55528 réponses à ce sujet

[llbountyhunter]

jgibson14352 wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

Its not just Shepard who's special in the story, its humans in general, they have genetic diversity that other species lack. And Actually when you think about it humans seem to be a bit more resistant to indoctrination than others. Take TIM and grayson for example, both able to maintain a large part of themselves free from the effects of indoc for prolonged periods of time.

And Shepard a human that stands out from the rest.

 i actually praised ME for not portraying humans as special, just another race in the galaxy. the genetic diversity was explained in the novels as a temporary thing that happens to all species before they identify themselves as not a nation or ethnicity but as a species. gene pools converge and dominant traits become staples of a species. as for indoctrination, humans have no more a capacity to resist than other species, or at least the asari. benezia was able to resist after countless days and months IN sovereign, and shiala was able to also. saren was freed at the very end of ME1 as well

Well humans are the best for the reapers... so that could be a bad thing..

and I meant resist the start of indoctrination, and yes grayson and Tim are able to fend it off longer. But once indoctrinated they were no better off then anyone else.

[EpyonX3]

Simon_Says wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

I presented that here before. No one believed me. They're not scared of one man or one galaxy worth of fleets. They're scared of the one unknown variable, the Crucible. Sure they knew about it but they didn't know about what it did. Even the Catalyst admits that the designs have evolved and organics are more resourceful than they thought.

If the Reapers were not afraiid, they wouldn't have taken the Citadel and gather around it to protect it like they did.

Uuunless the Crucible was a trap laid by the reapers all along, for some reason. But that's an entirely different can of speculating worms.

Oh it is. I went through that as well.

[llbountyhunter]

leonia42 wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

Its not just Shepard who's special in the story, its humans in general, they have genetic diversity that other species lack. And Actually when you think about it humans seem to be a bit more resistant to indoctrination than others. Take TIM and grayson for example, both able to maintain a large part of themselves free from the effects of indoc for prolonged periods of time.

And Shepard a human that stands out from the rest.

But once again, the Catalyst says specifically that Shepard is the Perfect Organic. Why?

And we can't know that humans are more resistant than any other species, not enough data to draw that conclusion.

Good memory on the red herring image but I doubt we can draw anything from that other than "something's still missing about this story".

Its all lies! Part of the the indoctrination attempt.... 

[Ravereth]

masster blaster wrote...

Ravereth wrote...

masster blaster wrote...

Can you provided me with a link to See if Female Shepard does the same thing as Shepard once Anderson Dies.

And if there is nothing that i can connect to I will stop.

Here you are

okay so they both do the same thing it"s just that I thought that they both do the same thing just I never played as Female Shepard before so ya. hate me if you want it"s just I haven"t go to yet because I wanted to finish the Male story first then start the Female one.

Don't worry, neither did I ...

[masster blaster]

Oh and Synthesis is bull because people in the whole galaxy would hate the Reapers still even though there is final evolution there still can be WAR, and how many children would grow up learning that there family"s are inside the Reapers and were killed just because of the Catalyst wanted to.Plus the Reapers are helping the Galaxy but are Rebuilding everything in there image not the people but Reapers.

Also I think Hackett would start the New Cerberus Organization because even though there is peace i would not trust the Reapers and many would join unless all became Indoctrinated in which case helps proves that Synthesis is not right because if you listen to the Catalyst carefully it states that " the minds of the Reapers/all the people that have become one with the Reapers would help the Organics and synthetics understand each other and also it explains why now body even tried to continue attacking the Reapers because the are all Indoctrinated.

Edit:
Also the Catalyst still lives in Control and Synthesis so it still has control over the Reapers even though in Control Shepard may have some Control over the Reapers but the Child is still around and if Shepard did something that the Catalyst did not like it can order a Reaper to kill Shepard and start reaping all over again.

Also what's to say synthesis is the FINAL evoultion. There could be a new specias that has no programing of Shepards choice of Synthesis infullns. So it can begin all over again.

Modifié par masster blaster, 01 juillet 2012 - 05:02 .

[Auralius Carolus]

EpyonX3 wrote...

