55528 réponses à ce sujet

[Makrys]

To be honest, it sounds like we haven't seen the last of Shepard.

There's no other logical reason to leave the breath scene.

And yet I'm pissed at Bioware for it. I just wanted some freaking closure, and I got very little. Yes, I saw the galaxy rebuilding, but I really wanted a scene with Liara at the end.

Did it happen? Nope. Thanks, Bioware.

Modifié par Makrys, 26 juin 2012 - 03:30 .

[nullobject]

ean0611 wrote...

nullobject wrote...

ean0611 wrote...

nullobject wrote...

ean0611 wrote...

Seriously, Relax. Bioware will have more weekend fun with multiplayer, and eventually get to Firebase earth, and will add in the real fight against Harbinger. I'm calling it right now.

Want to put some money on that?

$20 to the charity of the winner's choice?

Sure.

To clarify, you're claiming Bioware will at some point release Single Player DLC that reveals the current endings aren't real and provides combat with Harbinger (either gameplay or cutscene). Correct?

Whats the horizon date? 3 months?

I'd give it a horizon date of Dec 31st barring another announcement. I pick this because I suspect that they will have the DLC for the holiday season to sell more copies of Mass Effect 3.

"It was all a dream" ME3 single-player ending DLC featuring combat against Harbinger released on or before Dec 31, 2012. You're on.

Keeping with tradition, you can send the $20 to childsplay. 

[Brother Takka]

v0rt3x22 wrote...

Brother Takka wrote...

I know there is still the Breath part at the end, but I just think that's Bioware saying Shep lives. .

Yes but why would they bother showing this?
They could just leave the entire thing to your imagination.

And why would they only show it with the "Destroy" ending?

Think about it...

I have done. did you not read all of my post, or did you just pick out that one line?

Why leave it in you ask, to show shep can survive one of the endings, for people who didnt want there shep to die? So it's "the happy" ending people wanted. And it's a cheap way of doing it. there are many resions for that seen to still be there. But i think BioWare would have come out with it by now that IT is real or fake.

I can't see them going, this is the end of the game, ok you didnt like that one, here the end again but better.  HAHA we had you. Now hears the real ending. If in a few months they bring out a DLC with the "real ending" I will lose my mind. I love the ME games. and I want the end to be the end. not be Trolled for half a year into thinking that I've seen the end.

If IT is to remamin the true end, BioWare need to cowboy the **** up and tell us.

[v0rt3x22]

Makrys wrote...

To be honest, it sounds like we haven't seen the last of Shepard.

There's no other logical reason to leave the breath scene.

And yet I'm pissed at Bioware for it. I just wanted some freaking closure, and I got very little. Yes, I saw the galaxy rebuilding, but I really wanted a scene with Liara at the end.

Nope. Thanks, Bioware.

I honestly think we need to either come up with an open letter or another cupcake thing - to have them reveal whether IT is true (ie. was their intention) or not.

This is getting a bit ridiculous.

[Silhouett3]

nullobject wrote...

Easy, Bioware wrote an ending that  doesn't make sense and has plot holes. Welcome to 3 months ago.

The IT was about how it really did make sense, once you crack the super-sekrit code. Then Bioware were supposed to release new DLC explaining the super-sekrit code to everyone else and we'd all hail them as geniuses.

Instead of that, now you're left with "my headcanon fills some plot holes".

Ah.. the "bad writerz writez bad" argument for the 46745th time. That also can support IT you know or in fact anything else too, because it doesn't need any context to work with, it can go for anything. So no one can take that as an explanation. Sorry, try again later maybe:innocent:

The endings are fundementaly the same. We were offered what a Reaper puts as "ascendance". We were offered a future that develops alongs the Reapers' paths. We were asked to become Reaper nations. The scene-to-scene interpratations made by some IT theorists before may be wronged now, but the reasons IT was born in the first place are still there, not touched one bit.

[v0rt3x22]

Brother Takka wrote...

v0rt3x22 wrote...

Brother Takka wrote...

I know there is still the Breath part at the end, but I just think that's Bioware saying Shep lives. .

Yes but why would they bother showing this?
They could just leave the entire thing to your imagination.

And why would they only show it with the "Destroy" ending?

Think about it...

I have done. did you not read all of my post, or did you just pick out that one line?

Why leave it in you ask, to show shep can survive one of the endings, for people who didnt want there shep to die? So it's "the happy" ending people wanted. And it's a cheap way of doing it. there are many resions for that seen to still be there. But i think BioWare would have come out with it by now that IT is real or fake.

