55528 réponses à ce sujet

[Starbuck8]

HellishFiend wrote...

Arian Dynas wrote...

HellishFiend wrote...

Arian Dynas wrote...

I am referring to incongruities, but you also need to establish the significance of things like whispering and such by showing the symptoms of indoctrination.

That and thematic evidence is so inextricable from simple momentary incongruities that the incongruities mean nothing without the context of theme, alone each piece can be dismissed as a "bug" or a strange artistic choice.

You may see it that way, and your sentence/opinion is well worded, but I have to disagree with it. Clevernoob's "documentary" is a perfect example of the clear distinction that most people place between tangible/inconsistency-based evidence and thematic evidence . Some people have only eyes and ears for things that dont require much - if any - context. Turbo and I aim to attack that problem. 

Dude. You're talking to an archaeologist.

Context is God to people in my profession.

And listing every little strangeness in a mission would take alot of time and I'm ****ing lazy.

But one way or another, get Prettz onboard, he's the go to guy for the kind of video you are looking for, if you just want videos focusing on weird bits without context. 

Arian, I didnt ask for a list. Just general topics. And I honestly should hope that I've proven that I can handle making videos from top to bottom, as I neither asked for nor needed help for my Infrasound video. And for that matter I only asked for "help" with Choose Wisely to give people a chance to chip in and contribute if they wanted to (Turbo notwithstanding). So I dont really feel the need to bother prettz with it. He's done more than his fair share and even expressed the need for a break from making them. 

ok too tired to go back and find the original post to quote. but I would like to see a good video that goes over everything with the boy in the beginning. Show the location where the boy is originally, then show where that building is after the attack and how it looks, and how far that building is from the balcony where he shows up, then go over the vent stuff and the scene where he gets on the shuttle, pointing out how no one else seems to help or acknowledge him.

[zigamortis]

Chronos and Cronus ARE NOT the same entity. Chronos is the personification of time, and is a "primordial diety". Cronus the father of zues and leader of the titans, he is the god of "time", i.e., calendars, seasons, and harvests. Cronus is similar to Chronos but are not the same. Essentially Chronos IS time.

[HellishFiend]

Starbuck8 wrote...

ok too tired to go back and find the original post to quote. but I would like to see a good video that goes over everything with the boy in the beginning. Show the location where the boy is originally, then show where that building is after the attack and how it looks, and how far that building is from the balcony where he shows up, then go over the vent stuff and the scene where he gets on the shuttle, pointing out how no one else seems to help or acknowledge him.

Good idea! I dont think a comprehensive video has been done on that subject. It's all spread around in bits and pieces of other videos. 

[zigamortis]

Adios amigos may you find some mind blowing proof for the theory while i rest.

[Starbuck8]

HellishFiend wrote...

Starbuck8 wrote...

ok too tired to go back and find the original post to quote. but I would like to see a good video that goes over everything with the boy in the beginning. Show the location where the boy is originally, then show where that building is after the attack and how it looks, and how far that building is from the balcony where he shows up, then go over the vent stuff and the scene where he gets on the shuttle, pointing out how no one else seems to help or acknowledge him.

Good idea! I dont think a comprehensive video has been done on that subject. It's all spread around in bits and pieces of other videos. 

Yep. You could probably use some of what Turbo has on the garden and add to it.

[Schachmatt123]

I just play through the London Mission with my second Char and can confirm allmost all strange situations regarding IT. I just watched that Normandy evac - either it is really bad writing or a very clear sign pointing that something is terribly wrong - no way the normandy can be there in this situation. And Anderson telling Shepard again that he was born in London, with Shepards replying "Really" if it was news to him really sound weird.

However, while I'm at it I switched the language from english into german to find out if Harbingers one-liner was translated. Nope, it is not. It is the same audio file. Perhaps it is really just reaperish, if not, my bet would be on "join us".

[Arian Dynas]

insomniak9 wrote...

