55528 réponses à ce sujet

[liggy002]

http://social.biowar...42/polls/35904/

Go vote please. This is an important poll.

Modifié par liggy002, 28 juin 2012 - 05:55 .

[DJBare]

Btw, did anyone notice the name on the dialogue when talking with the AI?, it's possibly my memory failing again, but before the EC I'm sure it used "Catalyst:" but since EC it uses "Child:"; am I remembering incorrectly?

Modifié par DJBare, 28 juin 2012 - 05:56 .

[BatmanTurian]

jasonh10 wrote...

I've only posted on this forum a couple of times before, but I noticed something that I haven't seen really addressed. Of course there's about a million posts a minute in this forum right now, so sorry if it has. Anyway, this seems like a good thread to post this.

So in the control ending, Shepard starts off saying that the words 'eternal,' 'immortal' and 'infinite' were words that old Shepard said but didn't understand yada yada yada. I don't remember hearing anyone but Sovereign use those words. Maybe Harbinger did some. He talked a lot and I don't remember. But it was definitely reaper talk.

Then in the synthesis ending, EDI says "... to reach a level of existence I cannot even imagine." Stop me if I'm wrong, but did Sovereign not also say something like that? Something about there being a realm of existence far beyond what you can possibly imagine?

Is this just coincidence, a by-product of 'joining' with reapers,' or maybe something else?

I think you may be on to something.

[Bill Casey]

DJBare wrote...

Btw, did anyone notice the name on the
dialogue when talking with the AI?, it's possibly my memory failing
again, but before the EC I'm sure it used "Catalyst:" but since EC it
uses "Child:"; am I remembering incorrectly?

It was always "Child", same as Ventboy...

Modifié par Bill Casey, 28 juin 2012 - 05:59 .

[BansheeOwnage]

Starbuck8 wrote...

Btw, the EC definitely added some kind of content into the rest of the game. A game that was played with EC installed from before Rannoch through before the Cerberus HQ will not play without EC installed.

I noticed the engineering conversation during this playthrough, after installing EC. Is it the only thing? Hmm.

Wait I'm not sure I follow. What do you mean won't work?

[FellishBeast]

Did they fix "Admiral Anderson" or w.e people were talking about. His name for the dialogue text.

[Andromidius]

HellishFiend wrote...

Sure, its possible, but I hope you're wrong. Why? Because even when invoking "retroactive lore" by picking Synthesis or Control, that still contemptuously spits in the face of the established themes of the entire trilogy. I will still lose respect for BW as storytellers if they go that route, even if it allows for IT to be true in one of the choices. 

Retroactive lore works for IT at least, in that Starbinger would make whichever of the choices Shepard made seem 'best' to keep the illusion going strong.

Only when you refuse to play along does it get angry and snap at you.

If Reject is the only real choice (which would be weird, but bare with me) it would also explain why Starbinger seems okay with you destroying the Reapers but gets angry when you won't play with it.

As for Destroy, it could potentially be a method of breaking down Shepard's resolve by making him think he's won and also tap into his guilt by making him think he sacrificed friends to achieve that victory.  And then, boom, prime for reprogramming to serve the Reapers as a tool of destruction.

Would also mean there was no 'right' option with the original game, and they did mention the EC was always planned.

Course...doesn't explain the breath scene.  But it it was moved to the Reject choice it would be a bit bloody obvious, eh? 

[FellishBeast]

Speaking of breaths, Shepards little twitch on the Citadel when he comes to still weirds me out.

[Starbuck8]

BansheeOwnage wrote...

Starbuck8 wrote...

Btw, the EC definitely added some kind of content into the rest of the game. A game that was played with EC installed from before Rannoch through before the Cerberus HQ will not play without EC installed.

I noticed the engineering conversation during this playthrough, after installing EC. Is it the only thing? Hmm.

Wait I'm not sure I follow. What do you mean won't work?

The game refuses to load a save game created, and says it's missing the EC after uninstalling.

[BansheeOwnage]

FellishBeast wrote...

Did they fix "Admiral Anderson" or w.e people were talking about. His name for the dialogue text.

I don't know as I play without subtitles, but speaking of Anderson: I don't remember if this was in the original but he says "What's your surrounding look like?" and Shepard promptly ingores him and talks about something else.

Modifié par BansheeOwnage, 28 juin 2012 - 06:09 .

[BansheeOwnage]

Starbuck8 wrote...

BansheeOwnage wrote...

Starbuck8 wrote...

Btw, the EC definitely added some kind of content into the rest of the game. A game that was played with EC installed from before Rannoch through before the Cerberus HQ will not play without EC installed.

I noticed the engineering conversation during this playthrough, after installing EC. Is it the only thing? Hmm.

Wait I'm not sure I follow. What do you mean won't work?