I can't see them going, this is the end of the game, ok you didnt like that one, here the end again but better.  HAHA we had you. Now hears the real ending. If in a few months they bring out a DLC with the "real ending" I will lose my mind. I love the ME games. and I want the end to be the end. not be Trolled for half a year into thinking that I've seen the end.

If IT is to remamin the true end, BioWare need to cowboy the **** up and tell us.

I did read your entire post - but I don't like to quote lengthy posts, when all I'm commenting is on a small section - that's why.

And yes I agree - BioWare needs to be straight up with us.

[ThisOneIsPunny]

nullobject wrote...

v0rt3x22 wrote...

Now consider that in context:

- Bioware just spent big piles of time and money making a new ending DLC that expands on the endings given, taking them completely seriously, and removes many of the plot holes and inconsistencies that prompted the IT

Removes? Which ones?

No more teleporting squadmates - there is now a scene showing them being picked up.

No more out-of-character fleeing of Normandy - orders are given by Hackett and the crew discuss it

Less 1M1 textures (but not completely gone)

Less inconsistencies about Shepard/Anderson placement in citadel - Shepard is shown being tossed into pile of bodies after ascending beam (haven't seen this, going on someone's post only)

No more destroyed citadel, destroyed relays, galactic wasteland and stranded Normandy - retconned away (these weren't so much plot holes as things people hated, that made them want a better ending)

Shepard less out-of-character in Catalyst conversation (investigate and reject options).

Probably find more once I actually get to play it.

Why put all this effort into "fixing" a hallucination sequence? According to the IT, the whole point of these inconsistencies was that they showed the clever people that "it was all just a dream"?

The weapon bobbing is still present

The room with similarities to not only the apartment the child was in, but also similarities to Shepard's own quarters (bed, hamster cage, much much more)

The surrealism of the decision chamber, the echo of both shepard VAs made LOUDER

Harbinger screeching at you while you run to the beam, shooting you damn near DEAD on this time instead in front of you and yet you still survive.

Shepard still clutching the same side Anderson was shot in
Oh hey, the wound is still there too.

That's hardly all of it, that's not even going into the underlying themes throughout the series, the foreshadowing, or the infrasound. And how about that refusal ending? How many people wanted to defy the catalyst's logic, remember that? Boy that sure ends well.And that "So be it." line? Totally nothing to look into there. Nope.<_<

My point being, IT neither been confirmed, nor denied. If anything, there's more to speculate on.

[v0rt3x22]

Jessica Merizan is on the forum now.

[masster blaster]

v0rt3x22 wrote...

Makrys wrote...

To be honest, it sounds like we haven't seen the last of Shepard.

There's no other logical reason to leave the breath scene.

And yet I'm pissed at Bioware for it. I just wanted some freaking closure, and I got very little. Yes, I saw the galaxy rebuilding, but I really wanted a scene with Liara at the end.

Nope. Thanks, Bioware.

I honestly think we need to either come up with an open letter or another cupcake thing - to have them reveal whether IT is true (ie. was their intention) or not.

This is getting a bit ridiculous.

I don't know but why add the breath scene still if we see the galaxy rebuilding or have we, and it makes no senes to have Shepard breath at the end of Destroy but it happered right after the epoiloge ended.

[FellishBeast]

ean0611 wrote...

Razerath wrote...

ean0611 wrote...

http://twitter.com/J...607553838874625

Has anyone saw that? She knew exactly what he meant. This is intentional.

Bioware. FINE! Take my money! SELL ME A GOD DAMN DLC to finish off the reapers. I want a fight with Harbinger.

Because Destroy is worse than Refusal.

Refusal the Catalyst can still find a "new" Shepard to help solve the problem of chaos and create peace someday. Choosing Destroy means it will never happen and unless by luck another Reaper AI is created with the same guidelines as the Catalyst, everything in the galaxy is eventually doomed. Synthetics will kill organics and never gain "true understanding".

Control helps the issue because Shepard can instead of the cycles, stick around in Reaper form as an armada of super robots to keep everything in check as best as he can. Even the Catalyst allowing this shows the connection it has for wanting peace. The Catalyst is willing to give up it's solution to let it's organic counterpart try his/her own way.

Synthesis is the true good ending. It's how it all stops and even though it's deeply rooted in sci-fi, the idea is extremely plausible. Not to mention the Catalyst basically says that not only will all life be saved, so will those preserved in Reaper form.

You're indoctrinated.

