nightcobra8928 wrote...
Elyiia wrote...
I don't have to consider anything. Fact: This message appears immediately after choosing one of the options and going through the cutscenes. Fact: If IT is true, Shepard has not defeated the Reapers. Therefore message discredits IT.
if IT is true then we haven't seen shepard defeat the reapers...yet.
If we haven't defeated the Reapers, they wouldn't tell us that we've defeated the Reapers.nightcobra8928 wrote...
Elyiia wrote...
I don't have to consider anything. Fact: This message appears immediately after choosing one of the options and going through the cutscenes. Fact: If IT is true, Shepard has not defeated the Reapers. Therefore message discredits IT.
if IT is true then we haven't seen shepard defeat the reapers...yet.
yes this would mean we'd have an incomplete product at launch, at least it's completion is free of charge.
Candidate 88766 wrote...
The fact that it covers up a lot of the plotholes doesn't mean its true.Darth_Trethon wrote...
Just take a second and actually THINK about it. There is no explanation besides the IT that can possibly make this and all the other trillion similar plotholes right.
Claiming the entire trilogy is a dream gets rid of every plothole, but it clearly isn't true.
Anyway, I thought you were going?
Candidate 88766 wrote...
If we haven't defeated the Reapers, they wouldn't tell us that we've defeated the Reapers.nightcobra8928 wrote...
Elyiia wrote...
I don't have to consider anything. Fact: This message appears immediately after choosing one of the options and going through the cutscenes. Fact: If IT is true, Shepard has not defeated the Reapers. Therefore message discredits IT.
if IT is true then we haven't seen shepard defeat the reapers...yet.
yes this would mean we'd have an incomplete product at launch, at least it's completion is free of charge.
Elyiia wrote...
nightcobra8928 wrote...
Elyiia wrote...
I don't have to consider anything. Fact: This message appears immediately after choosing one of the options and going through the cutscenes. Fact: If IT is true, Shepard has not defeated the Reapers. Therefore message discredits IT.
if IT is true then we haven't seen shepard defeat the reapers...yet.
No. Just no. It happens immediately after the choice, there is no more gameplay, no more control. It does not work.
Darth_Trethon wrote...
Who the hell said anything about the trilogy being a dream? The IT only touches events since the start of ME3 but only claims dreams state after Shepard is hit by the reaper beam.
The fact of the matter is there is no other way to explain it.....you are still not providing ANY logic.
It has been PROVEN BioWare intended and planned for an indoctrination scenario....it's tight there in black and white in their own production notes.....there's in game file names clearly labeling indoctrination and I'm not just talking about the endings. The only things you are denial without reason or logic.....because BioWare said something in a lazy textbox. REALLY, is that your best effort? It's also been proven BioWare lied to us a hundred times over about the ME3 endings....have you really got nothing?
I can sit around and deny that 1+1=2 and defend that 1+1=97 could be explained without ever providing any logic but that would be just stupid wouldn't it?
nightcobra8928 wrote...
Elyiia wrote...
nightcobra8928 wrote...
Elyiia wrote...
I don't have to consider anything. Fact: This message appears immediately after choosing one of the options and going through the cutscenes. Fact: If IT is true, Shepard has not defeated the Reapers. Therefore message discredits IT.
if IT is true then we haven't seen shepard defeat the reapers...yet.
No. Just no. It happens immediately after the choice, there is no more gameplay, no more control. It does not work.
on twitter people asked if the ending DLC would be just cutscenes and no gameplay
the response was something along these lines:
"where did you get that idea?"
Elyiia wrote...
nightcobra8928 wrote...
Elyiia wrote...
nightcobra8928 wrote...
Elyiia wrote...
I don't have to consider anything. Fact: This message appears immediately after choosing one of the options and going through the cutscenes. Fact: If IT is true, Shepard has not defeated the Reapers. Therefore message discredits IT.
if IT is true then we haven't seen shepard defeat the reapers...yet.
No. Just no. It happens immediately after the choice, there is no more gameplay, no more control. It does not work.
on twitter people asked if the ending DLC would be just cutscenes and no gameplay
the response was something along these lines:
"where did you get that idea?"
Again, it happens directly after your choice. I don't know how else I can say this to make you understand. EC is irrelevant at this point. The game tells you you have defeated the Reaper threat.
Modifié par nightcobra8928, 14 mai 2012 - 02:15 .
Modifié par Hadeedak, 14 mai 2012 - 02:18 .
Erield wrote...
Wowky wrote...
People still need to remember that the ending doesn't have to change for IT to turn out to be right. I'm not saying it is or isn't (I really hope it is, because I think it's super clever), but the ending can stay the way it is and IT will still make sense.
