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[FreddyCast]

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

FreddyCast wrote...

byne wrote...

comrade gando wrote...

FreddyCast wrote...

Hey guys, I know I already mentioned this before, but what do you think the Crucible actually does?
Some have said it is a time machine that pulls past armadas into the present outnumbering the reapers and defeating them, others say it's a combination of an EMP bomb and an indoctrination canceller?
Is there any other idea that you think the Crucible does?
And please don't say it's a Reaper Trap.
Just think for a moment and say that it's not a reaper trap, but a superweapon meant to stop the Reapers. How would the Crucible stop them?

idk what the crucible really is. the problem right now is what bioware says it is right now: a giant magic machine with the ability to alter the laws of physics and reality with little to no explanation. It's flat out bad writing, that's really all there is to it, unless there actually is some deeper meaning to it all, because honestly I don't see bioware screwing up the ending this badly. It's SUSPICIOUSLY bad writing.

BioWare straight up said there wouldnt be a 'Reaper off switch.'

Then they gave us a Reaper off switch.

I mean, that cant even be excused as bad writing. Thats deliberate misinformation. I doubt they'd just straight up lie like that without a purpose.

I know that the whole idea of the Crucible doesn't really make sense. It was thrown at us at the beginning of the game without any hints to it in the last two games, but its completely part of ME 3 now, there's no changing that.
So, no one is going to give it a shot and speculate as to what the Crucible might do?

I got several Ideas, some my own, some from other people in this and the last thread:

First the ideas if the Crucible truly is a weapon and we have yet to see it in action:

Citadel Accelerator Cannon. Basicly the Crucible turns the Citadel into a massive mass acceleretor cannon using its existing fucntion as a mass relay. Using debris and/or Reapers who get to close as ammunition a weapon of that size could easily even the odds in the battle. Also it tie very well into the Accelerator shot which crippled the Derelict Reaper from ME2.

Shield Disable Pulse: A pusle of energy which overloads the Reapers kinetic barriers leaving them vulnerable to the fleets weapons allowing for a chance at victory.

Now if the Crucible is a Trap:

Mass Indoctrination device. Self explanatory.

Reaper Power Source: Tying into the Reapers using the Citadel for making more Reapers, the Crucible could eaily be the battery so to speak they use to activate a new Reaper fully.

Citadel Realy Power Source: An idea for why no one has discovered the Citadel is a Mass Relay. Essentially the Relay part is without much power a, only able to receive the Reapers from dark space, not send them back, minimizing the risk anyone would figure out it is a Relay. An interesting thing on this is that the Citadel dosent have a visible Eezo core unlike the other Relays and it is this purpose the Crucible would fill. As such having the races of the cycle build the Crucible only easens the Reapers work and the vanguard of each cycle disposes of the Crucible.

There are more ideas which i have forgotten, but this is a few of them.

Still though an important thing to remember is that we cannot win by conventional means so the Crucible has to be turned to our advantage somehow or the battle is lost.

The "Citadel Accelerator Cannon" is very interesting.
However, To be honest, in my opinion, to say that the Crucible is just a Reaper trap in whatever form would make the IT pointless, since without it we cannot defeat the Reapers. And yes, yes I know, this is what the the Non-ITers and Bioware wants us to believe, but based on on the ME lore and how long the Reapers have existed and how they produce Reapers, Bioware and the Non-ITers are right, we can't defeat the Reapers. Their numbers are just too great. We need the Crucible. I'm not asking for a "Reaper off-switch", I'm asking for a fighting chance for our Fleet to finish the job they started at Earth. A war should be won by our Fleets.

[Raistlin Majare 1992]

FreddyCast wrote...

