55528 réponses à ce sujet

[BatmanTurian]

TJBartlemus wrote...

BatmanTurian wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

OK, I know I said that I was going to take a break, but I had a thought. Remember how people were SO upset that there was only ONE way to break free of indoctrination while there were TWO ways to succumb to it? Well, maybe Rejection was added as a second way of breaking free. That way, two unindoctrinated endings, and two indoctrinated endings. Any thoughts?

I have honestly given up on the idea of a full hallucination at this point and taken on a more waking nightmare approach. I think the endings are as real as they are supposed to be and indoctrination is used sparingly in the game and not to its full potential. That is just my opinion, though.

Edit: Here is a possibility on what BioWare could have done. If not then, I still will believe in IT.

Yes!! I feel that the Reapers are influencing your perceptions, in an attempt for you to make a choice that is favorable to them. Control/Synthesis impose the Reapers on the galaxy. It's too much like giving up and surrendering. Harbinger doesn't destroy the Normandy because then it would be too hard to get Shepard to trust the leader of the Reapers. Harbinger attempting on Shepard's life is to make the situation seem more real and like the Reapers are the bad guy but the leader of them is your friend. He tells you the truth about their origins, and that he didn't expect the Crucible. He then lies to you about the choices to get you to trust him. (He still lied about the fact you wouldn't survive destroy) How else would the Reapers make you choose something favorable to them in a situation they didn't (or possibly did) expect?

So BioWare could have possibly made a "melding" of the two perspectives on the ending. This way everyone was right.

That's what I'm saying. People want to come in here and demand for us to say we were completely wrong. Well, sorry, but we weren't. There were some parts we had wrong, but some of it was true. In the end, both sides were wrong and right even if it seems only one side will admit it.

[v0rt3x22]

Trollgunner wrote...

v0rt3x22 wrote...

No course not and thanks :-) Just give credit if you can <3

I sure will do. You know what's a pity? When I was looking for an artistic person to do smth like that : " A picture of Shepard riding a Normandy on top, swinging his omni-blade and shouting "Joker! Drive me closer, I want to hit those reapers with my omni-blade!" and a sign under it "Badass Shepard  in DLC you demanded" " No one did that D: And i couldn't do it myself TзT Aww..

yea sorry I'm not that artistic 

[BatmanTurian]

masster blaster wrote...

My question is why does Shepard look back when Shepard wakes up after Shepard enters the Conduit on Earth. Is he looking for Anderson, or is Shepard looking at the thing behind him/her which look's just like the relay in the Citadel? Thoughts.

" How did I get up here? Oh. Makes sense then. "

[Earthborn_Shepard]

v0rt3x22 wrote...

Earthborn_Shepard wrote...

Ok then We're still a big family.

And I don't mind being called a he, that's only logical to assume.. just thought I'd clarify.

You're a girl who like Mass Effect? <3 Will you be my LI?

Sorry, but I'm already space-married to Kaidan...

[SubAstris]

BatmanTurian wrote...

SubAstris wrote...

BatmanTurian wrote...

SubAstris wrote...

TJBartlemus wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

OK, I know I said that I was going to take a break, but I had a thought. Remember how people were SO upset that there was only ONE way to break free of indoctrination while there were TWO ways to succumb to it? Well, maybe Rejection was added as a second way of breaking free. That way, two unindoctrinated endings, and two indoctrinated endings. Any thoughts?

Well I feel Desroy was the best one of all of them, because it gave everyone hope to choose their lives. In Synthesis or Control you impose those decisions on the rest of the galaxy. Reject I feel is counter productive. Cause Michael Gamble replied that the next cycle uses the crucible anyway, so what was the point of refusing it??

On a separate point, doesn't this imply that the Crucible wasn't a Reaper device and the Catalyst was right?

Yes, the catalyst says itself that it is not a reaper device. The catalyst is not a complete liar but can be said to be slightly manipulative.

I thought Reapers were fully evil, surely they would lie about everything...
But what bits are manipulative?

it appears as a boy. It's thrown up the peace flag but it's lobbying shepard to choose a future that includes the Reapers,  and its true voice is masked. It isn't the catalyst because the catalyst is the Reapers. A catalyst is not changed by a reaction. The citadel is not changed by the reaction so it is the true catalyst. The starkid, however, is changed by the reaction. It simply doesn't exist anymore in two of the endings. Therefore, it was a Reaper because the Reapers are changed no matter what happens.