I'm still almost 100% sure that Chronos and Cronus are two separate different beings O.o

The whole point is the Chronos actually is the personification of Time.
Cronus is the God of the passing of time, the Harvest etc. He also parallels TIM to a large extent.

They have the same root (as you say, from Chron...) but they are different beings.

I've found the source of the confusion.

Khronus, latinized as Chronus, was the personification of time in pre-Socratic literature and philosophy.

Chronus was later conflated with the distinct god Cronus also known as Kronus, Kronos, Saturn, Saturnus, who was the Titan god of time in post-Socratic literature and the two apparently later became the same deity in mythology and literature.

Well, that and other sources say that the two were merely aspects of the same deity, each known as a distinct god in their own right.

Yeah, mythology can be a pain.

Modifié par Arian Dynas, 08 juillet 2012 - 10:09 .

[legaldinho]

The last thing I want is another indoctrination video, even less one like clevernoobnetwork, which is shallow and superficial.

I'd much prefer a thematic presentation of the significance of indoctrination, in the ME games, as Dynas suggests. And maybe some cuts to ME3 nods in the direction of shepard being indoctrinated: whispers, dreams etc.

The importance is the theme and interpretation. The clues are only meant to help you get there. Once you see ME3 unfold through the prism of "Shepard fighting indoctrination" it is inescapably part and parcel of the story.

Modifié par legaldinho, 08 juillet 2012 - 10:10 .

[Arian Dynas]

legaldinho wrote...

The last thing I want is another indoctrination vide, even less one like clevernoobnetwork.

I'd much prefer a thematic presentation of the significance of indoc, in the games, and maybe some cuts to ME3 nods in the direction of shepard being indoctrinated.

The importance is the theme and interpretation. The clues are only meant to help you get there. Once you see ME3 unfold through the prism of "Shepard fighting indoctrination" it is inescapably part and parcel of the story.

You haven't been paying attention have you? Check HellishFeind's signature, click the big "Choose Wisely" thing, that would be exactly what you seek.

[Arian Dynas]

Schachmatt wrote...

I just play through the London Mission with my second Char and can confirm allmost all strange situations regarding IT. I just watched that Normandy evac - either it is really bad writing or a very clear sign pointing that something is terribly wrong - no way the normandy can be there in this situation. And Anderson telling Shepard again that he was born in London, with Shepards replying "Really" if it was news to him really sound weird.

However, while I'm at it I switched the language from english into german to find out if Harbingers one-liner was translated. Nope, it is not. It is the same audio file. Perhaps it is really just reaperish, if not, my bet would be on "join us".

Welp, considering as far as I know, the German localization of the ME games is VERY good, I'd say that's the idea that it's English pretty well axed.

[Starbuck8]

Hmm I'm curious, has anyone done a post-EC playthru and confirmed whether they've left in or taken out the first "I was born in London" mention by Anderson?

[legaldinho]

Arian Dynas wrote...

legaldinho wrote...

The last thing I want is another indoctrination vide, even less one like clevernoobnetwork.

I'd much prefer a thematic presentation of the significance of indoc, in the games, and maybe some cuts to ME3 nods in the direction of shepard being indoctrinated.

The importance is the theme and interpretation. The clues are only meant to help you get there. Once you see ME3 unfold through the prism of "Shepard fighting indoctrination" it is inescapably part and parcel of the story.

You haven't been paying attention have you? Check HellishFeind's signature, click the big "Choose Wisely" thing, that would be exactly what you seek.

I was quoting you, effectively, and agreeing with you- from a couple of pages back. Hard to keep up with the conversation.

Seen hellish's vid. It's infinitely better than something like clevernoobs.

Modifié par legaldinho, 08 juillet 2012 - 10:15 .

[Arian Dynas]

legaldinho wrote...

Arian Dynas wrote...

legaldinho wrote...

The last thing I want is another indoctrination vide, even less one like clevernoobnetwork.

