55528 réponses à ce sujet

[ZerebusPrime]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

The problem with the Crucible/Reaper trap theory (which I like and support) is that there is then no way to win against the Reapers...

I would argue that that is not the case (that there is no way to win).  What is required is a means to alter the Crucible to turn the trap back upon the Reapers, much as the Protheans altered the Citadel.  Of course, that requires in depth knowledge of how the Crucible works, a working knowledge of Reaper tech, and a trump card to base the alterations around, such as the Reaper override signal discovered by Mr. Lawson.  Let's see, who would have all those things.... Oh right, the shades of grey antagonist who oddly lost all his marbles in the current ending.

This is one reason I promote the idea of Cerberus taking over Omega to convert the station into their own version of the Crucible, viability linked directly to whether or not one saves the Collector base in ME2.

[Rifneno]

Uncle Jo wrote...

Yes, I remember it. It raised quite a discussion too, as much as I can recall, it's nearly impossible to hack the safety-measures. But they maybe haven't tried that hard, because there was no emergency/need at this time. Other problem was (I think) that an object travelling faster than light would not cause enough damage (not sure at all, physic was never my strong point)... Anyways, I dream of a cutscene in which suicide-ships led by Jacob fly for their last mission and where Vega, Allers, Cortez and other useful characters could prove that they actually can do something for the galaxy.

No, it is incredibly difficult to hack that safety measure. But that's why I keep pointing to Taetrus. Because it's already been done. We can do it. And what makes me think it's got a real shot of being how this ends is because the codex doesn't acknowledge Taetrus. Why wouldn't the characters acknowledge it unless they just don't want to ruin the surprise? It'd be like people disputing the feasibility of slamming a plane into a skyscraper in 2002.

DJBare wrote...

The only way it would work is for the mass effect core to be disabled just before impact, the mass core reduces the ships mass for FTL to be possible, the ship would need to return to normal mass before impact otherwise its just going to bounce off.

Tell that to the smoking crater that Taetrus used to call its capital, Vallum. The only other argument is that a shop going at FTL would simply pierce right through the Reaper rather than cause a multi-gigaton explosion. Which may be true, but have you ever seen someone get shot with a widow? It doesn't tickle. The only difference is that the FTL ship would have to aim at a part of the Reaper we know something vital, like the mass effect core, is located.

[Uncle Jo]

ZerebusPrime wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote... I wrote...

The problem with the Crucible/Reaper trap theory (which I like and support) is that there is then no way to win against the Reapers...

I would argue that that is not the case (that there is no way to win).  What is required is a means to alter the Crucible to turn the trap back upon the Reapers, much as the Protheans altered the Citadel.  Of course, that requires in depth knowledge of how the Crucible works, a working knowledge of Reaper tech, and a trump card to base the alterations around, such as the Reaper override signal discovered by Mr. Lawson.  Let's see, who would have all those things.... Oh right, the shades of grey antagonist who oddly lost all his marbles in the current ending.

This is one reason I promote the idea of Cerberus taking over Omega to convert the station into their own version of the Crucible, viability linked directly to whether or not one saves the Collector base in ME2.

You quoted the wrong person...

From my point of view, the Crucible is a weapon which was indeed made by ancient races but discovered by the Reapers at some point before it was completely finished (I just can't buy that they never knew about it) and "altered" to their own advantage (for example, removing a vital component "the catalyst" which could be the Citadel or something else. Like taking out the battery of a car) The result is that the threatened civilizations, who are persuaded that there is no other way to win, put all what they got (resources, time, people) on building it and search for the last component... Evnetually they think they found it --->the Citadel in this cycle. You know the rest, all the fleets gather at one place making the reaper's job easy...

Some people think it's an amplificator for a "low" indoctrination signal (enough to submit but not to huskify, since it would spoil the harvest), other that it's made to lead Shepard right into his own indoctrination and so on...

Edit : Your theory is interesting. But what would be the missing component ? TIM is in this case not indoctrinated or I'm wrong ?

Modifié par Uncle Jo, 20 mai 2012 - 04:50 .

[Uncle Jo]

Rifneno wrote...

