55528 réponses à ce sujet

[Ace7]

hey guys, first time poster, long time lurker and apologies for not staying on topic but I just wanted to pop in here and show my support and appreciation for this thread and everyone involved in it. I've been a staunch believer in IT all along and I think there are many many more like me but who haven't stumbled upon this thread yet. I'm keeping the faith or holding the line as they say and checking this forum everyday for any glimmer of hope that there is more to come in terms of the ending.

While i'm here I might as well get these questions off my chest. Perhaps this has been discussed before but i'm sure you guys will let me know fairly quick .......
There is one particular part near the end that has always bugged me. When shepard collapses he takes the magic elevator to the catalysts pad, when he reaches the top, he gets on his knees and the starchild asks him to "wake up" even though he apparently is already awake. I know it's only a small detail but I can't help thinking there is more to this piece. The recent confirmation of "symbolism" makes me think this even more. What do you guys think or has this been discussed already?

Also, many people have commented on the fact that Harbinger plays little part throughout the whole ME3 campaign. I now feel this was entirely intentional as it would have been kind of weird to have Harby run his mouth off throughout the game only to face the starchild at the end. It looks like they had to make some kind of sacrifice when they shoehorned the starchild into the story.

Anyway, as I said, I give you much love and support for this thread! Peace!

[Starbuck8]

MaximizedAction wrote...

Arian Dynas wrote...

I find it more interesting that they said they gave you the child, a non threatening form, as opposed to having another conversation with a Reaper hologram or Harbinger/Sovereign.

Might as well out and say "Yep, he's a Reaper."

I think there is no other way to interpret the "So be it!", either. He's clearly a Reaper in some way.

Starbuck8 wrote...

*lots of speculations*

Thanks for the answers in written form. Helps a lot for a better analysis.

Yeah I was hoping it would help to have some solid quotes to analyze and speculate on.

And yeah I forgot I was going to comment on that part too. It's becoming more and more clear he's a reaper... and he's in your head!

[MaximizedAction]

Starbuck8 wrote...

Anyway, this was interesting to me because she called them the "reapers' offers". I dunno, the game makes it feel like your choices are the result of the crucible, not the catalyst. But considering them the "reapers' offers", and also considering that according to the writers the catalyst chooses his form, the boy, which is quite manipulative given what they specifically stated he represents, all the people who Shepard couldn't save on earth, I think this is pretty significant for IT.

Not necessarily for IT only, it's an overall sign that Shepard is not seeing clearly. The CC panel Q&A  and the one from the german forum from a few days ago pretty much hint that the Reapers are inside Shepard's head. The Catalyst is clearly using Shep for his interest, while also being a Reaper of some form. So it's only obvious that they are messing with Shep's head. And the gunswap only emphasizes that.

The only difference to IT is, this doesn't necessarily mean that the endings didn't happen. And neither does the real motivation of the Catalyst become in any way clear; i.e. whether that whole Organics vs Synthetics is legit or just bullsh*t.

For players who payed attention throughtout the trilogy, however, it should be only natural to call for bullsh*t. But, the reality is somewhat different, unfortunately. I find that the player community is fighting over something odd, for some reason bashing ITers seems more interesting for most people than discussing the actual facts and clues presented in-game. *insert Javik 'primitives' quote here*

Modifié par MaximizedAction, 20 juillet 2012 - 12:05 .

[elegolas1]

 social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/355/index/13241822

Have you seen? You guys are being petitioned and I'm being banned apparently

Modifié par elegolas1, 20 juillet 2012 - 12:15 .

[Starbuck8]

@MaximizedAction: You're right, well said. Its getting too late to write out my thoughts very coherently. So good night and happy speculating to all!

[CoolioThane]

We have to be wary of acting arrogant mind you.

It's true that whilst we are enjoying speculating, digging through the game and analysing/discussing, reading Arian's awesome IT ending, getting excited with new evidence and putting it through its paces...there are others who are striving to be negative, to put down those who are trying to have fun just because they think they're right and it's bad...you know...even if IT isn't true, I've had the time of my life discussing it with everyone. Thank you.

Though I do truly believe IT to be true

[shepdog77]

elegolas1 wrote...

 social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/355/index/13241822

Have you seen? You guys are being petitioned and I'm being banned apparently

Lol thanks for the support

[Ace7]

It's a weak petition, Chris would have moved it by now if there was a problem with it and I doubt anyone will get banned.

[Raistlin Majare 1992]

shepdog77 wrote...

elegolas1 wrote...

 social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/355/index/13241822

Have you seen? You guys are being petitioned and I'm being banned apparently

Lol thanks for the support

Lets see after more than 4000 posts and 3-4 months with this topic beeing in the Story and Campaign Discussion i doubt they are gonna move it to Fan Creations.

If they felt it belonged there they would have moved it long ago.