I'd much prefer a thematic presentation of the significance of indoc, in the games, and maybe some cuts to ME3 nods in the direction of shepard being indoctrinated.

The importance is the theme and interpretation. The clues are only meant to help you get there. Once you see ME3 unfold through the prism of "Shepard fighting indoctrination" it is inescapably part and parcel of the story.

You haven't been paying attention have you? Check HellishFeind's signature, click the big "Choose Wisely" thing, that would be exactly what you seek.

I was quoting you, effectively, and agreeing with you- from a couple of pages back. Hard to keep up with the conversation.

Seen hellish's vid. It's infinitely better than something like clevernoobs.

To be honest I agree, but mostly it comes down from Clevernoob's arrogance about having "every piece of evidence" as well as the things he discards out of hand.

Last I checked, the only times I see him posting in this thread are when he's annoucing his next video.

[byne]

Arian Dynas wrote...

insomniak9 wrote...

I'm still almost 100% sure that Chronos and Cronus are two separate different beings O.o

The whole point is the Chronos actually is the personification of Time.
Cronus is the God of the passing of time, the Harvest etc. He also parallels TIM to a large extent.

They have the same root (as you say, from Chron...) but they are different beings.

I've found the source of the confusion.

Khronus, latinized as Chronus, was the personification of time in pre-Socratic literature and philosophy.

Chronus was later conflated with the distinct god Cronus also known as Kronus, Kronos, Saturn, Saturnus, who was the Titan god of time in post-Socratic literature and the two apparently later became the same deity in mythology and literature.

Well, that and other sources say that the two were merely aspects of the same deity, each known as a distinct god in their own right.

Yeah, mythology can be a pain.

I once read a book where a guy became Chronos, but then he had to live backwards in time.

It was a good book from what I recall. It was part of a series where mortals took on the jobs of immortal beings, like the Grim Reaper, Mother Nature, Chronos, and the like.

Incarnations of Immortality I think it was called.

I always liked that series because the mortal who became Satan was actually a good guy, but he was bound by the rules of his office and had to act evil.

I dont know why I brought this up, now that I think about it. Probably because I'm tired.

But now I totally wanna find those books and reread them...

[HellishFiend]

legaldinho wrote...

Arian Dynas wrote...

legaldinho wrote...

The last thing I want is another indoctrination vide, even less one like clevernoobnetwork.

I'd much prefer a thematic presentation of the significance of indoc, in the games, and maybe some cuts to ME3 nods in the direction of shepard being indoctrinated.

The importance is the theme and interpretation. The clues are only meant to help you get there. Once you see ME3 unfold through the prism of "Shepard fighting indoctrination" it is inescapably part and parcel of the story.

You haven't been paying attention have you? Check HellishFeind's signature, click the big "Choose Wisely" thing, that would be exactly what you seek.

I was quoting you, effectively, and agreeing with you- from a couple of pages back. Hard to keep up with the conversation.

Seen hellish's vid. It's infinitely better than something like clevernoobs.

Thanks. Glad you liked it.  It sounds like you'll like our upcoming vids just as much, if not more. Choose Wisely was 90% theatrics and 10% informative, and our upcoming vids will be tipping the scale the other way. The goal is to to walk people through the thematic connections step-by-step so that they actually have a chance to come to the same conclusions we have. 

[Arian Dynas]

byne wrote...

Arian Dynas wrote...

insomniak9 wrote...

I'm still almost 100% sure that Chronos and Cronus are two separate different beings O.o

The whole point is the Chronos actually is the personification of Time.
Cronus is the God of the passing of time, the Harvest etc. He also parallels TIM to a large extent.

They have the same root (as you say, from Chron...) but they are different beings.

I've found the source of the confusion.

Khronus, latinized as Chronus, was the personification of time in pre-Socratic literature and philosophy.

Chronus was later conflated with the distinct god Cronus also known as Kronus, Kronos, Saturn, Saturnus, who was the Titan god of time in post-Socratic literature and the two apparently later became the same deity in mythology and literature.