Simon_Says wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

I presented that here before. No one believed me. They're not scared of one man or one galaxy worth of fleets. They're scared of the one unknown variable, the Crucible. Sure they knew about it but they didn't know about what it did. Even the Catalyst admits that the designs have evolved and organics are more resourceful than they thought.

If the Reapers were not afraiid, they wouldn't have taken the Citadel and gather around it to protect it like they did.

Uuunless the Crucible was a trap laid by the reapers all along, for some reason. But that's an entirely different can of speculating worms.

Oh it is. I went through that as well.

Well, when you think about it, if the thing works as intended it will generate massive amounts of Dark Energy, (if memory serves), resulting in either: A.) The overloading of Reapers and Reaper tech or B.) Recharging, if not supercharging the Reapers and their tech.

[Simon_Says]

Auralius Carolus wrote...

Well, when you think about it, if the thing works as intended it will generate massive amounts of Dark Energy, (if memory serves), resulting in either: A.) The overloading of Reapers and Reaper tech or B.) Recharging, if not supercharging the Reapers and their tech.

Or just duds and does nothing at all.

Also, you sure it's all about the dark energy in more than its power source? Because between apparently releasing a 'reaper client update', something best explained as a wholesale spread of (modified/unmodified) reaper nanites, and something that destroys technology for some reason... yeah.

Modifié par Simon_Says, 01 juillet 2012 - 05:03 .

[Big_Boss9]

llbountyhunter wrote...

Its not just Shepard who's special in the story, its humans in general, they have genetic diversity that other species lack. And Actually when you think about it humans seem to be a bit more resistant to indoctrination than others. Take TIM and grayson for example, both able to maintain a large part of themselves free from the effects of indoc for prolonged periods of time.

And Shepard a human that stands out from the rest.

Given the bottleneck in the human population in the last 70,000~ years, it's borderline ludicrous that humanity would be the most genetically diverse species in the galaxy. Humans are one of the least genetically diverse species on Earth, but they're somehow more diverse than the rest of the galaxy? That plot point has always bothered me.

[masster blaster]

EpyonX3 wrote...

masster blaster wrote...

CoolioThane wrote...

Shepard intrigues the Reapers.

He came back from the dead which is pretty amazing.

He has united the galaxy and is the only man who can potentially stop the Reaper threat.

He's the perfect target for indoctrination, as, under Reaper control, he can convince the people he has recruited to the cause to do whatever the Reapers want. Shepard is the expert, why wouldn't they believe him.

The whole game is the Reapers trying to indoctrinate him...it's the only explanation,

Also I thinks that" why the Reapers try to convince Shepard that they were not bad because they FINALY KNEW WHAT THE MEANING OF FEAR IS.

Also is it possible that Harbinger created the AI catalyst ot convinve Shepard that the Catalyst created the Reapers and to give Shepard a sob story about why the Reapers do this?

I presented that here before. No one believed me. They're not scared of one man or one galaxy worth of fleets. They're scared of the one unknown variable, the Crucible. Sure they knew about it but they didn't know about what it did. Even the Catalyst admits that the designs have evolved and organics are more resourceful than they thought.

If the Reapers were not afraiid, they wouldn't have taken the Citadel and gather around it to protect it like they did.

yep and that's why harby chose not to show it's self because Shepard ruined it's plains not once not twice but three times, so ya. i would be afried of the Man/woman that defies death it'self.

Modifié par masster blaster, 01 juillet 2012 - 05:04 .

[Simon_Says]

Big_Boss9 wrote...

Given the bottleneck in the human population in the last 70,000~ years, it's borderline ludicrous that humanity would be the most genetically diverse species in the galaxy. Humans are one of the least genetically diverse species on Earth, but they're somehow more diverse than the rest of the galaxy? That plot point has always bothered me.

Not to mention that a species that has been spaceborne for hundreds of years should be developing significant genetic diversity between different colonies, even with common and rapid transit between them.

Particularily the salarians. They've been in space for two thousand years at least, and they have a very rapid generation turnover rate. Not to mention that their society very rigidly controls breeding in the population. I'm actually surprised they haven't split into multiple species by the time of the ME games.

Then again, alien genetics are alien genetics. No guarantee that they'll behave even remotely like terrestrial genetics.

