55528 réponses à ce sujet

[Riot86]

EpyonX3 wrote...

*quote pyramide snip*

If EC was planned, we would have seen it much sooner because the scripts, designs of the levels for prerendered scenes and some dialog would have been complete or at least conceptualized. Or, they would have delayed the game another month or two.

The "Low EMS Squadmate death scene" could be found the Final Hours App in a slightly different version than in the Extended Cut (Video).

So at least this cutscene seems to be something BioWare originally planned to be in the game but was left out for some reasons in the final game  (maybe due to the dead line). So it might be possible, that other sequences from the EC were also in an early development stage, but didn't find their way into the game.

Modifié par Riot86, 28 juin 2012 - 05:39 .

[BP20125810]

masster blaster wrote...

Ownaholic wrote...

I'll just leave these here.
When Anderson says "They're controlling you", he looks directly at the camera (which is currently Shepard's POV) upon saying the word "You".
You can see this in video form here.

I thought this would be spark some new ideas of why is this still in the EC?

Edit: yes this was from a month ago but it's still in the EC.

Well, I think he was in the act of turning around, and he was pretty hurt, so his movements were affected.  Plus, people don't ALWAYS look ohters in ht eyes when talking.

[RealStyli]

I still like IT even if it is less likely. It's not completely debunked, in my opinion. The only thing going against it is the elaboration of the endings apart from Destroy.

After all, most of the IT evidence was based on Shep's attempted indoctrination taking place between Harby shooting him and him picking a choice. I've already said before that even the new "refusal" ending could be interpreted as Shep choosing to die rather than be indoctrinated (control, synthesis) or break-free (destroy).

Without IT, there's still a lot of ambiguity and plot-holes in there - the dreams, Anderson got to the Citadel ahead of Shepard, Anderson's strange description of the Citadel, the re-used assets on the Citadel, the Child's seemingly skewed agenda, Anderson/Shepard's shared gunshot wound, etc...

I don't mean IT is the ONLY explanation of the ending, I've already said it's "less likely". BioWare did a good job of "fixing" their endings so that they work better with the literal interpretation but without killing off the IT. I don't know why, maybe they like the interpretation but acknowledge it wasn't their own idea.

To end, I'll say that I'm agnostic. I don't think IT was anything more than the work of a community of fans dedicated to making sense of a really badly delivered ending. I don't think BioWare were clever enough to come up with it on their own. It was the work of hundreds of fans sifting through hours of lore and gameplay to retcon an understanding. It's genius. And the reason that I'm agnostic is that I prefer it over the literal endings and I'd rather believe in the possibility that BioWare are going to run it than that they will completely ignore it.

So this is where I stand. I've gone from hating the original ending to loving the IT interpretation to settling on what was delivered in the EC. The EC wasn't perfect but it provided a satisfactory ending that addressed most of the issues fans had with the original endings.

Am I being clear? I hope I am.

[MegumiAzusa]

llbountyhunter wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

Andromidius wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...
Prove it.

Lair of the Shadow Broker took less time and has more content.

Next.

 I know right? The EC cutscene are probably 300mb at the most ... Im dumbfounded on where exactly those 1.7gigs are....

They are 1.3GB out of 2.3GB (extracted)

Are there perhaps scene not found in EC? Because that seems lIke alot.

I've downloaded entire movies with a good resolition at .5 gigs

Resolution isn't everything. Videos in ME3 are in 720p, depending on how much changes in the scenes file size can vary. Also bink isn't the best when it comes to file size, but it does support good quality, especially if you do upscaling.
Also just did a test so you have something to compare, I binked a random screencap of the ending and also encoded it with H.264 with standard settings for YT.
The binked file is 17.7MB, the other one 5.6MB

[D.Sharrah]

OdanUrr wrote...

D.Sharrah wrote...

Gwyphon wrote...

Andromidius wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...
Prove it.

Lair of the Shadow Broker took less time and has more content.

Next.

Lair of the Shadow Broker was planned before launch of ME2. EC was not.

Can you prove the bolded satetement?  I would think that MIke Gamble tweet right after release would it least point to the possibility that it is not true.  If someone has the link to this that would be great...I do not.

If EC had been planned, it would have been released sooner and it would've flowed better. The devs have stated many times that they did not anticipate the fans' reaction and developed the EC as a result of it. I believe Ray Muzyka in his statement said something similar.

By the by, Gamble's tweet probably referred to all of the SP DLC in development, which actually sounds pretty intriguing.