The game refuses to load a save game created, and says it's missing the EC after uninstalling.

That is weird. Maybe you have to do the Leviathan DLC there?

[spotlessvoid]

DiebytheSword wrote...

D.Sharrah wrote...

spotlessvoid wrote...

My personal biggest new question is:

If you choose reject, the Reapers win conventionally, therefore the Reapers can win conventionally. Why even offer Shepard any options if winning conventionally is still fully possible? Shepard is completely vulnerable and Starchild doesn't need to explain anything to Shepard regardless...

Great point...wish I had an answer for you.

Simpler than it seems, the Crucible forces the Catalyst to discharge the energy of the crucible and end its rampage, it changes the Catalyst, alters its programming to end the cycle and offer a new solution to its problem.  A more interesting question is how someone figured out how to hack the reapers, which is essentially the first part of what the crucible does.

Still, the Crucible only forces this change and actuates it, the choice must come from those using it, apparently, as the Catalyst defaults to its old solution if ignored.

Shepards collection of EMS, his resultant show of resolve, shapes what the Catalyst/GUARDIAN is willing to show as new solutions.

Still doesn't make sense.
1. The catalyst can successfully discharge the crucible energy if Shepard rejects any options. So if the crucible doesn't force the catalyst into one of the 3 options without Shepard making the decision, and the catalyst doesn't choose one of the 3 options on it's own, then clearly the catalyst still prefers choosing none. So clearly the catalyst still has the desire to continue the cycles. And clearly, the Reapers are capable of winning conventionaly.

Or am I supposed to believe that a previous cycle got close enough to understand who the catalyst is, how to design a weapon to override it's software AND redesign it structurally to give 3 easy options? (Or did the catalyst already have those built, ready to be dusted off?) So the crucible can change the catalyst to offer 3 options, but it can't shut it down or make it stop?

And there's still the questions of why doesnt the catalyst/reapers stop Shepard before the crucible is activated?

[BatmanTurian]

Andromidius wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

Sure, its possible, but I hope you're wrong. Why? Because even when invoking "retroactive lore" by picking Synthesis or Control, that still contemptuously spits in the face of the established themes of the entire trilogy. I will still lose respect for BW as storytellers if they go that route, even if it allows for IT to be true in one of the choices. 

Retroactive lore works for IT at least, in that Starbinger would make whichever of the choices Shepard made seem 'best' to keep the illusion going strong.

Only when you refuse to play along does it get angry and snap at you.

If Reject is the only real choice (which would be weird, but bare with me) it would also explain why Starbinger seems okay with you destroying the Reapers but gets angry when you won't play with it.

As for Destroy, it could potentially be a method of breaking down Shepard's resolve by making him think he's won and also tap into his guilt by making him think he sacrificed friends to achieve that victory.  And then, boom, prime for reprogramming to serve the Reapers as a tool of destruction.

Would also mean there was no 'right' option with the original game, and they did mention the EC was always planned.

Course...doesn't explain the breath scene.  But it it was moved to the Reject choice it would be a bit bloody obvious, eh? 

Oh god. Now all of the endings are ruined for me again. damnitall.

[Jadebaby]

liggy002 wrote...


http://social.biowar...42/polls/35904/

Go vote please. This is an important poll.

Don't make it too biased. Spread it elsewhere too.

[BansheeOwnage]

spotlessvoid wrote...

DiebytheSword wrote...

D.Sharrah wrote...

spotlessvoid wrote...

My personal biggest new question is:

If you choose reject, the Reapers win conventionally, therefore the Reapers can win conventionally. Why even offer Shepard any options if winning conventionally is still fully possible? Shepard is completely vulnerable and Starchild doesn't need to explain anything to Shepard regardless...

Great point...wish I had an answer for you.

Simpler than it seems, the Crucible forces the Catalyst to discharge the energy of the crucible and end its rampage, it changes the Catalyst, alters its programming to end the cycle and offer a new solution to its problem.  A more interesting question is how someone figured out how to hack the reapers, which is essentially the first part of what the crucible does.

Still, the Crucible only forces this change and actuates it, the choice must come from those using it, apparently, as the Catalyst defaults to its old solution if ignored.

Shepards collection of EMS, his resultant show of resolve, shapes what the Catalyst/GUARDIAN is willing to show as new solutions.

Still doesn't make sense.
1. The catalyst can successfully discharge the crucible energy if Shepard rejects any options. So if the crucible doesn't force the catalyst into one of the 3 options without Shepard making the decision, and the catalyst doesn't choose one of the 3 options on it's own, then clearly the catalyst still prefers choosing none. So clearly the catalyst still has the desire to continue the cycles. And clearly, the Reapers are capable of winning conventionaly.