Modifié par Simon_Says, 01 juillet 2012 - 05:10 .

[masster blaster]

Big_Boss9 wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

Its not just Shepard who's special in the story, its humans in general, they have genetic diversity that other species lack. And Actually when you think about it humans seem to be a bit more resistant to indoctrination than others. Take TIM and grayson for example, both able to maintain a large part of themselves free from the effects of indoc for prolonged periods of time.

And Shepard a human that stands out from the rest.

Given the bottleneck in the human population in the last 70,000~ years, it's borderline ludicrous that humanity would be the most genetically diverse species in the galaxy. Humans are one of the least genetically diverse species on Earth, but they're somehow more diverse than the rest of the galaxy? That plot point has always bothered me.

That's why people say that Shepard can not be indoctrinated because Shepard is diffrent from every being in the galaxy but they fail to see it"s not something that we can see or compriend but only we can try to fight but in the end they will control Shepard but we can fight it enof to kill the Reapers for good.

[llbountyhunter]

Simon_Says wrote...

Big_Boss9 wrote...

Given the bottleneck in the human population in the last 70,000~ years, it's borderline ludicrous that humanity would be the most genetically diverse species in the galaxy. Humans are one of the least genetically diverse species on Earth, but they're somehow more diverse than the rest of the galaxy? That plot point has always bothered me.

Not to mention that a species that has been spaceborne for thousands of years should be developing significant genetic diversity between different colonies, even with common and rapid transit between them.

Some earth species can interact yet remain unchanged.  Its assumed humans are diverse because there DNA is malleable (stated by harbinger several times) whereas other species have relatively fixed DNA.

[HellishFiend]

Big_Boss9 wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

Its not just Shepard who's special in the story, its humans in general, they have genetic diversity that other species lack. And Actually when you think about it humans seem to be a bit more resistant to indoctrination than others. Take TIM and grayson for example, both able to maintain a large part of themselves free from the effects of indoc for prolonged periods of time.

And Shepard a human that stands out from the rest.

Given the bottleneck in the human population in the last 70,000~ years, it's borderline ludicrous that humanity would be the most genetically diverse species in the galaxy. Humans are one of the least genetically diverse species on Earth, but they're somehow more diverse than the rest of the galaxy? That plot point has always bothered me.

Well, to be fair, we are the most genetically diverse sentient species on the planet. If the writers want to make the other races in the story less genetically diverse than we are, I dont see the problem with that. Especially if it's important to the plot. 

[jgibson14352]

Simon_Says wrote...

Big_Boss9 wrote...

Given the bottleneck in the human population in the last 70,000~ years, it's borderline ludicrous that humanity would be the most genetically diverse species in the galaxy. Humans are one of the least genetically diverse species on Earth, but they're somehow more diverse than the rest of the galaxy? That plot point has always bothered me.

Not to mention that a species that has been spaceborne for hundreds of years should be developing significant genetic diversity between different colonies, even with common and rapid transit between them.

Particularily the salarians. They've been in space for two thousand years at least, and they have a very rapid generation turnover rate. Not to mention that their society very rigidly controls breeding in the population. I'm actually surprised they haven't split into multiple species by the time of the ME games.

in utero gene therapy. there are laws in the systems alliance stating which genetic modifications are legal and illegal, and every alliance soldier upon enlisting is given genetic modification. there would likely be a set of laws and medical practices in place that would regulate any serious genetic mutation

[Auralius Carolus]

Simon_Says wrote...


Also, you sure it's all about the dark energy in more than its power source? Because between apparently releasing a 'reaper client update', something best explained as a wholesale spread of (modified/unmodified) reaper nanites, and something that destroys technology for some reason... yeah.

The exact effects of DE isn't widely spoken of in the ME universe; it can, apparently, be both harmful and benign.

Basically all we know is that: Power Source + Element Zero = Dark Energy; in the case of Star Ships and the Crucible, the base reactant is Helium 3. Could it possibly shut down tech? Uncertain, as vehicles regularly experience it in FTL flight.

And as a software update or nanite thrower, that is certainly and interesting idea, but I find it unlikely. Seeing as the Crucible is being built by organics, the composition would be known, likely eleminating the risk of nanites. As to an update, the question's would be: Why this way? And How?

