55528 réponses à ce sujet

[Wolfram Tarant]

FellishBeast wrote...

Wolfram Tarant wrote...

I always hated the idea that he was just chilling in the Citadel the entire time instead of doing something malicious like we've come to expect from him... seriously so he was just sitting around in there and waiting?

No idea.

Not to mention he comes up the same way you come in but you never see him on the way.

The ramp up to TIM's room at Cronos reminds me of the ramp up to the Citadel room place (that also looks exactly like TIM's room). The walls are really weird, too. Like a bunch of green panels sticking out of the wall.

Yes! I thought the same thing, especially on my first play through. As soon as I came to the top of the ramp the first time I was so sure I was looking at some kind of surreal new manifestation of TIM's room.... I mean to me at least, the ward arms resembled the brown dwarf, there was the luminous control panel, and the general layout of that room. And the dark silhouette with his back turned to me. I was sooo positive that was the Illusive Man until the cutscene started and I realized it was Anderson.
The first thing my mind went to when I came to the top was that it looked exactly like TIM's room.

[liggy002]

So they said that they are not going to be prescriptive about the ending yet they refuse to release an extended ending with gameplay? Bioware/EA are clearly favoring the pro enders.

Seriously? If I am an IT believer, I now have to imagine my ending. They should in principal realease an EXTENDED ENDING DLC with gameplay. Otherwise, they are just giving most people more of what they don't want. This is simply not wise.

[Starbuck8]

FellishBeast wrote...

Starbuck8 wrote...

FellishBeast wrote...

Wolfram Tarant wrote...

@FellishBeast

That was always confusing to me... I always assumed the literal explanation was just that the implants were dissolving... or they huskified his face over a short period of time. Looks quite painful actually... eek. I liked the way he looked in the end scene though, rightly horrifying. Ugh that scene should've been so much longer. Do we know if Martin Sheen recorded any new dialogue?

And yeah it would make sense that Shepard imagined him as being more Reaper-like in the dream, that's sort of what I figured for IT

Yeah I was just wondering if there was a non-IT explanation. Because IT has always seemed too good to be true, so I'm really not expecting it. But I'm hoping for it, and I support the crappy bananas out of it.

Honestly can't think of a really good literal explanation, as there's no precedent for someone looking like this after implantation. The implant he received caused additional implants to spring up, due to nanid/tes or something... replacing his skin? We have to assume this happens very quickly, or that the hologram projection of him is altered to look more normal...

Maybe he got impatient, waiting for Shepard, and went up and touched the "Control" device before Harbinger screamed at him, so it only partially absorbed him. Then that caused a clitch in the system that made the Catalyst appear as a kid, instead of its true form.

Lol

[StElmo]

liggy002 wrote...

So they said that they are not going to be prescriptive about the ending yet they refuse to release an extended ending with gameplay? Bioware/EA are clearly favoring the pro enders.

Seriously? If I am an IT believer, I now have to imagine my ending. They should in principal realease an EXTENDED ENDING DLC with gameplay. Otherwise, they are just giving most people more of what they don't want. This is simply not wise.

I don't think the marketing team has very good long term outlook. They seem to be all about short term, which I have noticed is what is making this fail so quickly. EA's matra is always about short term the past couple years and that isn't realistic in todays climate.

[Starbuck8]

liggy002 wrote...

So they said that they are not going to be prescriptive about the ending yet they refuse to release an extended ending with gameplay? Bioware/EA are clearly favoring the pro enders.

Seriously? If I am an IT believer, I now have to imagine my ending. They should in principal realease an EXTENDED ENDING DLC with gameplay. Otherwise, they are just giving most people more of what they don't want. This is simply not wise.

Let's not freak out before the EC is released. They are being deliberately vague about it right now. Give them a chance, experience the EC for yourself, and then come to a judgement about what that means for IT and the ME fan base in general.

[Bill Casey]

FellishBeast wrote...

I'm at Cronos Station right now. Anything specific I should look for?

- Shepard's Identity Crisis He just had a dream where he saw himself, and now he's questioning if he's even the real Shepard. Assault on Identity and Guilt are part of the "breaking down the self" phase of brainwashing...

science.howstuffworks.com/environmental/life/inside-the-mind/brainwashing1.htm

- You can turn the music off and listen to the human reaper. Also, the circuitry on the human reaper is the same pattern as the synthesis ending...

