55528 réponses à ce sujet

[Big_Boss9]

Dusen wrote...

Big_Boss9 wrote...

Given the bottleneck in the human population in the last 70,000~ years, it's borderline ludicrous that humanity would be the most genetically diverse species in the galaxy. Humans are one of the least genetically diverse species on Earth, but they're somehow more diverse than the rest of the galaxy? That plot point has always bothered me.

Where do you figure any of this from? What bottleneck would that be? Look around, there are hundreds of different ethnicities that each possess traits unique from one another whether it be skin color, facial structure, body size and build, mucle density, etc. Not to mention that our males are inherently different from females. Just look at asari in-game for an example of a general lack of genetic diversity, they don't even have male/female genetics.

It is surmised from the Toba eruption, which most geneticists believe reduced the numbers of humanity to ~10,000 (and perhaps left as few as 1,000 viable breeding pairs). Our physical appearance is irrelevant in terms of genetic makeup. You will find less genetic variation between an Asian and European than you would between two chimpanzee groups in Africa. At any rate, I understand that it can be plot magicked for sake of the story, but one of the things I enjoyed about the earlier parts of the series was that humanity wasn't special. And, through this, it was. It's a tired sci-fi trope, was disappointing is all.

Side note: Some believe the bottleneck occured 50,000 years ago. Dun dun dun!

[Rifneno]

Andromidius wrote...

I'm fine with him being highly resistant to it. But no-one could hold off forever. If thousand year old Asari can succum, how can a 30 something Human who might not even have Biotics to protect themself?

What does biotics have to do with willpower?

Big_Boss9 wrote...

Given the bottleneck in the human population in the last 70,000~ years, it's borderline ludicrous that humanity would be the most genetically diverse species in the galaxy. Humans are one of the least genetically diverse species on Earth, but they're somehow more diverse than the rest of the galaxy? That plot point has always bothered me.

And which real alien species are you using for this comparison?

Dusen wrote...

Where do you figure any of this from? What bottleneck would that be?

He's talking about the Toba Catastrophe. A supervolcano eruption about 70,000. The only supervolcano to have erupted in mankind's time on Earth. For those not familiar with the term, a supervolcano is to a volcano what an atomic bomb is to a grenade. Mt. St. Helen's was a tiny fizzle compared to Toba, which was such an immense blast that it actually caused a minor nuclear winter (technically volcanic winter) and ice age. Experts estimate humans may have been down to only about a thousand breeding pairs after the Toba Catastrophe was done killing.

BTW, there's a supervolcano under Yellowstone Park. It's overdue to erupt. It's bigger than Toba. Sleep tight.

[Simon_Says]

Dusen wrote...

Big_Boss9 wrote...

Given the bottleneck in the human population in the last 70,000~ years, it's borderline ludicrous that humanity would be the most genetically diverse species in the galaxy. Humans are one of the least genetically diverse species on Earth, but they're somehow more diverse than the rest of the galaxy? That plot point has always bothered me.

Where do you figure any of this from? What bottleneck would that be? Look around, there are hundreds of different ethnicities that each possess traits unique from one another whether it be skin color, facial structure, body size and build, mucle density, etc. Not to mention that our males are inherently different from females. Just look at asari in-game for an example of a general lack of genetic diversity, they don't even have male/female genetics.

Have to look past the phenotypes and get down to the genetic code. Analysis of human genetics actually show that at the base level, we're not actually all that diverse from one another compared to most other nondomesticated species on Earth. This is explained by Toba Catastrophe Theory, and other similar theories claim that there was a significant bottleneck in the human population not that long ago.

-edit- What those two said.

Modifié par Simon_Says, 01 juillet 2012 - 05:33 .

[byne]

Rifneno wrote...

He's talking about the Toba Catastrophe. A supervolcano eruption about 70,000. The only supervolcano to have erupted in mankind's time on Earth. For those not familiar with the term, a supervolcano is to a volcano what an atomic bomb is to a grenade. Mt. St. Helen's was a tiny fizzle compared to Toba, which was such an immense blast that it actually caused a minor nuclear winter (technically volcanic winter) and ice age. Experts estimate humans may have been down to only about a thousand breeding pairs after the Toba Catastrophe was done killing.

BTW, there's a supervolcano under Yellowstone Park. It's overdue to erupt. It's bigger than Toba. Sleep tight.

Arent there three supervolcanoes in the US?

[masster blaster]

Auralius Carolus wrote...

masster blaster wrote...

Why build a Human Reaper in ME2 because Harby wanted to give it to Shepard as a sorry I tried to kill you and Happy birthday.

harby: Shepard I am sorry I tried to kill you so I ordered the Collectors to build you a human Reaper so that one day you can side with me and together we can rule the galaxy as Reapers in arms.