Uncle Jo wrote...
*snip*

No, it is incredibly difficult to hack that safety measure. But that's why I keep pointing to Taetrus. Because it's already been done. We can do it. And what makes me think it's got a real shot of being how this ends is because the codex doesn't acknowledge Taetrus. Why wouldn't the characters acknowledge it unless they just don't want to ruin the surprise? It'd be like people disputing the feasibility of slamming a plane into a skyscraper in 2002.

DJBare wrote...
*snip*

Tell that to the smoking crater that Taetrus used to call its capital, Vallum. The only other argument is that a shop going at FTL would simply pierce right through the Reaper rather than cause a multi-gigaton explosion. Which may be true, but have you ever seen someone get shot with a widow? It doesn't tickle. The only difference is that the FTL ship would have to aim at a part of the Reaper we know something vital, like the mass effect core, is located.

LMAO
The codex still says "the Citadel was built by the Protheans" so... The better counter-argument is also the scientifical one. But still.. simultaneously aiming at the mass effect core of the Reaper, at FTL and evading laser beams? Sounds like a suicide-mission... "Jacob! You're on it !"

Modifié par Uncle Jo, 20 mai 2012 - 04:37 .

[TSA_383]

Okay, prepare yourselves for a bunch of really kick-ass information.

First, I found something which I'm not sure has been discussed - not sure if it came from last year's leak because it appears to reference stuff from the final version of the game.
It's a set of notes used at some point in production for doing the cinematics:
http://pastebin.com/pnxTtak4

Destructorlio wrote...

Another quick repeat- one of the early 'clues' about Indoctrination Theory was that, according to several independent sources, the musical cues if you chose/walked toward the 'Control' or 'Synthesis' options contained a Reaper growl and were more downbeat, but if you chose/walked towards the 'Destroy' option there was no growl and the music was a bit more hopeful. However in the 98m documentary the author confirmed that this was NOT the case, that the music was actually identical, regardless of what choice you made/direction you walked in- it was all just the same music, on a loop.

Since the documentary had a few other flaws, can we get independent confirmation of this observation, be it true or false? Can someone look into the architecture of the game to see if different music files are triggered between the three choices, and if there is any difference between them?

Thanks!

It doesn't trigger different music.
BUT the music during the choice sequence is the same music as swells in when you see the child in the dreams, and also swells in at the point you're hit by harbinger's beam. Not similar, the same.

gunslinger_ruiz wrote...

The big message I got from it was
"ME3 is what we're going to show you" since they said they were
revealing a new game trailer in a week or some such.
The first two clues I saw as "Earth" or "takes place on Earth"
Third clue as "espionage" or "the UK" or maybe just "warriors"
Fourth
clue I didn't understand, now that I looked up The Clash, The Singles
album and "London Calling" I can see that as "takes place in London" or
"London is important" or "war in London"
Fifth code, red herring,
I have no idea, suppose i could mean "Dont' read too much into this" or
"this is a distraction" or "the real meaning of this (the trailer
reveal) is a distraction, wait and see"

Nah, in the words of
anderson, I was born in london, I don't think you're picking up the
meaning of "red herring" quite right - it's usually used in referring to
an intentionally misleading piece of information, some kind of trick,
which makes it a very, very interesting clue.

Also that clash song has incredibly interesting lyrics [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/lol.png[/smilie]

Jesus christ guys with every passing day I feel more and more like we're taking part in the year zero game [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/tongue.png[/smilie]

Dryball wrote...

I sure hope the current endings are some kind of sick joke by Bioware...I could forgive THAT.

I hope all of you guys are right about the IT.

I expect so

Uncle Jo wrote...

TSA_383 wrote...

*Image removed*

You should post it in some of the Pro-Ending threads (or did you actually do it?)
I'd be glad to read your theory about the Citadel but unfortunately the link you gave doesn't work...

