55528 réponses à ce sujet

[Rosewind]

byne wrote...

paxxton wrote...

Rosewind wrote...

paxxton wrote...

lex0r11 wrote...

byne wrote...

Simon_Says wrote...

Byne, the Slayer can teleport through walls.

Interested now?

Not really. Thats nowhere near as awesome as Nova.

But biotic slash destroys everything! The same goes for the electric version of the Shadow.

Also, phase disruptor is the ranged version of nova.
And yes, the Slayer is very mobile.

Biotic Slash is funny cause you can fight through walls with it.

Byne, you are right, Vanguards FTW! There's nothing better than a good ol' Biotic Charge followed by Novas. + Shockwave.

Antil they bug you out so much you can not play ><

Yeah, it happened to me once. I was suspended in the air just before extraction. Swarms of Cerberus troopers were killing me over and over again. But I finally made it.

That only happens if you arent host. Thats why I only ever play vanguard when I'm the host.

Really? good to know! Because I know what causes it to stuff up to begin with.

Modifié par Rosewind, 23 juillet 2012 - 02:18 .

[Rosewind]

Simon_Says wrote...

By the way. Interesting pseduo-literalist idea that asks an important question: What did the protheans add to the Crucible design?

Interesting, I thought they added the citadel into the design....

Modifié par Rosewind, 23 juillet 2012 - 02:17 .

[Lokanaiya]

Rosewind wrote...

Simon_Says wrote...

By the way. Interesting pseduo-literalist idea that asks an important question: What did the protheans add to the Crucible design?

Interesting, I thought they added the citadel into the design....

The Citadel was the first thing they lost when the Reapers invaded, so they probably wouldn't have added something they and, as far they knew other cycles, wouldn't have access to.

Modifié par Lokanaiya, 23 juillet 2012 - 02:34 .

[Simon_Says]

And it was stated that the Citadel was incorporated into the design before the prothean cycle I believe.

[Simon_Says]

SwobyJ wrote...

Agreed BleedingUranium. The Crucible would then, quite literally, be the 'test' for the 'test tube of the Reapers'... known as the galaxy. The cycles are there for Reaper reproduction, sure, but the endgame is that they (or rather Harbinger and/or the creator race) are waiting for a cycle to successfully make the Crucible.

Higher EMS also means a better Crucible.
It also means a more prepared and capable cycle.
And thusly, higher EMS means you're a cycle worth 'preserving', to the Reapers.

If the Crucible is an indoctrination device, then it makes sense. With complete and total indoctrination of the current cycle, things can be set up so that the Reapers can harvest them, over millenia, without resistance. No need to wipe the galaxy clean. No need to micromanage the scenario so that a cycle doesn't arrive that would have the tools to resist.

It's essentially a 'perfect crop'.

With low-EMS, Catalyst couldn't give a crap. You're not worthy of Synthesis, and sometimes not even worthy of being under the illusion of controlling the Reapers (aka becoming a Reaper yourself ROFLREAPERTROLLROFL). "Let him have his illusion of destroying the Reapers. It matters not. He is useless" -Harbinger, potentially.

It's not neccesary for the Crucible itself to be an indoctrination device. Even if the reapers indoctrinate Shepard only they can end the war. Come up with a story of how Shepard blah-blah-blah- Shepard ended the war, becomes a hero, and the reapers get to be a tolerated presence in galactic affairs for a few centuries while they get to work reaping the council cycle without resistance.

And reject borks that idea. Shepard isn't indoctrinated, reapers aren't destroyed, council cycle falls but not without taking a few reapers along with them. Hence the anger.

SwobyJ wrote...

Also agreed smokingotter1. We're cracked the case, maybe

It's quite possible that what is happening in the Crucible, is still happening, IN A WAY, not in a dream. That there is still a Crucible scenario, but it is a lot less....mystical in 'reality'. No ghost child. No red, blue, and green. THIS is all in Shepard's mind.

