55528 réponses à ce sujet

[MegumiAzusa]

ExtendedCut wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

ExtendedCut wrote...

The Invisible Commando wrote...

Sauruz wrote...

The Invisible Commando wrote...

If they went with IT, it would be fan appeasement. "Okay lets roll with your ending and make you happy." . We all see that Bioware does not like being told their ending ideas suck. To roll with IT is like saying "yes we did not make a real ending"

The child was always some attempt at poetry that Shepard is hurting inside that he can't save everyone. The StarBrat is a Reaper using his weakness against him. Yes its not great writing, but I get it.

How do you know that IT is wrong and your headcanon is right? Maybe Bioware always intended IT. Your headcanon isn't much less baseless than IT.
Besides, how did the Reaper know Shepard was "hurting inside" about that child?
I found a plot hole in your headcanon.

Reapers can speak to the mind. They can get in your head. That doesn't mean you have to be fully indotrinated for that to happen. Shepard is famous among the Reapers, their big nemesis. Use his weakness on him.

Your also talking to the Reaper God. It is very powerful and since its poorly intoduced, we don't know what it can and can not do. If the average Reaper can turn organics into husks, it stands to reason their god can do more. Trying to fool Shepard with a child that Shepard is thinks about won't be too hard.

If Shepard is on the ground in London and the Reaper in his head knows he is alive then why not just finish him off and end the anti-Reaper threat. Reapers aren't smart enought to hit him twice?

Your turning Reapers into James Bond villians who never just shoot Bond in the head. Have to do it the hard way for some reason?

"Trying to fool Shepard with a child that Shepard is thinks about won't be too hard" = Indoctrination???

How would they know Shepard is thinking about that child?

That's my point.  The Reapers, in a face-value ending, couldn't know anythng about the Vancouver-kid-in-the-vent,  so how would they know to have the Starkid appear as the vent-kid? 

However, in IT, it is explainable because the Starkid is merely an illusion/hallucination that appears to Shepard due to the suggestions of the Reaper indoctrination.  In other words, Shepard takes the indoctrination suggestion and forms his "dream" into what he knows and it familiar with - the vent-kid that has been haunting his dreams.

It is well established Reapers have some sort of mind reading abilities. Without they couldn't place their "gentle nudge in the right direction".

[Bill Casey]

If the ending is face value, why does Shepard see Anderson shooting the pipe?

Modifié par Bill Casey, 14 mai 2012 - 07:44 .

[RavenEyry]

About the shadows mentioned earlier on, I've done a little with the Unreal and to get effects like that I believe you would have to move the light sources around. I can't think of any reason you would do that if you didn't want to create funky shadows.

[DJBare]

Bill Casey wrote...

If the ending is face value, why does Shepard see Anderson shooting the pipe?

You do know what the answer to that will be of course.
It's to show noobs how to do it, of course they could have had a visual of Shepard doing if it were for that reason alone.

[BleedingUranium]

So, you know how we know nothing and have no hints as to what will be in EC, other than the Crucible is probably a trap? What about this?

(Copy-pasted from Parabolee's Blog)

Interview with Mac Walters (Lead Writer) 2/28/12

“[The presence of the Rachni] has huge consequences in Mass Effect 3. Even just in the final battle with the Reapers.”

What Rachni? Not even in the Earth battle cutscenes...

Modifié par BleedingUranium, 14 mai 2012 - 07:48 .

[dreamgazer]

RavenEyry wrote...

About the shadows mentioned earlier on, I've done a little with the Unreal and to get effects like that I believe you would have to move the light sources around. I can't think of any reason you would do that if you didn't want to create funky shadows.

Essentially like the "global light" functionality in Photoshop, right?

[DistantUtopia]

nightcobra8928 wrote...

 

DistantUtopia wrote...

As much as I'd like IT to be true, the more I think about it, I have a few questions that come to mind:

ME has always had a "canon" ending. It's just the way it works in the trilogy:
ME1 - Shepard defeats Sovereign
ME2 - Shepard defeats Collectors
ME3 - Shepard...???