1) Yes cool he does, and by doing so reminds Shepard of the horrors of the Reapers and all the people he has lost. I guess it would be like meeting someone who had a bloodied knife in one hand and a severed head in the other, it wouldn't go down too well

2) These things aren't necessarily mutually exclusive if what he is saying is true, and given by the cutscenes we got with EC it seems that not everything would be bad controlling the Reapers for instance.

3) It's a form. It has to adopt a voice because it is an AI.

4) You know this isn't supported by evidence in-game, why put it in? 

5) Correct

6) The Starkid himself doesn't change, the Crucible has created new possibilites for Shepard to choose. He himself can't choose them, can't get used up.

[BatmanTurian]

v0rt3x22 wrote...

Earthborn_Shepard wrote...

Ok then We're still a big family.

And I don't mind being called a he, that's only logical to assume.. just thought I'd clarify.

You're a girl who like Mass Effect? <3 Will you be my LI?

She probably has a guy. Also internet relationships rarely work out. Also asking someone out on a message board is creepy. Also you are probably joking and this post is a waste of time.

[SubAstris]

Xavendithas wrote...

SubAstris wrote...

Xavendithas wrote...

SubAstris wrote...

On a separate point, doesn't this imply that the Crucible wasn't a Reaper device and the Catalyst was right?

The Catalyst itself states that they believed they did not know for certain what cycle had created the Crucible, and that the reapers believed they had destroyed all evidence of the Crucible....

But according to IT he is lying through his teeth, or is he just conveniently not lying at this moment?

I can't tell you how to interpret that piece of dialogue. You have to do that for yourself. I personally did not take it as a lie, or even a half truth. The Catalyst seemed to be providing an answer to what it was asked.

Why doesn't the Catalyst in that respect seem to not be providing other credible answers?

[Trollgunner]

BatmanTurian wrote...

v0rt3x22 wrote...

Earthborn_Shepard wrote...

Ok then We're still a big family.

And I don't mind being called a he, that's only logical to assume.. just thought I'd clarify.

You're a girl who like Mass Effect? <3 Will you be my LI?

She probably has a guy. Also internet relationships rarely work out. Also asking someone out on a message board is creepy. Also you are probably joking and this post is a waste of time.

Oh BatmanTurian *wink and silly music plays*

[Earthborn_Shepard]

BatmanTurian wrote...

v0rt3x22 wrote...

Earthborn_Shepard wrote...

Ok then We're still a big family.

And I don't mind being called a he, that's only logical to assume.. just thought I'd clarify.

You're a girl who like Mass Effect? <3 Will you be my LI?

She probably has a guy. Also internet relationships rarely work out. Also asking someone out on a message board is creepy. Also you are probably joking and this post is a waste of time.

...your work is done, Captain Obvious. Here, have this rock!

[paxxton]

byne wrote...

paxxton wrote...

byne wrote...

paxxton wrote...

byne wrote...

You know what? I'm not getting into this crap with you again Paxxton. You can keep your control and synthesis endings and have sweet dreams about being a god and forcing people into line, or being a god and altering their DNA, but not me. I have principles.

I also have principles. Even in RL war changes everything and the world after is much different than before. There are no status quo solutions during the war.

So basically you have principles, just not in war? That must be convenient.

I personally cant just turn off my principles when it suits my needs.

LOL. This is not what I meant.
Grabbing your principles and waving them like a flag is ok but you still have to be open for new possibilities that arise, new solutions and ways of resolving conflicts, novel thinking. Especialy if they can prevent further destruction and bring added value. And especially during the war with the Reapers.

No amount of mental contortions will ever make it ok for me to either enslave the Reapers or to forcibly alter everyone in the galaxy on a molecular level.

You might be ok with abandoning your principles, but I'm not.

Then you lose the war, destroy everything, make people suffer, vaporize them and make a galactic mess. Oh, and Hackett is proud of that. Really cool.



We're lucky IT is still a serious possibility.

In reference to Earthborn_Shepard's post, no, you're not rude.

Modifié par paxxton, 27 juin 2012 - 07:44 .

