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[paxxton]

Salient Archer wrote...

paxxton wrote...

Salient Archer wrote...

byne wrote...

paxxton wrote...

You're mixing 2 interpretations.
Literal:
1. Control gives Shepard an opportunity to undo the Reapers' deeds.
2. Synthesis makes the whole discussion irrelevant because there's no more Organics/Synthetics division after it.
3. Destroy is just destroy. The most straightforward resolution to the conflict.

1: I dont care what Shepard does with the Reapers. Nothing at all justifies all the genocides the Reapers have committed (Quick math: oldest known Reaper? One billion years old. One billion divided by 50,000? 20,000. The Reapers have committed at least 20,000 genocides.)

2: Synthesis makes the whole discussion irrelevant, sure, but thats only because you've agreed to even have the discussion with godchild in the first place. You agreed to his way of thinking and took his way out to solve it. That holds true even if you dont consider IT.

paxxton choosing control is an example of making a mistake to fix another one. Better to be slain by your enemy than to succumb to his methods.

There's nothing to forgive the mass of atrocities the Reapers have performed for the past eon. It's not just what they do to us but it's also how they go about it. They don't just rob us of our freewill and creativity [our greatest assets] they commit mass galactic genocide and they make no appolgies for doing it. Worse yet on top of it all they do it by harvesting our friends and families so they can covert them into abominations designed to kill and torture us.

I'm sorry, but my full-paragon Shepard doesn't need a trophy of those sins ... he'll always pick destroy.

Controlling the Reapers is all about changing their method, changing them to stop them from committing atrocities. And as a bonus you get technology that surpasses everything else so far invented.

But that's making the assumption Reaper-Bieber is being honest or that Shepard is even capable of such a feat. Whose to say he has the strength to resist that level of coruption, besides Control is also a Reaper concept shared by many of the indoctrinated. 

Even still, As an outsider would you suddenly trust the Reapers just because Shepard is supposedly in 'control' of them? And it's not like keeping their technology hasn't been a recipe for disaster in the past. I'm sorry, but these are just the surface issues with control and there's already too many unknowns for my liking.

If Starkid is lying then Shepard is in for a big unpleasant surprise. But how can a being of light popping out of nowhere in a form of a child only Shepard saw lie? Nah.  

[UrgedDuke]

Big Bad wrote...

UrgedDuke wrote...

paxxton wrote...

UrgedDuke wrote...

is it me or does it seem that we lost a big following when the old thread got shut down

The new thread is moving much slower than the last one.

haven't seen much of Lex, Balance, BigBad or SS2Dante in this new thread..... sad really

I am still here, i just haven't had time to post as much lately due to business at work and because i am jn the middle of replaying the series!

We need to reunite the IT heroes..... IT TEAM ASSEMBLE!!! 

[DJBare]

MegumiAzusa wrote...

I remember someone noticed that for the last time you can select a weapon if you go to the customize screen the camera doesn't stand still, now I am just playing Earth and noticed: there is weapon bob which is nowhere else but when you just get up from being shot by Harbinger.

Yup, I put up a video on the 4th of may, it shows the bench after you select your squad for the push, I noted there is no weapons bench in that location www.youtube.com/watch

[legaldinho]

just replayed tuchanka, third time. This time with the music off, and wandering around changing the settings on my headphones to hear the sounds, especially as I approach the starchild. No way anyone can convince me this isn't supposed to indicate the process of indoctrination is under way... and the child is a sinister character as the sounds escalate as you get closer, with the- super clear- harbinger filter being used for the low murmurs.

[Arian Dynas]

UrgedDuke wrote...

Big Bad wrote...

UrgedDuke wrote...

paxxton wrote...

UrgedDuke wrote...

is it me or does it seem that we lost a big following when the old thread got shut down

The new thread is moving much slower than the last one.

haven't seen much of Lex, Balance, BigBad or SS2Dante in this new thread..... sad really

I am still here, i just haven't had time to post as much lately due to business at work and because i am jn the middle of replaying the series!