I wanted to link Arian's marketing theory thread...anyone have the link?

[Dwailing]

EpyonX3 wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

Dwailing wrote...


Who says that the EC wasn't planned?  I remember Arian thought that, but I'm not completely sure.  Personally, I'm starting to think that what we got in the EC might have been what they intended originally, it's just that they didn't have the time.  I'm not saying that they necessarily ran out of time, but rather, they decided it would be better to release the endings in the form we saw originally (Prompting speculation.), and then they decided to release the full original endings (So they can claim that they weren't actually changing the endings because this is what they had intended in the first place.) given the amount of time they had to develope them (To prompt even more speculations.).  Remember, they had originally asked for six more months of dev time (June 2012) back when the release date was Holiday 2011, but they only got three months (March 2012).  And when did the EC come out?  In June, three months after the release of ME3, but six months after they had asked for more time.

Edit: I know this may be a little inelegant, but hopefully you'll all understand what I'm getting at.

If EC was planned, we would have seen it much sooner because the scripts, designs of the levels for prerendered scenes and some dialog would have been complete or at least conceptualized. Or, they would have delayed the game another month or two.

But they couldn't delay the game any longer, EA wouldn't let them have any more time.  Also, like I said before, they only said that they were reprioritizing the post-launch single-player DLC.  That doesn't mean they actually stopped developing other DLC, it just means they changed their priorities around slightly.

Let's not forget that it was EA that made the delay, not bioware.

Uh, no, I believe it was Bioware that asked for six months of extra development time, and EA only gave them three.  Not the other way around.  I'm pretty sure that's how the developer/publisher relationship works. 

[masster blaster]

balance5050 wrote...

Ravereth wrote...

Hey... wait, what about this whole saving organics stuff?

She would know too, she was partially made with reaper tech/code.

Brought this back up to also help the Non-ITer's about what EDI said.

[dreamgazer]

BP20125810 wrote...

They didn't work on ONLY EC for three months. It's clear that they also worked on the leviathan DLC. So, I think the added work on the extra DLC was the main reason for the three months. Plus, the development process DOES take a lot longer than people think.

They'd be crazy to schedule time for all the voice actors and not record some of the work for DLC in development. I'd be willing to bet they were doing both at the same time while they were in the booths. It's pretty apparent that they had the script for Leviathan already banged out.

[BP20125810]

Andromidius wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

It was like a hour and a half of gameplay.

And?  EC is less then an hour of combined cutscenes.

There's more level design in LotSB.  That's just obvious.

Yes, but Cinematics > Level design in terms of space, because cinematics can;t consist of items that have already been in the game, such as different platforms, and objects that have just been reskinned for differnt levels.  Cinematics can't really recycle elements as easy as gameplay can.  

Furthermore, they also used this DLC to squeeze in data on Leviathon, which looks to be a pretty big DLC.

[EpyonX3]

HellishFiend wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

You're not proving anything by implying that I need to be more educated on the process of game development to participate in this discussion. 

Well that is what is required to make something like EC. If you don't understand why EC took so long, then perhaps you need to review the process. Making something like EC isn't as simple as you think. Three months is actually a short time to release something like this. You can even notice that some Quality Control was skipped a bit when you look at the low ems destroy scene. They forgot to remove the crucible firing sound trigger at the time it should have without EC.

I'm not trying to insult you or your intelligence. But you asked me for proof of why it took so long and I'm providing it. It's up to you if you want to accept it or not.

I think you need to look up an article on proof. Regardless of how short or long the development process of the EC was, you can not cite "general knowledge of the game development process" as proof. You would still need something tangible. Now if that article somehow contained a magic formula that says something like "X amount of gameplay hours = X amount of development time" then maybe you could cite that. But that is certainly not the case here. The mere existence of Duke Nukem Forever and Diablo III disallows your citation of general game development knowledge as an element of proof. One could easily argue that neither justifies their amount of development time. Would you cite general game development knowledge as proof against that assertion? There are too many factors involved. You need to cite factors, not general knowledge. 

Don't forget that I asked you for proof initially, since you asserted that it could not have taken so long. You then asked me for proof that it was justifiable.

I provided something. Now it's your turn.

You must have missed my point. My point was that one can NOT provide proof for that sort of thing without having an inside source. Instead you continued with it as if providing proof either way was somehow possible. 

Then why didn't you just say that instead of asking me to prove it? Also, if you believed this originally, why did you begin to assert that it wouldn't have taken this long without being able to prove it yourself?

[OdanUrr]

D.Sharrah wrote...