If IT is true, and the endings don't change significantly, then the Reapers are still around. And in that case, then **** Bioware, I'm done with them forever. It means they lied in interviews to advertise the game and they lied within the game itself. It means that they knowingly, deliberately shipped an incomplete product, with the pure intent of tricking you into thinking that they hadn't. It would mean that they tried to scam off a lame ending on the majority of the crowd, and have a "real" ending later for the hard-core fans who'll pony up the money for it in DLC format 6 or 8 months down the line.
I don't think that's the case, but there's a thread of fear deep in my heart that that is exactly what they were going for.
You missed the point. I was saying that just because the IT covers up most of the plotholes, that isn't proof that its true.Darth_Trethon wrote...
Candidate 88766 wrote...
The fact that it covers up a lot of the plotholes doesn't mean its true.Darth_Trethon wrote...
Just take a second and actually THINK about it. There is no explanation besides the IT that can possibly make this and all the other trillion similar plotholes right.
Claiming the entire trilogy is a dream gets rid of every plothole, but it clearly isn't true.
Anyway, I thought you were going?
Who the hell said anything about the trilogy being a dream? The IT only touches events since the start of ME3 but only claims dreams state after Shepard is hit by the reaper beam.
The fact of the matter is there is no other way to explain it.....you are still not providing ANY logic.
It has been PROVEN BioWare intended and planned for an indoctrination scenario....it's tight there in black and white in their own production notes.....there's in game file names clearly labeling indoctrination and I'm not just talking about the endings. The only things you are denial without reason or logic.....because BioWare said something in a lazy textbox. REALLY, is that your best effort? It's also been proven BioWare lied to us a hundred times over about the ME3 endings....have you really got nothing?
And yet its exactly what you're doing.I can sit around and deny that 1+1=2 and defend that 1+1=97 could be explained without ever providing any logic but that would be just stupid wouldn't it?
nightcobra8928 wrote...
yup that is correct, and that doesn't intrinsically disprove the IT theory as such an ending is still possible within these parameters.
We're not trying to say it disproves the possibility of the IT being included later, we're saying that it disproves the idea that the IT is already true.nightcobra8928 wrote...
yup that is correct, and that doesn't intrinsically disprove the IT theory as such an ending is still possible within these parameters.
not saying it IS going to happen but rather that it can't be disproven at this point
Erield wrote...
/sigh
You take facts, like the text-name of a file, and then turn that into the fact that the entire sequence it appears in is a dream. This is faulty reasoning.
dream-plant as a file-name can lend credence to the fact that the scene it appears in is a dream, or it could mean a variety of other things that are equally plausible.
I'd re-type out everything. Again. But you didn't read it the first time around (apparently) even though you responded directly at least once.
ImmovableMover wrote...
Goddamn IT guys get stupider and stupider, I swear..
When people use "Dream" to describe something it usually means "Idyllic". People look forward to buying "Their dream house" or going on their "dream holiday" and that planet is, quite obviously, meant to be a "dream planet" - It's a veritable paradise (or is presented as such). Lush and green, beautiful sky, a sunset...yes it's fairly plain to see that it's meant to be "Perfect" and thus not a ****ty happenstance that they've crashed there.
And thus when building their dream planet, for sake of keeping files grouped together, they also have their assets labeled as such and that gives us...DreamPlant.
Iwillbeback wrote...
Are you stupid? They already lied.
Darth_Trethon wrote...
Erield wrote...
/sigh
You take facts, like the text-name of a file, and then turn that into the fact that the entire sequence it appears in is a dream. This is faulty reasoning.
dream-plant as a file-name can lend credence to the fact that the scene it appears in is a dream, or it could mean a variety of other things that are equally plausible.
I'd re-type out everything. Again. But you didn't read it the first time around (apparently) even though you responded directly at least once.
By itself that might mean something but it's got too much backing it.....you haven't touched the file names for TIM controlling Shepard. You haven't touched the fact that BioWare clearly planned for IT....all you got is that it was cut but you never address the overshadowing issue that TIM does controll you and that none of it makes any sense unless you took into account BioWare's INTENDED course of action. It's all right there.....you grasp at the minor strawn but never really address any of the major issues.
BioWare didn't expect the kind of lashback they got so they set to make things right....why wouldn't they do what they planned in the first place especailly since all polls proved most are willing to accept the solutiopn? You poinnt at double talk that again has been proven to be double speak with BioWare both claiming to change nothing and that we know nothing or we'd react differently.....both can't be true, period.
After all this you seriously claim that I am ignoring evidence? You have none.
Modifié par Hadeedak, 14 mai 2012 - 02:24 .
Erield wrote...
Iwillbeback wrote...
Are you stupid? They already lied.
They lied in the advertising of the game--which I paid exactly zero attention to. I knew I was going to buy the game, I didn't want any spoilers, I avoided all contact with anything that could give me information I didn't want.