Modifié par Auralius Carolus, 01 juillet 2012 - 05:14 .

[Dusen]

Big_Boss9 wrote...

Given the bottleneck in the human population in the last 70,000~ years, it's borderline ludicrous that humanity would be the most genetically diverse species in the galaxy. Humans are one of the least genetically diverse species on Earth, but they're somehow more diverse than the rest of the galaxy? That plot point has always bothered me.

Where do you figure any of this from? What bottleneck would that be? Look around, there are hundreds of different ethnicities that each possess traits unique from one another whether it be skin color, facial structure, body size and build, mucle density, etc. Not to mention that our males are inherently different from females. Just look at asari in-game for an example of a general lack of genetic diversity, they don't even have male/female genetics.

[llbountyhunter]

Dont you also need the proto reaper heart and/or brain for the crucible?

If that doesn't scream reaper trap.....

[masster blaster]

Why build a Human Reaper in ME2 because Harby wanted to give it to Shepard as a sorry I tried to kill you and Happy birthday.

harby: Shepard I am sorry I tried to kill you so I ordered the Collectors to build you a human Reaper so that one day you can side with me and together we can rule the galaxy as Reapers in arms.

Shepard: What the F***.

harby: It's your birthday present from me.

Shepard: happy face.

[masster blaster]

masster blaster wrote...

Oh and Synthesis is bull because people in the whole galaxy would hate the Reapers still even though there is final evolution there still can be WAR, and how many children would grow up learning that there family"s are inside the Reapers and were killed just because of the Catalyst wanted to.Plus the Reapers are helping the Galaxy but are Rebuilding everything in there image not the people but Reapers.

Also I think Hackett would start the New Cerberus Organization because even though there is peace i would not trust the Reapers and many would join unless all became Indoctrinated in which case helps proves that Synthesis is not right because if you listen to the Catalyst carefully it states that " the minds of the Reapers/all the people that have become one with the Reapers would help the Organics and synthetics understand each other and also it explains why now body even tried to continue attacking the Reapers because the are all Indoctrinated.

Edit:
Also the Catalyst still lives in Control and Synthesis so it still has control over the Reapers even though in Control Shepard may have some Control over the Reapers but the Child is still around and if Shepard did something that the Catalyst did not like it can order a Reaper to kill Shepard and start reaping all over again.

Also what's to say synthesis is the FINAL evoultion. There could be a new specias that has no programing of Shepards choice of Synthesis infullns. So it can begin all over again.

Helllishfiend what do you think about this?

[Simon_Says]

jgibson14352 wrote...

in utero gene therapy. there are laws in the systems alliance stating which genetic modifications are legal and illegal, and every alliance soldier upon enlisting is given genetic modification. there would likely be a set of laws and medical practices in place that would regulate any serious genetic mutation

Aritifical modification is one thing. Natural evolution is another deal entirely.

There's very little reason to believe that populations on two different planets won't develop signfiicant genetic deviations compared to each other. Different planets could even have different radiation levels, chemical environments, environmental conditions, and other factors that would no doubt accelerate deviation over several generations, unless there is either significant sharing between the populations such that they interbreed constantly or there is planned oversight that ensures genetic stagnation.

[Auralius Carolus]

masster blaster wrote...

Why build a Human Reaper in ME2 because Harby wanted to give it to Shepard as a sorry I tried to kill you and Happy birthday.

harby: Shepard I am sorry I tried to kill you so I ordered the Collectors to build you a human Reaper so that one day you can side with me and together we can rule the galaxy as Reapers in arms.

Shepard: What the F***.

harby: It's your birthday present from me.

Shepard: happy face.

Harbinger: Shepard... I am your father!
Shepard: But, how??? You lie!
Harbinger: No. Do you see the leg right here? It's really a humungous-
Shepard: No!!!!

[jgibson14352]

masster blaster wrote...

Oh and Synthesis is bull because people in the whole galaxy would hate the Reapers still even though there is final evolution there still can be WAR, and how many children would grow up learning that there family"s are inside the Reapers and were killed just because of the Catalyst wanted to.Plus the Reapers are helping the Galaxy but are Rebuilding everything in there image not the people but Reapers.