Believe me when I say, you're probably better off not having attempted to follow the link on that post.
Check the responses from people on here after if you want to know why

Just in case you are completely devoid of sensible instinct, though:
http://tinyurl.com/superhottali

And no, I've not posted any of my actual evidence in the pro-ending threads, because I don't like having clusters of people claiming I'm a moron for reading into a story that's supposed to encourage interpretation.

prettz wrote...

was looking at the endings and noticed something odd, (has this been talk about?)

first in the destroy good ending the soldiers are cheering raising there guns up to the sky
in the destroy bad ending the soldiers look on the city,now in complete ruins with no cheering
In Control good ending the soldiers are cheering raising there guns up to the sky
In Control bad ending the soldiers look on the city,now in complete ruins with no cheering

Now
hears the thing, in synthesis it's touted as a good ending but the
soldiers don't cheer but this time the city is not in ruins. they just
stair off the same way they looked at a devastated city. do you think
this has any symbolism?

I think I know why they're not cheering...

"No Soul, replaced by tech"
-A Model Scientist (Salarian)

Daryslash wrote...

Alright, this is a dialogue I got 5 minutes ago while playing Mass Effect 1 again.
I don't know if people already mentioned this, but it doesn't hurt to share.
I've
got to say, this was a big surprise for me. Some days ago, in the
previous thread, I was questioning the relevance of James asking about
the hum on the Normandy. Some people might remember I was against the
possibility of it having something to do with the IT (reluctantly so,
actually).
Well, I kind of completely changed my opinion right about a few minutes ago, because of Kaidan.
I
talked to him while passing by the Conduit on the citadel (the other
end of it, from which you "teleport" back to the citadel from Ilos).
That's what he said: "Anyone else hear that low hum? Sounds like it's
coming from that statue. Makes my teeth tingle."
Picture following.
Unfortunately I wasn't able to get the statue on it. Kaidan got me by
surprise, I took the screenshot in a hurry. The statue is right in front
of Shepard.
That's some strong evidence towards the IT right there, I think.

desmond.imageshack.us/Himg33/scaled.php

(I never posted any images on this forum, I'm not sure how to do it)

I figured that was what James was referencing (even if Biceps McMeathead didn't realise it at the time).
I'm absolutely sure it's meant as a clue, otherwise why go to the bother of recording that and having it in there?


Also, on an entirely unrelated note, I've been playing with geth/reaper noises for use as effects in dubstep tracks - started doing an intro earlier, reaper noises in particular work really well once you put them through the wringer with effects (wip link of you're interested, none of the synth lines have gone on yet but I suspect I'm the first person ever to turn a reaper noise into a dubstep drop: http://www.sendspace...om/file/lv1jfz )

Modifié par TSA_383, 20 mai 2012 - 04:45 .

[Uncle Jo]

@TSA_383
I've seen your link. You were right. I need a drink.

[BleedingUranium]

I've got something that's always bugged me. Not IT evidence, but certainly something like those Engineering pipes that don't end up being useful.

http://www.youtube.c...gLTdxHdo#t=795s

Was anyone else very strongly reminded of this?


Which was forgotten aaaaaaaall the way until:
http://www.youtube.c...iAf3JgknI#t=18s

We're missing that second part.

Modifié par BleedingUranium, 20 mai 2012 - 05:13 .

[TSA_383]

Uncle Jo wrote...

@TSA_383
I've seen your link. You were right. I need a drink.

BleedingUranium wrote...

I've got something that's always
bugged me. Not IT evidence, but certainly something like those
Engineering pipes that don't end up being useful.

http://www.youtube.c...gLTdxHdo#t=795s

Was anyone else very strongly reminded of this?


Which was forgotten aaaaaaaall the way until:
http://www.youtube.c...iAf3JgknI#t=18s

We're missing that second part.

What an epic IDT quote in the first one [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/andy.png[/smilie] I'd totally forgotten that conversation but it's another one that clearly hints at something that doesn't fully make sense until we get to where we are now.


I think I'm starting to crack under the weight of how badly some people don't seem to get it though...
http://social.biowar...6547/2#12147480

Modifié par TSA_383, 20 mai 2012 - 05:07 .

[Rifneno]

Uncle Jo wrote...

LMAO
The codex still says "the Citadel was built by the Protheans" so... The better counter-argument is also the scientifical one. But still.. simultaneously aiming at the mass effect core of the Reaper, at FTL and evading laser beams? Sounds like a suicide-mission... "Jacob! You're on it !"