They didn't change the pattern in which the galaxy "blows up". It STILL does not come from earth on the galaxy map. 

The Gun still changes from Caninfex to Predeator if you choose destory. The eyes still change on synthesis and control.

The star child is proven to be Harbinger based on the brand new reject ending.

Yeah, IT is not dead.

If it is, they'll have to add MORE DLC, and it's just getting old. If they go with it, I'll gladly accept, but with the EC as we have it, IT is nothing more than a theory.

[zambot]

v0rt3x22 wrote...

zambot wrote...

That is clearly not what Bioware is intending. They've now produced the same ending, twice.

I get what you're saying here - I find it strange as well - that despite all the drama - they haven't taken any stance on the theory - and it might end up hurting them more - but also - about producing the same ending twice:

a) EC was not originally planned
It's as you said: the SAME ending twice - so IT has not been debunked (nor confirmed)

If IT could actually offer an ending, then Bioware's desire that people can still speculate about it has legs. But IT has not ever offered us an ending. Unless it can, it should be relegated to the "wouldn't it be cool if...." category.

IT was never meant to be an ending....the way I see it (and interpret it) - the ending is a cliffhanger to a continuation.

"One more story about the shepard"?
Shepard breathing?
The tweets which tell us to hang on to our save games?

All of these indicate a continuation.

I always thought Bioware was clear about this for months through release of the game.  ME3 is the end, at least for Shepard.  Expecting it to go on, is expecting Bioware to change their minds.  

[Capeo]

Makrys wrote...

To be honest, it sounds like we haven't seen the last of Shepard.

There's no other logical reason to leave the breath scene.

And yet I'm pissed at Bioware for it. I just wanted some freaking closure, and I got very little. Yes, I saw the galaxy rebuilding, but I really wanted a scene with Liara at the end.

Did it happen? Nope. Thanks, Bioware.

Why do you say there isn't a logical reason to leave the breath scene?  It's the only possible ending Shep could survive.  The other two consume his body.  BW even went through more effort in making it quite literal by having your LI realize your still alive and take off to find you.

[Squallypo]

v0rt3x22 wrote...

Jessica Merizan is on the forum now.

where?

[LazyTechGuy]

v0rt3x22 wrote...

Jessica Merizan is on the forum now.

Oh my God, we haven't even vacuumed!

[ZerebusPrime]

 UrrrRRRRerrrrrrrRRRRRRRNNNNNNNRRRGHH!!!
I did it again!  I looked at the forums before I could play the game. 

Quick!  Someone use space magic to send me back into a state of blissful ignorance!  You know, like this thread about thirty pages ago, where I started reading this morning.

[v0rt3x22]

Squallypo wrote...

v0rt3x22 wrote...

Jessica Merizan is on the forum now.

where?

She locked a thread.

[nullobject]

v0rt3x22 wrote...

nullobject wrote...

Jessica Merizan says lots of wierd stuff on twitter. She's basically a fan, with fan-fic theories, retained by Bioware to help improve their image with fans.

For example, she was claiming at one point that the guys on the Normandy didn't run away like cowards, they crashed on Earth. An Earth that had suddenly grown an extra moon. 
 
Take her tweets seriously at your own risk.

I can't visit Twitter right now (Work) - what did she tweet?

I just did a search and either I fail at twitter search, or it's been deleted.

You can read this thread to see the discussion about it and other statements at the time - starts on page 5 or so.

[v0rt3x22]

LazyTechGuy wrote...

v0rt3x22 wrote...

Jessica Merizan is on the forum now.

Oh my God, we haven't even vacuumed!

[Smeffects]

OK i want the IT people that support this theory still to seriously answer my one question:

Before the EC, the destroy ending alive scene was the kind of prouf that you survived and that you could go and save the day. In every ending shepard dream is that of victory, even destroy. So we can establish that under IT theory, what ever happens shepard dream he has done the right thing. Ok now answer me this: Why do the refuse ending make you dream about ultimate failure?

Think long and hard about this one, bioware said they didnt want to debunk or confirm IT. Yet this ending is pretty strong about the Debunk for the very fact that it exist next to the Destroy ending, but does not wield even close results, yet in the IT thoery, both would be the perfect pick. Hell refuse would be the ultimate good ending because you ended the indoctrination much sooner then destroy? So why the dream about failure?

Modifié par Smeffects, 26 juin 2012 - 03:43 .

[nullobject]

ThisOneIsPunny wrote...

nullobject wrote...

v0rt3x22 wrote...