Well, that and other sources say that the two were merely aspects of the same deity, each known as a distinct god in their own right.

Yeah, mythology can be a pain.

I once read a book where a guy became Chronos, but then he had to live backwards in time.

It was a good book from what I recall. It was part of a series where mortals took on the jobs of immortal beings, like the Grim Reaper, Mother Nature, Chronos, and the like.

Incarnations of Immortality I think it was called.

I always liked that series because the mortal who became Satan was actually a good guy, but he was bound by the rules of his office and had to act evil.

I dont know why I brought this up, now that I think about it. Probably because I'm tired.

But now I totally wanna find those books and reread them...

Mother Nature is derived from a combination the Titaness Gaia (Gaea) and the goddess Demeter 
.
And Satan being the good guy, bound by his job is actually straight out of Hebrew myth, where Satan was Ha'Satan, the accuser or the challenger, who was an angel, chosen by God to test the faith of men (poor ****s like Job for instance) Lucifer, the lord of the Fallen Angels, known as Demons (which in and of itself is a corruption of the Greek Daimon, which merely meant "spirit" and could be either good or bad) was an entirely distinct figure. In fact, most of what we associate with "The Morning Star" or Lucifer (meaning bringer of Light) was written much later by John Milton and his book Paradise Lost.

[legaldinho]

Arian Dynas wrote...

legaldinho wrote...

Arian Dynas wrote...

legaldinho wrote...

The last thing I want is another indoctrination vide, even less one like clevernoobnetwork.

I'd much prefer a thematic presentation of the significance of indoc, in the games, and maybe some cuts to ME3 nods in the direction of shepard being indoctrinated.

The importance is the theme and interpretation. The clues are only meant to help you get there. Once you see ME3 unfold through the prism of "Shepard fighting indoctrination" it is inescapably part and parcel of the story.

You haven't been paying attention have you? Check HellishFeind's signature, click the big "Choose Wisely" thing, that would be exactly what you seek.

I was quoting you, effectively, and agreeing with you- from a couple of pages back. Hard to keep up with the conversation.

Seen hellish's vid. It's infinitely better than something like clevernoobs.

To be honest I agree, but mostly it comes down from Clevernoob's arrogance about having "every piece of evidence" as well as the things he discards out of hand.

Last I checked, the only times I see him posting in this thread are when he's annoucing his next video.

yeah, his second video had one piece of "evidence" which he "discovered himself"...

We'd talked about it in this thread/ its predecessor weeks before even his first video went up.

The problem with youtube vid mongers like him, crazy joe and whathaveyou, is they are limelight hoggers. They see IT as a way to generate views and revenue/kudos for their little youtube business.

That's why I love archengeia.

[byne]

Arian Dynas wrote...


Mother Nature is derived from a combination the Titaness Gaia (Gaea) and the goddess Demeter 
.
And Satan being the good guy, bound by his job is actually straight out of Hebrew myth, where Satan was Ha'Satan, the accuser or the challenger, who was an angel, chosen by God to test the faith of men (poor ****s like Job for instance) Lucifer, the lord of the Fallen Angels, known as Demons (which in and of itself is a corruption of the Greek Daimon, which merely meant "spirit" and could be either good or bad) was an entirely distinct figure. In fact, most of what we associate with "The Morning Star" or Lucifer (meaning bringer of Light) was written much later by John Milton and his book Paradise Lost.

Huh, I learn something new every day in this thread!

Anyways, its 6:40am, and I should probably be going to bed soon, so I'm off for now.

[SixG90]

TSA_383 wrote...

BatmanTurian wrote...

hey guys, i don't know if any of you have seen this but I was looking for ME images and I found this curious image.

It seems someone put Miranda in the place of the Catalyst, gave her its animation and " glow ", and it shows the face the Catalyst makes after Shep chooses Control. Again, pardon me if you guys have seen this already.



