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Was the Ending a Hallucination? - Indoctrination Theory Mark II!

Débuté par byne , mai 14 2012 05:06

55528 réponses à ce sujet

#53901
Guest_SwobyJ_*
Posté 27 juillet 2012 - 02:20

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FFZero wrote...

magnetite wrote...

So I extracted the Extended Cut audio files and found something rather interesting. Catalyst states, if you do not act, you will be forced to accept our dominion. I've played every extended ending, and I don't recall him saying that. Then again, there are audio files within the game that are not actually in the game. They're on the disk so to speak, but Bioware didn't actually include them when you play the game. There is no talk about the Citadel being some sort of trap or anything. Plus many more unused lines.


Unused lines aren’t unusual and a lot of us have speculated that Bioware are going to add to the endings through DLC, so those lines may end up being added at a later date.



That IS interesting. If they do plan on using these lines, I'd imagine that to be said once you force the 'Catalyst's' hand with proof you've acquired over the span of 1 or more DLCs.

#53902
Guest_magnetite_*
Posté 27 juillet 2012 - 02:22

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Wouldn't that ****** a lot of people off though? I mean people are already foaming at the mouth over what happened initially. I'm actually compiling a file that consists of some of the unused lines which may contribute to IT in some way. Least when I heard them they might have.

I'd imagine that to be said once you force the 'Catalyst's' hand with proof you've acquired over the span of 1 or more DLCs.


What he said sounds like a hint at IT. I'm sure everyone here knows what a dominion is. Absolute power and control over something. Enslavement ring any bells?

Modifié par magnetite, 27 juillet 2012 - 02:28 .

#53903
munnellyladt
Posté 27 juillet 2012 - 02:23

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Is it just me or can you hear faint whispers in the decision chamber?

#53904
Urdnot Amenark
Posté 27 juillet 2012 - 02:32

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munnellyladt wrote...

Is it just me or can you hear faint whispers in the decision chamber?


Haha I haven't heard any whispers in there. I might need to adjust my auditory enhancement apparatus though. 

#53905
Guest_SwobyJ_*
Posté 27 juillet 2012 - 02:33

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magnetite wrote...

Wouldn't that ****** a lot of people off though? I mean people are already foaming at the mouth over what happened initially. I'm actually compiling a file that consists of some of the unused lines which may contribute to IT in some way. Least when I heard them they might have.

I'd imagine that to be said once you force the 'Catalyst's' hand with proof you've acquired over the span of 1 or more DLCs.


What he said sounds like a hint at IT. I'm sure everyone here knows what a dominion is. Absolute power and control over something. Enslavement ring any bells?


Yeah, but I don't think BiEAware will care all too much. Things seem, to me, deliberately engineered so that players still have 'complete' endings without any further DLC.

This is especially true with the Extended Cut. Bioware can easily say "I thought you liked the closure we provided Shepard and the galaxy with the Extended Cut? What do you mean you didn't? This is just a version of the story, optional with DLC."

#53906
Guest_SwobyJ_*
Posté 27 juillet 2012 - 02:35

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But mark my words, if DLC confirms IT and elaborates on things in a big way, the VAST MAJORITY of Mass Effect players WILL buy AND play it. It'll be the ESSENTIAL DLC that will come with 'Complete Edition' copies of the game later on.

Some will complain about how moneygrubbing Bioware is being with it, and others will complain about Internet connection etc, but they will be a fast minority, and the rest of gamers and BSN etc will just say "Don't like it, don't buy it.".

#53907
munnellyladt
Posté 27 juillet 2012 - 02:35

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Urdnot Amenark wrote...

munnellyladt wrote...

Is it just me or can you hear faint whispers in the decision chamber?


Haha I haven't heard any whispers in there. I might need to adjust my auditory enhancement apparatus though. 


I don't know but i could hav sworen i heard whispers under that music when you choose.

#53908
Urdnot Amenark
Posté 27 juillet 2012 - 02:38

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munnellyladt wrote...

Urdnot Amenark wrote...

munnellyladt wrote...

Is it just me or can you hear faint whispers in the decision chamber?


Haha I haven't heard any whispers in there. I might need to adjust my auditory enhancement apparatus though. 