The "Citadel Accelerator Cannon" is very interesting.
However, To be honest, in my opinion, to say that the Crucible is just a Reaper trap in whatever form would make the IT pointless, since without it we cannot defeat the Reapers. And yes, yes I know, this is what the the Non-ITers and Bioware wants us to believe, but based on on the ME lore and how long the Reapers have existed and how they produce Reapers, Bioware and the Non-ITers are right, we can't defeat the Reapers. Their numbers are just too great. We need the Crucible. I'm not asking for a "Reaper off-switch", I'm asking for a fighting chance for our Fleet to finish the job they started at Earth. A war should be won by our Fleets.

Exactly.

I did a rough count of the Reaper numbers using a very good shot at Earth from the space battle cinematic. There is at least 150 Sovereign class Reapers at Earth and I can safely say I was not able to see all of the Reapers as some were cut of by the screen edges and others were hidden against the dark backgrounds. This made me give a rough estimate of 175-200 Sovereign class Reapers at Earth.

For comparision the combined fleets of every race, minus the Batarians, had just over 200 Dreadnoughts before the war. We know more than a few Dreadnoughts have been lost during the war.

But that wont really matter either as it takes 3 Dreadnoughts to bring down 1 Sovereign class Reaper. It dosent take a genuis to look at these numbers and realize we are screwed even in the best of circumstances.

We need the Crucible in some way.

Modifié par Raistlin Majare 1992, 22 juillet 2012 - 06:50 .

[FreddyCast]

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

FreddyCast wrote...

The "Citadel Accelerator Cannon" is very interesting.
However, To be honest, in my opinion, to say that the Crucible is just a Reaper trap in whatever form would make the IT pointless, since without it we cannot defeat the Reapers. And yes, yes I know, this is what the the Non-ITers and Bioware wants us to believe, but based on on the ME lore and how long the Reapers have existed and how they produce Reapers, Bioware and the Non-ITers are right, we can't defeat the Reapers. Their numbers are just too great. We need the Crucible. I'm not asking for a "Reaper off-switch", I'm asking for a fighting chance for our Fleet to finish the job they started at Earth. A war should be won by our Fleets.

Exactly.

I did a rough count of the Reaper numbers using a very good shot at Earth from the space battle cinematic. There is at least 150 Sovereign class Reapers at Earth and I can safely say I was not able to see all of the Reapers as some were cut of by the screen edges and others were hidden against the dark backgrounds. This made me give a rough estimate of 175-200 Sovereign class Reapers at Earth.

For comparision the combined fleets of every race, minus the Batarians, had just over 200 Dreadnoughts before the war. We know more than a few Dreadnoughts have been lost during the war.

But that wont really matter either as it takes 3 Dreadnoughts to bring down 1 Sovereign class Reaper. It dosent take a genuis to look at these numbers and realize we are screwed even in the best of circumstances.

We need the Crucible in some way.

I also did my own counts of the Reapers and the Dreadnoughts and I was being VERY conservative for both of them. I calculated that there was AT LEAST 900 Sovereign-class Reapers throughout the Galaxy (this is not even counting those that were in other clusters that didn't make it into ME3) and 140 Dreadnoughts. Even with unconventional means, we would do better in combat, but we would still fail, for the Reaper's REAL strength is not their firepower, but their NUMBERS.

Modifié par FreddyCast, 22 juillet 2012 - 06:59 .

[JasonSic]

KevShep wrote...

byne wrote...

BioWare straight up said there wouldnt be a 'Reaper off switch.'

Then they gave us a Reaper off switch.

I mean, that cant even be excused as bad writing. Thats deliberate misinformation. I doubt they'd just straight up lie like that without a purpose.

This^ was the biggest one for me. The crucible came out of nowhere and at a very convenient time.

Casey also said the ending wasn't A, B, C. That's what we got, so that's not the ending.

[Raistlin Majare 1992]

FreddyCast wrote...

I also did my own counts of the Reapers and the Dreadnoughts and I was being VERY conservative for both of them. I calculated that there was AT LEAST 900 Sovereign-class Reapers throughout the Galaxy (this is not even counting those that were in other clusters that didn't make it into ME3) and 140 Dreadnoughts. Even with unconventional means, we would do better in combat, but we would still fail, for the Reaper's REAL strength is not their firepower, but their NUMBERS.

