Mass Effect 3 has been a huge event in BioWare's history. Arguably one of their most anticipated games since their inception, nobody could have foreseen what ended up happening.
I'll get to the point: What is your opinion on BioWare as of now?
How do you feel about:
- Day 1 DLC: From Ashes
- Multiplayer
- Single player campaign
- ...the ending
- The unreleased Extended Cut
How has your opinion on BioWare changed?
Débuté par
Jamie9
, mai 14 2012 03:50
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#2
Posté 14 mai 2012 - 03:54
Obeded the 2nd
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Nope just my opinion on EA.
Well it was bad now it's even worse.
Well it was bad now it's even worse.
#3
Posté 14 mai 2012 - 03:55
Raiil
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1. I have never been against Day-1 DLC, but the Javik thing is iffy because having him actually clarifies the story as a whole.
2. I like the MP. Come at me, bros, it's better than the ending.
3. Huge debbie downer with a few fantastic sequences, mostly by the hand of Mr. Weekes. But while I realise that 'war is hell' and all that, there's realism and then there's 'we're going to kick you in your metaphorical balls repeatedly, but hey- funny dialogue'.
4. ;A; BioWare, y u no write better?
5. I have very little hopes. You don't dump more writing on bad writing, you erase and retool.
My opinion of BioWare is that they have a couple of good writers keeping them afloat, and that's about it.
2. I like the MP. Come at me, bros, it's better than the ending.
3. Huge debbie downer with a few fantastic sequences, mostly by the hand of Mr. Weekes. But while I realise that 'war is hell' and all that, there's realism and then there's 'we're going to kick you in your metaphorical balls repeatedly, but hey- funny dialogue'.
4. ;A; BioWare, y u no write better?
5. I have very little hopes. You don't dump more writing on bad writing, you erase and retool.
My opinion of BioWare is that they have a couple of good writers keeping them afloat, and that's about it.
#4
Posté 14 mai 2012 - 03:55
Eain
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It's a double edged sword. I think that there's confusion at the Bioware workfloor over why this game was so poorly received. From the consumer side of things, we see the same sort of entropy grip them as it did every other company that EA ever bought. Going purely by inference, we can only expect the same sort of gradual decline in quality that always takes place when EA gets it hands on things.
But it's difficult to rationalise that when you're a Bioware employee. You know the people you work with, you generally know them to be capable folk, you share your lunch and coffee breaks with them, you share your laughs and your drinks. As a guy working at Bioware it's impossible to look at your coworkers and go "these people are hacks who ruin games."
So there's a huge disconnect there between how Bioware employees perceive the company they work for, and how gamers do. I personally think that the reason ME3 went wrong isn't because of any individual employee but because of a certain culture seeping down from the top that starts to saturate a company's mentality (this could be the reason for why they thought Day One DLC was acceptable). I see this happen so often in other businesses, so I'm not surprised if the same is true here.
For me though the brand Bioware no longer guarantees quality like it once did. But then to be totally truthful, I'm not sure I can name a developer that's replaced them either.
But it's difficult to rationalise that when you're a Bioware employee. You know the people you work with, you generally know them to be capable folk, you share your lunch and coffee breaks with them, you share your laughs and your drinks. As a guy working at Bioware it's impossible to look at your coworkers and go "these people are hacks who ruin games."
So there's a huge disconnect there between how Bioware employees perceive the company they work for, and how gamers do. I personally think that the reason ME3 went wrong isn't because of any individual employee but because of a certain culture seeping down from the top that starts to saturate a company's mentality (this could be the reason for why they thought Day One DLC was acceptable). I see this happen so often in other businesses, so I'm not surprised if the same is true here.
For me though the brand Bioware no longer guarantees quality like it once did. But then to be totally truthful, I'm not sure I can name a developer that's replaced them either.
Modifié par Eain, 14 mai 2012 - 03:57 .