It could also fit the idea that Shepard has been in some tiny tiny form of indoctrination since the Lazarus Project.
Most of ME2 = Very very very tiny influence, only doing things like allowing Shepard to rationalize working with Cerberus, etc. Very innocent, and Shepard's reasoning is still 99% sound.

Arrival = The trigger point, even if you forget about the Lazarus Project as it could be wrong. Arrival is direct and continuous exposure to Reaper artifact, weakening Shepard's apparent 'immunity' to indoctrination. It also opens him up to mental warfare, starting with slight mental fatigue and ....the Earth child.

Thessia = The next trigger, it being the effect of defeat on Shepard's mind. The pinhole in his mind is now a door, left only slightly ajar. Everything after Thessia is suspect - happening yet not happening. The Cerberus Base stuff almost certainly happened, but certain aspects of it (like architecture etc stuff noted by IT theorists) may be important or changed as we get more single player DLC (like Leviathan) that could illuminate some things.

Earth = We're now not in the dream, but in a partial sleepwalk. Everything IS happening, but the door ajar has now become an open door, and plenty of things are 'not right', as Vega would say. Earth is where things get quite serious, as Shepard is now NOW the mentally competent person he was even prior to this and especially Thessia.

Citadel = The door is now an open gate. Shepard is there, so is Anderson, and TIM, but you cannot trust ANYTHING at this point. It is ALL a 'version' of events, and you might even be in a Reaper-facility for all we know, surrounded by Reaper tech without even realizing it. Shepard is STILL strong here, however, and able to stop TIM. You're all suffering however, which is why Anderson can be paralyzed by something you never would think is possible (Reaper tech does this? Um...), etc. You're ALL under indoctrination, except Anderson is most capable of resisting it.

Crucible = The open gate is now ...well, there's nothing now. It's pure indoctrination flowing into your/Shepard's mind. This is the test. Do you succumb, even partially? (Control would be 'partially' depending on EMS, IMO), or do you retain your will and end the Reapers once and for all?

Good analysis. Should work the reapers' invasion of Earth into there as well. After all it is the point where Shepard interacts with the child (real or not) who huants their dreams, which starts the process of buttering up Shepard for the mind screws to follow.

Modifié par Simon_Says, 23 juillet 2012 - 02:39 .

[smokingotter1]

Interesting observation I made taking notes, in both refuse and destroy ending the conduit beam stops or dries up. I don't know why.

I have some ideas: conduit beam is representative of the indoctrination signal.

Overlay hypothesis: reapers were hoping Shepard would gun for the beam to either kill/indoctrinate him. Shepard is only allowed close to the beam if he opens his mind to indoctrination. Since he does not in refuse or destroy they turn off the beam so no one makes it to the citadel just in case.Explains why the breathe scene he's on earth yet you don't see light from the conduit beam.

[Simon_Says]

Or the beam itself is a sign of the indoctrination beacon's operation. Like the thin pillars of light coming off the prothean beacons in ME1.

[Nightingale]

It's worth noting (and I'm sure I'm not the only one who has said this) that Synthesis is portrayed as the "obvious" choice in more than what the "Catalyst" says: it's the middle option. Control and Destroy have paths opened to them but Synthesis is straight ahead. All you have to do is walk up to it. Control you have to actually click it to take hold of the controls, Destroy you have to shoot. Synthesis activates without any input from the player.

[Arian Dynas]

byne wrote...

estebanus wrote...

byne wrote...

estebanus wrote...

Page 2077... World war III starts...

Also Liara is born.

Coincidence? I think not!

The Fallout universe realized it would never have Liara and annihilated themselves.

No, they realized they would never invent videogames or compelling television. 

[Arian Dynas]

estebanus wrote...

Well, I'm off to play some Fallout: New Vegas. See you guys later!

 

Hey, me too! :happy:

[TheConstantOne]

lex0r11 wrote...

So people have been reading some of my posts! Or at least have the same ideas..