Shepard: What the F***.

harby: It's your birthday present from me.

Shepard: happy face.

Harbinger: Shepard... I am your father!
Shepard: But, how??? You lie!
Harbinger: No. Do you see the leg right here? It's really a humungous-
Shepard: No!!!!

Shepard: So if you are my farther does that mean you can stop the Reapers from killing my friends and the Galaxy.

Harby: Well Shep I wish I could but I take orders from a god child so ya I can't.

Shepard: So your somebody elses B**** then that's takes the form of the kid.

harby: Ya. That's about sums it up.

Sheaprd: okay but wait where WERE you for the last 28 years of my life, and how did you meet mom.

Harby: Well I met your mom in Vegas.."

Shepard: VEGAS. HO-How did you fool anybody to... oh Indoctrination.

harby: Yep and we got drunk and next thing i knew your mom was pregnet.

Shepard: [mind blown]So I was an accident?

harby: Ya as was the rest of humanity, oh and I left back into space whne you were born so ya that"s about it.

Shepard: I don't know what to say but  F*** you for leaving mom and you and your Reaper friends can go back to hell.

Harby: INSOLENT BRAT YOU WILL REGRET THIS.

Shepard: Hardly.

Modifié par masster blaster, 01 juillet 2012 - 05:44 .

[comrade gando]

gah, all I can say is that even though it appears the writers wanted it to end this way... the story stinks. It stinks of poor writing, and it stinks of speculation. It just flat out stinks.

[masster blaster]

HellishFiend wrote...

masster blaster wrote...

masster blaster wrote...

Oh and Synthesis is bull because people in the whole galaxy would hate the Reapers still even though there is final evolution there still can be WAR, and how many children would grow up learning that there family"s are inside the Reapers and were killed just because of the Catalyst wanted to.Plus the Reapers are helping the Galaxy but are Rebuilding everything in there image not the people but Reapers.

Also I think Hackett would start the New Cerberus Organization because even though there is peace i would not trust the Reapers and many would join unless all became Indoctrinated in which case helps proves that Synthesis is not right because if you listen to the Catalyst carefully it states that " the minds of the Reapers/all the people that have become one with the Reapers would help the Organics and synthetics understand each other and also it explains why now body even tried to continue attacking the Reapers because the are all Indoctrinated.

Edit:
Also the Catalyst still lives in Control and Synthesis so it still has control over the Reapers even though in Control Shepard may have some Control over the Reapers but the Child is still around and if Shepard did something that the Catalyst did not like it can order a Reaper to kill Shepard and start reaping all over again.

Also what's to say synthesis is the FINAL evoultion. There could be a new specias that has no programing of Shepards choice of Synthesis infullns. So it can begin all over again.

Helllishfiend what do you think about this?

I agree with you. I think we are supposed to assume that the "evolution" process suddenly makes both the organics and the Reapers buddy-buddy with each other, but I would hope most of the players know better than that. 

ya. And what does everyone else think about this.

no comments Byne or anyone.

Modifié par masster blaster, 01 juillet 2012 - 05:49 .

[Auralius Carolus]

Simon_Says wrote...

Also, update theory. Why, how? Updated nanites, that's why and how.

Not saying I like this theory, just that it's something that may provide answers of some form.

Yeah, but, how does the Crucible get nanites? That they could ride the flow of energy makes sense, but how would they get in that thing without the human machinists knowing it? They would have to produce them, or provide the parts to.

[HellishFiend]

comrade gando wrote...

gah, all I can say is that even though it appears the writers wanted it to end this way... the story stinks. It stinks of poor writing, and it stinks of speculation. It just flat out stinks.

Well, I happen to love speculation and story analysis, so I'm rather enjoying it. And if IT does turn out to be true in the form I'm imagining, then it's actually brilliant, groundbreaking writing that pushes videogaming as a storytelling medium to unprecedented heights. 

[Simon_Says]

Auralius Carolus wrote...

Simon_Says wrote...

Also, update theory. Why, how? Updated nanites, that's why and how.

Not saying I like this theory, just that it's something that may provide answers of some form.

Yeah, but, how does the Crucible get nanites? That they could ride the flow of energy makes sense, but how would they get in that thing without the human machinists knowing it? They would have to produce them, or provide the parts to.

I just said: the Crucible was plugged into the Citadel. It's probably the Citadel that would churn out the reaper nanotech while the Crucible provided the juice.

[Auralius Carolus]

masster blaster wrote...


Harby: INSOLENT BRAT YOU WILL REGRET THIS.

*Harbinger stamps away*

*Harbinger turns around*

"Your mother was a cankerous husk!"

[Auralius Carolus]

Simon_Says wrote...

Auralius Carolus wrote...

Simon_Says wrote...