We need to reunite the IT heroes..... IT TEAM ASSEMBLE!!! 

Oh most of us are here, I've seen Balance, Lex0r, Big Bad and SS3Dante, they just haven't had much to say latley it seems.

[Arian Dynas]

RavenEyry wrote...

I've said it before and I'll say it again, if I apply Occam's razor (appropriate or not) I find IT to be the simplest explanation.
Possibility 1: Company well known for very good writing makes one of the worst endings to anything ever. They made this mistake because they are terrible writers, or so I am told.
Possibility 2: Company well known for very good writing makes a fake ending to trick people but leaves many clues, both in-game and out.

I find 2 to be the more plausible to be honest.

Well the thing about that, Occam's razor DOES apply there, because it's a real world thing to dissect their methods and motivations, he's talking about using Occam's razor IN STORY.

[paxxton]

Indoctrination hallucination can incorporate visual and audio cues from Shepard's memory.

Modifié par paxxton, 22 mai 2012 - 12:07 .

[Xavendithas]

Xavendithas wrote...

HyperGlass wrote...

Xavendithas wrote...

That does sound like Big Ben, the first three notes of Big Bens chime anyways.

Indeed and also someone commented on hearing wind which I do hear too after the chime. When was there wind on the Citadale?

With the volume turned way up on my speakers, it sounds as if he is inside and you are just hearing the ambient noise of an unstable building creaking.



That said, pause the video at the 7 or 8 second mark and look at the object in the background.

Is it just me or does that look like part of Object Rho?

Just bumping a question I threw out earlier. Was wondering if others noticed this during the breath scene.

[HellishFiend]

DJBare wrote...

MegumiAzusa wrote...

I remember someone noticed that for the last time you can select a weapon if you go to the customize screen the camera doesn't stand still, now I am just playing Earth and noticed: there is weapon bob which is nowhere else but when you just get up from being shot by Harbinger.

Yup, I put up a video on the 4th of may, it shows the bench after you select your squad for the push, I noted there is no weapons bench in that location www.youtube.com/watch

I think the only possible explanation for this is that Shepard's psyche is starting to weaken. Normally it would be something I'd write off as "Fits in either context", but being that the weapon bob starts in a very subtle way during the final mission and before you get hit with Harbinger's beam, well, there is only that one conclusion to come to.

Besides, it could also potentially explain why Anderson "wobbles" during the TIM conversation. If Anderson really does represent Shepard's willpower, he could be wobbling in a similar fashion to the aim of your gun. 

[Salient Archer]

paxxton wrote...

Salient Archer wrote...

paxxton wrote...

Salient Archer wrote...

byne wrote...

paxxton wrote...

You're mixing 2 interpretations.
Literal:
1. Control gives Shepard an opportunity to undo the Reapers' deeds.
2. Synthesis makes the whole discussion irrelevant because there's no more Organics/Synthetics division after it.
3. Destroy is just destroy. The most straightforward resolution to the conflict.

1: I dont care what Shepard does with the Reapers. Nothing at all justifies all the genocides the Reapers have committed (Quick math: oldest known Reaper? One billion years old. One billion divided by 50,000? 20,000. The Reapers have committed at least 20,000 genocides.)

2: Synthesis makes the whole discussion irrelevant, sure, but thats only because you've agreed to even have the discussion with godchild in the first place. You agreed to his way of thinking and took his way out to solve it. That holds true even if you dont consider IT.

paxxton choosing control is an example of making a mistake to fix another one. Better to be slain by your enemy than to succumb to his methods.

There's nothing to forgive the mass of atrocities the Reapers have performed for the past eon. It's not just what they do to us but it's also how they go about it. They don't just rob us of our freewill and creativity [our greatest assets] they commit mass galactic genocide and they make no appolgies for doing it. Worse yet on top of it all they do it by harvesting our friends and families so they can covert them into abominations designed to kill and torture us.

I'm sorry, but my full-paragon Shepard doesn't need a trophy of those sins ... he'll always pick destroy.