I wanted to link Arian's marketing theory thread...anyone have the link?

Think I've read it already.

[Orph]

Synthesis.

The synthetic remains synthetic.

The organic becomes synthetic.

Uhm... That's suspicious... ¬¬

[masster blaster]

Ownaholic wrote...

balance5050 wrote...

If you haven't seen the Jesse Houston Comic-Con interview, you should. Check it out here:

http://www.youtube.c...g5xltLkk#t=291s 

The top comment on that video is all I needed to see:

"I can't tell you that the end of the story will be on the disc... But  within that context, given the terms there's a bit of a different.. the way that we're structuring the story is pretty different.. So it will make a good sense why the dlc plugs in to where it does."

Good find my friend.

From a month ago but it's still puzzaling to me.

[Dwailing]

BP20125810 wrote...

masster blaster wrote...

Ownaholic wrote...

I'll just leave these here.
When Anderson says "They're controlling you", he looks directly at the camera (which is currently Shepard's POV) upon saying the word "You".
You can see this in video form here.

I thought this would be spark some new ideas of why is this still in the EC?

Edit: yes this was from a month ago but it's still in the EC.

Well, I think he was in the act of turning around, and he was pretty hurt, so his movements were affected.  Plus, people don't ALWAYS look ohters in ht eyes when talking.

But this is a game, if BW had wanted Anderson to not look into the camera, they would have programed it so that he didn't look into the camera.  Instead, they programed it so he looked in the camera.  Nothing in a game is an accident (You know, aside from bugs and glitches, but I'm pretty sure this doesn't count, considering that it's still in there post-EC.).

[Lokanaiya]

I think this got lost in the arguing....

Lokanaiya wrote...

I just got a friend of mine who knows absolutely nothing about Mass Effect or even games in general to listen to Harbinger's line right before you get hit, and she says that it really sounded like "Serve us" to her.

Here's what I'm talking about for anyone who doesn't know.

[BP20125810]

Orph wrote...

Synthesis.

The synthetic remains synthetic.

The organic becomes synthetic.

Uhm... That's suspicious... ¬¬

It's more so the combinning of the two.  This is shown by the reapers and geth and EDI changing with the same green glow as everyone else.  My personal fave ending.

BTW, I think I've heard that RENEGADE CONTROL ending is pretty evil.

[HellishFiend]

EpyonX3 wrote...

Then why didn't you just say that instead of asking me to prove it? Also, if you believed this originally, why did you begin to assert that it wouldn't have taken this long without being able to prove it yourself?

You said prove it with a wink, I said no you with a . I thought the low level of seriousness of the requests was understood. My mistake. I'm not gonna bother going back to check, but I'd be surprised if I made the mistake of "asserting" that the DLC factually couldnt justify 3 months and 2 gigs. I believe I prefaced it with "I dont think that", making it an opinion. 

[Grubas]

Orph wrote...

Synthesis.

The synthetic remains synthetic.

The organic becomes synthetic.

Uhm... That's suspicious... ¬¬

source or it didnt happen.

[Dwailing]

Also, I just re-watched the Breath scene from the EC on YouTube, and the Mako is still there.

[Rossa14]

BP20125810 wrote...

masster blaster wrote...

Ownaholic wrote...

I'll just leave these here.
When Anderson says "They're controlling you", he looks directly at the camera (which is currently Shepard's POV) upon saying the word "You".
You can see this in video form here.

I thought this would be spark some new ideas of why is this still in the EC?

Edit: yes this was from a month ago but it's still in the EC.

Well, I think he was in the act of turning around, and he was pretty hurt, so his movements were affected.  Plus, people don't ALWAYS look ohters in ht eyes when talking.

Didn't someone look through the ME files and find that the listener during that line was Shepard and not TIM though? Thought i read that somewhere.

[EpyonX3]

Dwailing wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

Dwailing wrote...


Who says that the EC wasn't planned?  I remember Arian thought that, but I'm not completely sure.  Personally, I'm starting to think that what we got in the EC might have been what they intended originally, it's just that they didn't have the time.  I'm not saying that they necessarily ran out of time, but rather, they decided it would be better to release the endings in the form we saw originally (Prompting speculation.), and then they decided to release the full original endings (So they can claim that they weren't actually changing the endings because this is what they had intended in the first place.) given the amount of time they had to develope them (To prompt even more speculations.).  Remember, they had originally asked for six more months of dev time (June 2012) back when the release date was Holiday 2011, but they only got three months (March 2012).  And when did the EC come out?  In June, three months after the release of ME3, but six months after they had asked for more time.