[CoolioThane]

elegolas1 wrote...

 social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/355/index/13241822

Have you seen? You guys are being petitioned and I'm being banned apparently

Thanks dude, I always love a good shepdog dumbassery thread

[paxxton]

elegolas1 wrote...

 social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/355/index/13241822

Have you seen? You guys are being petitioned and I'm being banned apparently

I posted a request for explanation there.

[shepdog77]

CoolioThane wrote...

elegolas1 wrote...

 social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/355/index/13241822

Have you seen? You guys are being petitioned and I'm being banned apparently

Thanks dude, I always love a good shepdog dumbassery thread

Reported for personal attack and insult.

[CoolioThane]

shepdog77 wrote...

CoolioThane wrote...

elegolas1 wrote...

 social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/355/index/13241822

Have you seen? You guys are being petitioned and I'm being banned apparently

Thanks dude, I always love a good shepdog dumbassery thread

Reported for personal attack and insult.

Lol, yeah really stuck the knife in there 

They're gonna be bored with all of your reporting. Maybe you should take a little rest? I fear for your health with all this stress!

[Ace7]

well, this has been a rather interesting hour. Shepdog, you need to relax, did you really expect the I.T. thread to take kindly to your petition? It was an attacking motion on your behalf and the people here are rightly offended by your actions

[Arian Dynas]

shepdog77 wrote...

CoolioThane wrote...

elegolas1 wrote...

 social.bioware.com/forum/1/topic/355/index/13241822

Have you seen? You guys are being petitioned and I'm being banned apparently

Thanks dude, I always love a good shepdog dumbassery thread

Reported for personal attack and insult.

Why is it every other post of your I see simply translates to " WAAAAAAAHHHH!" over and over?

[paxxton]

Ace7 wrote...

well, this has been a rather interesting hour. Shepdog, you need to relax, did you really expect the I.T. thread to take kindly to your petition? It was an attacking motion on your behalf and the people here are rightly offended by your actions

He can't do anything to the IT Community because we have the Reapers on our side.

Modifié par paxxton, 20 juillet 2012 - 12:40 .

[CoolioThane]

http://social.biowar.../index/13242318

I like this thread

[Raistlin Majare 1992]

shepdog77 wrote...

Reported for personal attack and insult.

And it was not an attack upon us when you came into this thread and asked why it had not been moved to Fan Creations over 3 months after the creation of the original thread without even posting any reasoning? If Bioware deemed that this thread belonged in fan Creations they would probably have moved it long ago.

Also it dosent belong in Fan Creations in the first place, it belongs right here in Story and Campaign Discussions.

Why? Well look around, every piece of infromation, every interpretation, every little hint comes directly from Bioware and the Mass Effect games. We arent making things up, we are analyzing and discussing what is allready there. Everything in the theory is based upon existing things in the game and thus it is a discussion of the game and not Fan Fiction.

This is only further supported by the fact that Bioware themselves that they have left the game open to interpretation and that some things do have symbolic meaning. Beyond that they ahvent denied It and outrights stated the EC cut would not confrim or deny IT so it is clearly a viable interpretation.

Have a good day.

[Ace7]

 anyway's........I bid you all a good (insert part of day in your region) and hopefully this will resolve itself before people end up getting banned or the thread gets locked. Just in case my early and first post has been lost in the mayhem i am posting a snippet of what I was asking earlier....
"There is one particular part near the end that has always bugged me. When shepard collapses he takes the magic elevator to the catalysts pad, when he reaches the top, he gets on his knees and the starchild asks him to "wake up" even though he apparently is already awake. I know it's only a small detail but I can't help thinking there is more to this piece. The recent confirmation of "symbolism" makes me think this even more. What do you guys think or has this been discussed already?"

[Raistlin Majare 1992]

Ace7 wrote...

 anyway's........I bid you all a good (insert part of day in your region) and hopefully this will resolve itself before people end up getting banned or the thread gets locked. Just in case my early and first post has been lost in the mayhem i am posting a snippet of what I was asking earlier....
"There is one particular part near the end that has always bugged me. When shepard collapses he takes the magic elevator to the catalysts pad, when he reaches the top, he gets on his knees and the starchild asks him to "wake up" even though he apparently is already awake. I know it's only a small detail but I can't help thinking there is more to this piece. The recent confirmation of "symbolism" makes me think this even more. What do you guys think or has this been discussed already?"

I think it was Otter who recently compared this scene to how Shepard falls to his knees before Object Rho in arrival. Certainly an interesting comparision since we know Object Rho Indoctrinated several people and Shepard spends 2 days passed out near it.

[Arian Dynas]

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

shepdog77 wrote...

Reported for personal attack and insult.

And it was not an attack upon us when you came into this thread and asked why it had not been moved to Fan Creations over 3 months after the creation of the original thread without even posting any reasoning? If Bioware deemed that this thread belonged in fan Creations they would probably have moved it long ago.

Also it dosent belong in Fan Creations in the first place, it belongs right here in Story and Campaign Discussions.

