55528 réponses à ce sujet

[jgibson14352]

Big_Boss9 wrote...

plfranke wrote...

DJBare wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...
While you guys are entitled to your opinion, not everyone feels the same. I, for one, am loving the speculation. It's the most enjoyable meta-gaming experience I've ever had. Best part of all? It's free!

I agree, while Bioware have not fullfilled my hopes in the game, it's led to some very good discussions without becoming overly bitter, but I have to say that if Bioware are playing a mind game, they best be real careful how far they take it, because eventually people will turn around and say "I've had enough of this farce"

I think it's gonna come to an end at comicon. They simply can't wait till the very end of their dlc schedule to reveal IT, because by then the only people who will be left playing the game are people who love the endings as they are. Though I must say I get chills thinking about all those literalists saying "So... the Indoctrination Theory was right afterall."

While I hope they hint at or reveal something content-wise, I don't think it has to come to an end by then. They'll want the EC to sink in for a while and let people marinate on it and discuss, etc. If we're still talking about this next summer and they've not said one word or the other, and the DLCs don't outright clarify anything, it's probably time to move on.

i think a year is a little long, but overall i agree. if the first DLC they release doesnt drop STRONG hints, or they dont announce anything at SDCC, im moving on. i cant spend all of my free time from here on out discussing "well maybe this" with you guys.
SDCC is by far their best opporitunity to announce upcoming DLC and the planned future for ME, if they say nothing, its safe to assume that the chances are were all going to have to live with being extrememly disappointed

[SubAstris]

CoolioThane wrote...

I don't understand literalists at all...

They obviously are not happy with the endings.

We go through and come up with this theory, this amazing, wonderful theory that will make everyone happy...

We are insane cultists...

Would they prefer the endings we have at face value or an ending that is true to Bioware and to the series?

It's almost like they are dismissing this out of spite as they want something to hate. God, pessimists are lame.

It depends, some are indeed happy.

You assume that everyone will instantly fall in love with IT. I think it is quite a clever idea just not BW's original plan and I think that is shown in the whole game. It is not a matter of preference but what BW actually intended. People who don't like IT aren't pessimists, they are just skeptical of IT as an explanation of events

[SubAstris]

agmrpink wrote...

Lurker here.

Random YouTube tangents led me to this clip, and it got me wondering.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=tqrK0WYH6xE#t=1m41s

I've heard literalists use the conversation on Thessia with the VI, Vendetta, as "proof" that the whole Citadel and Starbaby scene was real. From an ITer's perspective, who are the "masters" referred to in charge of the cycle?

Maybe it's a Reaper-hacked VI, perhaps?

What do y'all think?

Yeah, I was arguing how this really puts a spanner in IT because it is so close foreshadowing. I think most ITers before thought it would all be explained in the EC, but it wasn't. Question is, why not?

Any ITers want to explain this at all?

Modifié par SubAstris, 02 juillet 2012 - 11:03 .

[Andromidius]

CoolioThane wrote...

They obviously are not happy with the endings.

A lot of them actually like the endings.  Some even liked the original endings, but most are now satisfied with the sprinkles they got.

As for why they call us cultists, zealots, insane, whatever...  Its a common ad-hominum attack used by people who can't come up with a proper argument.  And as for why they dislike the theory, maybe they feel threatened by a concept that went over their heads?  Or maybe they think their headcanon is better?  Who knows, we rarely get someone willing to actually tell us these things!

And some are just skeptical and think the concept is too convoluted to be true.  And they tend to be the ones who are nicest when it comes to disagreeing with IT.

[Dessalines]

This might be grasping out straws, but:

Star-Kid states that the Reapers are like a cleansing fire. How does all of Shepard's dream end with the the kid being cleanse by fire. The last dream, Shepard and the kid are joined together to be cleanse by fire.

[UrgedDuke]

CoolioThane wrote...

I don't understand literalists at all...

They obviously are not happy with the endings.