- Kai Leng will say he's stronger for using reaper tech, and "We evolve or we die"

The color scheme and associated themes...
Destroy section is at the beginning, the labs with horrific experiments have a green motif, and the human reaper is bathed in blue...






- The Illusive Man has no issue having live surgery performed on him with no anasthetic. It's unsettling and inhuman. Harbinger makes several references to pain being "an illusion".

Modifié par Bill Casey, 24 juin 2012 - 07:51 .

[liggy002]

Starbuck8 wrote...

liggy002 wrote...

So they said that they are not going to be prescriptive about the ending yet they refuse to release an extended ending with gameplay? Bioware/EA are clearly favoring the pro enders.

Seriously? If I am an IT believer, I now have to imagine my ending. They should in principal realease an EXTENDED ENDING DLC with gameplay. Otherwise, they are just giving most people more of what they don't want. This is simply not wise.

Let's not freak out before the EC is released. They are being deliberately vague about it right now. Give them a chance, experience the EC for yourself, and then come to a judgement about what that means for IT and the ME fan base in general.

   The only thing that will satisfy me at this point, since there is no gameplay in the EC, would be an extended downloadable content that expands on the IT.  It would include a Harbinger boss fight and additional gameplay.  It would have to be post ending DLC, obviously, and that would go against what they said earlier but things can change.  That is the principal reason why I would be willing to give the EC a chance.  If it doesn't confirm IT, then this is the only scenario in which I would find it acceptable.

  You're right.  Patience and a sense of calm is what I need to practice more of at the moment.

[Starbuck8]

liggy002 wrote...

Starbuck8 wrote...

liggy002 wrote...

So they said that they are not going to be prescriptive about the ending yet they refuse to release an extended ending with gameplay? Bioware/EA are clearly favoring the pro enders.

Seriously? If I am an IT believer, I now have to imagine my ending. They should in principal realease an EXTENDED ENDING DLC with gameplay. Otherwise, they are just giving most people more of what they don't want. This is simply not wise.

Let's not freak out before the EC is released. They are being deliberately vague about it right now. Give them a chance, experience the EC for yourself, and then come to a judgement about what that means for IT and the ME fan base in general.

   The only thing that will satisfy me at this point, since there is no gameplay in the EC, would be an extended downloadable content that expands on the IT.  It would include a Harbinger boss fight and additional gameplay.  It would have to be post ending DLC, obviously, and that would go against what they said earlier but things can change.  That is the principal reason why I would be willing to give the EC a chance.  If it doesn't confirm IT, then this is the only scenario in which I would find it acceptable.

  You're right.  Patience and a sense of calm is what I need to practice more of at the moment.

We all have an idea of how you feel. We've all been going through a bit of a rollercoaster of emotion since the announcements. But what the EC is now is set in stone. We will find out Tuesday. We may be in for some pleasant surprises, we may be disappointed, but there's not a lot of use in assuming the worst and giving ourselves an ulcer before its release.

[liggy002]

Bill Casey wrote...

FellishBeast wrote...

I'm at Cronos Station right now. Anything specific I should look for?

- Shepard's Identity Crisis He just had a dream where he saw himself, and now he's questioning if he's even the real Shepard. Assault on Identity and Guilt are part of the "breaking down the self" phase of brainwashing...

science.howstuffworks.com/environmental/life/inside-the-mind/brainwashing1.htm

- You can turn the music off and listen to the human reaper. Also, the circuitry on the human reaper is the same pattern as the synthesis ending...

- Kai Leng will say he's stronger for using reaper tech, and "We evolve or we die"

The color scheme and associated themes...
Destroy section is at the beginning, the labs with horrific experiments have a green motif, and the human reaper is bathed in blue...






- The Illusive Man has no issue having live surgery performed on him with no anasthetic. It's unsettling and inhuman. Harbinger makes several references to pain being "an illusion".

It seems as if they went through an awful lot of trouble here to hint at something (the IT I believe) for them to just leave us with an ending that we have to imagine.  It just doesn't fit but time will tell.

[Wolfram Tarant]

I guess I'll be going to sleep now
See you all later 

[Salient Archer]

I've been thinking about the events from Thesia onwards and I'm starting to believe more and more that the Reapers have orchestrated more than we realise.