Why? Well look around, every piece of infromation, every interpretation, every little hint comes directly from Bioware and the Mass Effect games. We arent making things up, we are analyzing and discussing what is allready there. Everything in the theory is based upon existing things in the game and thus it is a discussion of the game and not Fan Fiction.

This is only further supported by the fact that Bioware themselves that they have left the game open to interpretation and that some things do have symbolic meaning. Beyond that they ahvent denied It and outrights stated the EC cut would not confrim or deny IT so it is clearly a viable interpretation.

Have a good day.

Although there ARE fan creations in it 

But even those are rooted in speculation, theory and are intended more as "Well this is how it COULD be done." than anything else.

[paxxton]

Ace7 wrote...

 anyway's........I bid you all a good (insert part of day in your region) and hopefully this will resolve itself before people end up getting banned or the thread gets locked. Just in case my early and first post has been lost in the mayhem i am posting a snippet of what I was asking earlier....
"There is one particular part near the end that has always bugged me. When shepard collapses he takes the magic elevator to the catalysts pad, when he reaches the top, he gets on his knees and the starchild asks him to "wake up" even though he apparently is already awake. I know it's only a small detail but I can't help thinking there is more to this piece. The recent confirmation of "symbolism" makes me think this even more. What do you guys think or has this been discussed already?"

Maybe what the Catalyst says doesn't come completely from the Reapers. If the Catalyst takes a form of a child from Shepard's memory and uses his voice, somehow Shepard's subconscious tries to shout to the rescue.

Modifié par paxxton, 20 juillet 2012 - 12:52 .

[Leonia]

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

Ace7 wrote...

 anyway's........I bid you all a good (insert part of day in your region) and hopefully this will resolve itself before people end up getting banned or the thread gets locked. Just in case my early and first post has been lost in the mayhem i am posting a snippet of what I was asking earlier....
"There is one particular part near the end that has always bugged me. When shepard collapses he takes the magic elevator to the catalysts pad, when he reaches the top, he gets on his knees and the starchild asks him to "wake up" even though he apparently is already awake. I know it's only a small detail but I can't help thinking there is more to this piece. The recent confirmation of "symbolism" makes me think this even more. What do you guys think or has this been discussed already?"

I think it was Otter who recently compared this scene to how Shepard falls to his knees before Object Rho in arrival. Certainly an interesting comparision since we know Object Rho Indoctrinated several people and Shepard spends 2 days passed out near it.

Heh makes me think of EDI's infamous "I love the sight of humans on their knees" joke. But yeah the comparison to Arrival is hard to ignore. I'm still puzzled about being asked to wake up when clearly Shepard is already awake. Was there ever any audio analysis done of that line?

[Ace7]

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

I think it was Otter who recently compared this scene to how Shepard falls to his knees before Object Rho in arrival. Certainly an interesting comparision since we know Object Rho Indoctrinated several people and Shepard spends 2 days passed out near it.

That is quite a good comparison actually. Im not dismissing that in anyway or anything but I was focussing more so on the "wake up" line. Is there some kind of connection between shepard lying unconscious on the ground having been hit by harbinger and this moment being perhaps the pinnacle of the indoctrination attempt. The catalyst who has now fully engaged Shepards brain (which has been reduced to its weekest state) but has not been able to gain complete control of him having already tried with TIM and is now almost asking shep to 'refocus' or 'wake up' to what is happening and thus attempting indoctrination from a different angle i.e. the three/four choices. 

To me, it's looks like the catalyst is giving shepard back some control in order to force him into using his own free.

Modifié par Ace7, 20 juillet 2012 - 01:10 .

[comrade gando]

Simon_Says wrote...

EpyonX3 wrote...

I can't imagine they'd be hiding this at this point. They've explained away some of the plot holes in the ending, (some, and they were realtively minor ones. The most egregious ones remain) they explained the dreams and the shadows of people (no they haven't. They explained what they represent, they never explained the purpose of that arc and what it finally culminated to in the ending) and they admit that the original plan was to leave the ending open to interpretation (But did they say that it was their plan to leave it that way?). They also state that there's no canon ending. IT would be a canon ending. (Moving forward with the MEverse will require a canon of some sort. Though yes, we can't say if they're going to actually move forward and not back.)

For the endings to be open to interpretation, they have to be taken literally first. Otherwise, you'd have to wonder if the whole series was a dream. (I fail to see the connection of logic here. It makes sense to start examing possible interpretations from a reductionist viewpoint and then noting what was wrong, true. But that's what we did, remember? The literal ending didn't add up logically or thematically, and so we deduce a dream sequence because a dream sequence would.)

Note that I haven't yet had a chance to examine everything Bioware said. I'll get on that now.

well from what I'm getting from the stargazer scene the entire trilogy never really happened (it's a game yeah), it lets you know IN GAME that it was all a story for... starchild??? that makes... no sense.