And yet when I proposed the theory that Harbinger might be a Prothean Reaper, everyone thought quoting the codex saying people believe it's the oldest was an instant disprove. Hehe.

Honestly, I doubt there's a need to avoid lasers. Even Reapers can't track stuff at FTL (see The Fall of Thessia codex). And even if they could, lasers are a form of light. I'm not a physics professor but I doubt they move faster than normal light and FTL is... well, FTL. But more importantly, think about this question for a moment: if starships kamakazi'ing at FTL wasn't deadly to the Reapers, why would they have gone to such lengths to ensure it couldn't be done with the FTL tech they left behind?

[gunslinger_ruiz]

TSA_383 wrote...
*snip*

I think I'm starting to crack under the weight of how badly some people don't seem to get it though...
http://social.biowar...6547/2#12147480

They can be a great people TSA, they wish to be. They only lack the light to show the way.

[TSA_383]

gunslinger_ruiz wrote...

TSA_383 wrote...
*snip*

I think I'm starting to crack under the weight of how badly some people don't seem to get it though...
http://social.biowar...6547/2#12147480

They can be a great people TSA, they wish to be. They only lack the light to show the way.

You're not helping that lovely "the IDT people are like religious fundamentalists" line y'know...

[gunslinger_ruiz]

TSA_383 wrote...

gunslinger_ruiz wrote...

TSA_383 wrote...
*snip*

I think I'm starting to crack under the weight of how badly some people don't seem to get it though...
http://social.biowar...6547/2#12147480

They can be a great people TSA, they wish to be. They only lack the light to show the way.

You're not helping that lovely "the IDT people are like religious fundamentalists" line y'know...

I prefer the "bunch of paranoid nuts" line personally, it has character .

EDIT: that was a Superman movie quote in case you didn't catch it.

Modifié par gunslinger_ruiz, 20 mai 2012 - 05:27 .

[blooregard]

TSA_383 wrote...

Okay, prepare yourselves for a bunch of really kick-ass information.

First, I found something which I'm not sure has been discussed - not sure if it came from last year's leak because it appears to reference stuff from the final version of the game.
It's a set of notes used at some point in production for doing the cinematics:
http://pastebin.com/pnxTtak4

Destructorlio wrote...

Another quick repeat- one of the early 'clues' about Indoctrination Theory was that, according to several independent sources, the musical cues if you chose/walked toward the 'Control' or 'Synthesis' options contained a Reaper growl and were more downbeat, but if you chose/walked towards the 'Destroy' option there was no growl and the music was a bit more hopeful. However in the 98m documentary the author confirmed that this was NOT the case, that the music was actually identical, regardless of what choice you made/direction you walked in- it was all just the same music, on a loop.

Since the documentary had a few other flaws, can we get independent confirmation of this observation, be it true or false? Can someone look into the architecture of the game to see if different music files are triggered between the three choices, and if there is any difference between them?

Thanks!

It doesn't trigger different music.
BUT the music during the choice sequence is the same music as swells in when you see the child in the dreams, and also swells in at the point you're hit by harbinger's beam. Not similar, the same.

gunslinger_ruiz wrote...

The big message I got from it was
"ME3 is what we're going to show you" since they said they were
revealing a new game trailer in a week or some such.
The first two clues I saw as "Earth" or "takes place on Earth"
Third clue as "espionage" or "the UK" or maybe just "warriors"
Fourth
clue I didn't understand, now that I looked up The Clash, The Singles
album and "London Calling" I can see that as "takes place in London" or
"London is important" or "war in London"
Fifth code, red herring,
I have no idea, suppose i could mean "Dont' read too much into this" or
"this is a distraction" or "the real meaning of this (the trailer
reveal) is a distraction, wait and see"

Nah, in the words of
anderson, I was born in london, I don't think you're picking up the
meaning of "red herring" quite right - it's usually used in referring to
an intentionally misleading piece of information, some kind of trick,
which makes it a very, very interesting clue.

Also that clash song has incredibly interesting lyrics [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/lol.png[/smilie]

Jesus christ guys with every passing day I feel more and more like we're taking part in the year zero game [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/tongue.png[/smilie]

Dryball wrote...