Bear in mind the fact that TIM and Kai Leng are both indoctrinated and hence unwitting agents could it not stand to reason that the Reapers intended for everything to take place exactly as it did so that not only could they keep the galactic forces preoccupied with building the crucible and using up valuable time and resources but they always intended to move the citadel to earth but were just waiting for the crucible to be finished so the galactic fleet would all come at once so they could take them all down in one massive assault?

So hence they lead Shepard and Co to Cronos station, where they just happen to find out that the citadel is the catalyst but it's now been moved to earth, which just happens to be the planet the Reapers wish to harvest the most due to humans being their #1 choice for Reaper baby ooze. More over it forces the galactic fleet to face the Reapers on their turf and terms with a very predictable widespread assault. All the while gaining the opportunity to take out the one individual that's always been a thorn in their side: Commander Shepard, who so far has not only proven that he is tenacious enough to be a real threat but he's also proven to be quite useful as he just gift wrapped the unified galactic forces for them. So the Reaper's decide that instead of killing him conventionally (as this apparently doesn't work) they decide to take him out in the most permanent, insidious and deprecating way possible: full Indoctrination.

Modifié par Salient Archer, 24 juin 2012 - 08:35 .

[TSA_383]

Starbuck8 wrote...

liggy002 wrote...

So they said that they are not going to be prescriptive about the ending yet they refuse to release an extended ending with gameplay? Bioware/EA are clearly favoring the pro enders.

Seriously? If I am an IT believer, I now have to imagine my ending. They should in principal realease an EXTENDED ENDING DLC with gameplay. Otherwise, they are just giving most people more of what they don't want. This is simply not wise.

Let's not freak out before the EC is released. They are being deliberately vague about it right now. Give them a chance, experience the EC for yourself, and then come to a judgement about what that means for IT and the ME fan base in general.

I'm going to quote you and just bold this bit because EVERYBODY SHOULD READ IT.

Starbuck8 wrote...

FellishBeast wrote...

Wolfram Tarant wrote...

@FellishBeast

That
was always confusing to me... I always assumed the literal explanation
was just that the implants were dissolving... or they huskified his face
over a short period of time. Looks quite painful actually... eek. I
liked the way he looked in the end scene though, rightly horrifying. Ugh
that scene should've been so much longer. Do we know if Martin Sheen
recorded any new dialogue?

And yeah it would make sense that
Shepard imagined him as being more Reaper-like in the dream, that's sort
of what I figured for IT

Yeah I was just wondering
if there was a non-IT explanation. Because IT has always seemed too good
to be true, so I'm really not expecting it. But I'm hoping for it, and I
support the crappy bananas out of it.

Honestly can't
think of a really good literal explanation, as there's no precedent for
someone looking like this after implantation. The implant he received
caused additional implants to spring up, due to nanid/tes or
something... replacing his skin? We have to assume this happens very
quickly, or that the hologram projection of him is altered to look more
normal...

If I were looking for a literal explanation - the Sanctuary mission explains that reaper modification is based on how the nanides interact with the reaper signal. This is the signal TIM believed he could overcome. If he implanted himself then succumbed to a reaper signal (like... the one emanating from the massive disected reaper in the heart of his base?) then he could start becoming a husk some time AFTER being implanted maybe?

That's about as well as I can do. I still don't believe for a second that he's real in that scene.

Salient Archer wrote...

So hence they lead Shepard and Co
to Cronos station, where they just happen to find out that the citadel
is the catalyst but it's now been moved to earth, which just happens to
be the planet the Reapers wish to harvest the most due to humans being
their #1 choice for Reaper baby ooze. More over it forces the galactic
fleet to face the Reapers on their turf and terms with a very
predictable widespread assault. All the while gaining the opportunity to
take out the one individual that's always been a thorn in their side:
Commander Shepard, who so far has not only proven that he is tenacious
enough to be a real threat but he's also proven to be quite useful as he
just gift wrapped the unified galactic forces for them. So the Reaper's
decide that instead of killing him conventionally (as this apparently
doesn't work) they decide to take him out in the most permanent,
insidious and deprecating way possible: full Indoctrination.

Certainly seems like he's not quite sure what he's doing

I still buy the "the crucible is some kind of trap and the reapers fully intended you to bring the entire galactic fleet to them" line.