#5
Posté 14 mai 2012 - 04:03
incinerator950
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1. I wouldn't care if it was released normally Day 1 for regular users. However, as awesome as getting freebies on the CE, a lot of it was finished before release, and a good portion of it was on disc. No matter how Bioware argues it was recycled material that was cut, or they used more data then in ME 2 for their plot Anchor.
2. It's enjoyable, and the MP team is doing a better job then the SP team. Granted, they live off the age-old rule of adding crap to the pile instead of cleaning it up.
3. It's enjoyable, and I love that it doesn't try to hide the Illusion of Choice like ME 1 did horribly. It however, is lacking. The Intro was weak, you have a new crew who are more loyal then your ME 1 or Cerberus Crew (lol?) and when they said they were revising the script after the leak, the only changes were cuts. A lot of the cut material is still on disc, and all of the promotional weapons are there.
4. Ending is palpable, I don't care about it, and I chose Control. If ME 1 had half as bad of an ending, people would have argued about the majority of its plot being streamlined and Vigil doing the exact same thing. However, while I hate writing myself, I'm not incompetant. Taking Eragon equivalent quality material and trying to complicate it with Cthulhu mythos Starships and a Macguffin is begging for a bad review. If its simple from the start, don't nuke it, keep it simple.
5. Still don't care, new stuff to look at in SP. I'm spending more time trying to learn what to edit in the Gibbed Editor. I rolled in glee when I found all of the SP weapons, including my baby Collector Assault Rifle, the MP weapons, and the Indra and friends guns. However, don't expect the EC to actually change anything, its visual and dialogue changes, and Bioware has stated repeatedly they're keeping the ending choices.
TLDR: I don't care about Bioware, they have made good games, I enjoy the ones I like. I remember names of companies for what they put out, but I like the brands, not the companies. Bioware has had a nasty habbit of recycling cycle plots and character heirarchy from Jade Empire, past Kotor into ME, with DAO being a spiritual BG successor.
2. It's enjoyable, and the MP team is doing a better job then the SP team. Granted, they live off the age-old rule of adding crap to the pile instead of cleaning it up.
3. It's enjoyable, and I love that it doesn't try to hide the Illusion of Choice like ME 1 did horribly. It however, is lacking. The Intro was weak, you have a new crew who are more loyal then your ME 1 or Cerberus Crew (lol?) and when they said they were revising the script after the leak, the only changes were cuts. A lot of the cut material is still on disc, and all of the promotional weapons are there.
4. Ending is palpable, I don't care about it, and I chose Control. If ME 1 had half as bad of an ending, people would have argued about the majority of its plot being streamlined and Vigil doing the exact same thing. However, while I hate writing myself, I'm not incompetant. Taking Eragon equivalent quality material and trying to complicate it with Cthulhu mythos Starships and a Macguffin is begging for a bad review. If its simple from the start, don't nuke it, keep it simple.
5. Still don't care, new stuff to look at in SP. I'm spending more time trying to learn what to edit in the Gibbed Editor. I rolled in glee when I found all of the SP weapons, including my baby Collector Assault Rifle, the MP weapons, and the Indra and friends guns. However, don't expect the EC to actually change anything, its visual and dialogue changes, and Bioware has stated repeatedly they're keeping the ending choices.
TLDR: I don't care about Bioware, they have made good games, I enjoy the ones I like. I remember names of companies for what they put out, but I like the brands, not the companies. Bioware has had a nasty habbit of recycling cycle plots and character heirarchy from Jade Empire, past Kotor into ME, with DAO being a spiritual BG successor.
Modifié par incinerator950, 14 mai 2012 - 04:09 .
#6
Posté 14 mai 2012 - 04:03
Mcfly616
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Long story, short......Bioware went from first to last on my favorite game developers
Bioware could do no wrong in my eyes....
But then the ridiculously vague and out of place ending
And the way they handled it(no comment, no explanation.....just artistic integrity)
And then, the derogatory statements about and towards the fans....straight from BW employees....
Pre-release false statements about what the game entails, and post-release lies
Oh.....and just to put the cherry on top:
"We'll have discussions about the ending when more people have had a chance to finish the game"....