Well if you believe what Vendetta says the Reapers have concentrated their forces around Earth, but as I pointed out in a massive post a week or so ago Vendetta has more than a few strange circumstances sourrounding it which makes me question how much we can trust it.

What idd like to see actually would be that Earth is simply the turning point in the war. That we defeat the Reapers at Earth with the help of the Crucible and then go on to retake the Council worlds one by one, driving the Reapers out of the Galaxy.

But more than anything I actually want some Reapers to survive. They have harvested the gaalxy for more than a billion years (based on dating of the Leviathan of Dis) and it would be wrong if they were simply completely wiped out in a single cycle. Defeated and forced to retreat, sure, but utterly annihilated, no thanks.

[RavenEyry]

Over night I thought of something else for the 'dream starts earlier' or 'warped perception' ideas, y'know about London looking like Vancouver crossed with Palavan's moon. The red phone boxes. Yes really. Today there are hardly any of those in London, the ones that are there are preserved because tourists expect to see them, yet not one but several survive the reaper invasion. When I saw them the first time I half expected to see a scots guard and a couple of beefeaters among Anderson's soldiers, thinking Bioware had made the same assumptions as tourists. But last night I thought 'has Shepard ever been to London before?'. Probably not, and they're seeing the phone boxes because they expect to see them in London.

[Rosewind]

JasonSic wrote...

KevShep wrote...

byne wrote...

BioWare straight up said there wouldnt be a 'Reaper off switch.'

Then they gave us a Reaper off switch.

I mean, that cant even be excused as bad writing. Thats deliberate misinformation. I doubt they'd just straight up lie like that without a purpose.

This^ was the biggest one for me. The crucible came out of nowhere and at a very convenient time.

Casey also said the ending wasn't A, B, C. That's what we got, so that's not the ending.

I agree how do we know the current endings are really the endings, they always said they weren't going to change the endings maybe there's nothing to change cause we haven't got them yet.

[KevShep]

JasonSic wrote...

KevShep wrote...

byne wrote...

BioWare straight up said there wouldnt be a 'Reaper off switch.'

Then they gave us a Reaper off switch.

I mean, that cant even be excused as bad writing. Thats deliberate misinformation. I doubt they'd just straight up lie like that without a purpose.

This^ was the biggest one for me. The crucible came out of nowhere and at a very convenient time.

Casey also said the ending wasn't A, B, C. That's what we got, so that's not the ending.

Wrong, Its not an A,B,or C ending. Its a Blue,Green,Red ending. Casey was telling the truth

[Rosewind]

RavenEyry wrote...

Over night I thought of something else for the 'dream starts earlier' or 'warped perception' ideas, y'know about London looking like Vancouver crossed with Palavan's moon. The red phone boxes. Yes really. Today there are hardly any of those in London, the ones that are there are preserved because tourists expect to see them, yet not one but several survive the reaper invasion. When I saw them the first time I half expected to see a scots guard and a couple of beefeaters among Anderson's soldiers, thinking Bioware had made the same assumptions as tourists. But last night I thought 'has Shepard ever been to London before?'. Probably not, and they're seeing the phone boxes because they expect to see them in London.

I think the post boxes there were to make people who never been to london more londonish. Personally I never been to London or Vancouver or Rio so they probably did it to recognise it really is London I guess. If that made sense lol

[Raistlin Majare 1992]

Rosewind wrote...

RavenEyry wrote...

Over night I thought of something else for the 'dream starts earlier' or 'warped perception' ideas, y'know about London looking like Vancouver crossed with Palavan's moon. The red phone boxes. Yes really. Today there are hardly any of those in London, the ones that are there are preserved because tourists expect to see them, yet not one but several survive the reaper invasion. When I saw them the first time I half expected to see a scots guard and a couple of beefeaters among Anderson's soldiers, thinking Bioware had made the same assumptions as tourists. But last night I thought 'has Shepard ever been to London before?'. Probably not, and they're seeing the phone boxes because they expect to see them in London.