EDIT: I could be wrong. Not sure.

Now That's some goooooood evidence

Now we just need someone to swap the models over and flycam it

That's really interesting. Can someone in this fantastic thread do it? 

[Arian Dynas]

BORING! SOMEONE SPECULATE! ENTERTAIN ME DAMN YOU!

[prettz]

Arian Dynas wrote...

BORING! SOMEONE SPECULATE! ENTERTAIN ME DAMN YOU!

I'm trying but took a break and started playing Deus Ex Human revolution cause my coats vid giving me a headache.

[MaximizedAction]

BatmanTurian wrote...

hey guys, i don't know if any of you have seen this but I was looking for ME images and I found this curious image.

It seems someone put Miranda in the place of the Catalyst, gave her its animation and " glow ", and it shows the face the Catalyst makes after Shep chooses Control. Again, pardon me if you guys have seen this already.



EDIT: I could be wrong. Not sure.

WOW...just, wow. That's one of the most creative ways of finding evidence I've seen! Well done that-particular-individual.

[Andromidius]

Not sure what type of 'evidence' this is, but...

Think about the Catalyst's reactions to Shepard's choices.

1/ Destroy - while disapproving and implying/outright stating that Shepard will die along with EDI and the Geth, the Catalyst doesn't seem to react at all to this choice being made - it just leaves abruptly after the tube is shot.

2/ Control - encourages this as an alternative. Seems to like this option, and 'smiles' if you pick it - even though apperently you'll be replacing it as the commander of the Reapers and then go about ruining their plans by not dealing with the 'problem' anymore.

3/ Synthesis - heavily encourages this as the best solution and really wants you to do this. Picking this not only messes with the Reaper's plans of 'perfecting' everything into a Reaper, but also screws with the Reapers' own 'perfection'.

4/ Refuse - the Catalyst flips the table with annoyance and goes about killing everything again with renewed vigor.

Questions would be:
Why is the Catalyst indifferent to its own destruction and the end of its billions-year old work to 'bring order to chaos'?
Why is the Catalyst happy to be replaced by a being that doesn't share its views and will stop its billions-year old work and infact HELP spread the chaos that it so wanted to end?
Why is the Catalyst highly encouraging of a process that reduces the Reapers' own perfection, and how does this solution end the chaos if essentially the only thing that's changed is that organics now have green lights for eyes?
Why does the Catalyst flip its nut if you won't pick any of these three options that will harm the Reapers to a greater or lesser degree, and in all cases end the Reaper's billions-year old work?

My own answer: because picking Blue or Green means Shepard gives in to the Reapers' will. Destroy merely breaks the indoctrination attempt, and does no harm to the Reapers (hense why Starbinger - yeah, let's call him that again now - doesn't seem bothered when Shepard chooses it). Picking Refuse is a show of defiance that enrages the ego that Starbinger seems to have programmed into its software, an insult to its carefully crafted trap.

I could be wrong, but that's why we have SPECULATIONS FOR EVERYONE!.

[Arian Dynas]

MaximizedAction wrote...

BatmanTurian wrote...

hey guys, i don't know if any of you have seen this but I was looking for ME images and I found this curious image.

It seems someone put Miranda in the place of the Catalyst, gave her its animation and " glow ", and it shows the face the Catalyst makes after Shep chooses Control. Again, pardon me if you guys have seen this already.

*snip*

EDIT: I could be wrong. Not sure.

WOW...just, wow. That's one of the most creative ways of finding evidence I've seen! Well done that-particular-individual.

If we truly want to prove the point however, then we need to replace the model with that of the boy, otherwise we'd get complaints about it just being anyone and thus mutable.

[Andromidius]

Arian Dynas wrote...

If we truly want to prove the point however, then we need to replace the model with that of the boy, otherwise we'd get complaints about it just being anyone and thus mutable.

Yep yep.  100%.

Also, StarMiri is creepy as all heck.