Shrouded view of the kill switch, partially influenced from the outside (option of destroy?) still perceived by Shepard because part of the mind is still free and working.

Shepard waking up in that "decision chamber" is in reality him/her waking up in front of the console again he/she couldn't reach after the radio message. Reapers see the need to intervene with the Catalyst Show and have to speed up the process, thus making it less effective (indoctrination is more effective when done slowly). They can't control the whole illusion, so the mindgame has to work in restricted conditions. Playing along with Shepard's free mind that is still remaining, they build in other choices to make it seem they belong like this.

Again, they can't make the meaning of destroy disappear because of the "mind fight" still going but they can tamper with it and sell it as the worst possible choice. This build on the concept of destroy being the only way to completely break indoctrination would put Paragons in a dilemma (synthetic mass murder and all). But according to the overall idea of IT this is not about paragons choosing blue and renegades choosing red but to fight indoctrination, therefore no forced color that doesn't match someones alignment or even a final decision that doesn't matter. So maybe people who decide to go with synthesis or control just need enough EMS to pull it off. Then we break free and have the final decision this whole trilogy has been about.
Hit the fking kill switch and end the reapers.

edit.
Of course with the EC, the whole 'which decision" is right debate is irrelevant now, with refusal being the path to build on. I forgot again, duh.


Oh, on a sidenote. I already adressed this a little in the past and maybe someone already posted something like this in all those 4000+ pages and I just didn't notice. If so, just ignore it and make fun of me.

I agree completely with the Crucible chamber taking part in front of the control pnael "in reality."  The elevator that pops out of nowhere is when Shepard is entering the dream.

From an IT point of view, Shepard would wake up after making his choice.  The console would be primed to do *something* based on what Shepard just chose in his dream.  Let's assume for a moment that the explosive or deadly moments involved with each choice are what jars Shepard into consciousness.  I am fond of epic boss fights (that doesn't mean the enemy has to be a large, imposing menace like the human proto-reaper; the combatant itself could be emotionally engaging.)  With this thought in mind... the Reapers want to stop Shepard from activating the Crucible weapon and pull their last trump card: either an indoctrinated Illusive Man OR an indoctrinated Anderson.

An indoc'ed TIM would be akin to the Saren fight and would occur if Shepard chooses destroy.  If Shepard chooses control, Anderson could be revealed to not have died and wakes up to stop a clearly indoctrinated Shepard.  Just imagine the emotions that could be thrown into such a fight.... neither of these fights could be done with normal game mechanics as Shepard is definitely wounded.  It would be an emotionally engaging melee.  The TIM vs Shepard match I'd imagine proceeding just like the nearly beaten Neo vs Smith in the Matrix Revolutions.

TIM/Harbinger: "Shepard, why do you persist."
Shepard: "Because I choose to."

If Anderson was saved, he could wake up and land a surprise blow on TIM, allowing Shepard to kill him and activate the console.

Synthesis could involve Shepard reprogramming the Crucible to adversely affect organics, as the Crucible device has an extraordinary amount of resources.

I know that this is all speculation but if Bioware embraces the IT route someday...an Anderson vs Shep or Harbinger/TIM vs Shep are two things I'd really like to see

Edit: I know that the rubble in the breath scene has to be addressed; this is just a brainstorm of "what might happen after" any kind of indoctrination sequence

Modifié par TheConstantOne, 23 juillet 2012 - 03:16 .

[smokingotter1]

You know what would be hilarious? If the conduit turned out just to be a giant version of this: 


*zap*

[Nightingale]

smokingotter1 wrote...

You know what would be hilarious? If the conduit turned out just to be a giant version of this: 


*zap*

...That would explain the sound when Shepard first gets up after going up the beam

[Simon_Says]

It could be that.

Or it could be that the London Beam is the troublesome organics  zapper.

In completely unrelated news, I don't know if this has been linked yet.