Controlling the Reapers is all about changing their method, changing them to stop them from committing atrocities. And as a bonus you get technology that surpasses everything else so far invented.

But that's making the assumption Reaper-Bieber is being honest or that Shepard is even capable of such a feat. Whose to say he has the strength to resist that level of coruption, besides Control is also a Reaper concept shared by many of the indoctrinated. 

Even still, As an outsider would you suddenly trust the Reapers just because Shepard is supposedly in 'control' of them? And it's not like keeping their technology hasn't been a recipe for disaster in the past. I'm sorry, but these are just the surface issues with control and there's already too many unknowns for my liking.

If Starkid is lying then Shepard is in for a big unpleasant surprise. But how can a being of light popping out of nowhere in a form of a child only Shepard saw lie? Nah.  

Well when you put it that way ... 

[Big Bad]

Two unrelated thoughts:

1) If "control" is a truly viable option (perhaps even the Paragon option!), why is it that up until the last five minutes, the game goes out of its way to hit you over the head with the notion that trying to control the reapers is ultimately futile and counterproductive? It's not like the starchild ever presents any compelling arguments to refute what we've heard previously, so why would I trust him over everything else we've been told about control?

2) I have a crazy idea about the crucible (my apologies in advance if subconsciously stole this from anybody) - Assuming that IT is true for the moment, what if the true function of the Crucible is to use the reaper IFF signal as a homing beacon to target all the reapers in the galaxy, and then fire some sort of high energy weapon that can travel through mass effect relays? Granted it's still a little too convenient, but if they ended the game with something like that, I wouldn't hate it.

[JasonSic]

ll PAYASO323 ll wrote...

i keep hearing EVERYWHERE lately that the ending was wrote by Casey and Mac alone. No input from the rest of the team whatsoever.
Why do people keep mentioning this? is this even true? Wasup with that

If true, it could be to keep the true ending a secret from anyone else in Bioware. A good way to prevent it from being leaked.

Modifié par JasonSic, 22 mai 2012 - 12:15 .

[DJBare]

Big Bad wrote...

2) I have a crazy idea about the crucible (my apologies in advance if subconsciously stole this from anybody) - Assuming that IT is true for the moment, what if the true function of the Crucible is to use the reaper IFF signal as a homing beacon to target all the reapers in the galaxy, and then fire some sort of high energy weapon that can travel through mass effect relays? Granted it's still a little too convenient, but if they ended the game with something like that, I wouldn't hate it.

I prefer the idea that it's a mass indoctrination device considering we gave the damn thing a human reaper heart without question.

Modifié par DJBare, 22 mai 2012 - 12:18 .

[Big Bad]

DJBare wrote...

Big Bad wrote...

2) I have a crazy idea about the crucible (my apologies in advance if subconsciously stole this from anybody) - Assuming that IT is true for the moment, what if the true function of the Crucible is to use the reaper IFF signal as a homing beacon to target all the reapers in the galaxy, and then fire some sort of high energy weapon that can travel through mass effect relays? Granted it's still a little too convenient, but if they ended the game with something like that, I wouldn't hate it.

I prefer the idea that it's a mass indoctrination device considering we gave the damn thing a human reaper heart without question.

Oh yeah, I totally prefer the "it's a trap!" idea about the crucible too, but I'm trying not to get my hopes up about that.

[delldo]

@Xaven,

Back in the old thread I posted a picture comparing that object in the rubble to the conduit, but now I think that it may actually be a part of a reaper. I still need to find some good close up shots of each of the reapers, but the destroyers seem to have parts that resemble the object in question. If only work and my wife would leave me be long enough to put some time into it I am sure I could prove or debunk it, but we know how that goes.

[Xavendithas]

delldo wrote...

@Xaven,

Back in the old thread I posted a picture comparing that object in the rubble to the conduit, but now I think that it may actually be a part of a reaper. I still need to find some good close up shots of each of the reapers, but the destroyers seem to have parts that resemble the object in question. If only work and my wife would leave me be long enough to put some time into it I am sure I could prove or debunk it, but we know how that goes.