I don't know but i could hav sworen i heard whispers under that music when you choose.


It's probably just atmospheric effects to emphasize the mood.

#53909
Arian Dynas
Posté 27 juillet 2012 - 02:42

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SwobyJ wrote...

SubAstris wrote...

A lot of productive talk on IT here... Have the "clues" dried up?


Actually, yes, pretty much.

The majority of 'clues' are simply speculative parts of the game. Nothing is an absolute proof (duh) and at this point, it is all searching for little stuff in the game files and discussion of symbolic material in the series and ending.

And I don't think Leviathan will actually prove anything. The best it can do for ITers is REALLY boost up the legitimacy of their theory. I personally go with the idea that if Bioware intends on indoctrination (and maybe more) to be a part of the story, they'll stretch out the true (as in, much more substantial) clues for it over their entire DLC timeline in 2012 and 2013, in time to announce whatever new project they have.


Don't do it. Don't make me quote my Bioware business plan theory...

#53910
BansheeOwnage
Posté 27 juillet 2012 - 02:44

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Since we seem to be in a speculating mood again right now, I'll post one of my own findings.
 
Old news: For a while there was much confusion about why certain squadmates exited the Normandy on the Jungle planet. We found out it was because they were the 2 squadmates you took on the fewest missions. This fits with IT because Shepard would naturally care about them more than others and would imagine seeing them okay.

News: I haven't seen this posted yet so here it goes: I figured out the reason why 1 certain squadmate will tell Joker to leave. The reason is...

[Drumroll]

They are the squadmate you took on missions the least.

Evidence: I put this together while playing MP with BleedingUranium and CoolioThane. They confirmed my suspicions. In my playthrough it was James. I took James almost nowhere. In BLUR's playthrough, it was Ashley (same reason). In CoolioThane's playthrough he said it was Garrus and had purposely not taken Garrus many places that playthrough.
Amazing right? And it fits with IT! Posted Image Shepard sees the person she cares least about (at least in my case) tell Joker he should leave her behind.

#53911
ill_eyggro
Posté 27 juillet 2012 - 02:45

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FFZero wrote...


Unused lines aren’t unusual and a lot of us have speculated that Bioware are going to add to the endings through DLC, so those lines may end up being added at a later date.




I finished the game today, watched the EC endings (not bad) and then search for the originals on youtube. Then I landed here, and found out other things like the trees, the oily shapes and the color of your choices at the end, that adds to others that I already think that questions the intended narrative of the game.
All ME2's DLC makes sense, even if you finished the game (except for Overlord maybe) but with Mass Effect 3 it's seems that it's not the case. Now that I know about this theory, I only wish it takes form beyond our imagination, and we could play it at least as a DLC

#53912
byne
Posté 27 juillet 2012 - 02:47

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BansheeOwnage wrote...

Since we seem to be in a speculating mood again right now, I'll post one of my own findings.
 
Old news: For a while there was much confusion about why certain squadmates exited the Normandy on the Jungle planet. We found out it was because they were the 2 squadmates you took on the fewest missions. This fits with IT because Shepard would naturally care about them more than others and would imagine seeing them okay.

News: I haven't seen this posted yet so here it goes: I figured out the reason why 1 certain squadmate will tell Joker to leave. The reason is...

[Drumroll]

They are the squadmate you took on missions the least.

Evidence: I put this together while playing MP with BleedingUranium and CoolioThane. They confirmed my suspicions. In my playthrough it was James. I took James almost nowhere. In BLUR's playthrough, it was Ashley (same reason). In CoolioThane's playthrough he said it was Garrus and had purposely not taken Garrus many places that playthrough.
Amazing right? And it fits with IT! Posted Image Shepard sees the person she cares least about (at least in my case) tell Joker he should leave her behind.

 
But in my first EC playthrough it was Liara, and not only did I take her everywhere, she's my LI.

I think Shep might care about her a little bit.

#53913
BansheeOwnage
Posté 27 juillet 2012 - 02:48

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magnetite wrote...
*snip*
What he said sounds like a hint at IT. I'm sure everyone here knows what a dominion is. Absolute power and control over something. Enslavement ring any bells?