Also, update theory. Why, how? Updated nanites, that's why and how.

Not saying I like this theory, just that it's something that may provide answers of some form.

Yeah, but, how does the Crucible get nanites? That they could ride the flow of energy makes sense, but how would they get in that thing without the human machinists knowing it? They would have to produce them, or provide the parts to.

I just said: the Crucible was plugged into the Citadel. It's probably the Citadel that would churn out the reaper nanotech while the Crucible provided the juice.

Hmm. Okay. But that still leaves the question of how to get rid of the things.

[masster blaster]

Oh and any news on the new video that CleverNoob might make about the EC and how it support's IT, also any news from Estebren.

[Andromidius]

Rifneno wrote...

What does biotics have to do with willpower?

Nothing.  It was just something I added on in case someone brought up an argument involving biotics preventing mind control or some such nonsense.

[Lokanaiya]

Auralius Carolus wrote...

Simon_Says wrote...

Also, update theory. Why, how? Updated nanites, that's why and how.

Not saying I like this theory, just that it's something that may provide answers of some form.

Yeah, but, how does the Crucible get nanites? That they could ride the flow of energy makes sense, but how would they get in that thing without the human machinists knowing it? They would have to produce them, or provide the parts to.

The same way that hundreds or thousands of the galaxy's brightest scientists can all work together on building and understanding a single device and still not have a clue what it actually does? The Crucible makes absolutely no sense at all all, but then, considering how closely it's related to the Catalyst, I'd be surprised if it did.

[masster blaster]

Auralius Carolus wrote...

masster blaster wrote...


Harby: INSOLENT BRAT YOU WILL REGRET THIS.

*Harbinger stamps away*

*Harbinger turns around*

"Your mother was a cankerous husk!"

Shepard gives Harby the finger the middle finger.

Oh ya well your the Catalyst  B****.

[XanderLav]

HellishFiend wrote...

Big_Boss9 wrote...

llbountyhunter wrote...

Its not just Shepard who's special in the story, its humans in general, they have genetic diversity that other species lack. And Actually when you think about it humans seem to be a bit more resistant to indoctrination than others. Take TIM and grayson for example, both able to maintain a large part of themselves free from the effects of indoc for prolonged periods of time.

And Shepard a human that stands out from the rest.

Given the bottleneck in the human population in the last 70,000~ years, it's borderline ludicrous that humanity would be the most genetically diverse species in the galaxy. Humans are one of the least genetically diverse species on Earth, but they're somehow more diverse than the rest of the galaxy? That plot point has always bothered me.

Well, to be fair, we are the most genetically diverse sentient species on the planet. If the writers want to make the other races in the story less genetically diverse than we are, I dont see the problem with that. Especially if it's important to the plot. 

http://masseffect.wikia.com/wiki/Forum:Harbinger's_race_opinions 
Here is Harbinger thoughts on all of the races. He considers human perfect candidates.

[Leonia]

This thread is more fun when it stays on topic.

[Simon_Says]

Lokanaiya wrote...

Auralius Carolus wrote...

Simon_Says wrote...

Also, update theory. Why, how? Updated nanites, that's why and how.

Not saying I like this theory, just that it's something that may provide answers of some form.

Yeah, but, how does the Crucible get nanites? That they could ride the flow of energy makes sense, but how would they get in that thing without the human machinists knowing it? They would have to produce them, or provide the parts to.

The same way that hundreds or thousands of the galaxy's brightest scientists can all work together on building and understanding a single device and still not have a clue what it actually does? The Crucible makes absolutely no sense at all all, but then, considering how closely it's related to the Catalyst, I'd be surprised if it did.

Actually, maybe try to think of it like chidlren making a gigantic, ultracomplex lego set. Like, say, a fully functional lego car. They have the instructions. They can acquire the pieces. It's all designed and presented to be rather simple to put together. But it's so big and complex that they'll never be able to see or understand how the whole thing works, what exactly it's for, or forsee all the things that can be done with it. They just know that it's something big that moves along and guzzles batteries or something. Those kids may never come up with the idea that this car can be used to go cruising for chicks crash the annual homecoming parade with their new Deathmobile.

Modifié par Simon_Says, 01 juillet 2012 - 06:01 .

[masster blaster]

leonia42 wrote...

This thread is more fun when it stays on topic.

Sorry did not mean to get of topic but ojay i will stop.

[HellishFiend]

Simon_Says wrote...

Lokanaiya wrote...

Auralius Carolus wrote...

Simon_Says wrote...

Also, update theory. Why, how? Updated nanites, that's why and how.

Not saying I like this theory, just that it's something that may provide answers of some form.

Yeah, but, how does the Crucible get nanites? That they could ride the flow of energy makes sense, but how would they get in that thing without the human machinists knowing it? They would have to produce them, or provide the parts to.