Or am I supposed to believe that a previous cycle got close enough to understand who the catalyst is, how to design a weapon to override it's software AND redesign it structurally to give 3 easy options? (Or did the catalyst already have those built, ready to be dusted off?) So the crucible can change the catalyst to offer 3 options, but it can't shut it down or make it stop?

And there's still the questions of why doesnt the catalyst/reapers stop Shepard before the crucible is activated?

Well starkid makes no sense because in short, he wants you to choose something but all the Reapers try to kill you.

??????????????????????????????????????????????????????????

[hippojoe]

i personally think the endings are dumb, but i want to say this

if IT was true, and in upcoming DLC/ME4 they show that it was a dream/mental battle or whatever, 99% of people who played ME3 would be like, WTF?!?!

Most people do not have even the remotest idea that the ending could have been "fake"

somewhat related funny sidenote

i meantioned halo 3 earlier, and being in this thread, i thought what if H3's ending was a dream

the last thing you do is basically the last thing you do in halo 1 (warthog run to escape explosion)

just like the conduit runs

plus tge whole wake me when you need me/wake up john stuff

haha!

Modifié par hippojoe, 28 juin 2012 - 06:48 .

[Andromidius]

BatmanTurian wrote...

Oh god. Now all of the endings are ruined for me again. damnitall.

Sorry!  Just brainstorming!

I have nothing to back those ideas up with, and like I said the breath scene is a big mark against it.  But otherwise it would suit the theme, I think.

[Jadebaby]

So while I still see IT being a stretch, they did add wierd things in there to keep ITers guessing. It would be so cool if those Leviathan of DIs files led to being able to have a greater success at refuse, then we see the Catalyst for his true form, Harbinger!

[BatmanTurian]

Andromidius wrote...

BatmanTurian wrote...

Oh god. Now all of the endings are ruined for me again. damnitall.

Sorry!  Just brainstorming!

I have nothing to back those ideas up with, and like I said the breath scene is a big mark against it.  But otherwise it would suit the theme, I think.

I know, but now that your thought worm is in my head, Destroy sounds just as bad as all of the others.

Now I know why people hate the ME writers... <_<

[OneWithTheAssassins]

Well... I finished my run of ME3. I was a paragon, I romanced Tali, I brought together all the races and I chose destroy. How do I feel about it? To qout Wrex for a moment "Better then I hoped, worse then I feared" is all I can say. That and I cried a little; I'm not afraid to admit that.

[hippojoe]

Candidate 88766 wrote...

v0rt3x22 wrote...

No it doesn't sound like awful storytelling to me - and honestly I don't know what's going to happen.

You can't be serious.

We're talking about leaving the end of the Mass Effect trilogy resolved until a game not in the trilogy, and you seriously don't think this is bad?

Have I misunderstood you or something?

I mean, not finishing the story of the Mass Effect trilogy until game 4 sounds pretty awful whichever way you look at it.



Its like those guys that kept saying the rapture was coming. "No no, I promise, this time, this time, it'll be for real guys". 

Halo
(sorry, im reading a hundred pages back and replying when i see something, and it happens to all be halo related)

[boeloe]

OneWithTheAssassins wrote...
To qout Wrex for a moment "Better then I hoped, worse then I feared".

Uh I think you got that wrong. Think about it.

[FellishBeast]

Jade8aby88 wrote...

liggy002 wrote...


http://social.biowar...42/polls/35904/

Go vote please. This is an important poll.

Don't make it too biased. Spread it elsewhere too.

[hippojoe]

SwobyJ wrote...

hippojoe wrote...

i personally think the endings are dumb, but i want to say this

if IT was true, and in upcoming DLC/ME4 they show that it was a dream/mental battle or whatever, 99% of people who played ME3 would be like, WTF?!?!

Most people do not have even the remotest idea that the ending could have been "fake"

somewhat related funny sidenote

i meantioned halo 3 earlier, and being in this thread, i thought what if H3's ending was a dream

the last thing you do is basically the last thing you do in halo 1 (warthog run to escape explosion)

just like the conduit runs

haha!

Not if explained very, very well.

And if they still have branches based on your decision.
-Full indoctrination
-Mostly indoctrination
-Partial indoctrination
-Dunno what they would do, if anything, with this Refuse option they just added. Might have been 'canon' for Bioware to have Shepard succumb even while ending the Reapers(?).

if you had never been to the forums or heard of the IT, and they put out ANOTHER endings dlc, you would be very confused as to what is going on in bioware's head.

And honestly, i do not see another free sp dlc for this game, i think we are lucky that we got this one :/

i would love for IT to be true, and have Shep live on to victory, but it doesn't seem that way

but with the destroy/live inding, they could have ME4 be the final moments of covilization fighting the reapers until our final defeat

oh god.....just like halo reach....from the beginning we knew the end....why do i keep seeing halo in everything