That statement was made literally 2 months ago....pretty sure the majority has had the chance to beat it....
My biggest pet peave is that people do what they say they're gonna do.....well Bioware did the exact opposite, and continued to do so after the release of the game.....FAIL
Bioware could do no wrong in my eyes....
But then the ridiculously vague and out of place ending
And the way they handled it(no comment, no explanation.....just artistic integrity)
And then, the derogatory statements about and towards the fans....straight from BW employees....
Pre-release false statements about what the game entails, and post-release lies
Oh.....and just to put the cherry on top:
"We'll have discussions about the ending when more people have had a chance to finish the game"....
That statement was made literally 2 months ago....pretty sure the majority has had the chance to beat it....
My biggest pet peave is that people do what they say they're gonna do.....well Bioware did the exact opposite, and continued to do so after the release of the game.....FAIL
#7
Posté 14 mai 2012 - 04:04
rowan93
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I don't know really. The day one DLC didn't bother me because I ordered the CE which I did with little hesitation because, well it was Bioware and I loooooooove Mass Effect. I agree with Valentia X that Javik brings a lot more weight to what is going on, so its strange that Bioware would not release it for at least a cheaper price, though thats most likely EA speaking. But back to the point, I don't hate Bioware, but the whole debacle has definitely changed my view slightly on them. I will reserve judgement until the EC. The ending though seems like it was written by someone from a different company, which shocks me so much as like others I expected no wrong from BW. The multiplayer I like, it doesn't seem very fleshed out to be honest but I play it often, it was a good first attempt, though perhaps it would have been best not to attach a first attempt on the finale of ME. Nevertheless not much to complain about.
As for buying more products and whatnot, I've only ever played ME, no interest in DA so the whole DA2 complaints I can't comment on.
As for buying more products and whatnot, I've only ever played ME, no interest in DA so the whole DA2 complaints I can't comment on.
#8
Posté 14 mai 2012 - 04:06
-Area51-Silent
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Bioware is now just the same as every other game company out there...
#9
Posté 14 mai 2012 - 04:14
Ghurshog
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- Day 1 DLC: From Ashes - Stopped caring about DLC (either I will by it or I won't)
- Multiplayer - it's unimaginative, repetitive, and will appeal to the FPS crowd at some level.
- Single player campaign - good and what I expected
- ...the ending - Please remove the Deus Ex from my Mass Effect!
- The unreleased Extended Cut - If it makes the story more enjoyable I am all for it.
Bioware is a brand not a living organism.
- The brand is tarnished for me.
- The people that work for Bioware I have great respect for. I work in their industry and understand how hard it is to make quality/enjoyable products in it. I understand the 'crunch' months, the compromises, feature creep, vision, deadlines, frustrations, and moments of triumph.
And I begrudge them nothing.
Now please remove the Deus Ex from my Mass Effect already!
- Multiplayer - it's unimaginative, repetitive, and will appeal to the FPS crowd at some level.
- Single player campaign - good and what I expected
- ...the ending - Please remove the Deus Ex from my Mass Effect!
- The unreleased Extended Cut - If it makes the story more enjoyable I am all for it.
Bioware is a brand not a living organism.
- The brand is tarnished for me.
- The people that work for Bioware I have great respect for. I work in their industry and understand how hard it is to make quality/enjoyable products in it. I understand the 'crunch' months, the compromises, feature creep, vision, deadlines, frustrations, and moments of triumph.
And I begrudge them nothing.
Now please remove the Deus Ex from my Mass Effect already!
#10
Posté 14 mai 2012 - 04:15
Humanoid_Typhoon
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Day 1 DLC is acceptable if and only if it is free for new copies of a game.
They can swear up and down that MP didn't take away anything from SP but there isn't a way they can prove it, every developer says their MP is made by another team, but they added the blandest flavor of a tacked on game mode, and if it feels like a tack on, it is a tack on.