Dominion:
1. Sovereignty; control
2. The territory of a sovereign or government

Huh. Posted Image

#53914
byne
Posté 27 juillet 2012 - 02:50

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BansheeOwnage wrote...

magnetite wrote...
*snip*
What he said sounds like a hint at IT. I'm sure everyone here knows what a dominion is. Absolute power and control over something. Enslavement ring any bells?

Dominion:
1. Sovereignty; control
2. The territory of a sovereign or government

Huh. Posted Image


That fits my idea that if the godchild is real, its actually Sovereign's mind uploaded into the Citadel after his destruction in ME1.

Yeah, even in my literalist interpetation of the endings, I dont trust godchild for a second.

#53915
BansheeOwnage
Posté 27 juillet 2012 - 02:51

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byne wrote...

BansheeOwnage wrote...

Since we seem to be in a speculating mood again right now, I'll post one of my own findings.
 
Old news: For a while there was much confusion about why certain squadmates exited the Normandy on the Jungle planet. We found out it was because they were the 2 squadmates you took on the fewest missions. This fits with IT because Shepard would naturally care about them more than others and would imagine seeing them okay.

News: I haven't seen this posted yet so here it goes: I figured out the reason why 1 certain squadmate will tell Joker to leave. The reason is...

[Drumroll]

They are the squadmate you took on missions the least.

Evidence: I put this together while playing MP with BleedingUranium and CoolioThane. They confirmed my suspicions. In my playthrough it was James. I took James almost nowhere. In BLUR's playthrough, it was Ashley (same reason). In CoolioThane's playthrough he said it was Garrus and had purposely not taken Garrus many places that playthrough.
Amazing right? And it fits with IT! Posted Image Shepard sees the person she cares least about (at least in my case) tell Joker he should leave her behind.

 
But in my first EC playthrough it was Liara, and not only did I take her everywhere, she's my LI.

I think Shep might care about her a little bit.



Should of figured it wouldn't last long. Oh well. Posted Image

#53916
Guest_magnetite_*
Posté 27 juillet 2012 - 02:52

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Don't forget absolute ownership of something.

#53917
byne
Posté 27 juillet 2012 - 02:52

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BansheeOwnage wrote...

byne wrote...

BansheeOwnage wrote...

Since we seem to be in a speculating mood again right now, I'll post one of my own findings.
 
Old news: For a while there was much confusion about why certain squadmates exited the Normandy on the Jungle planet. We found out it was because they were the 2 squadmates you took on the fewest missions. This fits with IT because Shepard would naturally care about them more than others and would imagine seeing them okay.

News: I haven't seen this posted yet so here it goes: I figured out the reason why 1 certain squadmate will tell Joker to leave. The reason is...

[Drumroll]

They are the squadmate you took on missions the least.

Evidence: I put this together while playing MP with BleedingUranium and CoolioThane. They confirmed my suspicions. In my playthrough it was James. I took James almost nowhere. In BLUR's playthrough, it was Ashley (same reason). In CoolioThane's playthrough he said it was Garrus and had purposely not taken Garrus many places that playthrough.
Amazing right? And it fits with IT! Posted Image Shepard sees the person she cares least about (at least in my case) tell Joker he should leave her behind.

 
But in my first EC playthrough it was Liara, and not only did I take her everywhere, she's my LI.

I think Shep might care about her a little bit.



Should of figured it wouldn't last long. Oh well. Posted Image


Well, Liara was with me on the beam run, so she shouldnt be the one who tells Joker to leave this time. I'll let you know who it was in a few minutes.

#53918
Either.Ardrey
Posté 27 juillet 2012 - 02:53

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BansheeOwnage wrote...

Since we seem to be in a speculating mood again right now, I'll post one of my own findings.
 
Old news: For a while there was much confusion about why certain squadmates exited the Normandy on the Jungle planet. We found out it was because they were the 2 squadmates you took on the fewest missions. This fits with IT because Shepard would naturally care about them more than others and would imagine seeing them okay.

News: I haven't seen this posted yet so here it goes: I figured out the reason why 1 certain squadmate will tell Joker to leave. The reason is...

[Drumroll]

They are the squadmate you took on missions the least.