Edit: I know this may be a little inelegant, but hopefully you'll all understand what I'm getting at.

If EC was planned, we would have seen it much sooner because the scripts, designs of the levels for prerendered scenes and some dialog would have been complete or at least conceptualized. Or, they would have delayed the game another month or two.

But they couldn't delay the game any longer, EA wouldn't let them have any more time.  Also, like I said before, they only said that they were reprioritizing the post-launch single-player DLC.  That doesn't mean they actually stopped developing other DLC, it just means they changed their priorities around slightly.

Let's not forget that it was EA that made the delay, not bioware.

Uh, no, I believe it was Bioware that asked for six months of extra development time, and EA only gave them three.  Not the other way around.  I'm pretty sure that's how the developer/publisher relationship works. 

http://www.cinemable...ayed-31780.html

""Essentially, step by step, [BioWare is] adjusting some of the gameplay
mechanics and some of the features that you'll see at E3 that can put
this into a genre equivalent of shooter-meets-RPG, and essentially
address a far larger market opportunity than Mass Effect 1 did and Mass
Effect 2 began to approach," said Riccitiello.
"

Not always. I'm sure the publisher has a say in what they want in the game or not. If EA want's more market share, they'll make bioware do it. Bioware will if they want their game published.

[masster blaster]

Lord Luc1fer wrote...

hey, this help anything at all?

https://twitter.com/...464201645428736

EDIT hope link works

This can help with the Sp File DLC we found in the EC.

[llbountyhunter]

Grubas wrote...

Orph wrote...

Synthesis.

The synthetic remains synthetic.

The organic becomes synthetic.

Uhm... That's suspicious... ¬¬

source or it didnt happen.

The reapers are already an combination, only organics and other synthetics were changed. 

[Dwailing]

EpyonX3 wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

Dwailing wrote...


Who says that the EC wasn't planned?  I remember Arian thought that, but I'm not completely sure.  Personally, I'm starting to think that what we got in the EC might have been what they intended originally, it's just that they didn't have the time.  I'm not saying that they necessarily ran out of time, but rather, they decided it would be better to release the endings in the form we saw originally (Prompting speculation.), and then they decided to release the full original endings (So they can claim that they weren't actually changing the endings because this is what they had intended in the first place.) given the amount of time they had to develope them (To prompt even more speculations.).  Remember, they had originally asked for six more months of dev time (June 2012) back when the release date was Holiday 2011, but they only got three months (March 2012).  And when did the EC come out?  In June, three months after the release of ME3, but six months after they had asked for more time.

Edit: I know this may be a little inelegant, but hopefully you'll all understand what I'm getting at.

If EC was planned, we would have seen it much sooner because the scripts, designs of the levels for prerendered scenes and some dialog would have been complete or at least conceptualized. Or, they would have delayed the game another month or two.

But they couldn't delay the game any longer, EA wouldn't let them have any more time.  Also, like I said before, they only said that they were reprioritizing the post-launch single-player DLC.  That doesn't mean they actually stopped developing other DLC, it just means they changed their priorities around slightly.

Let's not forget that it was EA that made the delay, not bioware.

Uh, no, I believe it was Bioware that asked for six months of extra development time, and EA only gave them three.  Not the other way around.  I'm pretty sure that's how the developer/publisher relationship works. 

http://www.cinemable...ayed-31780.html

""Essentially, step by step, [BioWare is] adjusting some of the gameplay
mechanics and some of the features that you'll see at E3 that can put
this into a genre equivalent of shooter-meets-RPG, and essentially
address a far larger market opportunity than Mass Effect 1 did and Mass
Effect 2 began to approach," said Riccitiello.
"

Not always. I'm sure the publisher has a say in what they want in the game or not. If EA want's more market share, they'll make bioware do it. Bioware will if they want their game published.

Uh, that sounds to me like Bioware needed more time to refine the game, actually.

[Orph]

BP20125810 wrote...

Orph wrote...

Synthesis.

The synthetic remains synthetic.

The organic becomes synthetic.

Uhm... That's suspicious... ¬¬

It's more so the combinning of the two.  This is shown by the reapers and geth and EDI changing with the same green glow as everyone else.  My personal fave ending.

BTW, I think I've heard that RENEGADE CONTROL ending is pretty evil.

No, it isn't. Starchild says the synthetic will understand the organic but remain 
synthetic. The organic will "evolve" and become 
synthetic...