientists, who then (like in the derelict Reaper), implaed themselves upon the dragons teeth.

The only reason I remember that was because Garrus specifically says (in reference to what brainwashed the scientists) "Well, whatever it was, it's long gone now." and I thought to myself : "Um, no it's not, it's sitting right out here in the middle of the cave"

I just rewatched it...That's a good point but that still leaves the husk though who are on the dragons teeth.

[Sisterofshane]

dreman9999 wrote...

Sisterofshane wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Many of those shouldn't count simply because they aren't established sources of indoctrination. Reaper troops and Dragon's Teeth aren't established indoctrination means, nor has the Collector Ship, Collector Base or proto-Reaper even been established to have the capacity to indoctrinat anyone, nor did Shepard's team ever voice any warning signs.

Yes they areastablished...
http://masseffect.wi...#Indoctrination 
 Ultimately, the Reaper gains the ability to use the victim's body to amplify its signals 

And for dragons teeth...
http://masseffect.wi...ing_Survey_Team 

Actually, in the middle of the largest cavern where you find the Exo Geni scientists, there is an object remarkably similar to Object Rho with a large glowing orb in the center. I always figured that was what indoctrinated the scientists, who then (like in the derelict Reaper), implaed themselves upon the dragons teeth.

The only reason I remember that was because Garrus specifically says (in reference to what brainwashed the scientists) "Well, whatever it was, it's long gone now." and I thought to myself : "Um, no it's not, it's sitting right out here in the middle of the cave"

I just rewatched it...That's a good point but that still leaves the husk though who are on the dragons teeth.

Why do they need to be indoctrinated when they are husks?  Aren't they then basically mindless shock troops that attack anything they are lobbed at?

[dreman9999]

Valentia X wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

Valentia X wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Many of those shouldn't count simply because they aren't established sources of indoctrination. Reaper troops and Dragon's Teeth aren't established indoctrination means, nor has the Collector Ship, Collector Base or proto-Reaper even been established to have the capacity to indoctrinat anyone, nor did Shepard's team ever voice any warning signs.

Yes they areastablished...
http://masseffect.wi...#Indoctrination 
 Ultimately, the Reaper gains the ability to use the victim's body to amplify its signals 

And for dragons teeth...
http://masseffect.wi...ing_Survey_Team 

That's not what he's saying. No one's arguing that it's possible, but things like Dragon's Teeth aren't proved to be remote indoctrination devices. Insofar as we know, Dragon's Teeth must physically rip through the body in order to work, and nothing states- even remotely- that Collector Ships have the passive indoctrination powers that the dead Reaper bodies do. We don't know if they're made of the same material or for the same purpose.

[color=rgb(255, 255, 255)">"An excavation team in the ] on the planet [/color]Aequitas found a Reaper artifact that creates advanced husks. This device does not resemble dragon's teeth at all, instead featuring an orb of energy that turned the excavation team into husks with what appears to be a form of indoctrination, according to logs kept by the team, before it started creating more husks."

And guess what- it's not dragon's teeth. And no one's arguing that remote indoctrination isn't possible. What is being said is that there is no proof that every Reaper creation is able to remotely indoctrinate. Everyone knows that there are devices in game- such as this orb, or Reaper bodies- that can indoctrinate you. But Reaper things that can indoctrinate passively =/= all reaper things can indoctrinate you.

1. me3..Hanar diplomat.
2.me3...Every cerberus Solder.
4. ME:RETRIBUTION.....pAULGRAYSON.
5.


6. ME2:arrival....The team on the project...

.... 

[dreman9999]

Sisterofshane wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Sisterofshane wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Many of those shouldn't count simply because they aren't established sources of indoctrination. Reaper troops and Dragon's Teeth aren't established indoctrination means, nor has the Collector Ship, Collector Base or proto-Reaper even been established to have the capacity to indoctrinat anyone, nor did Shepard's team ever voice any warning signs.

Yes they areastablished...
http://masseffect.wi...#Indoctrination 
 Ultimately, the Reaper gains the ability to use the victim's body to amplify its signals 

And for dragons teeth...
http://masseffect.wi...ing_Survey_Team 

Actually, in the middle of the largest cavern where you find the Exo Geni scientists, there is an object remarkably similar to Object Rho with a large glowing orb in the center. I always figured that was what indoctrinated the scientists, who then (like in the derelict Reaper), implaed themselves upon the dragons teeth.

The only reason I remember that was because Garrus specifically says (in reference to what brainwashed the scientists) "Well, whatever it was, it's long gone now." and I thought to myself : "Um, no it's not, it's sitting right out here in the middle of the cave"

I just rewatched it...That's a good point but that still leaves the husk though who are on the dragons teeth.

Why do they need to be indoctrinated when they are husks?  Aren't they then basically mindless shock troops that attack anything they are lobbed at?

No...No...no..no.
I'm saying husk give off indoctriantion feilds..