I sure hope the current endings are some kind of sick joke by Bioware...I could forgive THAT.

I hope all of you guys are right about the IT.

I expect so

Uncle Jo wrote...

TSA_383 wrote...

*Image removed*

You should post it in some of the Pro-Ending threads (or did you actually do it?)
I'd be glad to read your theory about the Citadel but unfortunately the link you gave doesn't work...

Believe me when I say, you're probably better off not having attempted to follow the link on that post.
Check the responses from people on here after if you want to know why

Just in case you are completely devoid of sensible instinct, though:
http://tinyurl.com/superhottali

And no, I've not posted any of my actual evidence in the pro-ending threads, because I don't like having clusters of people claiming I'm a moron for reading into a story that's supposed to encourage interpretation.

prettz wrote...

was looking at the endings and noticed something odd, (has this been talk about?)

first in the destroy good ending the soldiers are cheering raising there guns up to the sky
in the destroy bad ending the soldiers look on the city,now in complete ruins with no cheering
In Control good ending the soldiers are cheering raising there guns up to the sky
In Control bad ending the soldiers look on the city,now in complete ruins with no cheering

Now
hears the thing, in synthesis it's touted as a good ending but the
soldiers don't cheer but this time the city is not in ruins. they just
stair off the same way they looked at a devastated city. do you think
this has any symbolism?

I think I know why they're not cheering...

"No Soul, replaced by tech"
-A Model Scientist (Salarian)

Daryslash wrote...

Alright, this is a dialogue I got 5 minutes ago while playing Mass Effect 1 again.
I don't know if people already mentioned this, but it doesn't hurt to share.
I've
got to say, this was a big surprise for me. Some days ago, in the
previous thread, I was questioning the relevance of James asking about
the hum on the Normandy. Some people might remember I was against the
possibility of it having something to do with the IT (reluctantly so,
actually).
Well, I kind of completely changed my opinion right about a few minutes ago, because of Kaidan.
I
talked to him while passing by the Conduit on the citadel (the other
end of it, from which you "teleport" back to the citadel from Ilos).
That's what he said: "Anyone else hear that low hum? Sounds like it's
coming from that statue. Makes my teeth tingle."
Picture following.
Unfortunately I wasn't able to get the statue on it. Kaidan got me by
surprise, I took the screenshot in a hurry. The statue is right in front
of Shepard.
That's some strong evidence towards the IT right there, I think.

desmond.imageshack.us/Himg33/scaled.php

(I never posted any images on this forum, I'm not sure how to do it)

I figured that was what James was referencing (even if Biceps McMeathead didn't realise it at the time).
I'm absolutely sure it's meant as a clue, otherwise why go to the bother of recording that and having it in there?


Also, on an entirely unrelated note, I've been playing with geth/reaper noises for use as effects in dubstep tracks - started doing an intro earlier, reaper noises in particular work really well once you put them through the wringer with effects (wip link of you're interested, none of the synth lines have gone on yet but I suspect I'm the first person ever to turn a reaper noise into a dubstep drop: http://www.sendspace...om/file/lv1jfz )

If you don't mind I thought I'd throw in that one of the Cerberus science team members on the derilict Reaper say something like this (paraphrased) "The angles of the wall press down on you...and I find myself clenching my teeth."


indoctrination...indoctrination everywhere.

Modifié par blooregard, 20 mai 2012 - 05:38 .

[Arian Dynas]

Rifneno wrote...

Uncle Jo wrote...

LMAO
The codex still says "the Citadel was built by the Protheans" so... The better counter-argument is also the scientifical one. But still.. simultaneously aiming at the mass effect core of the Reaper, at FTL and evading laser beams? Sounds like a suicide-mission... "Jacob! You're on it !"

And yet when I proposed the theory that Harbinger might be a Prothean Reaper, everyone thought quoting the codex saying people believe it's the oldest was an instant disprove. Hehe.

The reason I did was because while yes, my evidence to disprove your theory is not much, you don't have enough to prove the theory from my point of veiw, hence why I disagree, since neither side can prove or disprove it.