Going back and seeing what kind of things they promised after the fact, well, they were pretty horrendous about it, but still--that's just in advertising. To lie about what you will get is different than to lie about what you got. I also work on a three-strikes rule, and they're not there yet. If they go with IT without defeating the Reapers, though, then they're past it.
Candidate 88766 wrote...
You missed the point. I was saying that just because the IT covers up most of the plotholes, that isn't proof that its true.Darth_Trethon wrote...
Candidate 88766 wrote...
The fact that it covers up a lot of the plotholes doesn't mean its true.Darth_Trethon wrote...
Just take a second and actually THINK about it. There is no explanation besides the IT that can possibly make this and all the other trillion similar plotholes right.
Claiming the entire trilogy is a dream gets rid of every plothole, but it clearly isn't true.
Anyway, I thought you were going?
Who the hell said anything about the trilogy being a dream? The IT only touches events since the start of ME3 but only claims dreams state after Shepard is hit by the reaper beam.
The fact of the matter is there is no other way to explain it.....you are still not providing ANY logic.
It has been PROVEN BioWare intended and planned for an indoctrination scenario....it's tight there in black and white in their own production notes.....there's in game file names clearly labeling indoctrination and I'm not just talking about the endings. The only things you are denial without reason or logic.....because BioWare said something in a lazy textbox. REALLY, is that your best effort? It's also been proven BioWare lied to us a hundred times over about the ME3 endings....have you really got nothing?
It has been PROVEN Bioware intended to go with a dark energy plotline. Is that proof that the dark energy plotline is real? No.
You also seem to misunderstand how to disprove something. The box pops up at the end, and disproves the IT. You're counter-argument to this is that its lazy and it could be a lie. Prove it. Prove that its a lie.And yet its exactly what you're doing.I can sit around and deny that 1+1=2 and defend that 1+1=97 could be explained without ever providing any logic but that would be just stupid wouldn't it?
Darth_Trethon wrote...
Huge difference....the dark energy plot was never developped or delivered.
Again, missing the point.There are mountains of both actual evidence and circumstantial evidence showing the IT HAS been developed and delivered. There's so much that not implementing the IT would be a greater "change" to the plot they developed and delivered than not implementing it. Then there's the all shadowing question that anything short of completely cutting and changing the ending which they claim not to do what options have they got? They got themselves in a corner....you deny without ever touching any of the larger arguments and concerns and you yourself show no hit that you are even able to think of an alternate solution.
Hadeedak wrote...
Darth_Trethon wrote...
Erield wrote...
/sigh
You take facts, like the text-name of a file, and then turn that into the fact that the entire sequence it appears in is a dream. This is faulty reasoning.
dream-plant as a file-name can lend credence to the fact that the scene it appears in is a dream, or it could mean a variety of other things that are equally plausible.
I'd re-type out everything. Again. But you didn't read it the first time around (apparently) even though you responded directly at least once.
By itself that might mean something but it's got too much backing it.....you haven't touched the file names for TIM controlling Shepard. You haven't touched the fact that BioWare clearly planned for IT....all you got is that it was cut but you never address the overshadowing issue that TIM does controll you and that none of it makes any sense unless you took into account BioWare's INTENDED course of action. It's all right there.....you grasp at the minor strawn but never really address any of the major issues.
BioWare didn't expect the kind of lashback they got so they set to make things right....why wouldn't they do what they planned in the first place especailly since all polls proved most are willing to accept the solutiopn? You poinnt at double talk that again has been proven to be double speak with BioWare both claiming to change nothing and that we know nothing or we'd react differently.....both can't be true, period.
After all this you seriously claim that I am ignoring evidence? You have none.
Well, for evidence, there's the actual game, which you can take literally.
Not datamining files for names that are usually just shorthand for artists to remember what it looked like.
Just telling the other poster they have no evidence while ignoring their points isn't exactly a compelling arguement.
Darth_Trethon wrote...
By itself that might mean something but it's got too much backing it.....you haven't touched the file names for TIM controlling Shepard. You haven't touched the fact that BioWare clearly planned for IT....all you got is that it was cut but you never address the overshadowing issue that TIM does controll you and that none of it makes any sense unless you took into account BioWare's INTENDED course of action. It's all right there.....you grasp at the minor strawn but never really address any of the major issues.
BioWare didn't expect the kind of lashback they got so they set to make things right....why wouldn't they do what they planned in the first place especailly since all polls proved most are willing to accept the solutiopn? You poinnt at double talk that again has been proven to be double speak with BioWare both claiming to change nothing and that we know nothing or we'd react differently.....both can't be true, period.
After all this you seriously claim that I am ignoring evidence? You have none.
Wrong.Darth_Trethon wrote...
it's proven BioWare intended it
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