The same way that hundreds or thousands of the galaxy's brightest scientists can all work together on building and understanding a single device and still not have a clue what it actually does? The Crucible makes absolutely no sense at all all, but then, considering how closely it's related to the Catalyst, I'd be surprised if it did.

Actually, maybe try to think of it like chidlren making a gigantic, ultracomplex lego set. Like, say, a fully functional lego car. They have the instructions. They can acquire the pieces. It's all designed and presented to be rather simple to put together. But it's so big and complex that they'll never be able to see or understand how the whole thing works, what exactly it's for, or forsee all the things that can be done with it. You just know that it's something big that moves along and guzzles batteries or something. Those kids may never come up with the idea that this car can be used to go cruising for chicks.

edit: ... I just sounded totally chauvinist there didn't I.

Are...are you asking Lokanaiya  if some kid could pick her up if he rolled up in a Crucible?

Modifié par HellishFiend, 01 juillet 2012 - 06:01 .

[XanderLav]

Simon_Says wrote...

Lokanaiya wrote...

Auralius Carolus wrote...

Simon_Says wrote...

Also, update theory. Why, how? Updated nanites, that's why and how.

Not saying I like this theory, just that it's something that may provide answers of some form.

Yeah, but, how does the Crucible get nanites? That they could ride the flow of energy makes sense, but how would they get in that thing without the human machinists knowing it? They would have to produce them, or provide the parts to.

The same way that hundreds or thousands of the galaxy's brightest scientists can all work together on building and understanding a single device and still not have a clue what it actually does? The Crucible makes absolutely no sense at all all, but then, considering how closely it's related to the Catalyst, I'd be surprised if it did.

Actually, maybe try to think of it like chidlren making a gigantic, ultracomplex lego set. Like, say, a fully functional lego car. They have the instructions. They can acquire the pieces. It's all designed and presented to be rather simple to put together. But it's so big and complex that they'll never be able to see or understand how the whole thing works, what exactly it's for, or forsee all the things that can be done with it. You just know that it's something big that moves along and guzzles batteries or something. Those kids may never come up with the idea that this car can be used to go cruising for chicks.

edit: ... I just sounded totally chauvinist there didn't I.

I also like how the Crucible is "upgraded" during each cycle. I find it very weird how can you upgrade something that you neither understand nor know it's purpose and how it works. So what do you do to upgrade it? Put a cherry on top, add rooms for smokers??

[Simon_Says]

HellishFiend wrote...

Are...are you asking Lokanaiya  if some kid could pick her up if he rolled up in a Crucible?

... edited. More Animal House reference now.

[HellishFiend]

Simon_Says wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

Are...are you asking Lokanaiya  if some kid could pick her up if he rolled up in a Crucible?

... edited. More Animal House reference now.

lol, ok. I have to admit though, the imagery was quite amusing!

[Taco Del Marr]

masster blaster wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

masster blaster wrote...

masster blaster wrote...

Oh and Synthesis is bull because people in the whole galaxy would hate the Reapers still even though there is final evolution there still can be WAR, and how many children would grow up learning that there family"s are inside the Reapers and were killed just because of the Catalyst wanted to.Plus the Reapers are helping the Galaxy but are Rebuilding everything in there image not the people but Reapers.

Also I think Hackett would start the New Cerberus Organization because even though there is peace i would not trust the Reapers and many would join unless all became Indoctrinated in which case helps proves that Synthesis is not right because if you listen to the Catalyst carefully it states that " the minds of the Reapers/all the people that have become one with the Reapers would help the Organics and synthetics understand each other and also it explains why now body even tried to continue attacking the Reapers because the are all Indoctrinated.

Edit:
Also the Catalyst still lives in Control and Synthesis so it still has control over the Reapers even though in Control Shepard may have some Control over the Reapers but the Child is still around and if Shepard did something that the Catalyst did not like it can order a Reaper to kill Shepard and start reaping all over again.

Also what's to say synthesis is the FINAL evoultion. There could be a new specias that has no programing of Shepards choice of Synthesis infullns. So it can begin all over again.

Helllishfiend what do you think about this?

I agree with you. I think we are supposed to assume that the "evolution" process suddenly makes both the organics and the Reapers buddy-buddy with each other, but I would hope most of the players know better than that. 

ya. And what does everyone else think about this.

no comments Byne or anyone.

No one in the galaxy would be ok with letting the gencodial death machines sruvive. Garrus even has great line regarding this at one point if you talk to him in the main battery he says something to the effect of about how after this war there are gonna be alot of angry orphans and the most people grow up thinking the galaxy is generally a nice place and then out of nowhere things that seemingly come out of nowhere just want destroy everything you know and love.