[Rifneno]

Arian Dynas wrote...

Rifneno wrote...

Uncle Jo wrote...

LMAO
The codex still says "the Citadel was built by the Protheans" so... The better counter-argument is also the scientifical one. But still.. simultaneously aiming at the mass effect core of the Reaper, at FTL and evading laser beams? Sounds like a suicide-mission... "Jacob! You're on it !"

And yet when I proposed the theory that Harbinger might be a Prothean Reaper, everyone thought quoting the codex saying people believe it's the oldest was an instant disprove. Hehe.

The reason I did was because while yes, my evidence to disprove your theory is not much, you don't have enough to prove the theory from my point of veiw, hence why I disagree, since neither side can prove or disprove it.

I didn't mean you specifically.  You're hardly the only one to bring that up.  And when I googled and saw others wondering about the same topic, they also got a ton of "no because the codex says".

[Arian Dynas]

Ah.

[gunslinger_ruiz]

Regardless of the codex there's still the "4 eyes Prothean vs 6 eye Harbinger" arguement Possible there's a 6-eyed Prothean species if Arian's on to something with Proheans having different castes But they'd have to be plentiful and have the same genetics to make a Reaper that massive/unique.

[TSA_383]

gunslinger_ruiz wrote...

Regardless of the codex there's still the "4 eyes Prothean vs 6 eye Harbinger" arguement Possible there's a 6-eyed Prothean species if Arian's on to something with Proheans having different castes But they'd have to be plentiful and have the same genetics to make a Reaper that massive/unique.

ME2 human reaper: 3 eyes
Human: 2 eyes

Maybe they like to have an extra 50% on the eye count for redundancy

[gunslinger_ruiz]

TSA_383 wrote...

gunslinger_ruiz wrote...

Regardless of the codex there's still the "4 eyes Prothean vs 6 eye Harbinger" arguement Possible there's a 6-eyed Prothean species if Arian's on to something with Proheans having different castes But they'd have to be plentiful and have the same genetics to make a Reaper that massive/unique.

ME2 human reaper: 3 eyes
Human: 2 eyes

Maybe they like to have an extra 50% on the eye count for redundancy

I always thought there'd be a 4th eye eventually grown into that human reaper, also wondered if ALL reapers have exactly 4 eyes under the metal as well as faces/parts reminiscent of their species. In the ending cinematic of ME2 we see a handful of unique looking Reapers that all get reduced to "Sovereign class" in 3, I assume to save on resources, but  I think all of them had 4 eyes.... Now I gotta find that screenshot to double-check.

[gunslinger_ruiz]

That's a fair amount of Reapers o_O
And I'm seeing at least 6 yellow lights on each of their faces..... Speculations!

Modifié par gunslinger_ruiz, 20 mai 2012 - 06:04 .

[Arian Dynas]

gunslinger_ruiz wrote...

Regardless of the codex there's still the "4 eyes Prothean vs 6 eye Harbinger" arguement Possible there's a 6-eyed Prothean species if Arian's on to something with Proheans having different castes But they'd have to be plentiful and have the same genetics to make a Reaper that massive/unique.

I'm still disappointed we didn't get to see the multiple different Reaper chassis that we saw at the end of ME2, I hope one day they release a graphical improvement pack or something that varies the chassis, swaps out the Tali picture for something more unique and makes Allers look less like she's having an allergic reaction/dresses less like a trollop.

[Arian Dynas]

gunslinger_ruiz wrote...


That's a fair amount of Reapers o_O
And I'm seeing at least 6 yellow lights on each of their faces..... Speculations!

Let's see.. one with two lights, one with a row of 6 together, Harbinger...

[gunslinger_ruiz]

Arian Dynas wrote...

gunslinger_ruiz wrote...


That's a fair amount of Reapers o_O
And I'm seeing at least 6 yellow lights on each of their faces..... Speculations!

Let's see.. one with two lights, one with a row of 6 together, Harbinger...

Two lights? do you mean in the wide lookings above harbinger on the right? I see 2 eyes on each side and one eye above each of those sets.

[Arian Dynas]

Now that you mention it... I see 8. the four below, two sets of two above, right under the plate.