[EpyonX3]

So who remembers that leak about EC? They were right about most of it weren't they?

[BatmanTurian]

SubAstris wrote...

BatmanTurian wrote...

SubAstris wrote...

BatmanTurian wrote...

SubAstris wrote...

TJBartlemus wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

OK, I know I said that I was going to take a break, but I had a thought. Remember how people were SO upset that there was only ONE way to break free of indoctrination while there were TWO ways to succumb to it? Well, maybe Rejection was added as a second way of breaking free. That way, two unindoctrinated endings, and two indoctrinated endings. Any thoughts?

Well I feel Desroy was the best one of all of them, because it gave everyone hope to choose their lives. In Synthesis or Control you impose those decisions on the rest of the galaxy. Reject I feel is counter productive. Cause Michael Gamble replied that the next cycle uses the crucible anyway, so what was the point of refusing it??

On a separate point, doesn't this imply that the Crucible wasn't a Reaper device and the Catalyst was right?

Yes, the catalyst says itself that it is not a reaper device. The catalyst is not a complete liar but can be said to be slightly manipulative.

I thought Reapers were fully evil, surely they would lie about everything...
But what bits are manipulative?

it appears as a boy. It's thrown up the peace flag but it's lobbying shepard to choose a future that includes the Reapers,  and its true voice is masked. It isn't the catalyst because the catalyst is the Reapers. A catalyst is not changed by a reaction. The citadel is not changed by the reaction so it is the true catalyst. The starkid, however, is changed by the reaction. It simply doesn't exist anymore in two of the endings. Therefore, it was a Reaper because the Reapers are changed no matter what happens.

1) Yes cool he does, and by doing so reminds Shepard of the horrors of the Reapers and all the people he has lost. I guess it would be like meeting someone who had a bloodied knife in one hand and a severed head in the other, it wouldn't go down too well

2) These things aren't necessarily mutually exclusive if what he is saying is true, and given by the cutscenes we got with EC it seems that not everything would be bad controlling the Reapers for instance.

3) It's a form. It has to adopt a voice because it is an AI.

4) You know this isn't supported by evidence in-game, why put it in? 

5) Correct

6) The Starkid himself doesn't change, the Crucible has created new possibilites for Shepard to choose. He himself can't choose them, can't get used up.

explain what you're asking in #4

6) Starkid is affected after the reaction, therefore it is changed. Shepard becomes the new Controlling Mind in Control, the Starkid understands organics in Synthesis, there is no starkid or Controlling Mind in destroy, therefore the " Catalyst" is changed. The Citadel itself is never changed (except in destroy where it is damaged a little) therefore it is the true catalyst.

[byne]

BatmanTurian wrote...

She probably has a guy. Also internet relationships rarely work out. Also asking someone out on a message board is creepy. Also you are probably joking and this post is a waste of time.

I dont know about that. I know of three couples who met through WoW and got married.

That'd be a weird conversation to have with your kids though.

Mommy, where did you meet daddy?

Azeroth.

[Dwailing]

You know, I think I recognize that sound that you hear right after you get to the Citadel and Shepard wakes up. I'm pretty sure that it's the same sound that you heard in ME1 during the cuts between parts of the Prothean vision of Eden Prime. What does this mean? Well, I'll let you all decide for yourselves, and I'll see if I like any particular explanation.

[RiouHotaru]

Wait...people still think IT is viable?

[Earthborn_Shepard]

byne wrote...

BatmanTurian wrote...

She probably has a guy. Also internet relationships rarely work out. Also asking someone out on a message board is creepy. Also you are probably joking and this post is a waste of time.

I dont know about that. I know of three couples who met through WoW and got married.

That'd be a weird conversation to have with your kids though.

Mommy, where did you meet daddy?

Azeroth.

You know, son, when two people really like each other, they go questing together...

[byne]

RiouHotaru wrote...

Wait...people still think IT is viable?

Wait, literalists still somehow think the EC made IT less viable?

[BatmanTurian]

Earthborn_Shepard wrote...

BatmanTurian wrote...

v0rt3x22 wrote...

Earthborn_Shepard wrote...

Ok then We're still a big family.

And I don't mind being called a he, that's only logical to assume.. just thought I'd clarify.

You're a girl who like Mass Effect? <3 Will you be my LI?