Now consider that in context:

- Bioware just spent big piles of time and money making a new ending DLC that expands on the endings given, taking them completely seriously, and removes many of the plot holes and inconsistencies that prompted the IT

Removes? Which ones?

No more teleporting squadmates - there is now a scene showing them being picked up.

No more out-of-character fleeing of Normandy - orders are given by Hackett and the crew discuss it

Less 1M1 textures (but not completely gone)

Less inconsistencies about Shepard/Anderson placement in citadel - Shepard is shown being tossed into pile of bodies after ascending beam (haven't seen this, going on someone's post only)

No more destroyed citadel, destroyed relays, galactic wasteland and stranded Normandy - retconned away (these weren't so much plot holes as things people hated, that made them want a better ending)

Shepard less out-of-character in Catalyst conversation (investigate and reject options).

Probably find more once I actually get to play it.

Why put all this effort into "fixing" a hallucination sequence? According to the IT, the whole point of these inconsistencies was that they showed the clever people that "it was all just a dream"?

The weapon bobbing is still present

The room with similarities to not only the apartment the child was in, but also similarities to Shepard's own quarters (bed, hamster cage, much much more)

The surrealism of the decision chamber, the echo of both shepard VAs made LOUDER

Harbinger screeching at you while you run to the beam, shooting you damn near DEAD on this time instead in front of you and yet you still survive.

Shepard still clutching the same side Anderson was shot in
Oh hey, the wound is still there too.

That's hardly all of it, that's not even going into the underlying themes throughout the series, the foreshadowing, or the infrasound. And how about that refusal ending? How many people wanted to defy the catalyst's logic, remember that? Boy that sure ends well.And that "So be it." line? Totally nothing to look into there. Nope.<_<

My point being, IT neither been confirmed, nor denied. If anything, there's more to speculate on.

All of those things are consistent with the "poor writing" hypothesis.

Bioware spending months refining insignificant aspects of a dream sequence is not consistent with the "Bioware intended Indoctrination Theory and have a real ending DLC coming" hypothesis

[v0rt3x22]

nullobject wrote...

v0rt3x22 wrote...

nullobject wrote...

Jessica Merizan says lots of wierd stuff on twitter. She's basically a fan, with fan-fic theories, retained by Bioware to help improve their image with fans.

For example, she was claiming at one point that the guys on the Normandy didn't run away like cowards, they crashed on Earth. An Earth that had suddenly grown an extra moon. 
 
Take her tweets seriously at your own risk.

I can't visit Twitter right now (Work) - what did she tweet?

I just did a search and either I fail at twitter search, or it's been deleted.

You can read this thread to see the discussion about it and other statements at the time - starts on page 5 or so.

Ohhh this was 3 months ago?? I thought it was happening now.

[zambot]

Smeffects wrote...

OK i want the IT people that support this theory still to seriously answer my one question:

Before the EC, the destroy ending alive scene was the kind of prouf that you survived and that you could go and save the day. In every ending shepard dream is that of victory, even destroy. So we can establish that under IT theory, what ever happens shepard dream he has done the right thing. Ok now answer me this: Why do the refuse ending make you dream about ultimate failure?

Think long and hard about this one, bioware said they didnt want to debunk or confirm IT. Yet this ending is pretty strong about the Debunk for the very fact that it exist next to the Destroy ending, but does not wield even close results, yet in the IT thoery, both would be the perfect pick. Hell refuse would be the ultimate good ending because you ended the indoctrination much sooner then destroy?

Bioware did not intend to debunk the IT, but they also don't understand all the details of IT, so they did not intentionally go out of their way to preserve it.  So it's possible things in the EC will debunk parts of IT.  It's also possible people will tear about the new content and use it to make new points for IT.  

[v0rt3x22]

nullobject wrote...

All of those things are consistent with the "poor writing" hypothesis.

Oh please don't start this.....<_<

[Modernpreacher]

Razerath wrote...
News Flash the Catalyst is the controller of the Reapers. It is the AI program that in fact Reaped it's own creators when it came up with it's solution. The creators of the AI charged with finding a way to keep peace between organics and synthetics ( the chaos ) were made into the first Reaper.

That's exactly what I said a few pages back. The Catalyst pretty much states that directly. Very little has to be read into what he's saying to take that away from the conversation.

Since then The Catalyst has been waiting for someone or someTHING (organic or synthetic) to fix the loop that it's been stuck in.

It doesn't know of another way, doing nothing isn't an option. It's been waiting for millennia for someone to tell it how it make it better.

[clos]

Boy, Bioware screwed the pooch with EC.