This brings to mind the following questions:
1.) If IT is "real", would this imply "Destroy" is the true ending?
- In ME1/2, you didn't have alternate endings. You simply had alternate sub-plots opened (i.e. dead crew, saved Collector base). Why the sudden change now?
2.) If IT is "real" and "Destroy" is the true ending, where does that leave players that chose the other colors?
- My main concerns is that it seems clear that EA wants to milk the ME franchise for as much as it's worth. This means new games, regardless if it stars Shepard or not. Does this mean other games will assume Destroy is the true ending as well, discarding other players choices? To me, this implies that regardless of our Palette choice, there is still a "true" ending somewhere buried in the ending which isn't very obvious to me.

how about this:

remember matriarch benezia? she overcame the indocrination for a few moments and then died.
so what if a paragon/renegade (depending on your dominant tone) interrupt is shown during the entirity of the credits, pressing it makes you break free of the indocrination and so end the fight.

if you picked destroy, shepard lives as he/she didn't get indocrinated

if you picked the other two, shepard breaks through and resists enough time to bring down the reapers along with him/her

That makes sense now

I would like to see some form of penalty (i.e. dead or injured squadmates or some other type of penalty) for "falling under indoctrination".  Guess I have to wait for the EC or headcanon my way through the endings

[Lord Luc1fer]

hey, this help anything at all?

https://twitter.com/...464201645428736

EDIT hope link works

Modifié par Lord Luc1fer, 14 mai 2012 - 07:48 .

[DJBare]

BleedingUranium wrote...

So, you know how we know nothing and have no hints as to what will be in EC, other than the Crucible is probably a trap? What about this?

(Copy-pasted from Parabolee's Blog)

Interview with Mac Walters (Lead Writer) 2/28/12

“[The presence of the Rachni] has huge consequences in Mass Effect 3. Even just in the final battle with the Reapers.”

What Rachni? Not even in the Earth battle cutscenes...

Yup, probably because the fight is not actually over.

[dreamgazer]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

ExtendedCut wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

ExtendedCut wrote...

The Invisible Commando wrote...

Sauruz wrote...

The Invisible Commando wrote...

If they went with IT, it would be fan appeasement. "Okay lets roll with your ending and make you happy." . We all see that Bioware does not like being told their ending ideas suck. To roll with IT is like saying "yes we did not make a real ending"

The child was always some attempt at poetry that Shepard is hurting inside that he can't save everyone. The StarBrat is a Reaper using his weakness against him. Yes its not great writing, but I get it.

How do you know that IT is wrong and your headcanon is right? Maybe Bioware always intended IT. Your headcanon isn't much less baseless than IT.
Besides, how did the Reaper know Shepard was "hurting inside" about that child?
I found a plot hole in your headcanon.

Reapers can speak to the mind. They can get in your head. That doesn't mean you have to be fully indotrinated for that to happen. Shepard is famous among the Reapers, their big nemesis. Use his weakness on him.

Your also talking to the Reaper God. It is very powerful and since its poorly intoduced, we don't know what it can and can not do. If the average Reaper can turn organics into husks, it stands to reason their god can do more. Trying to fool Shepard with a child that Shepard is thinks about won't be too hard.

If Shepard is on the ground in London and the Reaper in his head knows he is alive then why not just finish him off and end the anti-Reaper threat. Reapers aren't smart enought to hit him twice?

Your turning Reapers into James Bond villians who never just shoot Bond in the head. Have to do it the hard way for some reason?

"Trying to fool Shepard with a child that Shepard is thinks about won't be too hard" = Indoctrination???

How would they know Shepard is thinking about that child?

That's my point.  The Reapers, in a face-value ending, couldn't know anythng about the Vancouver-kid-in-the-vent,  so how would they know to have the Starkid appear as the vent-kid? 

However, in IT, it is explainable because the Starkid is merely an illusion/hallucination that appears to Shepard due to the suggestions of the Reaper indoctrination.  In other words, Shepard takes the indoctrination suggestion and forms his "dream" into what he knows and it familiar with - the vent-kid that has been haunting his dreams.