She probably has a guy. Also internet relationships rarely work out. Also asking someone out on a message board is creepy. Also you are probably joking and this post is a waste of time.

...your work is done, Captain Obvious. Here, have this rock!

[ThisOneIsPunny]

BatmanTurian wrote...

v0rt3x22 wrote...

Earthborn_Shepard wrote...

Ok then We're still a big family.

And I don't mind being called a he, that's only logical to assume.. just thought I'd clarify.

You're a girl who like Mass Effect? <3 Will you be my LI?

She probably has a guy. Also internet relationships rarely work out. Also asking someone out on a message board is creepy. Also you are probably joking and this post is a waste of time.

Channeling Liara a little too strongly for someone going by batmanturian 

[EpyonX3]

SubAstris wrote...

Xavendithas wrote...

SubAstris wrote...

Xavendithas wrote...

SubAstris wrote...

On a separate point, doesn't this imply that the Crucible wasn't a Reaper device and the Catalyst was right?

The Catalyst itself states that they believed they did not know for certain what cycle had created the Crucible, and that the reapers believed they had destroyed all evidence of the Crucible....

But according to IT he is lying through his teeth, or is he just conveniently not lying at this moment?

I can't tell you how to interpret that piece of dialogue. You have to do that for yourself. I personally did not take it as a lie, or even a half truth. The Catalyst seemed to be providing an answer to what it was asked.

Why doesn't the Catalyst in that respect seem to not be providing other credible answers?

Oh you know the answer to that one. That's one of the reasons I couldn't back IT. Everyone had their spin on it.

[BatmanTurian]

byne wrote...

BatmanTurian wrote...

She probably has a guy. Also internet relationships rarely work out. Also asking someone out on a message board is creepy. Also you are probably joking and this post is a waste of time.

I dont know about that. I know of three couples who met through WoW and got married.

That'd be a weird conversation to have with your kids though.

Mommy, where did you meet daddy?

Azeroth.

I said rarely. There are always exceptions to the rule.

[RiouHotaru]

byne wrote...

RiouHotaru wrote...

Wait...people still think IT is viable?

Wait, literalists still somehow think the EC made IT less viable?

But it does.  The EC clearly notes the endings and what happens in them.  There isn't room for IT.

[Xavendithas]

SubAstris wrote...

Xavendithas wrote...

SubAstris wrote...

Xavendithas wrote...

SubAstris wrote...

On a separate point, doesn't this imply that the Crucible wasn't a Reaper device and the Catalyst was right?

The Catalyst itself states that they believed they did not know for certain what cycle had created the Crucible, and that the reapers believed they had destroyed all evidence of the Crucible....

But according to IT he is lying through his teeth, or is he just conveniently not lying at this moment?

I can't tell you how to interpret that piece of dialogue. You have to do that for yourself. I personally did not take it as a lie, or even a half truth. The Catalyst seemed to be providing an answer to what it was asked.

Why doesn't the Catalyst in that respect seem to not be providing other credible answers?

In the 3400 pages of this thread, I don't recall ever saying that the Catalyst is lying. The IT theory is as diverse as the group of people that subscribe to it. My take on things is vastly different than say, Paxxtons(just using him as an example, because he is pro-Control).

While I don't think the Catalyst is lying outright, it is very clearly attempting to steer you towards an option that doesn't threaten it's existance.

Your take on it might be different and that's fine. I'm not going to get into a pissing match over this.

[byne]

BatmanTurian wrote...

Earthborn_Shepard wrote...

BatmanTurian wrote...

v0rt3x22 wrote...

Earthborn_Shepard wrote...

Ok then We're still a big family.

And I don't mind being called a he, that's only logical to assume.. just thought I'd clarify.

You're a girl who like Mass Effect? <3 Will you be my LI?

She probably has a guy. Also internet relationships rarely work out. Also asking someone out on a message board is creepy. Also you are probably joking and this post is a waste of time.

...your work is done, Captain Obvious. Here, have this rock!

*ponysnip, because seriously*

I'm going to phrase this in a way that I hope will make it easy for a brony to understand:

You are now 20% less cool for posting a pony picture.

[v0rt3x22]

RiouHotaru wrote...

Wait...people still think IT is viable?

yes get out....oh and proof is in my sig.