I think the post boxes there were to make people who never been to london more londonish. Personally I never been to London or Vancouver or Rio so they probably did it to recognise it really is London I guess. If that made sense lol

I woudl argue having Big Ben in the background as you advance to destroy the Hades annon allready established that you were in London.

[RavenEyry]

Rosewind wrote...

I think the post boxes there were to make people who never been to london more londonish. Personally I never been to London or Vancouver or Rio so they probably did it to recognise it really is London I guess. If that made sense lol

Yeah that's what I meant by the alternative. Bioware put them there because they don't know London well. I was just saying, they fit into ideas that London is partially made from Sheps mind too.

[Raistlin Majare 1992]

KevShep wrote...

Wrong, Its not an A,B,or C ending. Its a Blue,Green,Red ending. Casey was telling the truth

Ctr - Alt - Del 

[KevShep]

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

KevShep wrote...

Wrong, Its not an A,B,or C ending. Its a Blue,Green,Red ending. Casey was telling the truth

Ctr - Alt - Del 

Nice! I like that one lol. perfect.

Modifié par KevShep, 22 juillet 2012 - 07:27 .

[Raistlin Majare 1992]

KevShep wrote...

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

KevShep wrote...

Wrong, Its not an A,B,or C ending. Its a Blue,Green,Red ending. Casey was telling the truth

Ctr - Alt - Del 

Nice! I like that one lol. perfect.

Not mine though, but cant remember who first posted it

[RavenEyry]

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

I woudl argue having Big Ben in the background as you advance to destroy the Hades annon allready established that you were in London.

The Westminster Tower [/pedant]

[Rosewind]

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

Rosewind wrote...

RavenEyry wrote...

Over night I thought of something else for the 'dream starts earlier' or 'warped perception' ideas, y'know about London looking like Vancouver crossed with Palavan's moon. The red phone boxes. Yes really. Today there are hardly any of those in London, the ones that are there are preserved because tourists expect to see them, yet not one but several survive the reaper invasion. When I saw them the first time I half expected to see a scots guard and a couple of beefeaters among Anderson's soldiers, thinking Bioware had made the same assumptions as tourists. But last night I thought 'has Shepard ever been to London before?'. Probably not, and they're seeing the phone boxes because they expect to see them in London.

I think the post boxes there were to make people who never been to london more londonish. Personally I never been to London or Vancouver or Rio so they probably did it to recognise it really is London I guess. If that made sense lol

I woudl argue having Big Ben in the background as you advance to destroy the Hades annon allready established that you were in London.

lol Oh shhhh was a vaild point. Still wish there was a blue police box would of laughed anless there is I just haven't noticed.

[RavenEyry]

Rosewind wrote...

lol Oh shhhh was a vaild point. Still wish there was a blue police box would of laughed anless there is I just haven't noticed.

At least modern London actually has red phone boxes, 60's police boxes would've looked even more out of place.

[Raistlin Majare 1992]

Rosewind wrote...

lol Oh shhhh was a vaild point. Still wish there was a blue police box would of laughed anless there is I just haven't noticed.

Yeah, I always keep an eye out for a blue one when I go through the London level. Would just have been win.

[Raistlin Majare 1992]

RavenEyry wrote...

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

I woudl argue having Big Ben in the background as you advance to destroy the Hades annon allready established that you were in London.

The Westminster Tower [/pedant]

Oh right, sorry

[Lyria]

RavenEyry wrote...

Over night I thought of something else for the 'dream starts earlier' or 'warped perception' ideas, y'know about London looking like Vancouver crossed with Palavan's moon. The red phone boxes. Yes really. Today there are hardly any of those in London, the ones that are there are preserved because tourists expect to see them, yet not one but several survive the reaper invasion. When I saw them the first time I half expected to see a scots guard and a couple of beefeaters among Anderson's soldiers, thinking Bioware had made the same assumptions as tourists. But last night I thought 'has Shepard ever been to London before?'. Probably not, and they're seeing the phone boxes because they expect to see them in London.