I remember seeing those screenshots come up in the old thread, but I thought the discussion at the time was about whether or not s/he had something impaling his leg. I can't find any good screenshots of it. It just has the shape of part of Object Rho. Now I'm wishing I could remember what the device on Aequitas looked like.

[balance5050]

Arian Dynas wrote...

UrgedDuke wrote...

Big Bad wrote...

UrgedDuke wrote...

paxxton wrote...

UrgedDuke wrote...

is it me or does it seem that we lost a big following when the old thread got shut down

The new thread is moving much slower than the last one.

haven't seen much of Lex, Balance, BigBad or SS2Dante in this new thread..... sad really

I am still here, i just haven't had time to post as much lately due to business at work and because i am jn the middle of replaying the series!

We need to reunite the IT heroes..... IT TEAM ASSEMBLE!!! 

Oh most of us are here, I've seen Balance, Lex0r, Big Bad and SS3Dante, they just haven't had much to say latley it seems.

I've just been debating in other threads, the last piece of evidence I put forward was how the tree reflections looked like the same trees that we see at the beginning of the game where the kid is playing in the rooftop garden.

It was kind of a full circle clue for me.

[byne]

So, I just completed my replaying of DA:O (including Awakening).

Its interesting how the Architect guy is pretty similar to godchild, coming in at the last moment and saying he can end the darkspawn threat permanently. He even refers to the blights as cycles. Yet for some reason I actually trust the Architect.

I mean, sure, theres an epilogue saying the Deep Roads have been far quieter than usual if you side with him, making it pretty clear trusting him pays off, and in DA2 Nathaniel mentions something about how he is working with the Wardens, but I trusted him my first playthrough before I knew any of that.

I never once trusted godchild, not sure why I trusted the Architect.


Also, side note:

Naked Broodmothers?




Perfectly ok.

Naked banshees?



Also apparently ok.

Naked Traynor?

No way, that might scar our fragile little minds.

[/endrant]

[BleedingUranium]

byne wrote...

Also, side note:

Naked Broodmothers?

*images snipped*

Perfectly ok.

Naked banshees?

*image snipped*

Also apparently ok.

Naked Traynor?

No way, that might scar our fragile little minds.

[/endrant]

Or Ash, even though her romance scene uses the same camera angles and shots as Liara's...

[delldo]

@Xaven,

YouTube "abandoned mine mission in mass effect 2" and you will see that the artifact is the same as object rho from arrival. The curvature looks similar to the rubble object, but I will have to look closer when I get home and off this damn phone lol.

[Rosewind]

yeah but they monsters, and traynor is a ... human i guess lol that is why there is naked liara

[Rosewind]

byne wrote...

So, I just completed my replaying of DA:O (including Awakening).

Its interesting how the Architect guy is pretty similar to godchild, coming in at the last moment and saying he can end the darkspawn threat permanently. He even refers to the blights as cycles. Yet for some reason I actually trust the Architect.

I mean, sure, theres an epilogue saying the Deep Roads have been far quieter than usual if you side with him, making it pretty clear trusting him pays off, and in DA2 Nathaniel mentions something about how he is working with the Wardens, but I trusted him my first playthrough before I knew any of that.

I never once trusted godchild, not sure why I trusted the Architect.


*snip*

I think it because the darkspawn aren't sneaky buggers like the reapers, and the Architect doesn't really come into play at the end you just get to be able to talk to him then lol.

[delldo]

@Byne,

I agree with you, there are some bass ackwards standards going on in the world when nudity is only ok on gruesome and grotesque humanoid creatures... Gross boobs FTW!

[MegumiAzusa]

Liara's got scales, so it doesn't count.
Also the Architect does explain himself and what he is doing, he says he is trying to actively end the cycles (and yeah there are sooo many things similar in DA and ME) compared to the child who says I control the Reapers, and it's my solution in the first place... that's quite a difference. The child never wanted to cycles to stop, only (if true) supports it out of necessity.