SP campaign felt almost on rails, sure missions were nonlinear but you still only got a few at a time, there was only 1 (ONE!) hubworld, but I do appreciate the hard yeoman work put in by the staff at BW doing what they could under EA and the move away from RPG-TPS to Action-TPS.
The Ending....imagine driving in a Koenigsegg at 230 MPH and at the end of your thrill ride...it explodes, the ending was garbage, nonsensical, and it made the first two games pointless, well ME3 pretty much didn't even acknowledge ME2's existence but I digress, and worst of all it made Shepard a tool literally.
I truly want to believe BW knows what is riding on this EC, their awful PR has already put BW on many people's Do Not Buy lists and if (when) the EC fails they will alienate even more people, but their PR yet again gives little hope.
They can swear up and down that MP didn't take away anything from SP but there isn't a way they can prove it, every developer says their MP is made by another team, but they added the blandest flavor of a tacked on game mode, and if it feels like a tack on, it is a tack on.
SP campaign felt almost on rails, sure missions were nonlinear but you still only got a few at a time, there was only 1 (ONE!) hubworld, but I do appreciate the hard yeoman work put in by the staff at BW doing what they could under EA and the move away from RPG-TPS to Action-TPS.
The Ending....imagine driving in a Koenigsegg at 230 MPH and at the end of your thrill ride...it explodes, the ending was garbage, nonsensical, and it made the first two games pointless, well ME3 pretty much didn't even acknowledge ME2's existence but I digress, and worst of all it made Shepard a tool literally.
I truly want to believe BW knows what is riding on this EC, their awful PR has already put BW on many people's Do Not Buy lists and if (when) the EC fails they will alienate even more people, but their PR yet again gives little hope.
Modifié par Humanoid_Typhoon, 14 mai 2012 - 04:17 .
#11
Posté 14 mai 2012 - 04:16
Tazzmission
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nothing has changed there a buisness and you cant really argue how there doing it imo
i do however have a change of thought on the fanbase though
i do however have a change of thought on the fanbase though
#12
Posté 14 mai 2012 - 04:18
Doofe2012
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I really don't think they care that much about making a quality, finished product anymore. That, or they're just unable to.
Unless BW seriously changes something, their games are no longer guaranteed pre-orders for me, or even Day One purchases. In other words, they're just another typical developer now.
Unless BW seriously changes something, their games are no longer guaranteed pre-orders for me, or even Day One purchases. In other words, they're just another typical developer now.
#13
Posté 14 mai 2012 - 04:19
Humanoid_Typhoon
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Please explain why we can't argue unethical business practices?Tazzmission wrote...
nothing has changed there a buisness and you cant really argue how there doing it imo
i do however have a change of thought on the fanbase though
Not everyone is a sheep you know.
#14
Posté 14 mai 2012 - 04:21
M Hedonist
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Releasing DLC on the first day to buy is bull****. In this day and age, the line between 'game production' and 'game development' is very blurry. What does it matter to those who download the game when the production of the game ended? Everything that was developed prior to the release of the game should be included in the game.- Day 1 DLC: From Ashes
First off, completely unnecessary. Nobody asked for it.- Multiplayer
Not playing multiplayer should not have any negative impact on the singleplayer experience. As of now, you can't get the best ending if you don't play multiplayer. Which, again, is bull****. In the last of the game of the trilogy, you suddenly need to have a good internet connection to be able to get everything out of the game.
Meh. Too many things in the story challenge your suspension of disbelief.- Single player campaign
Dissatisfying. Any credibility Bioware used to have is lost. I don't want to ever get engaged into any of their games again. Even if everything about the game itself is great, there's no way to guarantee they don't choose to ruin everything in a future installment of that series.- ...the ending
No way they can save the ending unless they make some substantial changes.- The unreleased Extended Cut
#15
Posté 14 mai 2012 - 04:22
EricHVela
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^This because I have suspicions that BW intended to end up in EA's hands.Obeded the 2nd wrote...
Nope just my opinion on EA.
Well it was bad now it's even worse.