 
Well to be fair, when I saw the red booths I was half expecting a blue police box to suddenly appear, followed by a dashing fellow saying "Hello, I'm the doctor," which would result in the reaper threat being ended by a sonic screwdriver and timey wimey shenanigans. 

[Raistlin Majare 1992]

RavenEyry wrote...

Rosewind wrote...

lol Oh shhhh was a vaild point. Still wish there was a blue police box would of laughed anless there is I just haven't noticed.

At least modern London actually has red phone boxes, 60's police boxes would've looked even more out of place.

I am pretty sure Rosewind meant for the Doctor Who reference.

[Raistlin Majare 1992]

protognosis wrote...

RavenEyry wrote...

Over night I thought of something else for the 'dream starts earlier' or 'warped perception' ideas, y'know about London looking like Vancouver crossed with Palavan's moon. The red phone boxes. Yes really. Today there are hardly any of those in London, the ones that are there are preserved because tourists expect to see them, yet not one but several survive the reaper invasion. When I saw them the first time I half expected to see a scots guard and a couple of beefeaters among Anderson's soldiers, thinking Bioware had made the same assumptions as tourists. But last night I thought 'has Shepard ever been to London before?'. Probably not, and they're seeing the phone boxes because they expect to see them in London.

 
Well to be fair, when I saw the red booths I was half expecting a blue police box to suddenly appear, followed by a dashing fellow saying "Hello, I'm the doctor," which would result in the reaper threat being ended by a sonic screwdriver and timey wimey shenanigans. 

Would have been a better ending

Still The Doctor and Commander Shepard teaming up...the amount of win in that would be unbelievable.

Modifié par Raistlin Majare 1992, 22 juillet 2012 - 07:37 .

[RavenEyry]

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

I am pretty sure Rosewind meant for the Doctor Who reference.

Obviously, but to me it would've been as silly as the Enterprise appearing in the fleet and destroyed suspension of disbelief more than synthesis.

[FreddyCast]

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

FreddyCast wrote...

I also did my own counts of the Reapers and the Dreadnoughts and I was being VERY conservative for both of them. I calculated that there was AT LEAST 900 Sovereign-class Reapers throughout the Galaxy (this is not even counting those that were in other clusters that didn't make it into ME3) and 140 Dreadnoughts. Even with unconventional means, we would do better in combat, but we would still fail, for the Reaper's REAL strength is not their firepower, but their NUMBERS.

Well if you believe what Vendetta says the Reapers have concentrated their forces around Earth, but as I pointed out in a massive post a week or so ago Vendetta has more than a few strange circumstances sourrounding it which makes me question how much we can trust it.

What idd like to see actually would be that Earth is simply the turning point in the war. That we defeat the Reapers at Earth with the help of the Crucible and then go on to retake the Council worlds one by one, driving the Reapers out of the Galaxy.

But more than anything I actually want some Reapers to survive. They have harvested the gaalxy for more than a billion years (based on dating of the Leviathan of Dis) and it would be wrong if they were simply completely wiped out in a single cycle. Defeated and forced to retreat, sure, but utterly annihilated, no thanks.

I think we can trust Vendetta, it's the Godbrat we can't trust.
And I completely agree with you on the rest, except for the Reapers surviving part. They need to go. They are an abomination, unworthy of living, having absolutely no justification to keep on existing in any form. Three games is long enough. But that's just me. Plus, they're not the type to retreat or give up.

[Rosewind]

Raistlin Majare 1992 wrote...

RavenEyry wrote...

Rosewind wrote...

lol Oh shhhh was a vaild point. Still wish there was a blue police box would of laughed anless there is I just haven't noticed.

At least modern London actually has red phone boxes, 60's police boxes would've looked even more out of place.

I am pretty sure Rosewind meant for the Doctor Who reference.

Aye I did lol