Modifié par Simon_Says, 23 juillet 2012 - 03:44 .

[masster blaster]

So what's new, and did I miss a troll storm, or did they actually sided with us with the Harbinger saying something. And the Catalsyt bull s***.

I think CoolioThane's post on the BSN, and the comparesencs to the hints and winks that Bioware is giving people. Were out standing.

Also I had a felling that Bioware was trying to go with IT, but to many people believed IT, and to many people were angry at the endings, so they created the EC, to clam everyone down, and make IT stop growing a bit, so they can continue their plans.

[smokingotter1]

masster blaster wrote...

So what's new, and did I miss a troll storm, or did they actually sided with us with the Harbinger saying something. And the Catalsyt bull s***.

I think CoolioThane's post on the BSN, and the comparesencs to the hints and winks that Bioware is giving people. Were out standing.

Also I had a felling that Bioware was trying to go with IT, but to many people believed IT, and to many people were angry at the endings, so they created the EC, to clam everyone down, and make IT stop growing a bit, so they can continue their plans.

Go back a couple of pages, I baked some speculation cookies for everyone. Have a bite.

[masster blaster]

Otter I read them, but I am on my phone right now. I have family over so can't use the Computer, or everyone will want to use it.

[masster blaster]

Also I think you got the train with Control spot on, and don't forget in Control there are four handels not two. Two on top two on the bottem.

[FifthBeatle]

I don't know when the last time some of you played Arrival, but there is a funny line when talking to Dr. Kenson on board the shuttle after you rescue her. If you ask her about Object Rho and the fact that it could indoctrinate her and everyone else she says "I'm not a child." I'm sure its just coincidence that she says that, but BW had to have already known they were going with the starchild by the time they wrote Arrival, no? Not sure how IT related this is, but I had a small chuckle.

[Simon_Says]

By the way, Otter, it wasn't Fischer's militarized psyche that produced that freight train. It was Cobb's projection of Mal who did that. I know that's not what you said, just from the source, but still.

Also, might be a good idea to slap quotes on something your source. While I think the connection is tennuous and so is the connection to the Crucible play, I'm interested to see where you go with them.

Modifié par Simon_Says, 23 juillet 2012 - 03:58 .

[smokingotter1]

It's getting late and I'm running out of steam. Grasping at straws mode engaged: notice those two sentences you get in the end message:

"Congratulations on bringing an end to the reaper threat. Commander Shepard has become a legend."

It doesn't say: "Commander Shepard has ended the reaper threat." It only says he became a legend. Who ended the reaper threat? Who activated the crucible if it was all a hallucination?

Stay tuned for another episode of: Speculate that Ending!

[smokingotter1]

Simon_Says wrote...

By the way, Otter, it wasn't Fischer's militarized psyche that produced that freight train. It was Cobb's projection of Mal who did that.

I applaud you. I really need to see that movie again, I got lost in a few parts and uh... yeah... It think I might have to make one of these for the ending now *shudders*


dat complexity. Source

Sidenote: Harbinger's beam might be the "kick" for Shepard

Modifié par smokingotter1, 23 juillet 2012 - 04:06 .

[masster blaster]

If you have seen TDKR, then it's possible Bioware can do that, and that's what I see the comparisans from some movies and games into the ME3 endings.

[BansheeOwnage]

DrTsoni wrote...

It's worth noting (and I'm sure I'm not the only one who has said this) that Synthesis is portrayed as the "obvious" choice in more than what the "Catalyst" says: it's the middle option. Control and Destroy have paths opened to them but Synthesis is straight ahead. All you have to do is walk up to it. Control you have to actually click it to take hold of the controls, Destroy you have to shoot. Synthesis activates without any input from the player.

Hey DrTsoni, haven't seen you in a while! Yes, it is portrayed as the obvious option. It makes sense in an IT sense or a literal sense. Subtle manipulation. Shepard is weak at this point in both senses. It makes sense to present it as the easy option.