Evidence: I put this together while playing MP with BleedingUranium and CoolioThane. They confirmed my suspicions. In my playthrough it was James. I took James almost nowhere. In BLUR's playthrough, it was Ashley (same reason). In CoolioThane's playthrough he said it was Garrus and had purposely not taken Garrus many places that playthrough.
Amazing right? And it fits with IT! Posted Image Shepard sees the person she cares least about (at least in my case) tell Joker he should leave her behind.

What happens if I took everyone the least, save for 2? So far I've been picking two squadmates and sticking with them the whole available game. That way it's easier to encounter everyone's lines in each mission over multiple playthroughs. And Garrus did it on one of mine, and he wasn't the lowest.

#53919
BansheeOwnage
Posté 27 juillet 2012 - 02:55

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Either.Ardrey wrote...

BansheeOwnage wrote...

Since we seem to be in a speculating mood again right now, I'll post one of my own findings.
 
Old news: For a while there was much confusion about why certain squadmates exited the Normandy on the Jungle planet. We found out it was because they were the 2 squadmates you took on the fewest missions. This fits with IT because Shepard would naturally care about them more than others and would imagine seeing them okay.

News: I haven't seen this posted yet so here it goes: I figured out the reason why 1 certain squadmate will tell Joker to leave. The reason is...

[Drumroll]

They are the squadmate you took on missions the least.

Evidence: I put this together while playing MP with BleedingUranium and CoolioThane. They confirmed my suspicions. In my playthrough it was James. I took James almost nowhere. In BLUR's playthrough, it was Ashley (same reason). In CoolioThane's playthrough he said it was Garrus and had purposely not taken Garrus many places that playthrough.
Amazing right? And it fits with IT! Posted Image Shepard sees the person she cares least about (at least in my case) tell Joker he should leave her behind.

What happens if I took everyone the least, save for 2? So far I've been picking two squadmates and sticking with them the whole available game. That way it's easier to encounter everyone's lines in each mission over multiple playthroughs. And Garrus did it on one of mine, and he wasn't the lowest.

Apparently it is disproven. Oh well. But we still need to figure out if it is just random (why?) or if there is a reason we don't know about.

#53920
Rosewind
Posté 27 juillet 2012 - 02:55

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Arian Dynas wrote...

SwobyJ wrote...

SubAstris wrote...

A lot of productive talk on IT here... Have the "clues" dried up?


Actually, yes, pretty much.

The majority of 'clues' are simply speculative parts of the game. Nothing is an absolute proof (duh) and at this point, it is all searching for little stuff in the game files and discussion of symbolic material in the series and ending.

And I don't think Leviathan will actually prove anything. The best it can do for ITers is REALLY boost up the legitimacy of their theory. I personally go with the idea that if Bioware intends on indoctrination (and maybe more) to be a part of the story, they'll stretch out the true (as in, much more substantial) clues for it over their entire DLC timeline in 2012 and 2013, in time to announce whatever new project they have.


Don't do it. Don't make me quote my Bioware business plan theory...


I will cry if you do....

#53921
Guest_SwobyJ_*
Posté 27 juillet 2012 - 02:57

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byne wrote...

BansheeOwnage wrote...

magnetite wrote...
*snip*
What he said sounds like a hint at IT. I'm sure everyone here knows what a dominion is. Absolute power and control over something. Enslavement ring any bells?

Dominion:
1. Sovereignty; control
2. The territory of a sovereign or government

Huh. Posted Image


That fits my idea that if the godchild is real, its actually Sovereign's mind uploaded into the Citadel after his destruction in ME1.

Yeah, even in my literalist interpetation of the endings, I dont trust godchild for a second.


Ew that's creepy.

At least it would allow people to meet their favorite Reaper again.

youtu.be/FOIzZ6s-GTQ

.... youtu.be/gR3PnpEI2u0 (watch until a few minutes after my mark - everything about the cycle)

Sovvy... what if he is actually still the leader of the Reapers? The controller? :o omg :o

Modifié par SwobyJ, 27 juillet 2012 - 02:59 .

#53922
Lokanaiya
Posté 27 juillet 2012 - 02:57

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BansheeOwnage wrote...

Since we seem to be in a speculating mood again right now, I'll post one of my own findings.
 