It is well established Reapers have some sort of mind reading abilities. Without they couldn't place their "gentle nudge in the right direction".

... and I think there's a substantial difference between a quick manipulative mind-trick and manifesting the visage of the boy that a) is haunting your dreams, and was the symbol whom you associate the death of humanity's innocents.  Also, the Prothean and Asari mind-exploration capabilities all (unless I'm mistaken) pivot on some form of personal touch/imprinting.

[ExtendedCut]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

ExtendedCut wrote...

dreman9999 wrote...

ExtendedCut wrote...

The Invisible Commando wrote...

Sauruz wrote...

The Invisible Commando wrote...

If they went with IT, it would be fan appeasement. "Okay lets roll with your ending and make you happy." . We all see that Bioware does not like being told their ending ideas suck. To roll with IT is like saying "yes we did not make a real ending"

The child was always some attempt at poetry that Shepard is hurting inside that he can't save everyone. The StarBrat is a Reaper using his weakness against him. Yes its not great writing, but I get it.

How do you know that IT is wrong and your headcanon is right? Maybe Bioware always intended IT. Your headcanon isn't much less baseless than IT.
Besides, how did the Reaper know Shepard was "hurting inside" about that child?
I found a plot hole in your headcanon.

Reapers can speak to the mind. They can get in your head. That doesn't mean you have to be fully indotrinated for that to happen. Shepard is famous among the Reapers, their big nemesis. Use his weakness on him.

Your also talking to the Reaper God. It is very powerful and since its poorly intoduced, we don't know what it can and can not do. If the average Reaper can turn organics into husks, it stands to reason their god can do more. Trying to fool Shepard with a child that Shepard is thinks about won't be too hard.

If Shepard is on the ground in London and the Reaper in his head knows he is alive then why not just finish him off and end the anti-Reaper threat. Reapers aren't smart enought to hit him twice?

Your turning Reapers into James Bond villians who never just shoot Bond in the head. Have to do it the hard way for some reason?

"Trying to fool Shepard with a child that Shepard is thinks about won't be too hard" = Indoctrination???

How would they know Shepard is thinking about that child?

That's my point.  The Reapers, in a face-value ending, couldn't know anythng about the Vancouver-kid-in-the-vent,  so how would they know to have the Starkid appear as the vent-kid? 

However, in IT, it is explainable because the Starkid is merely an illusion/hallucination that appears to Shepard due to the suggestions of the Reaper indoctrination.  In other words, Shepard takes the indoctrination suggestion and forms his "dream" into what he knows and it familiar with - the vent-kid that has been haunting his dreams.

It is well established Reapers have some sort of mind reading abilities. Without they couldn't place their "gentle nudge in the right direction".

Could you please offer a reference?  In my mind, the Reaper "suggestion" that initiates and/or steers indoctrination is completely different than "mind reading".  I would appreciate something that contradicts me, however.

Modifié par ExtendedCut, 14 mai 2012 - 07:54 .

[Lord Luc1fer]

Lord Luc1fer wrote...

hey, this help anything at all?

https://twitter.com/...464201645428736

EDIT hope link works

Mike gamble comment on future SP dlc

[RavenEyry]

dreamgazer wrote...

RavenEyry wrote...

About the shadows mentioned earlier on, I've done a little with the Unreal and to get effects like that I believe you would have to move the light sources around. I can't think of any reason you would do that if you didn't want to create funky shadows.

Essentially like the "global light" functionality in Photoshop, right?

Dunno, don't use it. My point is, as far as I know, the light sources are on the map and interact with the characters. You can't change a characters shadow without moving the lights. I don't know why you would want to move the lights if you didn't want to modify shadows. The shadows can't accidentaly change.

[TSA_383]

blooregard wrote...

I was wondering about the dreamtree files.

What are the file names in the actual dreams? Are they the same or different.

They're identical. The places they've now been confirmed are:

Dreams
Post-harbinger
End Planet
Grissom Academy (the one weird one...)

The Invisible Commando wrote...