We go through and come up with this theory, this amazing, wonderful theory that will make everyone happy...

We are insane cultists...

Would they prefer the endings we have at face value or an ending that is true to Bioware and to the series?

It's almost like they are dismissing this out of spite as they want something to hate. God, pessimists are lame.

literalists are like the 2012 doomsday theorists, they like to hate and tell you "I told you so" but in the end we all lose

[Andromidius]

SubAstris wrote...
It depends, some are indeed happy.

You assume that everyone will instantly fall in love with IT. I think it is quite a clever idea just not BW's original plan and I think that is shown in the whole game. It is not a matter of preference but what BW actually intended. People who don't like IT aren't pessimists, they are just skeptical of IT as an explanation of events

Of course, its impossible to know what they intended unless they come out and say it.  But based on Final Hours, there's a lot of hinting that they did intend an indoctrination-based storyline to take part.  And there's plenty of foreshadowing that Shepard is slowly cracking under the pressure.

Heck, that LI scene with Liara and the helmet Shepard is talking about how he/she thought they heard the casing crack during the last fight.  Could be symbolic for Shepard's willpower being worn down. 

[Vaya]

EpyonX3 wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

@Hellish: Awesome I get a monocle! *puts on speculation monocle*

And...is Harbinger saying Serve us or save us? I can't make it out.

Neither. The sound he makes is not unique to him and has been heard by other reapers and destroyers throughout the game. Even Pre-EC.

Listening through the other examples, they're very similar, yet not the same. The one that is, or almost is, sounds like it's from Vancouver, so now I'm curious to see exactly where that's used there. The fact that they're similar and not exact actually implies more that its reaper speak and not just reused assets.

I can almost make out the one on Tuchanka ...

Oh? (clearly unimpressed by the big worm)

YEAH! (smashing Kalross into the shroud)

OH **iiiiiiiiiiit! (being pulled under the sand)

[Andromidius]

Dessalines wrote...

This might be grasping out straws, but:

Star-Kid states that the Reapers are like a cleansing fire. How does all of Shepard's dream end with the the kid being cleanse by fire. The last dream, Shepard and the kid are joined together to be cleanse by fire.

That's a nice connection, didn't even consider that before.  Could be subtle hints that Shepard should join with the Reapers - aka burn alongside them.

Dreams are nearly always symbolic, and that's a very powerful symbol there which fits with the new dialogue with Starbinger...

[insomniak9]

OOH!

The Leviathan DLC leak states about simulations of galactic languages

What if Leviathan will teach us Reaper-speak, just like the Thorian taught us the Cipher on Feros? O.o

Modifié par insomniak9, 02 juillet 2012 - 11:00 .

[CoolioThane]

Long live IT - I've heard them call us "arrogant and condescending" when in all my experience it's the anti-ITers who are dismissive, rude, arrogant and spiteful

e.g "I told you so" threads after EC...errr no?

[SubAstris]

Andromidius wrote...

SubAstris wrote...
It depends, some are indeed happy.

You assume that everyone will instantly fall in love with IT. I think it is quite a clever idea just not BW's original plan and I think that is shown in the whole game. It is not a matter of preference but what BW actually intended. People who don't like IT aren't pessimists, they are just skeptical of IT as an explanation of events

Of course, its impossible to know what they intended unless they come out and say it.  But based on Final Hours, there's a lot of hinting that they did intend an indoctrination-based storyline to take part.  And there's plenty of foreshadowing that Shepard is slowly cracking under the pressure.

Heck, that LI scene with Liara and the helmet Shepard is talking about how he/she thought they heard the casing crack during the last fight.  Could be symbolic for Shepard's willpower being worn down. 

I haven't read Final Hours, what does it actually say about indoctrination and Shepard. All I have heard is that TIM was meant to be this indoctrination beast but they scrapped it due to gameplay issues

Potentially, that doesn't necessarily imply indoctrination though.

[SubAstris]

UrgedDuke wrote...

CoolioThane wrote...

I don't understand literalists at all...