Modifié par TSA_383, 24 juin 2012 - 08:42 .

[Starbuck8]

Salient Archer wrote...

I've been thinking about the events from Thesia onwards and I'm starting to believe more and more that the Reapers have orchestrated more than we realise.

Bear in mind the fact that TIM and Kai Leng are both indoctrinated and hence unwitting agents could it not stand to reason that the Reapers intended for everything to take place exactly as it did so that not only could they keep the galactic forces preoccupied with building the crucible and using up valuable time and resources but they always intended to move the citadel to earth but were just waiting for the crucible to be finished so the galactic fleet would all come at once so they could take them all down in one massive assault?

So hence they lead Shepard and Co to Cronos station, where they just happen to find out that the citadel is the catalyst but it's now been moved to earth, which just happens to be the planet the Reapers wish to harvest the most due to humans being their #1 choice for Reaper baby ooze. More over it forces the galactic fleet to face the Reapers on their turf and terms with a very predictable widespread assault. All the while gaining the opportunity to take out the one individual that's always been a thorn in their side: Commander Shepard, who so far has not only proven that he is tenacious enough to be a real threat but he's also proven to be quite useful as he just gift wrapped the unified galactic forces for them. So the Reaper's decide that instead of killing him conventionally (as this apparently doesn't work) they decide to take him out in the most permanent, insidious and deprecating way possible: full Indoctrination.

That whole sequence of events makes so much sense with IT and your explanation. All these events never sat right with me. This is pretty similar to what I think/suspect about what's going on after Thessia as well. Let's not forget that Kai Leng was inside the temple on Thessia before we got there... it definitely feels like we were being strung along the whole time.

Edit for clarity. Lol I'm getting tired.

Modifié par Starbuck8, 24 juin 2012 - 09:10 .

[Arian Dynas]

Now I am really back.

It's good to be home. What have I missed?

[FellishBeast]

I think everyone is asleep. I know I am.

[MaximizedAction]

Arian Dynas wrote...

Now I am really back.

It's good to be home. What have I missed?

Just the announcement that the EC will be released Tuesday.

Modifié par MaximizedAction, 24 juin 2012 - 09:59 .

[StElmo]

How many people here would pay for alternative-ending DLC that made Indoctrination Theory true? But It was just non-canon?

[Arian Dynas]

MaximizedAction wrote...

Arian Dynas wrote...

Now I am really back.

It's good to be home. What have I missed?

Just the announcement that the EC will be released Tuesday.

*jawfloor*

Any other news? 

Anything supporting OR denying us? It would totally suck to get back and realize I missed something big.

Also, I expected a more enthusiastic welcome.  I feel unloved, unappreciated and forgotten! 

[Domanese]

Arian Dynas wrote...

MaximizedAction wrote...

Arian Dynas wrote...

Now I am really back.

It's good to be home. What have I missed?

Just the announcement that the EC will be released Tuesday.

*jawfloor*

Any other news? 

Anything supporting OR denying us? It would totally suck to get back and realize I missed something big.

Also, I expected a more enthusiastic welcome.  I feel unloved, unappreciated and forgotten! 

Enthusiasm has been slightly diminished after the word hit due to the obligatory flaming of threads on both literalists and theorists. Bioware is giving us the typical sealed lips motif though we have had a few glimmers of intel, some good some bad and some utterly useless (Jessica's double talk as always) Fears and hopes are running high. Fears of being proven wron, fears of  no answers still,  fears of more speculation, and hope of being right, and of actual clarification. You know, the usual.

Welcome back Arian.

Modifié par Domanese, 24 juin 2012 - 10:06 .

[MaximizedAction]

Arian Dynas wrote...

MaximizedAction wrote...

Arian Dynas wrote...

Now I am really back.

It's good to be home. What have I missed?

Just the announcement that the EC will be released Tuesday.

*jawfloor*

Any other news? 

Anything supporting OR denying us? It would totally suck to get back and realize I missed something big.

Also, I expected a more enthusiastic welcome.  I feel unloved, unappreciated and forgotten! 

I missed you, man.