Okay, here is some opposing. If your going to rebuild IT then I want all pro IT to answer my question: What is the real ending?

So Shepard wakes up in London and now what....

If I pick Destroy, how do I destroy the Reapers in the real world?

If I pick Control, how do I control the Reapers in the real world?

If
I pick Synthesis, do I then have to get up and shoot my squadmates and
the allies to save the Reapers? Oh how nice of me to turn traitor at the
last second.

Until this has an answer, your Indoctrination Theory falls apart at its core.

It doesn't fall apart because we have no idea what the real ending will eventually be.
Ask the devs [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/wink.png[/smilie]

The Invisible Commando wrote...



So you assume Control
somehow means Indocrinated? Oh yes not only TIM thinks he can use Reaper
tech, but some Protheans also tried to and that is mentioned on
Thessia. They are all wrong or Indoctrinated?

Yes.
In fact, the VI even refers to them as "indoctrinated agents".

SS2Dante wrote...

JasonSic wrote...

I
noticed that when Harbinger shoots Shepard with his beam, we never
actually see it hit Shepard. The screen fades to white before that.
Meaning Shepard may never actually get hit by the beam, it just comes
close enough to knock him out, or start the hallucination.

It
fades to white while playing a choir-like sound effect. A choir like
sound effect that only ever heard in the dreams and the Crucible
section...

It also plays when you get hit by harbinger's beam, but that's more difficult to hear without looking at the game files. Also, you were looking for me in the other thread I think before it locked

nightcobra8928 wrote...

if IT is true then we don't really know what happened to TIM after we talked to him at the cerberus base.
he could be like he was in the mental struggle or worse, a monster like in the artbook.
i'd
be fine if we could convince TIM to use his research to make all reaper
ground forces suicide before he dies as well, as a last act of defiance
against the reapers and preservation of humanity, not necessarily being
a good guy but a man who died for what he believed in, no matter how
misguided he was in the end.

I was suggesting in the last thread that TIM might make some sort of noble sacrifice (or attempt to) when it became obvious that humanity was under threat.
I really hope we get that, it'd be a powerful scene...

blooregard wrote...

The original thread was locked? That's...unexpected.

About time too, I posted a ton of interesting stuff that got lost among the dick jokes <_<

Now we just have to try and top 600k views on this thread as well! 

[M Hedonist]

The Invisible Commando wrote...

At the end? Shepard is hurt bad.

They'll just do the same to him as they did to Saren's body.

Only thing left is to try to bargan with him. I do hate that Shepard is letting himself bargan with Reapers, but that is how they wrote it.

Neither Shepard nor the Reapers should have any reason to bargain. Everything Catalyst had to do to stop Shepard was not to bring him up on the elevator. Or not talk to him. And Shepard could have at least talked to the Catalyst, he's making a decision that affects the whole galaxy and he has barely any information.
And the new 'solutions' are no solutions at all and crappy compromises at best. Catalyst admits himself that 'Destruction' will not prevent 'chaos' from happening. The thing the Reapers tried pretty hard to prevent for billions of years. And in 'Control' he hands all of his power over to Shepard, an individual whose motives he can't predict. Shepard might do anything, he could even use the Reapers to wipe out all organic life.

DJBare wrote...

JasonSic wrote...

I noticed that when Harbinger shoots Shepard with his beam, we never actually see it hit Shepard. The screen fades to white before that. Meaning Shepard may never actually get hit by the beam, it just comes close enough to knock him out, or start the hallucination.

Here's a thought, Shepard may not have even got that far, when in the armored personnel vehicle it crashes and lights out.

Interesting idea. It would make the 'dream trees' on the battlefield viable evidence for IT again.

Modifié par Sauruz, 14 mai 2012 - 07:54 .

[EpyonX3]

nightcobra8928 wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

DJBare wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...


I always thought the reapers were simply making sure that there can never be a rival to them. Or that the needed organics to fuel them and multiply, therefore, harvesting them when their populations are largest.

Then I played the ending.