They obviously are not happy with the endings.

We go through and come up with this theory, this amazing, wonderful theory that will make everyone happy...

We are insane cultists...

Would they prefer the endings we have at face value or an ending that is true to Bioware and to the series?

It's almost like they are dismissing this out of spite as they want something to hate. God, pessimists are lame.

literalists are like the 2012 doomsday theorists, they like to hate and tell you "I told you so" but in the end we all lose

Da f***?

[MaximizedAction]

Dessalines wrote...

This might be grasping out straws, but:

Star-Kid states that the Reapers are like a cleansing fire. How does all of Shepard's dream end with the the kid being cleanse by fire. The last dream, Shepard and the kid are joined together to be cleanse by fire.

Wow! Well done! That seems like a very good connection...considering that BW added this Catalyst line only with the EC. Seems like they also tried to add consistency.

[BansheeOwnage]

BansheeOwnage wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

BansheeOwnage wrote...

Dwailing wrote...

BansheeOwnage wrote...

BansheeOwnage wrote...

Here's an analogy that BleedingUranium came up with a while ago for ME3's ending.

In case you forget what happened in ME1, after Sovereign blows up, a piece of it hits the citadel tower (slightly creepy music at the end of "Victory"). This would be where ME3 ends (An End Once and For All). What were missing in ME3 is what happens after in ME1.

Shepard then emerges from a pile of wreckage to find her 2 slightly wounded squadmates and Anderson.

I hate bumping my own stuff but does anyone have anything to say about this?

That.  Is.  AMAZING!  Please BW, when you release the IT DLC (It'll happen eventually.), USE THIS!!!

I forgot to mention Shepard is holding the same spot he shot Anderson in ME3. That's why he imagines herself getting wounded here again. On the Citadel.

That's ALSO the same spot Anderson tapped him on in the beginning (Wow, that spot has a lot of significance for Shepard, doesn't it? ). 
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TIML9ku-HJs  (It's around the 1:49 mark, I think.)

On a personal note, that's even weirder for me because my ribcage was dislocated while sparring and my bottom rib sticks out a little right in that spot.
On a more relevant note, after getting knocked back, Shepard hit the only item of note in the dreams: a bench. And immidiately hears the dream soundtrack.

Thought I'd bring this topic up again since Dwailing mentioned it.

[Andromidius]

SubAstris wrote...
I haven't read Final Hours, what does it actually say about indoctrination and Shepard. All I have heard is that TIM was meant to be this indoctrination beast but they scrapped it due to gameplay issues

Potentially, that doesn't necessarily imply indoctrination though.

There was talk about having Shepard lose control of his/her body, but they couldn't work out how to impliment it into gameplay so the gameplay element was ditched.  No mention of if the concept itself was ditched.

And purely the fact indoctrination is a core tool of the Reapers, its not a stretch of the imagination that they'd attempt to indoctrination the figurehead of 'Organic Resistance' during this Cycle.

Whether or not they manage it is another matter, but its clear they are at least trying to.

[Dwailing]

SubAstris wrote...

Andromidius wrote...

SubAstris wrote...
It depends, some are indeed happy.

You assume that everyone will instantly fall in love with IT. I think it is quite a clever idea just not BW's original plan and I think that is shown in the whole game. It is not a matter of preference but what BW actually intended. People who don't like IT aren't pessimists, they are just skeptical of IT as an explanation of events

Of course, its impossible to know what they intended unless they come out and say it.  But based on Final Hours, there's a lot of hinting that they did intend an indoctrination-based storyline to take part.  And there's plenty of foreshadowing that Shepard is slowly cracking under the pressure.

Heck, that LI scene with Liara and the helmet Shepard is talking about how he/she thought they heard the casing crack during the last fight.  Could be symbolic for Shepard's willpower being worn down. 

I haven't read Final Hours, what does it actually say about indoctrination and Shepard. All I have heard is that TIM was meant to be this indoctrination beast but they scrapped it due to gameplay issues

Potentially, that doesn't necessarily imply indoctrination though.