Just yesterday, the morale in this thread was down, man. No mentioning of IT in an interview with Jessica, Mac and Casey. Jessica even tweeted that the EC will not confirm or deny IT.

the last two days have been like March all over again, trolls flooding in, telling us how now IT has been denied. Even ITer themselves felt defeated, just because BioWare will not clarify their standpoint on IT.

So, I felt you and your powers of uplifting the morale have been terribly missed in the last two days.

Good to have you back.

[Starbuck8]

Arian Dynas wrote...

Now I am really back.

It's good to be home. What have I missed?

Welcome back. We've been holding the line as best we could.

I guess you should start here www.masseffect.com/about/extended_cut/ (podcast, photos)

The biggest thing lately honestly was HF's infrasound vid. He is currently working on another vid with Turbo_J, and the Indoc Documentary Ver2 will be on YT tomorrow if things go as planned...

[Andromidius]

Arian Dynas wrote...
*jawfloor*

Any other news? 

Anything supporting OR denying us? It would totally suck to get back and realize I missed something big.

Also, I expected a more enthusiastic welcome.  I feel unloved, unappreciated and forgotten! 

The patch is 1.9GB.

It starts 'just before the beacon run' (Merizan's words).

And the usual 'adds clarity and closure' statements they've made for months.

Oh, and huge amounts of trolling laughing at how 'IT is debunked'.  Despite the statement 'IT will be neither confirmed nor denied, its up to personal interpretation'.

So yeah, take it as you will.  But it sounds like it'll be an open ending.  Again.

[Starbuck8]

MaximizedAction wrote...

Arian Dynas wrote...

MaximizedAction wrote...

Arian Dynas wrote...

Now I am really back.

It's good to be home. What have I missed?

Just the announcement that the EC will be released Tuesday.

*jawfloor*

Any other news? 

Anything supporting OR denying us? It would totally suck to get back and realize I missed something big.

Also, I expected a more enthusiastic welcome.  I feel unloved, unappreciated and forgotten! 

I missed you, man.

Just yesterday, the morale in this thread was down, man. No mentioning of IT in an interview with Jessica, Mac and Casey. Jessica even tweeted that the EC will not confirm or deny IT.

the last two days have been like March all over again, trolls flooding in, telling us how now IT has been denied. Even ITer themselves felt defeated, just because BioWare will not clarify their standpoint on IT.

So, I felt you and your powers of uplifting the morale have been terribly missed in the last two days.

Good to have you back.

Yes, we definitely need some backup in the morale department!
And anti-troll department.
And uninformed skeptic department...

Well I think I'll be going to sleep, may be lurking for a little bit. Night ppl.

[Arian Dynas]

*Cracks knuckles*

Well then I got my work cut out for me.

First off, you're all acting stupid then. And the Literalist camp is acting stupider than usual.

First, the fact that they neither mentioned OR denied IT says something, that it is a subject they don't want to get anywere near.

Why would that be? Think about it.

As for not being confirmed or denied? I have no problems with that actually, I seriously could live with a few more clues to make it more obvious and then panning out on Shepard's indoctrinated eye. Sort of an Inception thing. As Gamble said, how many years did it take them to confirm Deckard was a replicant in Bladerunner?

And read the release about the EC, it REEKS of something being up, Clarification? Addition of details? NEARLY 2 GIGABYTES OF STORAGE SPACE?! Come on people, get a grip.

Glad to be back guys, here's some tough love for you all.

Modifié par Arian Dynas, 24 juin 2012 - 10:21 .

[Lord Luc1fer]

Arian Dynas wrote...

*Cracks knuckles*

Well then I got my work cut out for me.

First off, you're all acting stupid then. And the Literalist camp is acting stupider than usual.

First, the fact that they neither mentioned OR denied it says something, that it is a subject they don't want to get anywere near.

Why would that be? Think about it.

As for not being confirmed or denied? I have no problems with that actually, I seriously could live with a few more clues to make it more obvious and then panning out on Shepard's indoctrinated eye. Sort of an Inception thing. As Gamble said, how many years did it take them to confirm Deckard was a replicant in Bladerunner?

And read the release about the EC, it REEKS of something being up, Clarification? Addition of details? NEARLY 2 GIGABYTES OF STORAGE SPACE?! Come on people, get a grip.

Glad to be back guys, here's some tough love for you all.

In fairness they have said the large download size is due to the sheer variability of the ending content which will actually amoun to + 10 mins or so per playthrough