This was my thought also, the real threat of synthetics is to the reapers themselves, synthetics cannot be indoctrinated, and before anyone says anything, the heretics were not controlled, they "chose" to follow Sovereign believing him to be some kind of god.

But there were pockets of geth "loaded with reaper code." They would have been synthetic husks eventually.

a code is just that, a line of code.
by itself it won't come alive or have thoughts of its own.
the geth only used that particular code to improve their processing up to a point where it is equivalent to an organic's brain.

The context implies that it was not a single line of code. When get reach consensus, they all follow.

[EpyonX3]

Ravereth wrote...

http://desmond.image...png&res=landing
+
"You have hope, more than you think"
=
"How many reapers does it take to stop Commander Shepard? six houndred and one. Six houndred fight his intergalactic armada and one pretends to be a kid and talks him into suicide"
OK I gues I should go play some MP... 

Wasn't Ashley's quote regarding Miranda's father's experiments on Sanctuary? If so they had nothing to do with reapers and all to do with human wanting power.

[DistantUtopia]

pirate1802 wrote...

Also, since this is the end of Shepard's story, there is no need of a "real" ending anyway. They don't have to continue his story like they had to in ME1 and 2.

Well, if there were no further ME stories (regardless if Shepard is in it or not), then I agree we don't need a "true" ending.

If for some reason EA makes Bioware release a sequel ME (not a prequel or side story), then we will need a "true" ending.

As someone mentioned, if all color endings lead to Shepard breaking out of the Indoctrination (with Destroy just resisting it altogether) and defeating the Reapers, then that would be the true ending (i.e. Shepard defeats the Reapers; how much loss would then be determined by our choices throughout the entire trilogy).

[Robhuzz]

JasonSic wrote...

I noticed that when Harbinger shoots Shepard with his beam, we never actually see it hit Shepard. The screen fades to white before that. Meaning Shepard may never actually get hit by the beam, it just comes close enough to knock him out, or start the hallucination.

I thought that was obvious enough. This isn't some simple anti personnel beam that can be shrugged off by a kinetic barrier. This is a beam that rips through the barriers and armor of a cruiser and destroys it in a single hit. If Shepard had been hit directly, there would be nothing left but ashes.

[balance5050]

EpyonX3 wrote...

Ravereth wrote...

http://desmond.image...png&res=landing
+
"You have hope, more than you think"
=
"How many reapers does it take to stop Commander Shepard? six houndred and one. Six houndred fight his intergalactic armada and one pretends to be a kid and talks him into suicide"
OK I gues I should go play some MP... 

Wasn't Ashley's quote regarding Miranda's father's experiments on Sanctuary? If so they had nothing to do with reapers and all to do with human wanting power.

Yeah but it's talking about how influencial "hope" can be, the symbolism in this game is rampant.

[M Hedonist]

Lord Luc1fer wrote...

hey, this help anything at all?

https://twitter.com/...464201645428736

EDIT hope link works

Yeah. They probably initially thought the same of DA II.
Let's see how the ending dlc plays out, first.

[Gorebat]

Dumb question, we aren't disputing how we obtained the Carnifex, correct? Because if I remember correctly we got that from our favorite Salarian scientist back on Omega.

[balance5050]

Gorebat wrote...

Dumb question, we aren't disputing how we obtained the Carnifex, correct? Because if I remember correctly we got that from our favorite Salarian scientist back on Omega.

Yeah, the Carnifex IS Shepard's pistol that he uses in ALL the cutscenes, to suddenly give him a predetor (both Saren  and TIM used it, plus other baddies) in the last few frames we see him, makes almost 0 sense to me.

[marcelo_sdk]

  

Just me or that's "The Suicide Mission" on the video? (it's in spanish cause was the only one I found, but I'm from Brazil) 

[Lord Luc1fer]

Sauruz wrote...

Lord Luc1fer wrote...

hey, this help anything at all?

https://twitter.com/...464201645428736

EDIT hope link works

Yeah. They probably initially thought the same of DA II.
Let's see how the ending dlc plays out, first.

Did they never make DA II DLC then? sorry, I didn't play it so not completely sure what you meant :S