BW did take a risk with their business maneuvering, but they lost IMHO by getting sold to EA instead of who they wanted to buy them if my suspicions are correct. They sold the control of their new partnership to a holding company that handles such sales -- not an uncommon practice. I think they were hoping Microsoft would take the deal. EA has more $$$ and resources dedicated to game development than MS, but they also have a terrible reputation regarding its acquisitions that goes back many years. I'm sure there are legal issues and future consequences with snubbing the likes of EA over a lesser deal with MS. (Again, this is all just suspicion.)
Given EA's reputation, the state of ME3 seems to follow along the same lines, putting the blame on EA for not handling their developers with a light touch instead of a heavy hand.
Modifié par ReggarBlane, 14 mai 2012 - 04:23 .
#16
Posté 14 mai 2012 - 04:22
SolidisusSnake1
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I'll sum it up like this, they turned me from this Fry:
To this Fry:
To this Fry:
#17
Posté 14 mai 2012 - 04:25
Sohlito
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Humanoid_Typhoon wrote...
Please explain why we can't argue unethical business practices?Tazzmission wrote...
nothing has changed there a buisness and you cant really argue how there doing it imo
i do however have a change of thought on the fanbase though
Not everyone is a sheep you know.
Was going to ask the exact same thing. No offense to Tazz, but that is a rather stupid notion.
#18
Posté 14 mai 2012 - 04:28
J0HNL3I
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1. i never minded day 1 dlc but when i got from ashes it was obviously meant to be in the game, whatever bioware or ea say
2. i like the multiplayer, i was scared it was going to be vs. but i love co-op/horde modes
3. single player is amazing like the other two
4. lets not go there again
5. dunno yet
2. i like the multiplayer, i was scared it was going to be vs. but i love co-op/horde modes
3. single player is amazing like the other two
4. lets not go there again
5. dunno yet
#19
Posté 14 mai 2012 - 04:28
M Hedonist
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One more important point OP, you should also add "- the lies Bioware told us prior to the release of the game"
#20
Posté 14 mai 2012 - 04:29
incinerator950
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Sauruz wrote...
One more important point OP, you should also add "- the lies Bioware told us prior to the release of the game"
Oh my god, they hyped the game up! Peter Molyneux is the Devil, and he possessed Casey Hudson and Mike Gamble during that time period!!!11!
#21
Posté 14 mai 2012 - 04:34
M Hedonist
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I... simply made a suggestion to the OP what he could also add to his list of points since this is something that many people are sensitive about.incinerator950 wrote...
Sauruz wrote...
One more important point OP, you should also add "- the lies Bioware told us prior to the release of the game"
Oh my god, they hyped the game up! Peter Molyneux is the Devil, and he possessed Casey Hudson and Mike Gamble during that time period!!!11!
What the hell is your problem?
#22
Posté 14 mai 2012 - 04:35
ediskrad327
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SolidisusSnake1 wrote...
I'll sum it up like this, they turned me from this Fry:
To this Fry:
#23
Posté 14 mai 2012 - 04:36
Subguy614
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There is a standing EA boycott at my house now. My son isn't even allowed to buy EA games.
#24
Posté 14 mai 2012 - 04:38
Humanoid_Typhoon
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There is a difference between puffery and outright lying.incinerator950 wrote...
Sauruz wrote...
One more important point OP, you should also add "- the lies Bioware told us prior to the release of the game"
Oh my god, they hyped the game up! Peter Molyneux is the Devil, and he possessed Casey Hudson and Mike Gamble during that time period!!!11!
#25
Posté 14 mai 2012 - 04:40
thesnake777
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Humanoid_Typhoon wrote...
There is a difference between puffery and outright lying.incinerator950 wrote...
Sauruz wrote...
One more important point OP, you should also add "- the lies Bioware told us prior to the release of the game"
Oh my god, they hyped the game up! Peter Molyneux is the Devil, and he possessed Casey Hudson and Mike Gamble during that time period!!!11!
The lies tie into the very issues that bug us about the game...theres that meme floating around with the qoute of hudson on the endings.....