Also I think Hackett would start the New Cerberus Organization because even though there is peace i would not trust the Reapers and many would join unless all became Indoctrinated in which case helps proves that Synthesis is not right because if you listen to the Catalyst carefully it states that " the minds of the Reapers/all the people that have become one with the Reapers would help the Organics and synthetics understand each other and also it explains why now body even tried to continue attacking the Reapers because the are all Indoctrinated.

Edit:
Also the Catalyst still lives in Control and Synthesis so it still has control over the Reapers even though in Control Shepard may have some Control over the Reapers but the Child is still around and if Shepard did something that the Catalyst did not like it can order a Reaper to kill Shepard and start reaping all over again.

Also what's to say synthesis is the FINAL evoultion. There could be a new specias that has no programing of Shepards choice of Synthesis infullns. So it can begin all over again.

remember mordins speech in me2 about how technological advancements beyond limitations are what kill culture? something along the lines of cant catch a fish, invent spear cant carry a load invent wheel, LIMITATIONS no limitations CULTURE STAGNATES. synthesis and its final evolution make it seem like the reapers and their billions of years of technological advancement are going to get rid of a few limitations...

Modifié par jgibson14352, 01 juillet 2012 - 05:24 .

[byne]

masster blaster wrote...

Why build a Human Reaper in ME2 because Harby wanted to give it to Shepard as a sorry I tried to kill you and Happy birthday.

harby: Shepard I am sorry I tried to kill you so I ordered the Collectors to build you a human Reaper so that one day you can side with me and together we can rule the galaxy as Reapers in arms.

Shepard: What the F***.

harby: It's your birthday present from me.

Shepard: happy face.

Talking about the human Reaper reminds me of this comic

[HellishFiend]

masster blaster wrote...

masster blaster wrote...

Oh and Synthesis is bull because people in the whole galaxy would hate the Reapers still even though there is final evolution there still can be WAR, and how many children would grow up learning that there family"s are inside the Reapers and were killed just because of the Catalyst wanted to.Plus the Reapers are helping the Galaxy but are Rebuilding everything in there image not the people but Reapers.

Also I think Hackett would start the New Cerberus Organization because even though there is peace i would not trust the Reapers and many would join unless all became Indoctrinated in which case helps proves that Synthesis is not right because if you listen to the Catalyst carefully it states that " the minds of the Reapers/all the people that have become one with the Reapers would help the Organics and synthetics understand each other and also it explains why now body even tried to continue attacking the Reapers because the are all Indoctrinated.

Edit:
Also the Catalyst still lives in Control and Synthesis so it still has control over the Reapers even though in Control Shepard may have some Control over the Reapers but the Child is still around and if Shepard did something that the Catalyst did not like it can order a Reaper to kill Shepard and start reaping all over again.

Also what's to say synthesis is the FINAL evoultion. There could be a new specias that has no programing of Shepards choice of Synthesis infullns. So it can begin all over again.

Helllishfiend what do you think about this?

I agree with you. I think we are supposed to assume that the "evolution" process suddenly makes both the organics and the Reapers buddy-buddy with each other, but I would hope most of the players know better than that. 

[Simon_Says]

Auralius Carolus wrote...

The exact effects of DE isn't widely spoken of in the ME universe; it can, apparently, be both harmful and benign.

Basically all we know is that: Power Source + Element Zero = Dark Energy; in the case of Star Ships and the Crucible, the base reactant is Helium 3. Could it possibly shut down tech? Uncertain, as vehicles regularly experience it in FTL flight.

And as a software update or nanite thrower, that is certainly and interesting idea, but I find it unlikely. Seeing as the Crucible is being built by organics, the composition would be known, likely eleminating the risk of nanites. As to an update, the question's would be: Why this way? And How?

And yet it's plugged into the Citadel. i.e. Reapertech Central. The Crucible itself is described as just a capacitor (again this is just what was said, not neccesarily what is true). Presumably one that would just allow the relay network to create FTL wavefronts that could carry whatever Space Magic was desired so that every part of the galaxy was affected.

Also, update theory. Why, how? Updated nanites, that's why and how.

Not saying I like this theory, just that it's something that may provide answers of some form.