Old news: For a while there was much confusion about why certain squadmates exited the Normandy on the Jungle planet. We found out it was because they were the 2 squadmates you took on the fewest missions. This fits with IT because Shepard would naturally care about them more than others and would imagine seeing them okay.

News: I haven't seen this posted yet so here it goes: I figured out the reason why 1 certain squadmate will tell Joker to leave. The reason is...

[Drumroll]

They are the squadmate you took on missions the least.

Evidence: I put this together while playing MP with BleedingUranium and CoolioThane. They confirmed my suspicions. In my playthrough it was James. I took James almost nowhere. In BLUR's playthrough, it was Ashley (same reason). In CoolioThane's playthrough he said it was Garrus and had purposely not taken Garrus many places that playthrough.
Amazing right? And it fits with IT! Posted Image Shepard sees the person she cares least about (at least in my case) tell Joker he should leave her behind.


Actually, who exits on the jungle planet is related to the relationship level. That's why your LI always exits first. Garrus is my LI, I took him on every mission possible, and he exited the Normandy first. Though the second person was Javik, who was in my squad for some missions, but far less than Liara, and quite a few more than EDI. Not sure why he came out, to be honest.

#53923
Rosewind
Posté 27 juillet 2012 - 02:58

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BansheeOwnage wrote...

Either.Ardrey wrote...

BansheeOwnage wrote...

Since we seem to be in a speculating mood again right now, I'll post one of my own findings.
 
Old news: For a while there was much confusion about why certain squadmates exited the Normandy on the Jungle planet. We found out it was because they were the 2 squadmates you took on the fewest missions. This fits with IT because Shepard would naturally care about them more than others and would imagine seeing them okay.

News: I haven't seen this posted yet so here it goes: I figured out the reason why 1 certain squadmate will tell Joker to leave. The reason is...

[Drumroll]

They are the squadmate you took on missions the least.

Evidence: I put this together while playing MP with BleedingUranium and CoolioThane. They confirmed my suspicions. In my playthrough it was James. I took James almost nowhere. In BLUR's playthrough, it was Ashley (same reason). In CoolioThane's playthrough he said it was Garrus and had purposely not taken Garrus many places that playthrough.
Amazing right? And it fits with IT! Posted Image Shepard sees the person she cares least about (at least in my case) tell Joker he should leave her behind.

What happens if I took everyone the least, save for 2? So far I've been picking two squadmates and sticking with them the whole available game. That way it's easier to encounter everyone's lines in each mission over multiple playthroughs. And Garrus did it on one of mine, and he wasn't the lowest.

Apparently it is disproven. Oh well. But we still need to figure out if it is just random (why?) or if there is a reason we don't know about.


But how come I always get Jarvik and I never taken him anywhere i admit I do always talk to him on the Normandy though

#53924
Rosewind
Posté 27 juillet 2012 - 03:00

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SwobyJ wrote...

byne wrote...

BansheeOwnage wrote...

magnetite wrote...
*snip*
What he said sounds like a hint at IT. I'm sure everyone here knows what a dominion is. Absolute power and control over something. Enslavement ring any bells?

Dominion:
1. Sovereignty; control
2. The territory of a sovereign or government

Huh. Posted Image


That fits my idea that if the godchild is real, its actually Sovereign's mind uploaded into the Citadel after his destruction in ME1.

Yeah, even in my literalist interpetation of the endings, I dont trust godchild for a second.


Ew that's creepy.

At least it would allow people to meet their favorite Reaper again.

youtu.be/FOIzZ6s-GTQ

.... youtu.be/gR3PnpEI2u0 (watch until a few minutes after my mark - everything about the cycle)

Sovvy... what if he is actually still the leader of the Reapers? The controller? :o omg :o


I thought he was just meant to stay behind to watch progress?

#53925
Guest_magnetite_*
Posté 27 juillet 2012 - 03:01

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What about the whole Normandy crash landing on the planet? Joker has Vrolik syndrome, where he can fracture his thumb on the mute button. When he crashed the Normandy during the Collector base mission, he claimed to have broken all his ribs. When he walks out, he does appear unharmed. Not limping or anything. Wasn't there somewhere in the trilogy that states he has to use leg braces or crutches to get around? That walking is extremely hard to do.

Modifié par magnetite, 27 juillet 2012 - 03:04 .

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