What the FH app basically says is that BW was planning on having a sequence where Shepard fell under full Reaper Control, but they couldn't make it work along side the dialogue choices, so the SEQUENCE was scrapped. I emphasize sequence because this indicates that they were planning to do something with indoctrination at least at one point. My guess is that the sequence was removed, but the concept of indoctrination was kept. I doubt you'll see it that way, but that's just my two cents.

[ThisOneIsPunny]

insomniak9 wrote...

OOH!

The Leviathan DLC leak states about simulations of galactic languages

What if Leviathan will teach us Reaper-speak, just like the Thorian taught us the Cipher on Feros? O.o

"morphological simulations of galactic languages"

Object Rho

Rho-
"Rho is classed as a liquid consonant, which has important implications for morphology."

[legaldinho]

agmrpink wrote...

Lurker here.

Random YouTube tangents led me to this clip, and it got me wondering.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=tqrK0WYH6xE#t=1m41s

I've heard literalists use the conversation on Thessia with the VI, Vendetta, as "proof" that the whole Citadel and Starbaby scene was real. From an ITer's perspective, who are the "masters" referred to in charge of the cycle?

Maybe it's a Reaper-hacked VI, perhaps?

What do y'all think?

Honestly, no.

But I did notice something. I don't think it adds much, but see what you think.

On Thessia, the VI is very happy to share information with you. Look it up on youtube. Then cerberus arrives, indoctrinated presence detected, and "activating security protocols".

In Chronos station, the VI asks you something like: "You are attempting to recover me from indoctrinated forces?" then Shep says "Yes. I need to know what the catalyst is".

The very next thing the VI says, instead of being compliant like last time, is "Security protocol have been overriden, I will comply". Then it talks to you

Now, I could explain it a number of different ways, but see if you all think it's significant. Shep's just had his third and final dream before Chronos.

[Andromidius]

ThisOneIsPunny wrote...

insomniak9 wrote...

OOH!

The Leviathan DLC leak states about simulations of galactic languages

What if Leviathan will teach us Reaper-speak, just like the Thorian taught us the Cipher on Feros? O.o

"morphological simulations of galactic languages"

Object Rho

Rho-
"Rho is classed as a liquid consonant, which has important implications for morphology."

So Object Rho was a Reaper translation device?

[Turbo_J]

DJBare wrote...

I know for a fact all ME3 is a dream, the damn sphere is missing from my cabin, either it's a dream or the damn space hamster took it!

Haha! I said that months ago and they damn near laughed the blue off my ass!

[Andromidius]

legaldinho wrote...

agmrpink wrote...

Lurker here.

Random YouTube tangents led me to this clip, and it got me wondering.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=tqrK0WYH6xE#t=1m41s

I've heard literalists use the conversation on Thessia with the VI, Vendetta, as "proof" that the whole Citadel and Starbaby scene was real. From an ITer's perspective, who are the "masters" referred to in charge of the cycle?

Maybe it's a Reaper-hacked VI, perhaps?

What do y'all think?

Honestly, no.

But I did notice something. I don't think it adds much, but see what you think.

On Thessia, the VI is very happy to share information with you. Look it up on youtube. Then cerberus arrives, indoctrinated presence detected, and "activating security protocols".

In Chronos station, the VI asks you something like: "You are attempting to recover me from indoctrinated forces?" then Shep says "Yes. I need to know what the catalyst is".

The very next thing the VI says, instead of being compliant like last time, is "Security protocol have been overriden, I will comply". Then it talks to you

Now, I could explain it a number of different ways, but see if you all think it's significant. Shep's just had his third and final dream before Chronos.

So basically its making it clear that it'll help you now based on its security being compromised, even though it didn't mention the security beforehand and was willing to help?

Well, it could merely be informing Shepard that it had been compromised so he/she knows 'indoctrinated forces' already have the information it has.  Or it was holding back beforehand and merely giving false information.

Strange how originally it was saying it would interface with the Catalyst and Crucible to join them together, but never mentioned it after its security is removed and its spilling the beans.

[ThisOneIsPunny]

Andromidius wrote...

ThisOneIsPunny wrote...

insomniak9 wrote...

OOH!

The Leviathan DLC leak states about simulations of galactic languages

What if Leviathan will teach us Reaper-speak, just like the Thorian taught us the Cipher on Feros? O.o

"morphological simulations of galactic languages"

Object Rho

Rho-
"Rho is classed as a liquid consonant, which has important implications for morphology."

So Object Rho was a Reaper translation device?

I'm just making connections until the rest of my brain decides to catch up. :happy:
 Edit: If the topic somehow comes up again, I think I'll have an idea of what to say but I'm not well informed on things revolving around morphology or even Object Rho at all (never played Arrival, still considering getting it depending on when the Leviathan dlc comes out). What I do know is that the topic of Object Rho and the relation or morphology came up once or twice before. Didn't see much discussion about it though?

Modifié par ThisOneIsPunny, 02 juillet 2012 - 11:55 .

[Turbo_J]

Andromidius wrote...

legaldinho wrote...

agmrpink wrote...

Lurker here.

Random YouTube tangents led me to this clip, and it got me wondering.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=tqrK0WYH6xE#t=1m41s

I've heard literalists use the conversation on Thessia with the VI, Vendetta, as "proof" that the whole Citadel and Starbaby scene was real. From an ITer's perspective, who are the "masters" referred to in charge of the cycle?

Maybe it's a Reaper-hacked VI, perhaps?

What do y'all think?

Honestly, no.

But I did notice something. I don't think it adds much, but see what you think.

On Thessia, the VI is very happy to share information with you. Look it up on youtube. Then cerberus arrives, indoctrinated presence detected, and "activating security protocols".

In Chronos station, the VI asks you something like: "You are attempting to recover me from indoctrinated forces?" then Shep says "Yes. I need to know what the catalyst is".

The very next thing the VI says, instead of being compliant like last time, is "Security protocol have been overriden, I will comply". Then it talks to you

Now, I could explain it a number of different ways, but see if you all think it's significant. Shep's just had his third and final dream before Chronos.

So basically its making it clear that it'll help you now based on its security being compromised, even though it didn't mention the security beforehand and was willing to help?

Well, it could merely be informing Shepard that it had been compromised so he/she knows 'indoctrinated forces' already have the information it has.  Or it was holding back beforehand and merely giving false information.

Strange how originally it was saying it would interface with the Catalyst and Crucible to join them together, but never mentioned it after its security is removed and its spilling the beans.

Exactly. It's been hacked and nothing it says can be trusted.

[insomniak9]

legaldinho wrote...

agmrpink wrote...

Lurker here.

Random YouTube tangents led me to this clip, and it got me wondering.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=tqrK0WYH6xE#t=1m41s

I've heard literalists use the conversation on Thessia with the VI, Vendetta, as "proof" that the whole Citadel and Starbaby scene was real. From an ITer's perspective, who are the "masters" referred to in charge of the cycle?

Maybe it's a Reaper-hacked VI, perhaps?

What do y'all think?

Honestly, no.

But I did notice something. I don't think it adds much, but see what you think.

On Thessia, the VI is very happy to share information with you. Look it up on youtube. Then cerberus arrives, indoctrinated presence detected, and "activating security protocols".

In Chronos station, the VI asks you something like: "You are attempting to recover me from indoctrinated forces?" then Shep says "Yes. I need to know what the catalyst is".

The very next thing the VI says, instead of being compliant like last time, is "Security protocol have been overriden, I will comply". Then it talks to you

Now, I could explain it a number of different ways, but see if you all think it's significant. Shep's just had his third and final dream before Chronos.

Exactly. I also wondered why it said that. Reason being, TIM has already overridden the protocol... it knows Shep is indoctrinated, but complies regardless.